Twitch just keeps getting worse and worse.

Adam Jensen

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Yeah I think I’ve officially hit ‘old man’ status on the Internet because I look at Twitch streamers and I feel like I’m at the shittiest ‘First Contact’ scenario Starfleet could provide.
You're not old. You're just sensitive to boredom. I've seen some of these "personalities". They're fuckin' dull. They're boring and more often than not stupid people with nothing interesting and nothing smart to say. Why spend hours at a time watching some asshole play games when you could be playing a video game instead? Not necessarily the same one that Twitch personality is playing if you don't have it, but that's besides the point. Watching other people engage in a leisure activity is inherently boring. It's a passive kind of activity, which makes it more for old people than playing a game yourself.
 
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CriticalGaming

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You're not old. You're just sensitive to boredom. I've seen some of these "personalities". They're fuckin' dull. They're boring and more often than not stupid people with nothing interesting and nothing smart to say. Why spend hours at a time watching some asshole play games when you could be playing a video game instead? Not necessarily the same one that Twitch personality is playing if you don't have it, but that's besides the point. Watching other people engage in a leisure activity is inherently boring. It's a passive kind of activity, which makes it more for old people than playing a game yourself.
It is really interesting because Twitch is a natural evolution of the Let's Play that people used to put onto Youtube. Except now creators get to put in less effort over it.

I used to watch Jesse Cox on Youtube for his Let's Plays because I genuinely thought he was really funny. Except what i didn't realize until Twitch, was how edited those videos really were. On Twitch you don't get to edit out the boring shit, the audience watches all of it. And while you still get these moments of entertaining funny things, clutch moments, or whatever, the vast majority of a playthrough for a thing is boring as fuck.

This led to other people seeing streamers being boring during boring parts of the game and they thought "Oh this is easy money, this person isn't even doing anything." Which led us to the first wave of "boobie" streamers who had the camera pointed down at their tits taking up the whole screen while they would sit in a lobby on League in a tiny ass window so that they techincally weren't going against ToS.

Now a days we've seen that the really big creators, the people who have the personalities to push people through the boring shit in a game, have become so huge and high profile that smaller and newer creators kind of resent them. When they don't realize their personality is boring or just shit and people don't want to watch them. Zombie Unicorn is a perfect example of someone who felt like they were entitled to views and money, except the only reason they had an audience at all was because they were naked on stream under "Bodypainting". She was part of that Bullyhunter's bullshit and tried to ride Anita Sark's coattails, only to flounder because she was genuinely a terrible person. Now she has had 700 views in the last 30 days, her audience is basically gone.

I feel like a lot of Twitch Streamers complain about bad discovery tools and there is some fair points to be made in that regard. Twitch tends to only suggest other popular streamers when I think the tool would be better suited for showcasing other streamers that share your interests instead. LIke if I watch Mr.Happy as a big FF14 streamer, I don't want Twitch to then suggest I watch Ninja afterwards because I'm probably not interested in Fortnite after just watching a big MMO-streamer. Instead it should showcase other FF14 streamers, or even other MMO-RPG's like WoW or whatever.

But it also shouldn't show me some random streamer with 12 viewers either. If that streamer has nothing in common with other thing's I've watched then Twitch has no reason to suggest that to me.

Discovery tools would be great, but ultimately even that tool would only go so far if you have the personality of a Deer.
 

Agema

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You're not old. You're just sensitive to boredom. I've seen some of these "personalities". They're fuckin' dull. They're boring and more often than not stupid people with nothing interesting and nothing smart to say.
I think my problem is that often some of these people just do stuff like shout "Whoa!" and "Woo-hoo" various other cliches in exaggerated excitement. I am unclear what the value added of this is for me, but undoubtedly it works for some viewers.
 
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TheMysteriousGX

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So... it's cancel culture
Yeah, but it's people they don't like playing games how they don't like with politics they don't like, so it's fine.

Just massive waves of bots shouting racial slurs to create a politics free twitch.
How about this girl?
Or is it just anyone and everyone who isn't a straight white dude? You are marginalized so long as you aren't that right? So over 60% of the population of Earth?
*links to somebody he'd throw off of Twitch if he had the chance*
 
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MrCalavera

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It is really interesting because Twitch is a natural evolution of the Let's Play that people used to put onto Youtube. Except now creators get to put in less effort over it.

I used to watch Jesse Cox on Youtube for his Let's Plays because I genuinely thought he was really funny. Except what i didn't realize until Twitch, was how edited those videos really were. On Twitch you don't get to edit out the boring shit, the audience watches all of it. And while you still get these moments of entertaining funny things, clutch moments, or whatever, the vast majority of a playthrough for a thing is boring as fuck.
And that's why locking out the chat isn't an option, barring maybe for streamers who get thousands of viewers per stream.
Audience participation is just a too important part of the medium.
 

