This is Why Criticizing Anita Sarkheesian is Irrelevant and Pointless

Vigormortis

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Little Gray said:
I dont think its fair to say she is huring "the cause." Regardless of if you agree with her methods or not you cant deny that she is dam good at pointing out all of the sexism in the gaming community. Yes she purposely draws their attention to her but from what I have seen it generally just reinforces her points.
But I can. I can deny that "she is dam good at pointing out all of the sexism in the gaming community".

Her grievances are often presented in the same manner as Total Biscuit. As in: start off with a few genuinely valid, if occasionally tenuous, points and repeat them ad nauseam whilst "reinforcing" them with hyperbole, exaggeration, misdirection, and straw-mans. All the while making damn sure to make her comments as inflammatory as possible.

There's a difference between using ones comments to draw attention to the matter at hand, and using the matter at hand to draw attention to yourself.

Ms. Sarkheesian seems only interested in the latter.

As I've said before: I do feel we all need to discuss the matter of sexism (and other issues) within the gaming industry and the gaming community. But again, Anita's way is not the right way.

It doesn't solve anything. It doesn't educate anyone to the truth. It simply stirs up vitriol and bile; on both sides of the topic.

You don't solve hatred and ignorance by applying more hatred and ignorance.
 

The-Traveling-Bard

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Uhura said:
Wyvern65 said:
People tend to rip apart everything she says.

Well maybe she should stop ripping apart things that aren't there?
She does the same thing and completely makes up things that aren't true.

Example: Kayne West Monster Video.

In fact I think someone posted about that earlier on the forums.


So if you're going to say people rip apart everything she says.

Anita should stop ripping apart everything as well and take a step further and stop making shit up for her victim complex.
 

Vale

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I have no problem with what she is doing, I have problem with the fact that she is the one doing it. I find her woefully uncharismatic and feel that if someone who actually has charisma would be the one to present these issues, then they would gather a lot more support. "Charisma" does not equal "more boobs". I really don't think this needs explanation, but I have a vague feeling someone might very well be willing to start an argument over this.
Also, kickstarter? I ain't against the people who gave her money, I just find it... off that she used it in the first place. I guess she really did need it, but it still feels... I'unno. Maybe I'm stupid to even think that she could've done her videos without it.
 

Uhura

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Aug 30, 2012
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@invadergir

She actually mentions several good things about Mattie but also criticizes certain other aspects of her characterization.

From the video description:
"Mattie Ross is the star of the award winning film True Grit. She is a remarkable character being cast as a strong, tough, independent, and determined young woman. While I think Mattie's character is (unfortunately) rare in major Hollywood films, many people have been quick to call her a feminist character... I have a slightly different take."

 

Wyvern65

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I thank you for taking the time to respond.

Honestly, I'm not sure it would benefit either of us or the conversation as a whole to continue it further. My entire 'argument' such as it is I posted on the first page of the thread in my first two posts. I stand by it. I thought it was fairly clearly written and straightforward. It will either stand or fall on its own merits, or far more likely simply be ignored.

Continuing down a discursive path and getting lost in the weeds only detracts from what I meant to say here. So consider this me bowing out and ceding the field. Have a pleasant day.
 

Eddie the head

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Uhura said:
@The-Taveling-Bard

Seriously, a facial expression? That's all you got?
Well body language dose make up for about half of the message you are trying to get across. So if I say something but my eyes, for example, say something different it can show my true intentions. I'm no expert "reader" but it dose appear she doesn't want to be asked that.
 

Uhura

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Aug 30, 2012
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Eddie the head said:
Well body language dose make up for about half of the message you are trying to get across. So if I say something but my eyes, for example, say something different it can show my true intentions. I'm no expert "reader" but it dose appear she doesn't want to be asked that.
To me she looks like she was surprised and amused that the interviewer would whip out the phrase "don't feed the trolls".
 

Yuuki

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Anita ends with: "This is also a window into what it?s like to be a female video game critic on twitter."

Female video game critic? I always thought she was a radical feminist who happened to be a video game critic. There's a big fuckin' difference.
 

Ablestron

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Im not sure if anyone has mentioned these articles (if so I apologize for the re post)

When I saw this forum post it seemed like great timing since I had recently finished reading a great article on the very subject

http://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2013/06/hyper-mode-anita-sarkeesian-and-the-trouble-with-m.html

There are some links to other good articles sprinkled in the piece, one I read and found pretty informative was this one

http://c.apricio.us/2013/03/further-explaining-the-damsel-in-distress/#.UbenItjpqPS


I highly recommend reading both no matter your opinion of Anita or her videos. I find it hard to watch her videos for many of the same reasons people have listed in this forum, but if there's one thing I do respect its the amount of dedication it takes to keep doing what she's doing despite all the hate mail, death threats and constant critiques of her integrity she gets every single time she makes sends a post or a tweet. You may argue that that's because the tweets easily infuriate people, but no matter how you look at it by answering her tweet (which was pretty much "no female protagonists in Xbox one line-up" coupled with the observation "this is still a problem") with statements like "your a ****" or "stop bothering us with your feminist agenda" or "go die".

