Super Smash Creator Thinks Melee Was Too Hard
- Thread starter John Funk
- Start date
I always thought Melee was a pick-up and play game, more so than brawl since it has so many more extra ways of doing things between the characters (recoveries being the main point) the only thing you need to get across to new players is the concept of "you must recover". I also didn't like the more "Kirby air ride" style of the menus.
Smash brothers always had the darker, more "Epic, universe-wide brawl" feel to it, which is one of it's main appeals, fighting as the famous nintendo characters.
I believe that Smash brothers is one of the easiest games in existence, especially with it's multilayer value.
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Unless you're playing with "that guy" (quote crowshaw) and he has no regard for the skill level of the new players. "be kind to beginners" (quote Smashbros.com, it's on there somewhere)
Smash brothers always had the darker, more "Epic, universe-wide brawl" feel to it, which is one of it's main appeals, fighting as the famous nintendo characters.
I believe that Smash brothers is one of the easiest games in existence, especially with it's multilayer value.
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Unless you're playing with "that guy" (quote crowshaw) and he has no regard for the skill level of the new players. "be kind to beginners" (quote Smashbros.com, it's on there somewhere)
Melee is a game I still play to this day, it's a great game with lots of ways to improve, go in-depth and have complexity. it's playable 4 player FFA with people that have only picked it up that very afternoon, and have a complete blast doing so, but at the same time allowing tournament players to have really high-level play and pull off amazing stuff. It wasn't hard, it was complex.
Easy to learn. Hard to master.
Easy to learn. Hard to master.
I don't think Brawl was really all that dumb down...Sach said:
Well, I don't see it, anyway...
Was it for the same bullshit reason I couldn't play as Game & Watch?Patrick_and_the_ricks said:
I always thought it was easily the best in the series. I didn't think it was too hard, it was amazing.
Brawl really wasn't, I was commenting more on the "I ever had a chance at another one, I doubt we'll ever see one that's as geared toward hardcore gamers as Melee was" statement, and the fact that this type of sentiment seems to be the common theme of developers these days.Matrixbeast said:
Wouldn't doubt it, only an idiot would be so damn serious about a local tournament.Patrick_and_the_ricks said:
First off, FINAL DESTINATION IS BADASS!
Second, this is just another game creator BAWWWWWWing about how people like their older stuff comapred to the newer shtie they feed to us now.
Square Enix did it just a few months ago.
Second, this is just another game creator BAWWWWWWing about how people like their older stuff comapred to the newer shtie they feed to us now.
Square Enix did it just a few months ago.
Oh god.... stop watering down games if you want anyone to play either have the AI play itself or make the defult setting super easy as anyone with a brain can use the menu to change it to normal or hard
My thoughts exactly. I can still pick up and play Melee today because it had such a great feel. In fact, I felt that the combat in Brawl was a step down from Melee.Not a Spy said:
I LOVE BRAWL!!!!
It's my favourite game at the moment, and has been for a while. It's just so much damn fun, and even my eight year old sister can play it and beat me! I do have Melee, but I haven't touched it since I got Brawl.
The gameplay is just awesome
and the Story Mode is tons of fun. It beats the hell out of any other fighting game, because it never gets boring. There's always something new getting thrown into the mix.
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FALCON PUNCH!!
It's my favourite game at the moment, and has been for a while. It's just so much damn fun, and even my eight year old sister can play it and beat me! I do have Melee, but I haven't touched it since I got Brawl.
The gameplay is just awesome
and the Story Mode is tons of fun. It beats the hell out of any other fighting game, because it never gets boring. There's always something new getting thrown into the mix....
FALCON PUNCH!!
I just can't wrap my head around Sakurai's thought processes. You want to make the game accessible? Okay, easily done. But why does that somehow mean the elements that make the game competitive have to go out the window?
Just look at Pokemon. At its simplest, it's Dragon Quest lite with cute monsters and fun characters. Everyone loves it because it's so easy to just get in there and do your thing. At its most competitive, on the other hand, it's one of the most complex PVP games ever made (yeah, I said it). Obviously, both playstyles are incredibly different, but neither exists as a detriment to the other. It's the perfect balance.
Melee, I feel, reached that balance. It was easy to pick up and play, and if you wanted to take the time to plumb the game's depths, you'd find it's a reasonably complex fighter. Brawl does pretty well in this department, too, but it's obvious that it's been changed to snip out the bits that make the game more competitive, and that's a damn shame.
Of course, it's all a moot point because Smash has one of the worst competitive communities in gaming.
Just look at Pokemon. At its simplest, it's Dragon Quest lite with cute monsters and fun characters. Everyone loves it because it's so easy to just get in there and do your thing. At its most competitive, on the other hand, it's one of the most complex PVP games ever made (yeah, I said it). Obviously, both playstyles are incredibly different, but neither exists as a detriment to the other. It's the perfect balance.
