The WoW Killer has finally arrived

[Aeshi]

People want WoW dead because due to the massive popularity of the game (note: popularity, not quality, it is popularity that defines industry benchmarks, not quality), it set a benchmark for the MMO industry to try and emulate that style of game in order to actually sell copies and this kind of "WoW Cloning" despite being repeatedly proven to not fucking work in most cases, was continually tried to the degree where MMO's have grown incredibly stale and boring. The lion's share of the market it continues to hold is holding back the genre's progression.

It follows a similar line of logic that people want an actually quality console shooter to be a "CoD-killer" so that Call of Duty will stop setting the benchmark for the industry and so they'll start producing more worthwhile games rather than just shitting out generic modern military games, so to it that people want companies to stop shitting out generic hot-key MMO's.

And if WoW were to die, "the MMO industry" would all start creating new progressive MMOs with their hitherto-unused originality, would they?

Hate to break it to you, but you can't force people to be original, and if they couldn't be assed to be original when it could make their MMO a Snowflake on a piece of black paper then I highly doubt they'll try to be original when it'll make their MMO a Snowflake in a Snowstorm.

If WoW/CoD dies people will just take the next most popular MMO/FPS and start to endlessly clone that until they're the ones "Holding back progression" instead. Or do you want us to start ritually sacrificing the currently most popular MMO every few months/years just to spite the industry?

 

[Schmeiser]

So they finally revived world pvp and you cry about that? Holy shit world pvp was so dead for the last 2 expansions even though i don't play wow anymore i'd love this feature

 

[Keltrick]

I had heard this was causing a massive shit storm, it sounds like wow is trying to do a similar thing to guild wars 2 with "overflow" servers but hasn't quite got it right.

From what you have said if PVE players are being dumped onto a PVP realm temporarily that is gonna make some people fucking mad lol i mean ganking is irritating anyway but if you don't even know its going to happen as your used to PVE realms? man thats gonna boil yur blood.

As stated in Lord of Insanity's post, that came a little after this one, this does not happen. PvP, PvE, RP, RPPvP, are all only crossed with servers of their own kind

EDIT: Accidentally quoted another post as well, that was unrelated. Removed*. Apologies.

 

[GamingAwesome1]

People want WoW dead because due to the massive popularity of the game (note: popularity, not quality, it is popularity that defines industry benchmarks, not quality), it set a benchmark for the MMO industry to try and emulate that style of game in order to actually sell copies and this kind of "WoW Cloning" despite being repeatedly proven to not fucking work in most cases, was continually tried to the degree where MMO's have grown incredibly stale and boring. The lion's share of the market it continues to hold is holding back the genre's progression.

It follows a similar line of logic that people want an actually quality console shooter to be a "CoD-killer" so that Call of Duty will stop setting the benchmark for the industry and so they'll start producing more worthwhile games rather than just shitting out generic modern military games, so to it that people want companies to stop shitting out generic hot-key MMO's.

And if WoW were to die, "the MMO industry" would all start creating new progressive MMOs with their hitherto-unused originality, would they?

Hate to break it to you, but you can't force people to be original, and if they couldn't be assed to be original when it could make their MMO a Snowflake on a piece of black paper then I highly doubt they'll try to be original when it'll make their MMO a Snowflake in a Snowstorm.

If WoW/CoD dies people will just take the next most popular MMO/FPS and start to endlessly clone that until they're the ones "Holding back progression" instead. Or do you want us to start ritually sacrificing the currently most popular MMO every few months/years just to spite the industry?

I'm aware that even if WoW died, the industry wouldn't start instantly putting out golden games, I'm not that naive. But WoW's stranglehold on the market is kind of stifling to original design, it's not the only factor by any means, but it certainly isn't helping.

And your point about everyone just cloning the next one most popular. The thing about this kind of benchmark setting is that it works for a while, iteration is good and with everyone trying to improve on the formula you can occasionally produce something even better than the original and then people iterate on that and a cycle of improvement occurs, in theory at least.

The problem occurs when one game stays as the benchmark for several years to the point where the market gets saturated, I don't like hot key MMO's but there is nothing inherently wrong with them. What is wrong is the fact there's so many outputted over the course of WoW's dominance and it's stagnating the genre and making it boring for a lot of people. People, however continue to play WoW because they have much invested in the game, friends and time etc. The normal cycle of iteration works fine with ordinary games but with MMO's where people get heavily invested in their MMO's and just can't play two of them at once, it doesn't.

As ludicrous as you seem to think this idea is, this benchmark shit by necessity does need to cycle games every few years and does cycle every few years, people get bored and move on to a new game and the cycle thus continues. Due to the above stated problem where people just don't move on from MMO's as quickly as they would from most other kinds of game, we have a very real problem where one popular game can effectively gum the genre's works for several years at a time and it's a very real and kind of distressing problem for any MMO dev wishing to take a stab at it in any form.

 

[aceman67]

I don't see this happening. MoP, love or hate the idea of it, is actually quality content. I've immensely enjoyed what i've played so far (the Pandaren starting zone, and Jade Forest Alliance side)

As for CRZ, I don't really have an issue with it so far. its nice being able to level through zones that just a few months before would have been devoid of any life. As for Corpse Camping, I only have to tell you this: This isn't a new issue, this has been happening on PVP servers for years since wow first launched. Don't want to be ganked, don't flag yourself for PVP or play on PVP servers. You only have yourself to blaim for playing under those circumstances (Flagged for PVP or playing on PVP servers).

TLDR;

MoP has been good so far.

Go QQ somewhere else. its your own fault for playing on a PVP server.

