The Matrix 4: Resurrections Trailer

Ezekiel

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Neo redirecting the missiles reminds me what a shame it was that they didn't expand his abilities in Reloaded and Revolutions. They just made him faster. I also thought other people would be able to do some of the things he could after he told the machines on the phone that he would show them a world where anything was possible. He might have meant the real world, but I doubt it, since he flew into the sky after.
 

gorfias

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I think this a chance for redemption. 2 was OK only. 3 really bad.
Things happened where Neo has powers in the real world. I would love to think the Matrix took over while he was in it and none of his "real world" experiences were in fact, real. He wakes up "Inception" style and realizes he never left. And then we go from there.

But as noted earlier, the Watchowski record since Matrix 1 has been pretty bad. I'm afraid to hope.
 

Piscian

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I think this a chance for redemption. 2 was OK only. 3 really bad.
Things happened where Neo has powers in the real world. I would love to think the Matrix took over while he was in it and none of his "real world" experiences were in fact, real. He wakes up "Inception" style and realizes he never left. And then we go from there.

But as noted earlier, the Watchowski record since Matrix 1 has been pretty bad. I'm afraid to hope.
If I were to get on my high shit horse, apparently everything good about The Matrix was stolen from a comicbook by Grant Morrison called The invisibles, literally down to artwork and designs apparently there's email proof that the crew was directed to read the comic and base all their designs on it, but it's owned by DC who also is owned by WB, so there's nothing grant can do about it, and he's apparently chill about the whole thing anyway.

In that context I'd bet the other two sucks because wachoskis didn't have anything to pull from for the sequels.

If all that's true you could make the case for being optimistic for Matrix 4 because there's other writers and crew involved. Only one of the wachoskis is getting director and writer credit.

But I'd only say all that if I were a jerk, which I'm not.
 
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gorfias

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If I were to get on my high shit horse, apparently everything good about The Matrix was stolen from a comicbook by Grant Morrison called The invisibles...
Wow! The Wachoskis concede they love comic books and I think they concede Miracle Man (earlier called Marvel Man... legal issues) inspired them. IRL, 1950s England came up with its own version of Shazam (formally Captain Marvel): Miracle Man (family that is mortal but with special word turn into g-ds). Maybe the greatest comic book writer of all time, Alan Moore, deconstructed the character in the 1980s: there never was a super hero named Miracle Man. He was an experiment in a lab kept in "the Matrix" where his crazy adventures existed in a virtual reality he believed. There was a Kid Miracle Man. Years later in MM's "real world" he meets up with him. The kid is now a man. And he isn't the kid grown up. The kid changed to KMM and never changed back and became evil. And he's essentially Agent Smith. So, now? I gotta find me some digital copies of Invisibles. Grant Morrison is one talented SOB too. Thanks for the tip.
 
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gorfias

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If I were to get on my high shit horse, apparently everything good about The Matrix was stolen from a comicbook by Grant Morrison called The invisibles, literally down to artwork and designs apparently there's email proof that the crew was directed to read the comic and base all their designs on it, but it's owned by DC who also is owned by WB, so there's nothing grant can do about it, and he's apparently chill about the whole thing anyway.

In that context I'd bet the other two sucks because wachoskis didn't have anything to pull from for the sequels.

If all that's true you could make the case for being optimistic for Matrix 4 because there's other writers and crew involved. Only one of the wachoskis is getting director and writer credit.

But I'd only say all that if I were a jerk, which I'm not.
Sorry for the double post. Errors from the website and I wanted to show off this: Kid MM looking like Agent Smith:
1631236183447.png

EDIT: I got some learning to do
 
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Dirty Hipsters

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But he won't hit as hard and high and as fast as he did eighteen years ago. I would have preferred a new protagonist myself.
He doesn't need to "hit hard" he's filming a movie. A movie that I might add mostly relies on CGI and wire work. The stuff he does in John Wick is just as technically difficult if not moreso than slow-mo wire-fu.
 

Piscian

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Wow! The Wachoskis concede they love comic books and I think they concede Miracle Man (earlier called Marvel Man... legal issues) inspired them. IRL, 1950s England came up with its own version of Shazam (formally Captain Marvel): Miracle Man (family that is mortal but with special word turn into g-ds). Maybe the greatest comic book writer of all time, Alan Moore, deconstructed the character in the 1980s: there never was a super hero named Miracle Man. He was an experiment in a lab kept in "the Matrix" where his crazy adventures existed in a virtual reality he believed. There was a Kid Miracle Man. Years later in MM's "real world" he meets up with him. The kid is now a man. And he isn't the kid grown up. The kid changed to KMM and never changed back and became evil. And he's essentially Agent Smith. So, now? I gotta find me some digital copies of Invisibles. Grant Morrison is one talented SOB too. Thanks for the tip.
I only know because Mr. Sunday movies did a little mini-doc on The Matrix recently and went into how if you do side by side comparisons theres artwork that literally traced out of invisibles.


