Smacking Your Child.

[soren7550]

I don't normally condone it, but I understand that it might be warranted in extreme situations.

Spoiler: Such as...

So my friend used to work at gamestop. There was this kid who stole from his parents in order to buy games. The parents couldn't afford rent because of this, but couldn't get a cash refund due to not having receipts. I'd say that's an extreme enough situation to warrant that.

They had the receipts, but they were past the point for a cash refund, and the kid had disposed of the cases they came in (I think he also bought a DS with their rent money). The best my boss could offer them was something like less than a hundred bucks in store credit, which naturally the father didn't want. What made the father madder was that he had to take a day off work to deal with this, and the argument between him, my boss, and the kid went on for 20 minutes. That kid certainly got his ass beat when they got home.

If you're going to tell my stories, please try to get more of it right, or at least ask me about the details, 'kay?

OT: Conceptually, I'm against it due to the whole 'the parent is likely much huger and stronger than the child, and probably has some issues when they think beating a child is the best course of action', but then again, I've come across a bunch of kids where I thought they needed a few good smacks, so I guess I'm a monster.

 

[Alarien]

I'm completely anti-smacking. It's not necessary at all and I believe it's harmful to the development of children.

You aren't allowed to hit another adult, you aren't allowed to hit your animals, why on earth would you think it's okay to hit a person much smaller than you who is completely dependant on you? It's not.

All smacking teaches a child is that if someone doesn't do what you want and you're bigger than them, hit them.

I've worked with kids for quite a bit previously, and have lots of experience with children, and I know it can be extremely frustrating at times. That is no excuse, you are the adult.
/rant over

Working with and having experience with children is not remotely similar to being a parent and understanding your individual child. There is a significant difference between working with children and raising a child. One puts the responsibility for development entirely on your shoulders while the responsibility of the other is, at best, extremely limited.

Many, many, of us born before the 1980's experienced spanking, smacks, or other forms of punishment. It was normal, accepted, and did not lead to poorly adjusted children or adults. While I've been in fights in my life, I have never once instigated or started a fight, bullied a person, or hit someone in anger. The only time I've struck another person is in response to them attacking me first. So, the entire idea that "all smacking teaches a child..." is completely erroneous.

What you are likely correct on, and referring to, is physical and emotional abuse. Those who are abused are more likely to use physical abuse on others. That is certainly true and many of us grew up knowing people with abusive parents, which often resulted in physically or emotionally abusive children.

 

[Phasmal]

Working with and having experience with children is not remotely similar to being a parent and understanding your individual child. There is a significant difference between working with children and raising a child. One puts the responsibility for development entirely on your shoulders while other responsibility of the other is, at best, extremely limited.

Many, many, of us born before the 1980's experienced spanking, smacks, or other forms of punishment. It was normal, accepted, and did not lead to poorly adjusted children or adults. While I've been in fights in my left, I have never once instigated or started a fight, bullied a person, or hit someone in anger. The only time I've struck another person is in response to them attacking me first. So, the entire idea that "all smacking teaches a child..." is completely erroneous.

What you are likely correct on, and referring to, is physical and emotional abuse. Those who are abused are more likely to use physical abuse on others. That is certainly true and many of us grew up knowing people with abusive parents, which often resulted in physically or emotionally abusive children.

I get that it's not the same as being a parent (I didn't say it was), just that I understood raising a child was difficult.
And I probably shouldn't have put `all` but I do think it's an aspect.

I'll just agree to disagree, I'm afraid. I don't think smacking is acceptable. As I said, I wouldn't hit my friends, I wouldn't hit an animal, why would I hit a child?

I understand that parenting is extremely stressful for some people, which is why I'm of the opinion that we should be teaching more about child development/parenting skills in school, but there are other ways to discipline kids.

 

[Alarien]

Snip

I think your comments are fair here. I understand why people can be generally against it, but the first post painted people who would disagree with you into a specific corner, which is why I came out strongly against it.