A lot of people are questioning why she gets to be the voice for feminism in gaming, of course there are other women who speak on the same subject, but none of them have put themselves out there as much as Anita; in other words no one has been as courageous as she has been to be in the public eye. Anita has probably dealt with more criticism than any and that deserves respect. That doesnt make her BETTER than the others who talk on the subject, obviously if your trying to understand the issue of equality and specifically of gender equality you have to do more than look at just the most known feminist. You have to do reaserch, with arguments and counter arguments. The point is to mature as a person so that we can then come to better conclusions that are beyond our own simple understanding, when you respond to things posted by a feminist with responses like "go die" your not maturing at all, even if you disagree with the person ho makes the statement.
 

Eddie the head

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Uhura said:
Eddie the head said:
Well body language dose make up for about half of the message you are trying to get across. So if I say something but my eyes, for example, say something different it can show my true intentions. I'm no expert "reader" but it dose appear she doesn't want to be asked that.
To me she looks like she was surprised and amused that the interviewer would whip out the phrase "don't feed the trolls".
Well I can't tell you your wrong, but I think she is moving way to much in her seat and blinking to much. It appears to me to be nerves, not surprise. As well as flicking of the hair. I don't see surprised. I see nervous and aversive.

I'm not an expert though, I could be wrong.
 

Uhura

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Aug 30, 2012
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Eddie the head said:
Well I can't tell you your wrong, but I think she is moving way to much in her seat and blinking to much. It appears to me to be nerves, not surprise. As well as flicking of the hair. I don't see surprised. I see nervous and aversive.
I'm not an expert though, I could be wrong.
Yeah, we both could be wrong. Maybe there's a guy eating doughnuts next to the camera and she got distracted?! Who knows. That's why it's a bit tricky 'evidence'.
 

Dr Pussymagnet

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The-Traveling-Bard said:
Vrex360 said:
;-; If you would be so kindly as to message me how you do this so we can have a better discussion. It would be great! :D ( I hope you're not getting angry.)

Anywho back on topic.

She is at fault completely. Since other people have also clearly she is just feeding to trolls to feed her own agenda that makes her worse than fucking Hitler. Preying on the weak and stupid because they don't know any better? Lawl. How low can you go.

Do you notice her face on the CNN news when the Lady told her "have you ever heard of don't feed the trolls?"
Her face just went "OH SHIT. I AM CAUGHT" but people are too stupid to read into what really went behind on that news cast that day. That YES Anita is literally using the hate to feed her agenda.

She's just has bad as School Shooters.

Oh! Nobody is listening to me! I'm going to go shoot up a school so people will pay attention to me.
ME, ME, ME, ME, ME.

It's also a worse fact that her SELF A PERSON FIGHTING ABOUT SEXIST IS ACTUALLY MOTHERFUCKING SEXIST!
She clearly states in her video that the only reason why man go after their loved ones is to fulfill a masculine duty that has been wounded.

Despite.. you know. The person took away the person they loved, built a family with, and other crap.

NOPE MASCULINE DUTY!


Let's not talk about gays. :b We don't need another flame war do we? Hahaha.
Even gays need a women to pass on their genetic Legacy.

Sex isn't about love yo. It's about baby making.

Okay, well yes. It's not a honest social commentary but that also wasn't my point.
My point is people are going to make fun of you regardless of who you are.
Anita isn't a fucking victim because she is a girl. She a victim of her own demise and stupidity which I will never, ever find acceptable and righteous by no means. America in general LOVES to play the victim game and it's down right sickening and disgusting how people can buy into this bullshit.

Anywho onto the actual angry comments.

Yeah, but do you honestly truly believe those people are actually sexist?
Or do you think they're just angry that this idiotic girl is trying to oppress her will on other people?
Do you think that the hate their have for Anita comes from any male superior thinking.
HELL! Do you even think for a second they even took a neno second to think about what they just posted?

All girls belong in the kitchen.
^ took me about a second to right that. No thought, no feeling, no complex secret hidden agenda behind it. Nothing.
People will say what they want on the internet because they get punished for it.
People also say things without thinking.
People do a lot of stupid things.


Jokes/insults. Fine.
Threats? Yeah, i'll agree with you. That's going too far. I'm asshole. I'm not a total asshole.