"It's really simple. The truth of that one is that design staff on The Matrix were given Invisibles collections and told to make the movie look like my books. This is a reported fact. The Wachowskis are comic book creators and fans and were fans of my work, so it's hardly surprising. I was even contacted before the first Matrix movie was released and asked if I would contribute a story to the website. (...) I'm not angry about it anymore, although at one time I was, because they made millions from what was basically a Xerox of my work and to be honest, I would be happy with just one million so I didn't have to work thirteen hours of every fucking day, including weekends. (2005) [13]" - Grant Morrison

It definitely makes sense that they copied stuff from Miracle Man as well. Theres a lot of fandom overlap between Grant Morrison, Alan Moore, Warren Ellis and Garth Ennis. I'd link you to where can just read Invisibles online, but its technically piracy so I don't think its allowed here. I'm a huge Miracle Man fan. I can definitely see what you're alluding to.
 
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Ezekiel

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He doesn't need to "hit hard" he's filming a movie. A movie that I might add mostly relies on CGI and wire work. The stuff he does in John Wick is just as technically difficult if not moreso than slow-mo wire-fu.
He trained six months for The Matrix. Of course the physicality matters. You can see it in the fights. The actors weren't slow. Most of the fighting wasn't even with wires, it was on the ground. By the way, fighting with wires is very difficult and painful even. And they didn't use just wires; with the sequels they built more complicated machinery. Like these rotating machines that were so painful and difficult to use that the stunt doubles couldn't stay in them for too long. The younger you are, the easier you can manage it. You would want the actor to do as much of it as possible, so as to hopefully not give it away too easily.




The gun fu of John Wick looks physically easier than what he did for The Matrix.
 
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Dwarvenhobble

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Ok I'm going to use spoilers for some stuff I say here because I think I might be about to give away fairly major plot points based on stuff I've noticed.

Before that. I have seen a good deal of the Wachowski's work after the Matrix only not seeing Sense 8 and Speed Racer. I'm also going to say I think it's good. Cloud Atlas is kind of a fart sniffing esoteric Sci-Fi but it doesn't feel like it's talking down the the audience really either and that makes it work once you start to understand the connections of the stories and the symbolism in them. Jupiter Ascending is 3 very fine films crushed down into one mediocre one where there's not really enough time for it to breath. And V for Vendetta is fun.

On The Matrix 2 & 3 being crap:
This is a common claim and while I'll say they have their issues I'll say I found them perfectly fine and 90% of the issue with them is there's a lot of elements that don't make sense unless you watch the Other Matrix film yes the Anamatrix everyone I know who has had problems with the sequels I have said watch the Anamatrix and things will slot into place, OR if not fully then watch 2 & 3 again. The big issue is The Anamatrix introduces some of the new characters and does a fair bit of explanation about the world

On the Trailer:
There's always been quite a number of references to Alice in Wonderland in The Matrix and so it all seems fitting to have that stuff come up again. I'm going to suggest this isn't a passing of the torch to a new lot of films this is it the end of the Matrix as it presently is as a franchise The Matrix Online had sort of 3 factions emerge "The System / the machines" the Zion faction and The Exiles (The Ghost twins the Vampire mob bosses etc) and among the human faction was The Kid (the Neo Fanboy first introduced in The Anamatrix and later in the 2nd film) who has a sort of almost religious group that believes Neo is still alive. The Blue pill to suppress peoples abilities to see through the system would be consistent with the Athletes story (again The Anamatrix) The Blue haired girl I'm going to take a big guess about her being he daughter of Ghost (Enter the Matrix).

So I'd better explain why I think this is the last Matrix film at least in terms of the present arcs and Matrix as we know it. The Wachowskis said so. No really just not directly. The Matrix The Path of Neo actually has the Wachowskis come on near the end and explain that the whole Neo doing a noble sacrifice to save humanity stuff is a bit crap for a video game ending so the game gives you a different ending so on some level the Wachowskis can be seen to not exactly think the ending they chose was the best one or the end point they really wanted and the new trailer suggest this is a sort of attempt to tie things up better.