I think I explained my thought process in my earlier post to answer some of the questions you raise, though. Even though I use corporal punishment, I don't use it as a punishment for after the fact behavior and, personally, I generally disagree with that usage. If, as some people have mentioned, you use spanking for something that has already occurred, I don't generally see the benefit. Honest discussion about implications, feelings (with liberally applied guilting), and privilege restriction will generally do the job, I think. Though, I admit that I can't speak to every child out there. Some kids may still only respond to spanking as a punishment, which is why I hesitate to generalize on it's usage entirely.

I only use it as an attention getter during a complete emotional meltdown/tantrum. I use it as an instant adrenaline check to get her focus to sharpen and on me, and then I use that to get her to look me in the eyes and slowly match breath until she calms down. It has worked very, very well at that.

It's fine to agree to disagree, though. If you do have kids, it's no one's place to tell you what you should do to raise yours. You figure that out for yourself.

 

[Little Woodsman]

Wish I had more time to talk about this-- but I don't so in brief:

I've never had to physically discipline my child. A stern talking to on a couple of occasions is the closest to punishment I've ever had to use. Reasoning and explaining the "why" behind a rule or why we do things a certain way or why certain things just aren't done has always worked wonderfully for her.

However, it varies greatly by individual child. I've seen some cases where a small amount of physical discipline (smack on the wrist or spanking) was appropriate, and worked. (In one particular case I saw it stop a child from doing something dangerous, so definitely preferable to the child actually injuring himself.)

But I do think that physical discipline is often over-used, used incorrectly or is too severe. You have to work with your child to see what the best course is for him/her.

 

[pearcinator]

As a teacher I can tell you that some kids just need a smack.

Smacking never hurt anyone and it lets the child know that they did the wrong thing. I don't think the cane is necessary but a slap on the bum doesn't do any damage. At school, kids hit each other way worse than a little smack. Some kids get away with too much nowadays and have lost the ability to respect others.

 

[ecoho]

Really all hitting a kid does is make you feel better. Because who doesn't want to hit a kid?

I've always been in the "shoot 'em or run the fuck away" camp myself. Absolutely terrified of kids, to the point I start thinking about looking for a new place to shop when I see one.

I could've been a REALLY fucking annoying kid, but you learn when you're held down for an hour that you probably shouldn't be acting that way, gets in the way of your own fun. So yeah, I'm all for smacking a kid, I'm all for smacking an adult when they're being pricks as well. Gets 'em ready for when the schoolyard comes into play too(which it will, for everyone at some point there was that one asshole that wouldn't leave you alone).

I mean, what is the alternative, constantly negotiate with a screaming brat? Letting them get their way every time? Allow them to cry themselves out? Sorry, but if they're going to cry, I'm either going to help them cut peppers without gloves and not tell them to rinse their hands, or do something for them to realize that doing that for no good reason is a detriment to them in some form. Whether that's pulling their ears, hitting their butts with a light cutting board, or just tying them to their beds and telling them they'd better get acquainted with their imaginations, because I'm not going to be talking to them while I sit in the corner for an hour with earplugs in.

Edit: reading this again, it wasn't clear that I was joking on most of this, but my basic feelings I think are plain.

Hitting will have an effect once or twice, maybe. But more than that and your just showing the kid the limit and teaching them that its not only alright to hit those smaller than them, but feels good too. Still though, even "having" to do it once means somethings gone wrong, you've already fucked something up.

let me tell you if you do the first spanking right the threat of receiving another is more then enough to keep you in line. Now I don't support abusing your child that's wrong but smacking a child and saying "No!" to them is not the same thing neither is spanking your child. A good parent is both loved and feared by their child.

 

[Parasondox]

As a teacher I can tell you that some kids just need a smack.

Smacking never hurt anyone and it lets the child know that they did the wrong thing. I don't think the cane is necessary but a slap on the bum doesn't do any damage. At school, kids hit each other way worse than a little smack. Some kids get away with too much nowadays and have lost the ability to respect others.

I don't exactly where you are from but as a teacher, do you think it's more harder to punish unruly kids today compared to, lets say, 10 years ago due to parents who will defend their child no matter what? Or do you think it's still the same. Once again I do not know where you are based and how long you have been a teacher before. I'm mostly thinking of it as a UK prospective.

