Thinking about it, what is the stupidest fictional thing ever?

EyeReaper

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Ooh, I gots a good one. In the early 1900's steam power is used to create giant robots to fight Ghosts. the elite team of pilots are also the staff of a theater, and the team includes: a cowgirl, an androgynous girl, a samurai, Dora the Explorer, A psychic Medic, and a lawyer.
Basically, Broadway Steam Machines vs. Japanese Ghost Warlords
 

NightmareWarden

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Casual Shinji said:
The Skullknight not just killing Griffith when he was still a human, thereby avoiding the flipping apocalypse. That's one thing I never really got about Berserk.

The dude obviously knows way ahead of time that Griffith is to join the Godhand. And even if he doesn't know about his rebirth as the fucking anti-Christ on Earth, him joining the Godhand should be enough to want to avoid it. You could agrue he has his own agenda, in using the Eclispe ceremony to break into Hell and get a piece of Void, but still...

Thanks for being a dick, Skullknight.
I'm going to assume that you've read the manga. I haven't seen the anime so I can't comment on that. If you haven't read the anime, this might be full of spoilers:
You know how the Skull Knight rarely tries to encourage Guts? How he is willing to help him and he notes how hard Guts struggles, yet he isn't really on the same team? As far as I can tell, this is because what Guts is attempting to do (stop/kill femto) is supposed to be impossible. Prior to noticing the anti-demon properties Guts' Dragonslayer eventually developed, the knight seemed to think Guts was hopeless, crazy, and pitiful. The fact that Guts was becoming strong enough to actually be a factor in the fate of the world (in terms of the God Hand's mysterious plans) was shocking to him. He learned this long after the eclipse; before that knowledge, why (besides for the sake of helping people) would he risk his endgame for the sake of saving people from eclipse?

Before the eclipse he was alone in his efforts, working his own angle towards whatever goal his fancy sword involves. Unlike Guts, he believes in destiny and fate. Perhaps Guts' strength is starting to waver his belief in fate, but he seemed to know the prophecy beforehand. It seems like he was trying to do something for the greater good during the eclipse, but I can't say what...
 

Eldritch Warlord

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Jasper van Heycop said:
An almighty being of pure malevolence, transfers his powers into a tiny golden ring and then dies when someone cuts it of his fingers. So wait you become weaker by making an all powerful jewel? I mean most people survive having their fingers lopped off, but not the Supreme Evil?
Sauron didn't weaken himself by pouring energy into the One Ring such that he would "die" if it were taken from him. It did make him stronger and that was how he was able to survive the Downfall of Númenor.
 

Atmos Duality

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YingDerpington said:
The second one sounds a hell of a lot like Dirge of Cerberus, but I haven't played that since it came out, and very stupid video game sums it up almost entirely. The first is entirely unknown to me.
Correct. The second description is indeed Dirge of Stairs Cerberus.
The first is from a schlocky holiday-themed film.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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FalloutJack said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
Okay, open discussion.
If any force around there has superior numbers, it really doesn't show it as well as it could or should. If they two armies have been fighting like hell over the Hoover Dam this long, then neither one of them has an overwhlming amount of numbers over the other. There is no shortage of gun power in the Mojave, and an undisclosed amount of vertibirds. Now, I know that vertibirds are not invulnerable. I've blown some up. However, mostly you need rocket launchers or better to actually down one. The Legion might have some of this stuff. Hell, one of their top commanders may have even been saving a fatboy for a rainy day. Not likely, though. I say you can go and bomb most Legion camps with impunity, like the Enola Gay of old.

That said, I cannot stress enough the way in which the bullet has dominated in war. Legion armor is also crap. It's not designed to withstand the bullets. I can guarantee that a small team of gun-toting vigilantes can overpower a large Legion force. And if not, then hey...Mr. Courier...how are you still standing? Okay, he's the main character, but I actually died to NCR gunfire before during an accidental discharge. The Legion couldn't handle my guy buck naked.
Ya but if they out numbered the enclave 5-10 to one the enclave would have limped to victory instead of sprinted.Notice how the legion patrols tend to have twice the number as the NCR.


