The Great Final Fantasy Retrospective - Let's Mosey

meiam

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Dang 5 below 13! I can sorta see it, its a bit rough of a game, but I appreciate the improvement in job system.

I'd probably go something like this myself (not ranking 1-3 since I haven't played them in original version)

FFT(sue me)>6>9>7>10>5>8>4>12>15>kick in the nuts>repeated kicks in the nuts>13>weed wacker to the nuts

I'm not sure about the order of the last two tbh
 
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sXeth

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Who's takes? My takes? Bro don't tell me FF8 is your favorite.



I suppose, but FF8's story sucks I sort of checked out of it mid-way through so i probably just didn't make the connection.

Fair enough.

I was gonna add Lightning as "just kinda there" too, then I realized then in the glazed over (repressed?) memory of my playthrough of 13 I don't even remember what her deal was.

Snow, sure, I remember his deal, he never shut the hell up about it. Chocobo hair dude, forget his name, but remember his storyline. Even the annoying kid that wanted revenge and all. Not a dang thing about what Lightning's motivation or arc was.
 
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CriticalGaming

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Fair enough.

I was gonna add Lightning as "just kinda there" too, then I realized then in the glazed over (repressed?) memory of my playthrough of 13 I don't even remember what her deal was.

Snow, sure, I remember his deal, he never shut the hell up about it. Chocobo hair dude, forget his name, but remember his storyline. Even the annoying kid that wanted revenge and all. Not a dang thing about what Lightning's motivation or arc was.
Something Something sister became a monster, something something save sister, whoops now we have to save the world for some reason, whoops maybe destroy it instead, whoops nobody gives shit.
 
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Dalisclock

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Something Something sister became a monster, something something save sister, whoops now we have to save the world for some reason, whoops maybe destroy it instead, whoops nobody gives shit.
Bad guy told us that killing other bad guy would cause the world to end. Solution? Do what bad guy said to kill other bad guy. Oops, he was right. Except the Australian lesbians pulled a dues ex machina to save us.

Cue Sequel, where bad guy keeps fucking with time to save girlfriend from dying over and over by crashing the universe and killing everything, except he just needed to kill himself to do that, but for some reason did everything the hard way.

It's not spoilers because it makes no sense.
 

meiam

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Well with FF13 millions re write its no surprise the main character got lost in her own story, its clear they were going for cloud 2.0, but it seems like the writer never really played 7 and based there interpretation on what the internet think Cloud is, so they ended up making Squall 2.0 instead, replace Rhinoa by her Sister (SARAH!).

But yeah, they never bother justifying why Ligthing want to go along with the bad guy plan, she actually doesn't even really seem to give a shit about her sister. Maybe a better comparison is FF4 Cecil early game, just without Rosa and no mid game change.
 
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hanselthecaretaker

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Dang 5 below 13! I can sorta see it, its a bit rough of a game, but I appreciate the improvement in job system.
It feels like busy work to pad game length to me, which is probably the main reason I haven’t gone back to finish it yet.
 

CriticalGaming

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That does explain a lot of why she sounds so brain dead.
That'a weird, didn't they sync the lip flaps to the english dub though? The lips don't match teh japanese dialog so how could they animate english dub before the dub was recorded.
 

EvilRoy

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That'a weird, didn't they sync the lip flaps to the english dub though? The lips don't match teh japanese dialog so how could they animate english dub before the dub was recorded.
My understanding of modelling is outdated and limited, but from conversations with a dorm mate who was in school for 3d graphics modelling a million years ago (talking about shitty lip flaps in PS2 games ironically enough):

Basically the modellers hack in something that looks basically right way before the translation, dialog tweaking and VA is done. Apparently because the modelling takes way longer than the VA and you gotta know how much English you can fit in a scene designed for Japanese.

Based on that, presumably, although I assume it would be a bad idea, you could fully model all the lip flaps without ever hearing the actual dialog. If you were a shitshow of a team and you didn't want to spend the money tweaking the animations to the actual dialog later when VA is done, I guess you could force the comparatively cheaper voice actors to match what was modelled rather than the more sane reverse.

It feels like this should never happen but if you were on a schedule you could definitely get all the parts moving simultaneously this way.
 

thebobmaster

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My understanding of modelling is outdated and limited, but from conversations with a dorm mate who was in school for 3d graphics modelling a million years ago (talking about shitty lip flaps in PS2 games ironically enough):

Basically the modellers hack in something that looks basically right way before the translation, dialog tweaking and VA is done. Apparently because the modelling takes way longer than the VA and you gotta know how much English you can fit in a scene designed for Japanese.

Based on that, presumably, although I assume it would be a bad idea, you could fully model all the lip flaps without ever hearing the actual dialog. If you were a shitshow of a team and you didn't want to spend the money tweaking the animations to the actual dialog later when VA is done, I guess you could force the comparatively cheaper voice actors to match what was modelled rather than the more sane reverse.

It feels like this should never happen but if you were on a schedule you could definitely get all the parts moving simultaneously this way.
And apparently, that's exactly what was done. They approximated the lip syncing to the translated script, then had Hedy time her performance to the lip syncing.
 

RhombusHatesYou

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If you were a shitshow of a team and you didn't want to spend the money tweaking the animations to the actual dialog later when VA is done
If the animations were prerendered rather than in-game animations then no, you never ever ever ever ever want to redo the animations. Especially if you don't have your own renderfarm and have to rent out time on one.
 