PS. Please do not grade my grammar. It's bad I know lol

 

[Quellist]

As a kid i got smacked and spanked a fair bit. I pretty much earned it, i was out of control, a smart mouth and generally a little gobshite. Mostly with a slipper on the thigh, other times on the butt, usually with a hand or a slipper. Hard enough to hurt and redden the skin but not to leave lasting marks. What it taught me was actions have (painful) consequences. It didn't cure me of bad behavior but it sure taught me to think before i did something bad.

As an Adult i think i'm pretty well balanced, I work and have a pretty good life and get on well with people in general. I guess i have a bit of a spanking fetish, though whether or not that has anything to do with my childhood i have no idea. So in my personal experience it was a good thing...when i was told off i didn't listen, when i had my stuff taken from me i stole it back, when i was spanked i went to my room, cried and decided maybe i wouldn't try that particular piece of mischief again.

 

[asinann]

Some kids need a smacked now and then, but it should never be the first reaction.

 

[Drops a Sweet Katana]

I was never smacked (so far as I can remember) as a child outside of a playful swat upside the head from my dad when we joked around. For me, scolding and taking away certain privileges were plenty to keep me in line. I was a fairly calm and mild-mannered kid, so they worked well on me. I'm not a parent (yet), but I would never see myself resorting to physical punishment as discipline without a damn good reason and an explanation to my kid as to why I did it. For some kids, a physical deterrent may be what's needed to reinforce right and wrong, but I think things like that warrant an explanation to the child.

 

[pearcinator]

As a teacher I can tell you that some kids just need a smack.

Smacking never hurt anyone and it lets the child know that they did the wrong thing. I don't think the cane is necessary but a slap on the bum doesn't do any damage. At school, kids hit each other way worse than a little smack. Some kids get away with too much nowadays and have lost the ability to respect others.

I don't exactly where you are from but as a teacher, do you think it's more harder to punish unruly kids today compared to, lets say, 10 years ago due to parents who will defend their child no matter what? Or do you think it's still the same. Once again I do not know where you are based and how long you have been a teacher before. I'm mostly thinking of it as a UK prospective.

PS. Please do not grade my grammar. It's bad I know lol

Well I am still new to teaching. Only graduated about 2 years ago but yes, I do believe that it's harder to punish kids today. As a male teacher I have to be extra careful where I touch a child as someone might think I'm some paedophile or some bullshit. At most, I can restrain a violent student by holding his or her arms by their side. 99% of the time though I just yell at them if they do the wrong thing but in some cases verbal discipline does not work at all.

How do children learn best? When they get a physical reaction from doing something. e.g. toddler tries to touch a fire, gets mild burn and knows not to do that again. Same thing with a smack! Child does something wrong, parents give them a (harmless) smack on the backside, child knows they did something wrong and won't likely do it again. I'll just finish it off with saying that I have no sympathy for children that hurt themselves because they did something stupid. I see it as a learning experience. The best ones are when you warn the student that they might hurt themselves and they continue to do it anyway (and hurt themselves). I almost want to say "I told you so!" but I have to remain professional and make sure the child isn't really injured.

 

[Leon Royce]

If you have to hit others to get them to respect you or to get them to follow the rules you put in place then you are probably not worth respecting or following.

Only brutes hit children.

If you speak to children with respect, and explain things to them like you would to an adult, you would be amazed at the results you can get. If your line of reasoning is clear and consistent, you will have no trouble. Most adults are terrified of this for multiple reasons:

- Some children are wiser than the adults around them (rare but does happen). Many adults are imbeciles their entire lives and don't want to look foolish in front of children. This is why many people preach the "you shouldn't talk back to an adult" BS. Of course you should talk back to an adult if s/he's wrong.

- Many adults have never taken the time to properly reflect on subjects of morality and discipline, and lead undisciplined lives themselves. Most have minds filled with cognitive dissonance, and they apply double standards all around them.

- Many adults see children not as human beings, but as semi-humans on probation waiting for their full human status.

- Many adults are lazy and like to take shortcuts. If someone is smaller than you, get their cooperation through coercion and threats. That's easier.

- Many adults are scared, hysterical or have control issues and are worried their children will not grow into a normal adult with being pushed and forced from every angle.

 

[Worgen]

Really all hitting a kid does is make you feel better. Because who doesn't want to hit a kid?

