Ubisoft Says Always-On DRM, "A Success"

infohippie

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jpoon said:
What a spectacular load of bullshit! Time to [do stupid stuff]
[image width=400]http://picardfacepalm.com/picard-facepalm.jpg[/IMG]
Dude, how many people just on this thread have already been warned for saying something like that? And you're on your second last suspension before permaban. You might wanna go back and edit your post.
 

mikespoff

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Dr. Pepper Unlimited said:
A self-proclaimed success I might add. As far as my little inner circle goes, none of my friends, including myself, bought anything DRM-related after Ubisoft pulled that stunt. That's several hundred dollars lost just right there. It might not speak for the world as a whole, but I'm sure many followed suit to some degree. So...if by working, they mean it's not working, then I agree.
Same with me. Ubi was one of my favourite publishers a few years ago - between Assassin's Creed, Rainbow Six Vegas, Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter, Far Cry 2, etc, most of my games started with the Ubisoft logo.

Then came their AC2 DRM stunt, and I haven't bought a Ubi title since.

As much as I'd love to see what they did with AssCreed, I'm not going to buy a game under those restrictions.
 

mikespoff

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Owyn_Merrilin said:
Steamworks is almost as bad as Ubisoft's DRM. The only real difference is if you lose your connection in the middle of a game, you don't lose anything on Steam, whereas you do with Ubisoft. In either case, if you don't have internet in the first place, you aren't playing your game, even if you've already registered it. I know Steam has an offline mode, but it only works if you're already online and you have to go off for some reason; there's no starting Steam in offline mode. Oh, it gives the option, but it almost never actually works, and it definitely doesn't work if you try to use online mode but it can't connect because there's something wrong with your internet connection.
Dude, I've been using Steam for a couple of years now, and I have no idea what you're talking about. I've run it on multiple computers with multiple OS's, and I have zero problems with offline mode.

For me, Steamworks is the right balance for DRM - it's seamless, it's invisible, and one-time activation is all you need. And you can uninstall and reinstall your games all you like.
 

fenrizz

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kyogen said:
Always-on drm is a success: it has successfully persuaded me to stop buying Ubisoft products entirely. They don't care, of course, so fair's fair.
Same here.

I boycott all Ubisoft games on all platforms.
I will tolerate this type of DRM, and nor am I willing to support a studio/publisher that uses such a DRM system.

I am not a criminal and I demand to not be treated like one.
 

Jodah

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If by success they mean pushing more and more people to piracy, then I agree.
 

Owyn_Merrilin

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mikespoff said:
Owyn_Merrilin said:
Steamworks is almost as bad as Ubisoft's DRM. The only real difference is if you lose your connection in the middle of a game, you don't lose anything on Steam, whereas you do with Ubisoft. In either case, if you don't have internet in the first place, you aren't playing your game, even if you've already registered it. I know Steam has an offline mode, but it only works if you're already online and you have to go off for some reason; there's no starting Steam in offline mode. Oh, it gives the option, but it almost never actually works, and it definitely doesn't work if you try to use online mode but it can't connect because there's something wrong with your internet connection.
Dude, I've been using Steam for a couple of years now, and I have no idea what you're talking about. I've run it on multiple computers with multiple OS's, and I have zero problems with offline mode.

For me, Steamworks is the right balance for DRM - it's seamless, it's invisible, and one-time activation is all you need. And you can uninstall and reinstall your games all you like.
I've been using it for a year, and have had no end of trouble with offline mode. If you have a spotty internet connection and it goes out while it's trying to log into your account, it will refuse to log in until you get internet back. Even offline mode spits out an error about being unable to connect to the server. Similarly, Steam does DRM checks every so often on the games, even after they've had their initial registration. The last time I had a few days out of reach of the internet, I couldn't play the Half Life games at all, because even though offline mode was working (along with most of the games), the DRM on Half Life hadn't been verified in a while, and Steam wasn't about to let me play until it contacted the mothership. If you aren't having problems with offline mode, count yourself lucky -- I know I feel lucky that I only have to deal with it when I'm traveling.

Edit: It also messes up if steam locks up while you're trying to log in, which generally happens if there's something wrong with your internet connection.
 

bakan

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Lets see, they drive away their customers and encourage piracy on the PC and call it a success.
Yet, they pretend as if piracy doesn't happen on consoles.

Well, I decided for myself not to buy any Ubisoft games, neither for my PS3 nor for my PC. (ok, I got AC for the PS3, but bought it used)
 

tlgAlaska

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I could join the ranting against the Always-On DRM, but then I would be a hypocrite, because nowadays a huge part of my games is on Steam and that's basically the same (but at least Valve makes up for it with neat sales now and then)
 
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Frostbite3789 said:
It is a bit funny that you would condemn DRM more or less, while referencing a Valve game. You know, those games that force you to use Steam. A form of DRM, whether you like admitting it or not.
The one that I said was a version of DRM earlier? While you have the picture of Saxton Hale.