At under level 10 the legion assassins over powered me every time. Heck even now at lvl 22 with high gun skill and luck its 50/50 if I am alone and I am wearing power armor(on PC on very hard), even tho I managed to take out the Nipton guys only because you can dodge spears in real time and there were houses to hide behind still was a very hard fight not so much luck with most close range gun fights too(even worse with death claws who can run with crippled legs now) tho this is the first FO game I could not strictly solo in on high difficulty.


So I can't discount the legion as a threat, not raided their side of the river yet but the assassins have been mixed in weapons used tho a few of their own raiding parties are woefully under powered against the traveling merchants they attack. Also I have yet to see them start to take the Mojave like the Super Mutants did in FO1. I hear after a quest they start a hard push across the Mojave.

All in all I think the legion only gives guns to non fodder class fighters and their forces have yet to really build up to fight the NCR whose the main established power in the area.

Tho if you look at it from the bigger picture the NCR has the advantage but I can not help but think the final conflict(outside the scope of the game) would be different. IE the Legion would be armed with guns but the low level fodder class would probably still use spears and swords.

Tho in the game the main thing keeping the NCR from taking the legion in the area is they are spread too thin policing and protecting to much if it was not because of that the legion would have no chance of winning.
 

FalloutJack

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Nov 20, 2008
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ZippyDSMlee said:
The old stand-by: Who would win in a fight?
I'm fairly certain that most cases of primitive-but-effective against most anyone toting powersuits, laser gatling guns, and of course plasma weapons is going to have not a phyrric, but a clear-cut victory in the case of the powersuit brigade. But the question of Enclave is neither here nor there. We're talking New California Republic. So!

The first thing I should acknowledge is that I am slightly-coloring this with my incredible ability to kill things in the wasteland, earning me multiple levels of Lord of Death in short order. I shouldn't speak of any side's abilities in reference to my own, because I shoot ALOT of things. That said, I've actually sat there and watched two sides duking it out as well. The usual case of something attacking the NCR patrols is that they raise their guns, they shoot at it until it dies, and they return to their duty. The time it takes for a Legion acolyte or something to do the running towards them, he could be dead before the spear lands, if it ever flies.

Okay, let's take Camp Forelorn Hope. There is a mission where you go there and you do things for these guys, but most importantly you help them out with their constant assault of Legion SOBs from an encampment. Now, I was figuring that this was going to be a terrible fight where everyone but me ends up dead in the first few seconds, and then perhaps I get dead too from overwhelming numbers. This was before I really understood that the Legion weren't all that great. I led the charge, chose my targets, and the guys following me cleaned up almost as well as I did. I think maybe one of them died from a spear to the face. While I was raiding all of the bodies, I wondered what in the hell the big deal was all about. Here I was, thinking we'd all - you know - die...and we were all badasses. Not just me, but them too.

I think, if anything, the thing holding NCR back is not them, but itself. I don't think their leadership is any good. They phased out the Tandi stuff and that made me sad. I think Caesar successfully got them to shit their pants because of brutal cutthroat attacks and propaganda, not actual power. The truth is, I think the Jackals are a greater threat, brutallity and technology, no regard for human life while living in an operational VAULT. I have a feeling that if the Legion were as powerful and as numerous as claimed, they'd march thousands west, kill their fill, and be done with it. The REAL Romans did that. These are just low-brained butchers.
 

Therumancer

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Nov 28, 2007
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Alhazred said:
Gunblades, i.e. weapons that combine a melee weapon and a firearm within the same object, are of 'sounds mathematically good on paper, turns out to be completely retarded' area of stupidity.

As far as I know, part of the reason why guns are designed the way they are is to deal with the recoil of essentially setting off a small explosion in your hand. So what happens when you put this in something not equipped to deal with the recoil? A load of broken hand bones, that's what. And this is without even considering the weight issues, or accidentally shooting yourself.