I've always been in the "shoot 'em or run the fuck away" camp myself. Absolutely terrified of kids, to the point I start thinking about looking for a new place to shop when I see one.

I could've been a REALLY fucking annoying kid, but you learn when you're held down for an hour that you probably shouldn't be acting that way, gets in the way of your own fun. So yeah, I'm all for smacking a kid, I'm all for smacking an adult when they're being pricks as well. Gets 'em ready for when the schoolyard comes into play too(which it will, for everyone at some point there was that one asshole that wouldn't leave you alone).

I mean, what is the alternative, constantly negotiate with a screaming brat? Letting them get their way every time? Allow them to cry themselves out? Sorry, but if they're going to cry, I'm either going to help them cut peppers without gloves and not tell them to rinse their hands, or do something for them to realize that doing that for no good reason is a detriment to them in some form. Whether that's pulling their ears, hitting their butts with a light cutting board, or just tying them to their beds and telling them they'd better get acquainted with their imaginations, because I'm not going to be talking to them while I sit in the corner for an hour with earplugs in.

Edit: reading this again, it wasn't clear that I was joking on most of this, but my basic feelings I think are plain.

Hitting will have an effect once or twice, maybe. But more than that and your just showing the kid the limit and teaching them that its not only alright to hit those smaller than them, but feels good too. Still though, even "having" to do it once means somethings gone wrong, you've already fucked something up.

let me tell you if you do the first spanking right the threat of receiving another is more then enough to keep you in line. Now I don't support abusing your child that's wrong but smacking a child and saying "No!" to them is not the same thing neither is spanking your child. A good parent is both loved and feared by their child.

That sounds like a fucked up upbringing.

 

[ecoho]

Really all hitting a kid does is make you feel better. Because who doesn't want to hit a kid?

I've always been in the "shoot 'em or run the fuck away" camp myself. Absolutely terrified of kids, to the point I start thinking about looking for a new place to shop when I see one.

I could've been a REALLY fucking annoying kid, but you learn when you're held down for an hour that you probably shouldn't be acting that way, gets in the way of your own fun. So yeah, I'm all for smacking a kid, I'm all for smacking an adult when they're being pricks as well. Gets 'em ready for when the schoolyard comes into play too(which it will, for everyone at some point there was that one asshole that wouldn't leave you alone).

I mean, what is the alternative, constantly negotiate with a screaming brat? Letting them get their way every time? Allow them to cry themselves out? Sorry, but if they're going to cry, I'm either going to help them cut peppers without gloves and not tell them to rinse their hands, or do something for them to realize that doing that for no good reason is a detriment to them in some form. Whether that's pulling their ears, hitting their butts with a light cutting board, or just tying them to their beds and telling them they'd better get acquainted with their imaginations, because I'm not going to be talking to them while I sit in the corner for an hour with earplugs in.

Edit: reading this again, it wasn't clear that I was joking on most of this, but my basic feelings I think are plain.

Hitting will have an effect once or twice, maybe. But more than that and your just showing the kid the limit and teaching them that its not only alright to hit those smaller than them, but feels good too. Still though, even "having" to do it once means somethings gone wrong, you've already fucked something up.

let me tell you if you do the first spanking right the threat of receiving another is more then enough to keep you in line. Now I don't support abusing your child that's wrong but smacking a child and saying "No!" to them is not the same thing neither is spanking your child. A good parent is both loved and feared by their child.

That sounds like a fucked up upbringing.

nope pretty nice actually, never got into fights, I prefer to negotiate problems rather then defaulting to force, and I abhor bullies. I don't know how old you are but if you look at parents who were baby boomers their children tend to be pretty well adjusted and civil, were as those who are younger tend to have children who are often in trouble all the time.

 

[Olas]

Only if the child is currently in the immediate process of doing something terrible and physically hitting them is the only available means of preventing it.

In other words... no. There are lots of ways to discipline bad behavior that aren't traumatic and anxiety inducing, and don't teach the child that violence is acceptable.

If your an adult who doesn't mind hitting a child, there's something wrong with you.

 

[Worgen]

Really all hitting a kid does is make you feel better. Because who doesn't want to hit a kid?