BrawlMan

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And that's why locking out the chat isn't an option, barring maybe for streamers who get thousands of viewers per stream.
Audience participation is just a too important part of the medium.
Unfortunately, there are some people that are either ignorant, too dense, or apathetic to to give a rat's ass or care.
 
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Trunkage

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Yeah, but it's people they don't like playing games how they don't like with politics they don't like, so it's fine.

Just massive waves of bots shouting racial slurs to create a politics free twitch.
One of the things I've always wondered is how much cancel culture is just trolls or bots.
 

TheMysteriousGX

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One of the things I've always wondered is how much cancel culture is just trolls or bots.
If anything in this stupid ecosystem is gonna get called Cancel Culture, bot attacks on small streamers for existing wrong fits the bill
 

Trunkage

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If anything in this stupid ecosystem is gonna get called Cancel Culture, bot attacks on small streamers for existing wrong fits the bill
Id also point out that it's really stupid to think that trolls are only right wingers

But, somehow, they never get pointed out

Yep, bot attacks is just f'ed up
 
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McElroy

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Why spend hours at a time watching some asshole play games when you could be playing a video game instead? Not necessarily the same one that Twitch personality is playing if you don't have it, but that's besides the point. Watching other people engage in a leisure activity is inherently boring. It's a passive kind of activity, which makes it more for old people than playing a game yourself.
One monitor in 2021? What are we CAVEMEN?! You can play while the stream is in the background. "Inherently boring" is just you, honestly. Everyone can think of a million things that are - on their own - leisure activities, but become entertainment once it's recorded and/or narrated. On the flipside there are games that are such grindfests that playing them is deathly boring.

I agree that "Why not play yourself?" is a legit question to ask.
 

BrawlMan

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I agree that "Why not play yourself?" is a legit question to ask.
Depends on the game. There are plenty of fans that like watching mid level or high level fighting game players, because they either play fighting games casually, not good at them, but enjoy seeing players be good or better, or they're learning. It's why so many people watch Max_Dood and his stream. Not to mention these guys are a riot when him and his buddies are altogether. They have their own streams too, btw. Sometimes people watch others play to know more about the game or game series, and will pick up the game later. One of my favorite LPs from YT is Seraphim17, who uses Twitch too, is known for difficulty walkthroughs. He's a much smaller channel, but I like him, because he's a pretty straightforward guy. He does not try to act constantly bombastic or over-the-top. Not only that, be has interesting things to say about a game's combat, level design, how a games does stealth, etc. And he is not afraid of showing his failures. Everyone makes mistakes when playing games.

 
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McElroy

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Depends on the game.
I'd say it depends on the person. Streams are not the best source for tips and tricks, edited videos are.
One reason: Because I like the lore and visuals of games like Dark Souls, but fuck if I'm going to subject myself to the teeth-grinding experience of playing them.
This is something I pondered back in the dark days of 2014-15 when "what is a REAL gamer?" was up in the air. Is watching a let's play a gaming experience? Sure there are reasons for doing it, but those reasons distance you from the revered title of REAL GAMER.

"Why not play it yourself?" is a legit question to ask if one honestly wants to spend their free time gaming instead of watching. I replied to Adam Jensen's comment because I think he's being a little dishonest when he says spectating is boring because it's not you doing it. Video games narrow it down for sure, but even there, like BrawlMan, I think there's entertainment value in seeing somebody's hours and hours of practice in action against others who've done the same, because it's a whole another world from the perspective of a casual player (myself).
 
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Cheetodust

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One monitor in 2021? What are we CAVEMEN?! You can play while the stream is in the background. "Inherently boring" is just you, honestly. Everyone can think of a million things that are - on their own - leisure activities, but become entertainment once it's recorded and/or narrated. On the flipside there are games that are such grindfests that playing them is deathly boring.

I agree that "Why not play yourself?" is a legit question to ask.
Ever watched a powerlifting meet? I think most people who don't actually lift themselves probably have little to no interest in watching powerlifting. Strongman? Sure, the events are varied and create a spectacle. Any person can go "whoa, that guy lifted a car". Fewer people have a point of reference for how strong someone who lifts a bar with 7 big metal plates either side of it from the ground before putting it back down is.

I oddly enough enjoy watching let's plays of Bloodborne specifically because of the amount of time I spent getting a platinum in it. I actually have very little interest in let's plays apart from Bloodborne. Sometimes being able to do something yourself is more insentive to watch others do it.
 