 

[Extasii]

A few things that are wrong with this thread.

1) Cross Realm Zones only interact with the same type of realm. A RP realm is only crossed with other RP realms, while PvP realms are crossed with fellow PvP realms. Same with PvE and other types of realms. PvE crossing with PvP does not happen. Blizzard made it clear that only same type realms will cross with each other.

2) Cross Realm Zoning is only for low population areas. Northern Barrens has maybe six, seven people in the entire zone? You'll soon be seeing people from other realms then whenever you reach a town area.

3) The only real problem with CRZ is that you'll end up fighting over mineral nodes once in a while.

While CRZing is interesting in concept and implementation, there are too many realms and too many high leveled people for it to ultimately work like Blizzard wants. Alts are nice and all, but a lot of players like sticking to one, maybe two, characters.

This sums it up perfectly, i see no problem with this and actually i prefer to see other people whilst leveling my alts, instead of feeling like the game has left me behind.

Totally agreed. It's pretty nice going through the BC leveling content and actually seeing more than one Death Knight for 10 levels.

 

[Fasckira]

So it survived the pandas then? Im pretty sure I read a few threads not long ago about people claiming the pandas would kill WoW, and yet its still going.

Doubt WoW will ever get killed, it'll most likely end up like UO - just fading slowly off into the sunset as the next generation of gamers dont bother signing up.

 

[DugMachine]

Christ what is with this "WOW IS HOLDING THE GENRE BACK" argument? If developers came up with their own unique ideas and didn't just try to copy/paste WoW mechanics to try and cash in then we could move foward. The only one to blame is the developers for making shit WoW clones.

WoW is doing it's own thing and being very successful. They have a tight grip on the market and until someone starts moving foward (kind of like GW2 or so I've been hearing) then we can see progress. But if lazy developers want to keep copying then so be it but just don't blame WoW. Greedy fucks that are in it for the money are the ones to blame.

 

[Tomeran]

There's no quick death to the behemoth, unless someone descides to continusly trigger EMPs at the blizzard server farms.

I was a long-time WoW player(roughly 6-7 years) and I can recall a fair few events that was properly stamped as "WoW killing incidents", including the release of every major competing mmorpg title(Age of Conan, Warhammer online, SWTOR and Rift perhaps standing as the biggest names there, but there are others) and stuff like battlegroup PvP, cataclysms many problems, MoP looking like rubbish and a laugh in the face of WoW's storyline and of course, the dreaded "Real identity to sign up on the WoW community forums"-stuff. That last one spawned a community outrage that numbered in millions of posts and it barely had an effect on sub numbers.

So yeah, I wouldnt overstate the effect of this.

All that being said, WoW has slowly but surely been loosing its status symbol as untouchable, because its been bleeding subscriptions for a -long time- now. Its still a giant by any definition, its just not as "oh my god its unstoppable"-big anymore like it was at its peak at WoTLK.

Personally, I quit when I heard MoP was announced. I thought it was a joke at first, but when I realized it wasnt, and that the content presented seemed like really scrape-of-the-barrel-stuff, I just left. And that wasnt easy, seeing as warcrack isnt the easiest stuff to just lay on the shelf when you have half your social circle playing it and you've been doing it for more then half a decade. This is probably the case for many more then me, and my guess it would be one of the reasons many still play it.

 

[excalipoor]

Snip

I never said it's harder. I said it's just as easy.

Twilight Highlands grants about 70k experience per quest, 100k for end-of-chain quests. Nevermind that, you'll always be doing 2-5 quests at a time instead of just the one. Each lvl 85 mob grants about 2500 experience, and each gathering node grants twice that. Gathering skills and Archaeology in particular are just ridiculous for leveling. I don't remember how much you get from exploration, but I'd say about 5-10k. And there's a whole lot of spots to discover.

Of course, if you're playing casually, you'll be Rested for double experience from mobs, exploration and gathering. Enter Twilight Highlands at level 84, Rested, do an instance or two while running through it, and you'll be 85 before you're halfway done with the zone. It is a terribly tedious zone, and the only possible choice for endgame leveling, I'll give you that. But Cataclysm was more about revamping the old world rather than the new zones.

You're also neglecting to mention that leveling in GW2 doesn't stop at 80, as you'll still need experience for skill points. And that the experience curves in WoW are steeper, so comparing 80 in GW2 and 85 in WoW is meaningless. Levels 82-85 are the only ones where you'll really start to feel the curve (at least it was so in Cata, I haven't touched Mists yet). The numbers aren't applicable. Compare play times instead, if you're so inclined. But I'm of the opinion that leveling content is content just the same as endgame PvP or raiding, and calling it a grind (unless it literally is that) means you're looking at it wrong. Besides, endgame is where the real grind begins, for both GW2 and WoW.

 

[Eddie the head]

Cataclysm killed WoW for me. I don't care if I am the only one who doesn't like it anymore, it's dead to me.

 

[Eddie the head]

So it survived the pandas then? Im pretty sure I read a few threads not long ago about people claiming the pandas would kill WoW, and yet its still going.

Doubt WoW will ever get killed, it'll most likely end up like UO - just fading slowly off into the sunset as the next generation of gamers dont bother signing up.

The world ends not in a bang but a wimpier. I think that was form "The Hollow Men." Although they are talking about the real world I would say it has applicability to this.

 

[Mr Companion]

I never played Wow, but I do love how people keep prophesising the "wow killer" and that various companies are always attempting to engineer such a thing. Its like Wow has a contract on its head and is constantly pursued by indadequite assassins every year. Say what you like about Wow, but it has a very high bounty on its head.