I've always been in the "shoot 'em or run the fuck away" camp myself. Absolutely terrified of kids, to the point I start thinking about looking for a new place to shop when I see one.

I could've been a REALLY fucking annoying kid, but you learn when you're held down for an hour that you probably shouldn't be acting that way, gets in the way of your own fun. So yeah, I'm all for smacking a kid, I'm all for smacking an adult when they're being pricks as well. Gets 'em ready for when the schoolyard comes into play too(which it will, for everyone at some point there was that one asshole that wouldn't leave you alone).

I mean, what is the alternative, constantly negotiate with a screaming brat? Letting them get their way every time? Allow them to cry themselves out? Sorry, but if they're going to cry, I'm either going to help them cut peppers without gloves and not tell them to rinse their hands, or do something for them to realize that doing that for no good reason is a detriment to them in some form. Whether that's pulling their ears, hitting their butts with a light cutting board, or just tying them to their beds and telling them they'd better get acquainted with their imaginations, because I'm not going to be talking to them while I sit in the corner for an hour with earplugs in.

Edit: reading this again, it wasn't clear that I was joking on most of this, but my basic feelings I think are plain.

Hitting will have an effect once or twice, maybe. But more than that and your just showing the kid the limit and teaching them that its not only alright to hit those smaller than them, but feels good too. Still though, even "having" to do it once means somethings gone wrong, you've already fucked something up.

let me tell you if you do the first spanking right the threat of receiving another is more then enough to keep you in line. Now I don't support abusing your child that's wrong but smacking a child and saying "No!" to them is not the same thing neither is spanking your child. A good parent is both loved and feared by their child.

That sounds like a fucked up upbringing.

nope pretty nice actually, never got into fights, I prefer to negotiate problems rather then defaulting to force, and I abhor bullies. I don't know how old you are but if you look at parents who were baby boomers their children tend to be pretty well adjusted and civil, were as those who are younger tend to have children who are often in trouble all the time.

That's a fallacy, youth crime actually spiked in the 70s and 80s, about when kids from the tail end of the baby boomers would be around. Not to mention the fact that I doubt you will find many people in prison who lament not fearing their parents enough or being there from lack of being hit.

 

[ecoho]

Really all hitting a kid does is make you feel better. Because who doesn't want to hit a kid?

I've always been in the "shoot 'em or run the fuck away" camp myself. Absolutely terrified of kids, to the point I start thinking about looking for a new place to shop when I see one.

I could've been a REALLY fucking annoying kid, but you learn when you're held down for an hour that you probably shouldn't be acting that way, gets in the way of your own fun. So yeah, I'm all for smacking a kid, I'm all for smacking an adult when they're being pricks as well. Gets 'em ready for when the schoolyard comes into play too(which it will, for everyone at some point there was that one asshole that wouldn't leave you alone).

I mean, what is the alternative, constantly negotiate with a screaming brat? Letting them get their way every time? Allow them to cry themselves out? Sorry, but if they're going to cry, I'm either going to help them cut peppers without gloves and not tell them to rinse their hands, or do something for them to realize that doing that for no good reason is a detriment to them in some form. Whether that's pulling their ears, hitting their butts with a light cutting board, or just tying them to their beds and telling them they'd better get acquainted with their imaginations, because I'm not going to be talking to them while I sit in the corner for an hour with earplugs in.

Edit: reading this again, it wasn't clear that I was joking on most of this, but my basic feelings I think are plain.

Hitting will have an effect once or twice, maybe. But more than that and your just showing the kid the limit and teaching them that its not only alright to hit those smaller than them, but feels good too. Still though, even "having" to do it once means somethings gone wrong, you've already fucked something up.

let me tell you if you do the first spanking right the threat of receiving another is more then enough to keep you in line. Now I don't support abusing your child that's wrong but smacking a child and saying "No!" to them is not the same thing neither is spanking your child. A good parent is both loved and feared by their child.

That sounds like a fucked up upbringing.

nope pretty nice actually, never got into fights, I prefer to negotiate problems rather then defaulting to force, and I abhor bullies. I don't know how old you are but if you look at parents who were baby boomers their children tend to be pretty well adjusted and civil, were as those who are younger tend to have children who are often in trouble all the time.