These weapons are all over the place in Roosterteeth's very stupid anime-inspired series RWBY, where just about everyone seems to have one of the fucking things. The dumbest of the lot belongs to the main character, combining a scythe (already a decidedly impractical weapon) with some sort of high-powered rifle. And is wielded by a girl about half its size. And to top it all off, she says she made it herself! Did she download the plans off the internet or something?
Errr, well Gunblades exist, Italy it seems was REALLY fond of them. I've visited a number of museums that have had them (and lots of them) on display like "The Higgen's Armory Museum". Now granted these are NOT the typical Anime gunblade or anything modern, they also having been intended for use in very close quarters fighting, the idea that you could pretty much drop some dude running up to swordfight you and still have your sword in hand pretty much.

What's more the concept of the "Bayonet" has lead to some interesting developments that could only be called gunblades. Military organizations of course kept it simple, putting basically a dagger/spearpoint onto a gun and intended them to be used en-masse in formation. On the other hand various explorers, adventurers, warriors, etc.. (many of whom were not famous) seemed to love having their own custom weapons, some of which made it into museums, we're talking cases where someone might have what amounts to double edged axe attached to his gun, the basic idea is that when out of bullets instead of just clubbing someone with it he could pretty much use it as a battle axe. Allegedly the weight of the axe blade also helped compensate for the recoil a bit too.

It seems like most of the elaborate personal weapons you see are largely inspired by what real life adventurers and such did during the age of exploration/conquest, etc... albeit made a bit more exciting for fantasy. Sure, a Sythe blade attached to a rifle isn't really going to be workable for example, but that's kind of one step removed from something someone actually did. Personalized weapons are fine IMO and the crazy ones simply require a bit of suspension of disbelief, I tend to mostly find it eyerolling when you see really exotic weapons supposedly put into mass production for military use as opposed to being the product of individual/independent warriors, since by and large the point of a military and mass weapon production is to keep things simple. That more than anything is my problem with things like the "Chainsaw Gun" and the like, I mean teaching people to break down and reassemble regular guns is hard enough when they have no base of knowledge, add on complicated motorized functions and everything else and your just asking for trouble, a military that requires Private Bob to basically have detailed knowledge of engineering and gunsmithing to perform maitenance on his weapons in the field has problems.
 

Hoplon

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Mar 31, 2010
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super_mega_ultra said:
1. Humanity will one day be smart enough to invent perfect medical pods that can remove cancer and other illness is seconds, yet thinks it would be a great business idea only to allow a select few to take advantage of this great new technology.
You are aware that the private medical industry does that now right?
 

Therumancer

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Nov 28, 2007
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FalloutJack said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
The old stand-by: Who would win in a fight?
I'm fairly certain that most cases of primitive-but-effective against most anyone toting powersuits, laser gatling guns, and of course plasma weapons is going to have not a phyrric, but a clear-cut victory in the case of the powersuit brigade. But the question of Enclave is neither here nor there. We're talking New California Republic. So!

The first thing I should acknowledge is that I am slightly-coloring this with my incredible ability to kill things in the wasteland, earning me multiple levels of Lord of Death in short order. I shouldn't speak of any side's abilities in reference to my own, because I shoot ALOT of things. That said, I've actually sat there and watched two sides duking it out as well. The usual case of something attacking the NCR patrols is that they raise their guns, they shoot at it until it dies, and they return to their duty. The time it takes for a Legion acolyte or something to do the running towards them, he could be dead before the spear lands, if it ever flies.

Okay, let's take Camp Forelorn Hope. There is a mission where you go there and you do things for these guys, but most importantly you help them out with their constant assault of Legion SOBs from an encampment. Now, I was figuring that this was going to be a terrible fight where everyone but me ends up dead in the first few seconds, and then perhaps I get dead too from overwhelming numbers. This was before I really understood that the Legion weren't all that great. I led the charge, chose my targets, and the guys following me cleaned up almost as well as I did. I think maybe one of them died from a spear to the face. While I was raiding all of the bodies, I wondered what in the hell the big deal was all about. Here I was, thinking we'd all - you know - die...and we were all badasses. Not just me, but them too.