So lets kick off the big major spoiler It's NOT Trinity as such it's the machines trying to basically save Trinity from death and the Trinity in the trailer is basically machine code likely considered an Exile program or similar as at 1:25 you see her code glitch. The thing being we also get show Trinity is Pregnant or the implied pregnancy stuff in the trailer suggesting which would bring up the idea that peace between the Humans and Machines could happen due to a child that's the combination of machine AI and human consciousness. This would also tie somewhat in to the ideas of symbolism around Christ and the Holy Grail and the Bloodline (See The Da Vinici Code) So if we take Neo as the Christ figure and Trinity somewhat as the Mary Magdalene figure then the saviour of humanity is their child, which if we're going to go super deep would then have the Oracle turn round and go "Told you that you weren't the One Neo" and have his child actually be the one because the Oracle said it would be some-one Trinity would love so a mothers love for her child. All this would also tie into the idea of the machines trying to evolve further who knows machines downloading into humans has already been shown so potential conflicts there. My guess is due to the weird splitting thing of Trinity at 2:06 is Trinity realising the various aspects of herself at a guess part of her human self patched up with system code and probably infected at some point with Exile code too.

As for Neo, well as from the 1st film we know he machines can create scenarios for people as the betrayer guy (name?) makes a deal with the machines to make him some wealthy high roller dude so while Neo is being repaired / in a coma the machines putting him into a mid level position somewhere would make sense. It's also explained in the first film that there needs to be some level of misery or people will rebel and the Matrix fails thus he's not some super hot shot running the company but like middle or upper management with a decent apartment so it's comfortable enough he doesn't try to break out due to the awful nature of his life (Part of how he was found in the first film) but also not so content his mind rebels against the system but even with all that the pills are used to help try to suppress his mind. It would also make sense for this to be the last Matrix film or the last in the present sort of arc because if we take the Neo = Christ metaphor further he has to rise again but he doesn't live on as such maybe he fades off to live somewhere with some sort of downloaded new version of Trinity or maybe the machines could only keep him alive not save him so he leaves the Matrix one last time to see reality and slowly dies maybe with the machines trying to fix the sky and so Neo feels sun on his skin for the first time ever and dies in the real world happy at the idea of the coming of a new age as such.

The man in the suit whose mouth goos up he's likely an Exile probably found Neo and is watching him because he's interesting to the Exiles but they can't act or the system will detect them and that's why he gets his mouth gooed up because he acted to help break Neo out of the controlled state.

The lack of lots of leather in the trailer is likely due to the fact Neo and New Trinity are civilian as such not aware of the Matrix as such because once you become aware then you get access to the leather jackets and stuff and hacker powers.
 

Ezekiel

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I like what this is saying. Freaking drones, all of you. Except YOU.
 

Piscian

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Apparently the latest rumor is that Neo himself is responsible for this current Matrix and intentionally lost his memory like its some kind of memento deal and the machines aren't necessarily the bad guys, Trinity and Morpheus are constructs.

One thing I keep hearing as I follow these trailer breakdowns and opinion videos is people saying they've softened on the 2&3 films. That they aren't as bad as people remember. I gotta disagree. I went back and rewatched the trilogy maybe a few months ago and I hated it for a variety of reasons even down to the aesthetics.

Theres a lot of scenes where even the clothes seemed impractical. Like it even bugged me when they have that ship captain meeting in matrix reloaded and everyone is dressed like they're in a french fashion show and wearing sun glasses in an almost totally dark room. Like wtf are you showing off for in this scene? WTF are you dressed like a halloween trick or treater for a military strategy meeting? I thought it was fun in the first Matrix. It was framed in such a way where it doesn't quite kill the immersion but they amped it up in the second and third films.

The real life clothes irritated me as well. In the first Matrix if you recall everyone wore plan gray utilitarian outfits. All the zion people wear these weird like tribal clothes and I couldn't help but think that the Wachoskis became more concerned with fashion than practically in the later films.

This extends to the story which felt very meandering and focused on ideation rather than grounding the story in reality enough to keep people feeling immersed. The first Matrix was very hard-edged and grounded in reality. People loved feeling like "man this really could happen in the future", then in the sequels its all about the Seraph and the oracle and the train master and the key maker bladiblahblahblah. They could have cut out all of that hokey highschool drama club theater bullshit and the rest of the story would have worked just fine. Its literally a film about technology and in perfect irony they ruined it with religious bs. Well that and a sweaty gross cave rave. At least wear some sandals...fuck!

Maybe that was all part of their whole sexual transition stuff idk. It did not work for me.
 
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Dwarvenhobble

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Apparently the latest rumor is that Neo himself is responsible for this current Matrix and intentionally lost his memory like its some kind of memento deal and the machines aren't necessarily the bad guys, Trinity and Morpheus are constructs.

One thing I keep hearing as I follow these trailer breakdowns and opinion videos is people saying they've softened on the 2&3 films. That they aren't as bad as people remember. I gotta disagree. I went back and rewatched the trilogy maybe a few months ago and I hated it for a variety of reasons even down to the aesthetics.