That's a fallacy, youth crime actually spiked in the 70s and 80s, about when kids from the tail end of the baby boomers would be around. Not to mention the fact that I doubt you will find many people in prison who lament not fearing their parents enough or being there from lack of being hit.

Correlation does not imply causation. Every kid ive met who parents were like mine, as in children of baby boomers, has one thing in common none of them got in trouble till well into their 20s. By that I mean your standard fighting ticket, speeding ticket, and fender bender. my neighbor's kids on the other hand are raised in the new way of no real consequences go sit in the "naughty chair" kind of punishments, and low and behold one just got busted selling drugs, and her youngest just got expelled for attacking a younger girl. now their middle child is actually not that bad got straight A's and is now in college studying to be a doctor, so I guess the new way works on 1 out of 3.

(the ages of the 3 kids are as follows 25 the oldest,22 the middle child and the last one is only 14 all three boys.)

 

[Nailzzz]

I am of the opinion that there should be one point when the child does something terrible anytime between the ages of 5-12, where the parent should beat that kid to the point where it considers that their parent may actually kill them. Just once. You will never have to do it again. I feel that it is important that the child understands that without rules, they are not safe and that it is in the child's best interest to uphold them itself. They need to understand that their actions have consequences that they themselves may suffer from, including in regards to their interactions with parents. Physical pain isn't the point. Fear of consequences is the point.

Beyond that you should generally avoid beating your kids.

 

[ecoho]

Really all hitting a kid does is make you feel better. Because who doesn't want to hit a kid?

I've always been in the "shoot 'em or run the fuck away" camp myself. Absolutely terrified of kids, to the point I start thinking about looking for a new place to shop when I see one.

I could've been a REALLY fucking annoying kid, but you learn when you're held down for an hour that you probably shouldn't be acting that way, gets in the way of your own fun. So yeah, I'm all for smacking a kid, I'm all for smacking an adult when they're being pricks as well. Gets 'em ready for when the schoolyard comes into play too(which it will, for everyone at some point there was that one asshole that wouldn't leave you alone).

I mean, what is the alternative, constantly negotiate with a screaming brat? Letting them get their way every time? Allow them to cry themselves out? Sorry, but if they're going to cry, I'm either going to help them cut peppers without gloves and not tell them to rinse their hands, or do something for them to realize that doing that for no good reason is a detriment to them in some form. Whether that's pulling their ears, hitting their butts with a light cutting board, or just tying them to their beds and telling them they'd better get acquainted with their imaginations, because I'm not going to be talking to them while I sit in the corner for an hour with earplugs in.

Edit: reading this again, it wasn't clear that I was joking on most of this, but my basic feelings I think are plain.

Hitting will have an effect once or twice, maybe. But more than that and your just showing the kid the limit and teaching them that its not only alright to hit those smaller than them, but feels good too. Still though, even "having" to do it once means somethings gone wrong, you've already fucked something up.

let me tell you if you do the first spanking right the threat of receiving another is more then enough to keep you in line. Now I don't support abusing your child that's wrong but smacking a child and saying "No!" to them is not the same thing neither is spanking your child. A good parent is both loved and feared by their child.

That sounds like a fucked up upbringing.

nope pretty nice actually, never got into fights, I prefer to negotiate problems rather then defaulting to force, and I abhor bullies. I don't know how old you are but if you look at parents who were baby boomers their children tend to be pretty well adjusted and civil, were as those who are younger tend to have children who are often in trouble all the time.

That's a fallacy, youth crime actually spiked in the 70s and 80s, about when kids from the tail end of the baby boomers would be around. Not to mention the fact that I doubt you will find many people in prison who lament not fearing their parents enough or being there from lack of being hit.

Correlation does not imply causation. Every kid ive met who parents were like mine, as in children of baby boomers, has one thing in common none of them got in trouble till well into their 20s. SNIP

Not agreeing or disagreeing with your actual point, but there is no way you can say something like "Correlation does not imply causation." and then launch into a litany of your personal anecdotes as though that meant anything.

lol I wasn't sure if what I posted in itself was correlation as it is plainly what ive seen with my own eyes. if its is then im as bad as worgen and I apologize.