I think, if anything, the thing holding NCR back is not them, but itself. I don't think their leadership is any good. They phased out the Tandi stuff and that made me sad. I think Caesar successfully got them to shit their pants because of brutal cutthroat attacks and propaganda, not actual power. The truth is, I think the Jackals are a greater threat, brutallity and technology, no regard for human life while living in an operational VAULT. I have a feeling that if the Legion were as powerful and as numerous as claimed, they'd march thousands west, kill their fill, and be done with it. The REAL Romans did that. These are just low-brained butchers.

Errr, well, after having met Caesar I got the impression that he was very loosely (very, very loosely) based on Milo Morai from Robert Adam's "Horseclans", and that his faction was never actually explored in the intended detail, including the brutality, slavery, and logic/morality that went along with it. Perhaps because it was decided that it would be too controversial and seem like they were trying to sell some things that they weren't if they did (Robert Adams himself had to put some disclaimers into his own books once in a while). As a result the overall equasion was never really broken down or explained well, and really there is only so much that can be conveyed by the current technology and AI.

In Horseclans half the point is that they wind up going up against far more technologically advanced forces and winning. Milo himself (in addition to being psionic and basically immortal to an extent similar to the guys from Highlander) knows a LOT about technology and modern tactics much like Caesar, but intentionally chooses not to have his current society based on it in rising from the ashes because he doesn't want them to depend on it. The basic argument being that his group of Barbarians pretty much live entirely off the land, and in skirmishes and such use stealth and the like to take down their enemies. They have little need for supply lines on a small scale, and pretty much everyone is a warrior due to the values of the culture. When it comes to massive battles, the leadership being familiar with technology means that they have the means to counter it by using "primitive means" you basically don't see these guys mindlessly panicing under the threat of "thundersticks" or whatever, and very much using their own siege engines and
the like. Of course to be fair The Horseclans also use psionically guided mutant elephants, telepathic (and sentinent) warcats, and it does help that the actual undying lords are nearly impossible to kill can fry people with their brains. Fallout doesn't really get much into the concept of "beneficial mutations" other than perhaps with the ghouls.

The point I'm getting at here is that as it's presented in Fallout the situation seems similar enough o have been inspired by that, with the "modern" military rivals being largely being dudes armed with assault rifles and guns, and typically only very specific groups of special forces operatives having the same kind of competence and individual abilities that the legions take for granted. Sure half a dozen guys in primitive armor running at a fortified position is a death wish, but in theory the legion should largely be acting a bit more stealthily in disputed territory, and when it comes to larger scale operations I'd imagine would be bringing out catapults and other weapons that are disdained by a more modern force, which also being post apocalyptic doesn't happen to maintain any technological equivilents due to there not being much in the way of tanks and stuff in circulation.

It should also be noted that for all of his semi-anti-tech approach Caesar also acted like Milo in that he seems to keep plenty of tech close at hand just in case, a lot of the elite troops and such using things like the "Ballistic Fists" and the like which pretty much means having an elite group of enemies in powered armor or something might play havoc with the general rank and file, but he's going to have his own elite forces packing enough tech to counter them.

This is all speculation on my part, because really, even in the design notes, it seems like the concept of the legion wasn't ever really explored, and it shallowness seems to be covered by the game more or less discouraging you to side with that faction (though you still can).

There are ways to justify it being a threat on the level presented, there was pretty much a whole series of books (as I mentioned) based loosely around the theme of a guy with modern knowledge dominating a post apocalyptic world by building a civilization of neo-barbarians, which in turn came into conflict with hold outs from the old world, other barbarians, mutants, and whatever else.
 

FalloutJack

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Nov 20, 2008
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Therumancer said:
I could understand, outside the box, what it could actually be and mean, but I dunno if all the stuff actually happening will bear that out. There is, after all, a huge difference between the Fallout world and the Legion and that book. If anything, it would be better to say that indeed the people who worked on the game kinda' goofed. They just didn't detail it enough to make it viable. Perhaps maybe they could have, but I dunno. the point of the whole discussion is to explicate the ridiculousness of the build and I believe we have.
 