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FakeSympathy

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Welp, here's my list of favorite FF games, because we totally need another opinion to jump in this mess!

6 > 7 > 4 > 5 > 9 > 8 > 12 > 10 > 15 > 3 > 1 > 2 > 13

(Never played 11 or 14)

As you can see, I definitely prefer the 2d FF games. Mostly from my love for the 2d art style and sprites, and 16 bit graphics looking timeless. 7 gets a second place, because it was so revolutionary and influential at the time, but I still prefer 6 more. I prefer 4 over 5 due to better story and characters, and 9 over 8 for the same reason.

Now granted there are many flaws with 15, but I found the effort to be refreshing. The combat is flawed but the effort was there to change the old system. The story was pretty good, despite important bits being sold as DLCs and some being cancelled. The world exploration was nice, because for once I am not being bashed in the head with some high-stake-save-the-world bit, but it's more like a one big road trip with friends.

But I just feel in terms of story and characters, 10 did it much better. Granted, in 10 there are some cutscenes and character interactions that feel stiff and in some ways 15 improved upon them. But 10 just feels it has deeper meaning and exposition, while 15 only seems to scratch the surface. For example, in 10 all the party characters are interacting with each other, and sometimes deeply cares for their well-being. Tidus isn't the constant focus, but can also be the bridge that helps them build relationship and be the observer to see them bonding.

I like Noctis and the boys, but all the interaction seems to be focused on him and only happens when he's around. Thre are casual banters, but no dedicated story bits or quest that build bonds. The whole dlc episodes were annoying being while they were nice, i was forced to pay extra to see more character developmentals. With 10, everything is just there.

Of course, I will always prefer Tidus and Yuna's relationship building over that of Noctis and Lunafreya's, because let's be frank here, there's almost no chemistry between the latter two.

You are probably asking why 1, 2, and 3 are so low on the list; I like 3's class system and the combat. I think it was a general improvement over 1. 2 tried to do this, but I found mastering skills to be a bit counter-productive.

13 is at the bottom of my list. Severely flawed game aside, I just remember this game being milked to death. FF7 was a bit forgivable when it was being milked, because the game itself was such as cultural phenomenon and sort of deserved all the attention. 13 didn't achieve this, so I don't know how it turned into a trilogy of its own, let alone get a sequel in the first place.
 
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meiam

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Of course, I will always prefer Tidus and Yuna's relationship building over that of Noctis and Lunafreya's, because let's be frank here, there's almost no chemistry between the latter two.
How could there be, they have maybe 2 scenes together and she dies almost immediately (one of the stupidest dead in video game). I think she genueinly has around 2 minutes of screen time in the entire game.
 
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sXeth

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Oh if we're doing that...


6 > 9 > X> 4> 5> 8> 7/1 > 12 > 13> 2

Never played 3, 15 or 11.

I'm going to abstain from FF14 because I ducked out early on (before my free trial thing ended) because the interface was a nightmare (LETS TARGET THE THING ACROSS THE MAP RATHER THEN THE ONE ACTIVELY IN COMBAT WITH ME (Playstation))


For reference, in my early-mid teens I basically got 6 and 7 back to back. My first job allowed me to finally buy (secondhand) games for my SNES and FF7 on PC was a birthday gift shortly after. My next batch of played ones was X and a PS1 CD collection which had 1, 2, and 4 (and Crono Trigger (which i already had on SNES) IIRC). 8 was shortly after, then 12. 9 was way way way way later (I think something on here or the old here actually prompted the playthrough, but its the PS4 version lol)


As that rating goes, after 5 (which I enjoyed the job system more then anything) its definitely thinner margins. I'm sure 1 might rate higher if I gave it the benefit of age scaling, but coming to it after a bunch of later ones its just painfully lacking (like comparing Zelda 1 when you've already played Link to the Past). You can go back in the thread for the controversial rating of 7, but tl;dr boring mechanics and a story based on motivations that the story itself retcons out of existence.
 

Drathnoxis

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Well if we're doing lists now, I feel like I should post 13 Final Fantasy lists from a blogger that I like. I think they were worth the read.


Oh if we're doing that...


6 > 9 > X> 4> 5> 8> 7/1 > 12 > 13> 2

Never played 3, 15 or 11.

I'm going to abstain from FF14 because I ducked out early on (before my free trial thing ended) because the interface was a nightmare (LETS TARGET THE THING ACROSS THE MAP RATHER THEN THE ONE ACTIVELY IN COMBAT WITH ME (Playstation))


For reference, in my early-mid teens I basically got 6 and 7 back to back. My first job allowed me to finally buy (secondhand) games for my SNES and FF7 on PC was a birthday gift shortly after. My next batch of played ones was X and a PS1 CD collection which had 1, 2, and 4 (and Crono Trigger (which i already had on SNES) IIRC). 8 was shortly after, then 12. 9 was way way way way later (I think something on here or the old here actually prompted the playthrough, but its the PS4 version lol)


As that rating goes, after 5 (which I enjoyed the job system more then anything) its definitely thinner margins. I'm sure 1 might rate higher if I gave it the benefit of age scaling, but coming to it after a bunch of later ones its just painfully lacking (like comparing Zelda 1 when you've already played Link to the Past). You can go back in the thread for the controversial rating of 7, but tl;dr boring mechanics and a story based on motivations that the story itself retcons out of existence.
Why is 10 the only one you refer to by Roman numeral?
 
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