Trump Town Hall Disaster

Agema

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When I saw the thread title I assumed a town hall had collapsed on top of Trump. Oh well.
I very much hope Trump survives long enough to lose the 2020 presidential election convincingly. Losing is bad for most people - it will be unbearable for someone like Trump, and that will be delicious. And then with a bit of luck he'll spent the rest of his life outside office fighting court cases for tax fraud and corruption.

I'm guessing the polls will settle towards long-term trends around 50-45 to Biden without any major controversies, but even that narrowing should leave Biden on at least 290 electoral college votes.
 

Thaluikhain

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I very much hope Trump survives long enough to lose the 2020 presidential election convincingly. Losing is bad for most people - it will be unbearable for someone like Trump, and that will be delicious.
I'd imagine a number of angry, semi-coherent speeches about how he was cheated, treason, and veiled references to the 2nd amendment to make things exciting for the immediate future.
 

Seanchaidh

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Why can't Biden bring the competance he did against Bernie, but against Trump.
He didn't bring competence, that's the problem. He barely even campaigned. He was gifted the nomination by Obama's backroom deals and a mainstream press that was absolutely desperate to promote any alternative to Bernie Sanders. Now he's one on one with Trump; there's no gigantic field of moderates for Obama to compel into dropping out and endorsing, and the corporate press doesn't have a scary socialist to unite together to sabotage anymore. MSNBC will be all in for Joe, but practically everyone who watches that either was already voting for him or only watches it to laugh at the derangement anyway.
 

Tsun Tzu

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It's...actually going to be pretty hilarious (again) if this big orange dick wins (again).
 

Gordon_4

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Who says I'm not politically active?
Bitching and lecturing us isn’t political activity, it’s (barely) intellectual masturbation. Get your fucking beret and Kalashnikov out and go storm Capitol Hill with some like minded fellows: put your proverbial money where your overactive mouth is, comrade.
 
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fOx

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And I have a lot to lose in the case of a Trump victory. I want to push the country left, and that is not mutually exclusive with making a tactical decision during a disappointing election cycle. If you choose not to take part in the election cycle, that means by extension that all your ideas about how one side or the other should be doing it this time around has about as much weight as the breath it takes you to say it.
There are ways to be politically active that don't involve voting. That is what I need you people to understand.


Ok, because you squared up and tried to explain your position more, I'm going to pull back now and engage.

Frankly, it's increasingly hard to consider a lot of your polls anything but trolls. I get not trusting the system. I get it not working for us so we have to replace it. We're on the same wavelength there.

But this is what is tripping us up.



Frankly, this is conversation that's gotten us in this mess in the first place. This is similiar dogma that the non voters in 2016 and some of the Trump voters used to cast their vote towards Trump. "Hey, it doesn't matter. Do whatever you can to bring down the government, even elect a fool like Trump. Damn the collateral damage".

Meanwhile, this is the collateral damage


I'm on that list. So are my family members.

Revolutions do not always have to have a high body count, but actions up until now have led to one.

Also when Buyetyen said this.





And you know what? I get this. I can actually understand every part of what you're saying, even if we go down different paths. But do you know what I don't care about?

Air Jordans. I don't know why people would spend so much on sneakers. They are footwear. They keep your feet safe. They don't make you rich.

I have a lot more to say on sneakers. But you know why you didn't know that I don't care about them? I don't talk about them. All the time. About how much they don't mean anything to me.

Again, I'm down with you here. This government is a joke. It doesn't represent its citizens in any meaningful way. We must combat it. But like Buyetyen said, the disinterest and apathy that you're expressing is sounding a lot like what we've seen before. And Trump and this division is the result. I think we're all hyper vigilant now
Honestly, fair enough. We can agree to disagree, but if there's a good reason to vote for biden, it's the way trump has handled the corona epidemic.
 

fOx

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Bitching and lecturing us isn’t political activity
Neither is reading comprehension, apparently. Go back and read some of my earlier posts.

I'm not a fan of the political system, but I must say, I've never seen a party more in love with losing elections then the democrats. They're so good at it, I almost wonder if they do it on purpose. But even I'm not that cynical.
 

lil devils x

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There are ways to be politically active that don't involve voting. That is what I need you people to understand.



Honestly, fair enough. We can agree to disagree, but if there's a good reason to vote for biden, it's the way trump has handled the corona epidemic.
The BESTs reason for not voting for Trump is because his policies:
1) kicked people who need food to survive off food stamps for them to starve.
2) kicked people off Medicaid by adding monthly premiums they could not afford
3)Damaged low income housing efforts making more people homeless.
4)take away people's access to medications they need to live literally killing people, The ACA right now is the ONLY thing keeping millions of people alive right now, including myself and my family members. If I am without my medication for even a day, for example, I can die at any point in time within 6 hours after I lose access to my breathing meds. People who think this is okay, are saying it okay for me, my friends, family and neighbors your friends, family and neighbors, to actually die here, so if the ACA is repealed, there will be no ability for many to " wait it out" for a replacement, we will just die while waiting.
5)are anti science so is setting the US back in research, advancement, the environment, and treatment of medicine and science due to the programs he chooses to underfund, cut funding entirely on.
6)Crush the lower and middle class. Trump's polices actually crush the lower and middle class because he doesn't understand nor does he want to how people are forced to live and that they can't just go ask daddy for more money like he did when it runs out. He has never had to decide what bills to pay or have to ration food or to become homeless or risk homelessness because he has been sheltered his entire life and due to this, he is cannot fathom how his policies force people into rationing, suffering and homelessness.