Vegosiux

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A sheep-powered raygun. That only works with one specific sheep, and only if the said sheep is alive. Stupid as hell. And it's awesome.
 

rcs619

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Mar 26, 2011
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Boudicca, Queen of the Celts, invades and sacks Rome with her barbarian horde and legions of war elephants.

Ryse is such a dumb game. They could have at least looked at Boudicca's article on wikipedia before they had the celts of all people sack Rome with war elephants of all things.
 

florzk

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Feb 5, 2011
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the idea of a "destined hero." big reason i despise halo 4.
it's just so... so... lazy and contrived; its like a writer just goes, "hmm... how do i write a good protagonist so that the audience (who are, of course, as intelligent as autistic baboons) know who they are supposed to root for? DURRWAHURR DESTINEEEEE!! HE ARE HERO CUZ GAWD SAY SO! YOU LIEK HIM!" ok, not necessarily god, but... you get the point. also, on a similar note, i hate villains who acknowledge and unapologetically revel in their evilness.

.... also, attack on titan. i just hate it. that's all.
 

Shoggoth2588

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Aug 31, 2009
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The fact that Magic isn't infinite seems stupid. When you limit magic it kind of defeats the purpose of magic. When Magic has rules that's one thing but to make it limited/finite and yet you're still calling it magic instead of technology, it just seems dumb...I can turn that around too: Penny's book from Inspector Gadget or, The Turtle Phone from the 80's/90's run of the series are fucking magical and so is every other technical device used by fictional characters without a thought to energy levels, reception, internet connectivity, etc.

---

When plan A fails but there is a magical plan B that is simpler, set up faster and, ultimately goes off without a hitch.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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FalloutJack said:
Ah sorry about my rambling I haz a broken streaming conscious. ><

I did say limp to victory instead of running. LOL

And when the enemy has sniper rifles and sub machine guns it becomes less clear, even more so when they are shooting at the fodder first. And that is how I see the legion working in full scale war. But yes the NCR dose have an advantage.

NV has kinda made me a sniper I use to be all about automatics but they are crap or at least on very hard your armor is paper thin so you do not survive gun fights well, I have the dog the eye bot and Veronica(can't seem to have her talk to the damn brotherhood about her unmarked quest so she can leave >

I still think what we see of the legion is just a foothold in the region not the main force but I do admit they are not well used in the game, they should be everywhere like raiders with small raiding parties spawning regularly but without that you have to wonder why they are such a threat.

You mean the fiends the jackles do not have a base of operations as far as I know. Tho half the time the raiders are the same as the Legion as most have melee weapons.The Fiends can't even unlock low level locks in the vault not to mention they are so strung out on drugs they can not accomplish much

And ya I forgot to bring that up that the NCR can't do much because they thin themselves out to much.

All in all I think the legion is poorly represented in the game which can make them seem like nothing. Then again they did make alliances with the Khans and the Fiends I guess they(the devs) thought that would be enough to go against the NCR?
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Therumancer said:
FalloutJack said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
The old stand-by: Who would win in a fight?
I'm fairly certain that most cases of primitive-but-effective against most anyone toting powersuits, laser gatling guns, and of course plasma weapons is going to have not a phyrric, but a clear-cut victory in the case of the powersuit brigade. But the question of Enclave is neither here nor there. We're talking New California Republic. So!

The first thing I should acknowledge is that I am slightly-coloring this with my incredible ability to kill things in the wasteland, earning me multiple levels of Lord of Death in short order. I shouldn't speak of any side's abilities in reference to my own, because I shoot ALOT of things. That said, I've actually sat there and watched two sides duking it out as well. The usual case of something attacking the NCR patrols is that they raise their guns, they shoot at it until it dies, and they return to their duty. The time it takes for a Legion acolyte or something to do the running towards them, he could be dead before the spear lands, if it ever flies.

