Yes I do believe they should...and go make a book or a movie...or find someone else who can make a good game to go with there good story because plenty of games suffer from that...pyrus7 said:If a game with good gameplay but a crappy story should remove the story elements, then shouldn't a game with a good story but crappy gameplay remove the gameplay elements?
Takes a big man to admit when he's been had. And you have been had ever so gloriously. Let this be a finger waggling lession to you, young man! Always finish reading the article before challenging something it has to say.Not G. Ivingname said:Oh... I am a moron.Tom Phoenix said:Not G. Ivingname said:Excuse me?Shamus Young said:Took until comment #40 until we got one!Not G. Ivingname said:Umm... you thought Sonic Unleashed, the game that brought the most annoying character that the Sonic world has ever brought upon us, had a good story?Shamus Young said:Sonic Unleashedand
In any case, brilliant article, Shamus. I could not agree more with your thoughts.Shamus Young said:(Also, I was just trolling you with Sonic Unleashed. Let's see if anyone ragequits the article and comments without reading all the way through.)
I think the problem with game developers is that they are unwilling to pay for top quality storytelling. They are willing to hire top-of-the-line artists, voice actors, musicians.....but when it comes to story, they are content with using a scribble a developer made during lunch.
Basically, if they want to convey good stories, they need to start hiring people that will make good stories. They should not be content with merely making something up as they go along.
Not G. Ivingname said:Umm... you thought Sonic Unleashed, the game that brought the most annoying character that the Sonic world has ever brought upon us, had a good story?Shamus Young said:Sonic Unleashedand
^ Point and laugh kids. Point and laugh.TsunamiWombat said:SONIC. UNLEASHED!?
manwhat?
Well, I'd say that that says a lot about your articles and the The Escapist community. Crushing majority of people will read your articles through before commenting. That can't be a bad thing.Shamus Young said:Took until comment #40 until we got one!
I am sorryFiria said:Takes a big man to admit when he's been had. And you have been had ever so gloriously. Let this be a finger waggling lession to you, young man! Always finish reading the article before challenging something it has to say.Not G. Ivingname said:Oh... I am a moron.Tom Phoenix said:Not G. Ivingname said:Excuse me?Shamus Young said:Took until comment #40 until we got one!Not G. Ivingname said:Umm... you thought Sonic Unleashed, the game that brought the most annoying character that the Sonic world has ever brought upon us, had a good story?Shamus Young said:Sonic Unleashedand
In any case, brilliant article, Shamus. I could not agree more with your thoughts.Shamus Young said:(Also, I was just trolling you with Sonic Unleashed. Let's see if anyone ragequits the article and comments without reading all the way through.)
I think the problem with game developers is that they are unwilling to pay for top quality storytelling. They are willing to hire top-of-the-line artists, voice actors, musicians.....but when it comes to story, they are content with using a scribble a developer made during lunch.
Basically, if they want to convey good stories, they need to start hiring people that will make good stories. They should not be content with merely making something up as they go along.
HAHAH! I was just about to throw a BF before that line.Shamus said:(Also, I was just trolling you with Sonic Unleashed. Let's see if anyone ragequits the article and comments without reading all the way through.)
Nah, I don't remember reading anything about it. But yeah, I agree.Da Ork said:Fable 2 would be better without the main story...I haven't read any one else's comments so someone may have said that before me but anyway...
Madshaw said:i honestly couldn't tell if the sonic thing was a troll, i have no intrest in playing it and i wads rubbish at it as a kid and never really got into it. imagine if there was a story worth its salt in there, i'd never know
So... yeah.Shamus said:(Also, I was just trolling you with Sonic Unleashed. Let's see if anyone ragequits the article and comments without reading all the way through.)
TsunamiWombat said:Whenever I bang on my "this story sucks" drum I invariably get someone asking me, "Why don't you just go watch a movie if you want to see a story so bad?" Which seems to imply that you shouldn't expect good stories from games. But if you think videogame stories have to suck, then you've been playing the wrong games. KOTOR, Jade Empire, Thief, Prince of Persia: Sands of Time, Max Payne, Sonic Unleashed and the aforementioned Left 4 Dead all manage to deliver both engaging gameplay and a well-written story.
SONIC. UNLEASHED!?
manwhat?
That just sounds like a choose your own adventure book, I hate those. I feel there is no story in the L4D games. Thegame just likes to trick you into thinking that there is one.Gethsemani said:I won't argue Half-Life or Portal (since I think Half-Life had good storytelling for its' time, with 2 being rather bad and not having played Portal). But Left 4 Dead has a totally different idea of storytelling I think. The idea is not that we are to follow the outbreak or get to see how it is handled or anything. The idea is that the players build their own Survival Horror story throughout the episodes being played.PedroSteckecilo said:Either or really, my dislike comes in the form of people feeling that Portal, Half-Life and Left 4 Dead tell "TEH BEST STORAIZ EVAR!" considering they barely have characters, barely have dialogue and barely have plots. What they have is good storytelling, not good stories in and of themselves. I guess it's a "Just because a game doesn't have cutscenes doesn't mean it's brilliant" gut reaction.Crunchy English said:I'm having a hard time discerning what kind of story telling you actually like. Just to clarify, what methods tell a decent story in your opinion? Legend of Zelda's cutscenes at regular intervals maybe? or do you prefer the on-the-fly dialogue of say, Uncharted 2?
Even then I suppose this was a mostly a misdirected rant at Multiplayer Storytelling.
When you play a game like Jade Empire you are supposed to say things like "And I totally did not see the plot twist coming! It was awesome!". When you play Left 4 Dead the idea is that you are supposed to say "And then he went down just as a wave spawned and we were three people with only handguns who had to protect the guy who was on the ground in the middle of the room! It was F-ING EPIC!"
In roleplaying terms (since I am a game master myself) it is the difference between White Wolfs Storytelling system and its' heavy focus on narrative and Dungeon crawling in a classical D&D session. One is all about telling an engaging story, the other is all about making a memorable experience.
I strongly recommend Planescapse:Torment for your symptoms.Uncompetative said:I hate Story in games.
Oh, God yes. Hideo Kojima and David Jaffe should read this.Uncompetative said:Too many AAA titles seem to be developed not by video game designers, but by frustrated film directors.
Even though the concept of reward can be debated and subverted.Uncompetative said:A game is a system of rules supporting your interactive participation that may involve some challenge and/or discovery yielding a "reward".