If you think that his handling of the Pandemic is all that is wrong here, you haven't been paying attention. You need to get your news from somewhere else if you think that is the worst thing going on right now.

Also, Not voting = GOP successful in voter suppression. That is all it means really. You are just silencing yourself and helping the GOP accomplish their goals. Nothing else comes from it. IF you convince other people not to vote as well as your form of being politically active all that = is Helping GOP be successful in voter suppression. Just be honest with yourself though, you are actively suppressing your own vote and encouraging others to do so, you are just promoting the GOP agenda, whose goal is to keep as many non GOP voters from voting or be able to vote. This isn't new, it has been their way for a very long time now. You either are knowingly helping them or just falling for their intentionally divisive rhetoric. Hell we were warned that much of the focus for even Russia trolls trying to get Trump elected would be focusing on voter suppression.
So is this the plan here? It is not surprising that most of the people on these forums who discouraged others from voting are the same ones who were okay with Trump being elected in2016. Go figure. It is the result of what you are doing either way right? The road to hell is paved with good intentions ?

Some strategies and tactics for election interference were the same as before. Russia’s trolls pretended to be American people, including political groups and candidates. They tried to sow division by targeting both the left and right with posts to foment outrage, fear, and hostility. Much of their activity seemed designed to discourage certain people from voting. And they focused on swing states.

GOP doesn't want you to vote
 
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Breakdown

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I very much hope Trump survives long enough to lose the 2020 presidential election convincingly. Losing is bad for most people - it will be unbearable for someone like Trump, and that will be delicious. And then with a bit of luck he'll spent the rest of his life outside office fighting court cases for tax fraud and corruption.

I'm guessing the polls will settle towards long-term trends around 50-45 to Biden without any major controversies, but even that narrowing should leave Biden on at least 290 electoral college votes.
Admittedly I don't anything about US politics, but I reckon that Trump has a good chance to win. The civil disorder in the US seems to be the most pressing issue right now and suspect that voters will want somebody who offers a quick fix. Trump can make the easy promises, but Biden will have to take a nuanced approach which probably won't satisfy anybody. It feels like a pretty similar situation to how the Brexit divide completely undermined Labour in the last UK election.
 

tstorm823

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I very much hope Trump survives long enough to lose the 2020 presidential election convincingly. Losing is bad for most people - it will be unbearable for someone like Trump, and that will be delicious. And then with a bit of luck he'll spent the rest of his life outside office fighting court cases for tax fraud and corruption.

I'm guessing the polls will settle towards long-term trends around 50-45 to Biden without any major controversies, but even that narrowing should leave Biden on at least 290 electoral college votes.
Well, as your on the ground PA representative here, I'd say prepare for a battle you seem to not expect. Biden in the polls is besting Trump on a personal basis, but this race is quickly becoming about neither candidate. I'm sure you're aware I've been arguing politics as a hobby for a decade or so. For the most part, I keep all of that compartmentalized: I don't instigate arguments in person, I refuse to engage on popular social media period, I take my fights to willing and prepared participants capable of keeping up. But lately, our little microcosm is bleeding out into the world with or without my involvement. We're slowly working our way to an election ultimately about communism. Like, I know lil devils is immovable core Democrat and I wouldn't have it any other way, but the recent moment where she thought nobody actually wanted to get rid of the police and all the communists here did roll call, I see things like that regularly with people I actually know. The most extreme left is outing themselves in public, the Democratic Party is pretending to support them (which is comically unwise), and a lot of previously apolitical people are aggressively going to vote against them for it.
 

Buyetyen

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There are ways to be politically active that don't involve voting. That is what I need you people to understand.
Oh, we understand that. We just find your advice on what to do about the actual election cycle to be empty.
 

Gordon_4

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Neither is reading comprehension, apparently. Go back and read some of my earlier posts.

I'm not a fan of the political system, but I must say, I've never seen a party more in love with losing elections then the democrats. They're so good at it, I almost wonder if they do it on purpose. But even I'm not that cynical.
I've read your posts; and frankly I think most of them are the kind of bullshit that gives the political left a bad name.
 

Agema

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Well, as your on the ground PA representative here, I'd say prepare for a battle you seem to not expect. Biden in the polls is besting Trump on a personal basis, but this race is quickly becoming about neither candidate.
Well, the PA Republicans better see that translate into votes somewhere, because Biden's ~7% up now, was ~7% up a month ago and ~7% up the month before that, which suggests to me it's going to take an awful lot to move voters. Just at the moment, if the polls are accurate, Trump needs to close the gap 3% just to get into the further reaches of the margin of error.

Observe the (national) polls for Trump-Biden:

Compare to Trump-Clinton and Obama-Romney

What you'll notice is the very low volatility in Trump-Biden compared to the other contests. This suggests to me an awful lot of people have made their minds up. Biden's been ~50% for a year, Trump's fluctuated mostly 42-44%. As said, I expect a load of covid-19 Trump doubters will end up reconciling themselves to him come election day and he could expect 44-45%, but he's still looking at being ~5% down nationally. That will be a Biden victory.

Like I said, there's going to have to be one hell of a game-changer to save Trump at this point. Vague mutterings about Communism won't cut it.
 

Agema

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The polls aren't accurate.
In PA, Clinton averaged ~+2 in 2016 in the last couple of weeks and lost by 0.7. That's within the margin of error, and why margins of error exist.
 

tstorm823

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In PA, Clinton averaged ~+2 in 2016 in the last couple of weeks and lost by 0.7. That's within the margin of error, and why margins of error exist.
One of these days, you're gonna start valuing my observations. I get so many thing right when you disagree with me.