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Cheetodust

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Ever watched a powerlifting meet? I think most people who don't actually lift themselves probably have little to no interest in watching powerlifting. Strongman? Sure, the events are varied and create a spectacle. Any person can go "whoa, that guy lifted a car". Fewer people have a point of reference for how strong someone who lifts a bar with 7 big metal plates either side of it from the ground before putting it back down is.

I oddly enough enjoy watching let's plays and streams of Bloodborne specifically because of the amount of time I spent getting a platinum in it. I actually have very little interest in let's plays apart from Bloodborne. Sometimes being able to do something yourself is more insentive to watch others do it.
 

CriticalGaming

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Speaking of Max_dood, I pointed this out in other threads but one of the biggest reasons I watched him was to enjoy his excitement over the FF7 Remake. Sometimes it's fun watching people react to a thing you also love. I don't know anyone in real life that has the same passion for FF7 as I do, so it was really awesome watching someone who shared that excitement for the game also play it.

I bet that alone is one of the biggest reasons why people watch streamers play games. Someone else is playing a game that you love too and you want to see someone else react to all the moments or cool things that got you hyped about it. Then by the end of that game, you find yourself interested in something else they play and soon enough you are just a fan of the personality and stop caring about what exactly they are playing.

Of course that also leads to a lot of back seating because many viewers that are watching are either further along or have already beaten the game 17 times, so it becomes uncontrollable to offer suggests (sometimes demands) when a streamer is struggling with something you know how to solve immediately.

*links to somebody he'd throw off of Twitch if he had the chance*
I wouldn't throw anyone off twitch, but thanks for being snide.

And that's why locking out the chat isn't an option, barring maybe for streamers who get thousands of viewers per stream.
Audience participation is just a too important part of the medium.
Then turn the raids off. Raids are so minor, and legit raids happen so infrequently that there aren't even stats for them. The number of people who legitly raid another streamer are so random that the odds of someone raiding you are incredibly small. So rather than hold out hope of winning the lottery, just turn the fucking raids off. Then you can't be hate raided, and you don't have to worry about locking chat down. I really don't understand why there is such a fight about this. God forbidden the streamer have to put in any effort to protect their stream. Twitch is a platform, they don't actually give a shit if you are successful on the platform or not. it is up to the streamer to make themselves a success by using the tools given to them by Twitch.

Twitch cannot protect against a bot attack. Just like even major companies can protect against getting DDoSed. When an attack like that happens they lock down their service until the attack is over, and then they move on. The same thing with these hate raids, except there is an easy button you can click to have them not happen at all.
 

McElroy

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Then turn the raids off.
You honestly believe the streamers who have been attacked repeatedly by bot raids haven't turned raids off? They aren't that stupid. Bots don't need a raid feature to raid. All of this is just a couple of clicks away and you can script the bots to do that. Like those 3 million xQc followers weren't added manually for sure. This "AsiaGoesPro" is chill about it because it happened once and nobody gets too upset at a one-time occurrence (of course it's very recent and we can't tell the future).
 

BrawlMan

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You honestly believe the streamers who have been attacked repeatedly by bot raids haven't turned raids off? They aren't that stupid. Bots don't need a raid feature to raid. All of this is just a couple of clicks away and you can script the bots to do that. This "AsiaGoesPro" is chill about it because it happened once and nobody gets too upset at a one-time occurrence (of course it's very recent and we can't tell the future).
Like I said before, he never gets it. Give him all the details, and one thing comes in, and it gets stuck in his ear and dies off in a minefield somewhere.
 

CriticalGaming

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You honestly believe the streamers who have been attacked repeatedly by bot raids haven't turned raids off? They aren't that stupid.
There are literally people in the community that have been hate raided telling people how to turn the raids off. I linked a tweet from someone previously.

You are seriously overestimating the effort that people actually put into streaming. Many people just get the stream to work and never touch a damn thing.

Case in point, Darksydephil has been streaming and Youtubing for 10 years and still doesn't know how to do a goddamn thing on Twitch or Youtube.

I wouldn't be surprised if many people don't even know raiding was a feature until they got bot raided, and maybe not even then. The twitter hashtag has tons of these creator's teach each other how to turn the raids off and even how to turn chat into different modes.

What's funny, is ya'll just keep making excuses as to why these solutions wont work, when there are examples all over Twitch and Twitter from people who've been hate raided showcasing solutions. Why? Because streamers like AfroSamurai, and Theblackhogage are not in the business of playing the victim. They got hate raided, they shut it down and literally mocked the raiders. They know there are already solutions to the problem, and they use them.

But instead these people want someone else to fix their problems.

People don't even know how to use the platform that they depend on for their livelihood and ya'll want to bash how much "I dont get it"?
 
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