Anita asked for this shit.
Anita KNEW and is playing us ALL to get her way. That's the bottom line.

The fact she is *clearly trolling with that twitter posts proves it* because there was a few games when the main character was female.

IN FACT THEY EVEN HAD A FEMALE PLAYING IN- GAME WITH OTHER MALES BEING ALL NICE BUDDY, BUDDY.

What the fuck.

You heard it here first folks, Anita Sarkeesian, a person who just talks about fucking video games, is literally just as bad as a school shooter

These responses are god damn embarrassing.
 

The-Traveling-Bard

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Dr Pussymagnet said:
The-Traveling-Bard said:
Vrex360 said:
;-; If you would be so kindly as to message me h

What the fuck.

You heard it here first folks, Anita Sarkeesian, a person who just talks about fucking video games, is literally just as bad as a school shooter

These responses are god damn embarrassing.
Metaphors.
Should look it up sometime.
 

Eddie the head

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Uhura said:
Eddie the head said:
Well I can't tell you your wrong, but I think she is moving way to much in her seat and blinking to much. It appears to me to be nerves, not surprise. As well as flicking of the hair. I don't see surprised. I see nervous and aversive.
I'm not an expert though, I could be wrong.
Yeah, we both could be wrong. Maybe there's a guy eating doughnuts next to the camera and she got distracted?! Who knows. That's why it's a bit tricky 'evidence'.
Ehh, I guess but even in her videos her body language is kind of off. She tends to exaggerate her eyebrow movement a little to much, and always has her arms folded together. I don't know as a reoccurring thing it appears to me that she doesn't believe fully in what she is saying.

It's like a used car car salesman trying to sell a bad car. That's what her body language is like. Not to say her product is bad, but if body language is half of communication then she is really shooting herself in the foot.
 

darlarosa

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comraderichard said:
I was going to agree to you until you compared a feminist who has no right to be the voice of feminism in gaming for various legitimate reasons to a guy who spent his life fighting out in the streets for equal rights for minorities and died because of it, real freaking tasteless, bub.
Who are you to say so. Plenty of people like her videos and plenty of people can and do critique gaming on feminist levels. She's just the one who has been harassed the most. She has the right to share her perspective

Tenmar said:
Why would they want to lie?

And supporting characters are on covers all the time in gaming, movies, books, comics, etc. Mass Effect 1 and 2, Dragon Age, GTA, one of the Metal Gear games, Jade Empire, etc.


Your logic is bad and you should feel bad. Anything and everything is a hobby. Watching movies, reading, listening to radio, sewing, cooking, studying fossils, learning about chemicals, etc. Everything is a hobby, and in many hobbies that produce works that are "art" or creatively made there are critiques of those things. From literature to movies we have examples, and there are even classes focusing on aspects of these things. Video Games are entertainment but they are also in some cases art, a creative product that reflects our world like a film or literature. It can be critiqued particularly when it comes to story elements and characters. People like to see reasonable representations of themselves in media such as video games, film, etc. Video games have a habit of rendering females in a very limited number of ways, and considering 40% of gamers are women it's unfair. Women and men have a right to critique something they view as unjust, narrowminded, sexist, racist, etc. I have the right to tell a publishers, a developer that "as a woman I was playing this game and for X reason things became uncomfortable" or that "It would be nice that an entire half of the species wasn't categorized as X". Ya see critiques are how art is advanced. Video games are an art, they are also a product, and can be a hobby. That doesn't mean it can't be critiqued. By allowing other stories to be told from another perspective we expand the field and the relevancy of art. It matures. Not to mention sometimes it's nice to feel welcome, or like a product wasn't made to exclude you or that a product doesn't view those like you as an object or a prize.
 

The-Traveling-Bard

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Dr Pussymagnet said:
The-Traveling-Bard said:
Dr Pussymagnet said:
The-Traveling-Bard said:
Vrex360 said:
;-; If you would be so kindly as to message me h

What the fuck.

You heard it here first folks, Anita Sarkeesian, a person who just talks about fucking video games, is literally just as bad as a school shooter

These responses are god damn embarrassing.
Metaphors.
Should look it up sometime.
Sorry, I'll remember to be more specific when criticizing shitty opinions.
Well that's just your opinion.

But I really don't see a difference between behaviors of Anita and most serial killers.

Behaviors, not actions.
 

Uhura

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Aug 30, 2012
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Eddie the head said:
Yeah, it's an important part of communication but not everyone is a natural performer. To me her body language doesn't read suspicious. To me it's most of the time ok and occasionally a bit forced (when she tries to joke). Although, I have to say that she seemed a bit more relaxed in her earlier videos than in the new ones.