Melee, I feel, reached that balance. It was easy to pick up and play, and if you wanted to take the time to plumb the game's depths, you'd find it's a reasonably complex fighter. Brawl does pretty well in this department, too, but it's obvious that it's been changed to snip out the bits that make the game more competitive, and that's a damn shame.
Of course, it's all a moot point because Smash has one of the worst competitive communities in gaming.
I think I can top that. I played in a tournament a few years ago. I didn't really want to but the cash prize was pretty substantial. The tournament was run by a woman who had absolutely no idea what she was doing. She lost the memory card so she banned all "secret characters." That actually helped me, as I didn't have to deal with Marth. But then she made each round 4 players, stock 5, with a 4 minute timer. You can facepalm now.Patrick_and_the_ricks said:
In the first round, I killed off players two and three, while player four hid most of the time, so we were both at three lives when the timer ran out. Then when Sudden Death started, my finger slipped and the other guy got off the first shot. I was pretty pissed off. Definitely didn't play any more tournaments with them after that.
Sounds like he's talking apples and oranges to me. There really is no link between approachability/accessibility and depth/balance. A well designed game, not just in the realm of fighting games, can and should have both.
Oh well, I never really got much into any of the Smash Bros games but I know there are players out there who used to always use Melee as the defense that the SSB games really are solid fighters. It appears that even if they were right about Melee, even the designer himself feels that's a black sheep in the series that he doesn't want to revisit.
Oh well, I never really got much into any of the Smash Bros games but I know there are players out there who used to always use Melee as the defense that the SSB games really are solid fighters. It appears that even if they were right about Melee, even the designer himself feels that's a black sheep in the series that he doesn't want to revisit.
Me! That was my first game, and still my absolute favourite.Dioxide20 said:
It wasn't too hard, it was perfect!! I didn't like Brawl, so went back to Melee. Me and my friens still hold tournaments, but unfortunately we switched to Brawl to be nice to the newbs
Personally, I think the only way it could be more accessible would be if there weren't any unlockable characters. Seriously, why do that? I wanna play as everyone from the get-go, not through some crappy story mode.
Oh. And bring back Mewtwo. Lucario is lame.
Oh. And bring back Mewtwo. Lucario is lame.
...why? There are so many characters, and you could only play as four? Who's dumb idea was that?Patrick_and_the_ricks said:
After reading the intro article i definitely know i will never *buy* a SSB IV if it ever comes. I had so much fun challenging the hardest game modes and always felt that i could become better. PWn a lvl 9? easy, 2 at once teamed against me? damn tough, put friendly fire on? he he... fun time...
Not to mention the adventure and classic modes, never did beat the highest difficulty on them but i got close.
*EDIT* *buy* not *but*
Not to mention the adventure and classic modes, never did beat the highest difficulty on them but i got close.
*EDIT* *buy* not *but*
Hmmmmm..... I have a friend of the FINAL DESTINATION ONLY NO ITEMS! breed. (who don't want to play BlazBlue and such with me because in those games you can win without skill... yeah....)
So when I do get to play with someone else, I happily choose another stage, with some exceptions. And I did play at 2 school tournaments if you will. Our rules were less strict than what I see,(melee) no items was there, but only the final needed to be final destination (I lost early though). The second one (brawl), all the settings where by default, so, items, any stage, any character. My FINAL DESTINATION!!! friend felt the tournament wasn't that well organized, because I eliminated both him and another friend of the same skill, in the same round, using Wario, and items (hey, I love to play on green greens). I think that cover most of it tournament wise.
The Melee vs Brawl thing... there is a difference, melee is faster, which I like, both feel about as hard as the other (melee is harder to come back, so easier to "kill" your opponent, while brawl is easier to come back, so easier to survive) I'm not sure which one I prefer though. I play Brawl more, but it's probably melee deep down (but in melee my FinalDestination friend can boast his skills even more, like defeating 3 lv.9 in team against him, or using only one hand against some players...screw Marth and his range)
So when I do get to play with someone else, I happily choose another stage, with some exceptions. And I did play at 2 school tournaments if you will. Our rules were less strict than what I see,(melee) no items was there, but only the final needed to be final destination (I lost early though). The second one (brawl), all the settings where by default, so, items, any stage, any character. My FINAL DESTINATION!!! friend felt the tournament wasn't that well organized, because I eliminated both him and another friend of the same skill, in the same round, using Wario, and items (hey, I love to play on green greens). I think that cover most of it tournament wise.
The Melee vs Brawl thing... there is a difference, melee is faster, which I like, both feel about as hard as the other (melee is harder to come back, so easier to "kill" your opponent, while brawl is easier to come back, so easier to survive) I'm not sure which one I prefer though. I play Brawl more, but it's probably melee deep down (but in melee my FinalDestination friend can boast his skills even more, like defeating 3 lv.9 in team against him, or using only one hand against some players...screw Marth and his range)