Theres a lot of scenes where even the clothes seemed impractical. Like it even bugged me when they have that ship captain meeting in matrix reloaded and everyone is dressed like they're in a french fashion show and wearing sun glasses in an almost totally dark room. Like wtf are you showing off for in this scene? WTF are you dressed like a halloween trick or treater for a military strategy meeting? I thought it was fun in the first Matrix. It was framed in such a way where it doesn't quite kill the immersion but they amped it up in the second and third films.

The real life clothes irritated me as well. In the first Matrix if you recall everyone wore plan gray utilitarian outfits. All the zion people wear these weird like tribal clothes and I couldn't help but think that the Wachoskis became more concerned with fashion than practically in the later films.

This extends to the story which felt very meandering and focused on ideation rather than grounding the story in reality enough to keep people feeling immersed. The first Matrix was very hard-edged and grounded in reality. People loved feeling like "man this really could happen in the future", then in the sequels its all about the Seraph and the oracle and the train master and the key maker bladiblahblahblah. They could have cut out all of that hokey highschool drama club theater bullshit and the rest of the story would have worked just fine. Its literally a film about technology and in perfect irony they ruined it with religious bs. Well that and a sweaty gross cave rave. At least wear some sandals...fuck!

Maybe that was all part of their whole sexual transition stuff idk. It did not work for me.
Did you watch the Anamatrix though before re-watching 2 & 3?
 

Hawki

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On The Matrix 2 & 3 being crap:
This is a common claim and while I'll say they have their issues I'll say I found them perfectly fine and 90% of the issue with them is there's a lot of elements that don't make sense unless you watch the Other Matrix film yes the Anamatrix everyone I know who has had problems with the sequels I have said watch the Anamatrix and things will slot into place, OR if not fully then watch 2 & 3 again. The big issue is The Anamatrix introduces some of the new characters and does a fair bit of explanation about the world
I'm not sure how that follows. Of all the shorts in The Animatrix, there's only two (IIRC) that actually tie-in with Reloaded, namely Final Flight of the Osiris, and Kid Story. Both of these plots points are adequately summized in Reloaded.
 
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Dwarvenhobble

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I'm not sure how that follows. Of all the shorts in The Animatrix, there's only two (IIRC) that actually tie-in with Reloaded, namely Final Flight of the Osiris, and Kid Story. Both of these plots points are adequately summized in Reloaded.
it also covers the Machine war and gives a bit more backstory to Trinity.
 

Hawki

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it also covers the Machine war and gives a bit more backstory to Trinity.
Neither of which are particuarly relevant to Reloaded. Second Renaissance is an origin story for the whole Matrix series, Detective Story deals with Trinity, but it doesn't tie-in with Reloaded, and it isn't clear when it occurs in relation to the films.
 
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BrawlMan

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One thing I keep hearing as I follow these trailer breakdowns and opinion videos is people saying they've softened on the 2&3 films. That they aren't as bad as people remember. I gotta disagree. I went back and rewatched the trilogy maybe a few months ago and I hated it for a variety of reasons even down to the aesthetics.
Maxilliam was one of those people. He said Reloaded and Revolution were not as bad as he remembers, but I hard disagree with him there. I find it funny that a lot of these people are coming out of the wood work with 4's announcement. Most of them would not dare to say it. So what the hell changed now? I'll give Max some credit as he held this stance in the mid 2010s at least.
 
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BrawlMan

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That picture is inaccurate. At least five of them should be on their smartphones. Not even looking at or thinking about the others.
Keep in mind, that picture was done before smartphones became widely popular and available.
 

Ezekiel

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I'm not sure what the guy above is talking about in saying the original Matrix was so grounded in reality. The whole movie is built on a prophecy. Well, three different prophecies, one for each of the heroes. That aspect to me is fantasy rather than science fiction.

I always liked Reloaded and Revolutions. Slightly less than The Matrix, but I appreciated how different they were and how they pulled the rug out from under Neo and the other characters by making the prophecy a lie. They're also remarkable technical achievements. I was wowed when I learned just a few years ago that they built a 1.25 mile freeway with a 19 foot wall for that chase.

Certainly there were missed opportunities and some head-scratching choices, but the suggestions I see tossed around by fans are usually even worse. Like making the real world another simulation. That worked for Fassbinder's World on a Wire, but I don't think The Matrix has the slow mystery for it. They're action movies with a simple love story that dabble in philosophy a bit. It would have been annoying. Based on some of the other kinds of complaints I've read over the years, it seems to me that many people just wanted more of the same from the sequels. I'm grateful they didn't do a Die Hard 2/Speed 2/Home Alone 2/Dirty Dozen: Next Mission.

I am seeing some people complain about Hugo Weaving not returning. Can't we just accept that Smith was destroyed? This is the problem with these kinds of sequels: bringing all the dead characters back with plot contrivances, so that the filmmakers can give people what they are familiar with.


It cheats the viewer of what happened before. It makes death and sacrifice meaningless.
 
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