Okay, let's take Camp Forelorn Hope. There is a mission where you go there and you do things for these guys, but most importantly you help them out with their constant assault of Legion SOBs from an encampment. Now, I was figuring that this was going to be a terrible fight where everyone but me ends up dead in the first few seconds, and then perhaps I get dead too from overwhelming numbers. This was before I really understood that the Legion weren't all that great. I led the charge, chose my targets, and the guys following me cleaned up almost as well as I did. I think maybe one of them died from a spear to the face. While I was raiding all of the bodies, I wondered what in the hell the big deal was all about. Here I was, thinking we'd all - you know - die...and we were all badasses. Not just me, but them too.

I think, if anything, the thing holding NCR back is not them, but itself. I don't think their leadership is any good. They phased out the Tandi stuff and that made me sad. I think Caesar successfully got them to shit their pants because of brutal cutthroat attacks and propaganda, not actual power. The truth is, I think the Jackals are a greater threat, brutallity and technology, no regard for human life while living in an operational VAULT. I have a feeling that if the Legion were as powerful and as numerous as claimed, they'd march thousands west, kill their fill, and be done with it. The REAL Romans did that. These are just low-brained butchers.

Errr, well, after having met Caesar I got the impression that he was very loosely (very, very loosely) based on Milo Morai from Robert Adam's "Horseclans", and that his faction was never actually explored in the intended detail, including the brutality, slavery, and logic/morality that went along with it. Perhaps because it was decided that it would be too controversial and seem like they were trying to sell some things that they weren't if they did (Robert Adams himself had to put some disclaimers into his own books once in a while). As a result the overall equasion was never really broken down or explained well, and really there is only so much that can be conveyed by the current technology and AI.

In Horseclans half the point is that they wind up going up against far more technologically advanced forces and winning. Milo himself (in addition to being psionic and basically immortal to an extent similar to the guys from Highlander) knows a LOT about technology and modern tactics much like Caesar, but intentionally chooses not to have his current society based on it in rising from the ashes because he doesn't want them to depend on it. The basic argument being that his group of Barbarians pretty much live entirely off the land, and in skirmishes and such use stealth and the like to take down their enemies. They have little need for supply lines on a small scale, and pretty much everyone is a warrior due to the values of the culture. When it comes to massive battles, the leadership being familiar with technology means that they have the means to counter it by using "primitive means" you basically don't see these guys mindlessly panicing under the threat of "thundersticks" or whatever, and very much using their own siege engines and
the like. Of course to be fair The Horseclans also use psionically guided mutant elephants, telepathic (and sentinent) warcats, and it does help that the actual undying lords are nearly impossible to kill can fry people with their brains. Fallout doesn't really get much into the concept of "beneficial mutations" other than perhaps with the ghouls.

The point I'm getting at here is that as it's presented in Fallout the situation seems similar enough o have been inspired by that, with the "modern" military rivals being largely being dudes armed with assault rifles and guns, and typically only very specific groups of special forces operatives having the same kind of competence and individual abilities that the legions take for granted. Sure half a dozen guys in primitive armor running at a fortified position is a death wish, but in theory the legion should largely be acting a bit more stealthily in disputed territory, and when it comes to larger scale operations I'd imagine would be bringing out catapults and other weapons that are disdained by a more modern force, which also being post apocalyptic doesn't happen to maintain any technological equivilents due to there not being much in the way of tanks and stuff in circulation.

It should also be noted that for all of his semi-anti-tech approach Caesar also acted like Milo in that he seems to keep plenty of tech close at hand just in case, a lot of the elite troops and such using things like the "Ballistic Fists" and the like which pretty much means having an elite group of enemies in powered armor or something might play havoc with the general rank and file, but he's going to have his own elite forces packing enough tech to counter them.

This is all speculation on my part, because really, even in the design notes, it seems like the concept of the legion wasn't ever really explored, and it shallowness seems to be covered by the game more or less discouraging you to side with that faction (though you still can).

There are ways to justify it being a threat on the level presented, there was pretty much a whole series of books (as I mentioned) based loosely around the theme of a guy with modern knowledge dominating a post apocalyptic world by building a civilization of neo-barbarians, which in turn came into conflict with hold outs from the old world, other barbarians, mutants, and whatever else.
Wow thats some good thinking!