Methinks you're fencing with the wrong person.

DRM does need condemning, even Steam, so do tabloid newspapers, early death, and a lot of other things. They're also necessary/unavoidable in a world like this. Doesn't mean I have to like them.
 

infohippie

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duchaked said:
guess Brotherhood on the PC LOST sales?
Well, my local game store had big piles of the boxed PC version sitting there that had been marked to 50% off less than two weeks after it was released. I'm pretty sure they weren't doing that because they were flying off the shelves. When the guy at the counter saw I was buying PC games, he tried to get me to buy this too. I told him exactly why I wasn't going to - he looked kinda glum about it, but he didn't argue the point.
 

James Crook

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Grey Carter said:
Ubisoft's DRM scheme, which requires players to be connected to an authentication server at all times while playing a game, was first introduced with Settlers 7 [http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=settlers+7&x=0&y=0] before being implemented in several high profile titles including Assassin's Creed 2 [http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=settlers+7&x=0&y=0#/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=assassins+creed+2&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Aassassins+creed+2] and Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood [http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=settlers+7&x=0&y=0#/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=assassins+creed+brotherhood&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Aassassins+creed+brotherhood].
Wait, hold on Rockfeller! Assassin's Creed II got patched last year to replace the always-on DRM by a one-time online registration modification of the DRM (so did Splinter Cell: Conviction), and Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood already shipped in May with this new version of the DRM. Just thought I'd point that out, if I already didn't get ninja'd by some of The Escapist's trained band of ninjas.
Like mentioned in a forum thread yesterday, this is Ubisoft simply going ass-backwards on this DRM controversy.
I still don't get it: Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood was a great game, I pre-ordered it on Steam after a friend of mine linked me via Steam chat to several articles about the pre-order bonus DLC and the change on Ubisoft's DRM policy. He added the comment "Yeah, they're going to remove the always-on DRM craziness, so that means you'll be able to play during your many network cuts", and THAT got me to pre-order.
Now, Driver: San Francisco looks fairly good, but this comeback of the always-on DRM just stopped me dead in my tracks on the way to pre-order it.
Get your shit together, Ubisoft! Didn't you see that you were actually praised for changing your DRM policy?
 

madster11

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Just because less people download your games doesn't mean your DRM is working.

It's just means that most of your games are shit, and it's not worth my HDD space to bother.

Not that i'd ever BUY a game with SecuRom or any of this shit on it. God no. I'm not stupid.
 

Callate

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Grey Carter said:
DRM is a pretty wide reaching term but usually when users condemn it they're talking about specific products, like SecuROM, Starforce or Ubisoft's DRM scheme. Quite often people's opinions on DRM doesn't extend to things like Steam or Battlenet, purely because they don't recognise them as such.
Quite frankly, that's absolutely not true.

Yes, Steam and BattleNet function as a kind of DRM. But they also give customers something. Steam means that I can play most of the same library of games on my desktop computer while I'm at home and my laptop computer on the road without having to swap disks out of the drive every time I change gears, and that many of those games automatically have the latest patches put into place in the background while I'm typing messages into forums on the Escapist. While I haven't delved into BattleNet in ages, I'm aware that it functions as a thriving competitive community, not just a place that keeps its players streaming data to Blizzard's servers.

What Starforce gave me, back in the bad old days, was a game I legitimately purchased that hard crashed my computer until I updated its drivers. My @#$%ing copy protection's drivers. They didn't even have the grace offer up that information freely; I had to go trawling deep into the murky backwaters of the Internet to figure it out for myself.

And Ubisoft's DRM means that I'm probably never going to play Assassin's Creed 2. Because even with relatively reliable broadband Internet, I still occasionally get "hiccups" that prevent me from remaining online. And while I'm willing to forgive the occasional bug or hang that was an honest mistake and the company is trying to correct, Ubisoft's "always on" DRM, at least at the outset, was perfectly capable of squandering its customer's time by shutting down their game without saving simply because they had the misfortune to have one of those "hiccups". That was not a bug; that was how it worked by design.

So- and forgive me if I'm harping on what is simply an ill choice of words- if gamers don't tend to think of Steam or BattleNet in the same light as StarForce or Ubisoft's "always on" DRM, it is most certainly not "purely" because they don't think of the latter as DRM. It's because Valve and Blizzard had the sense and seemingly the respect for their customers to meet them half-way and go into the process thinking of what they could offer them of value to go with what they needed to work their business model.

Whereas Ubisoft's tactic, from a customer's point of view, was to start with a functional working product and then add something to it that made it varyingly less functional for reasons that only benefited Ubisoft. And to add insult to injury (again, from the customer's possibly narrow-minded view), this lack of functionality was limited to those who had gone to Ubisoft fair and square, expecting an exchange of money for a functional game like they always had, while those who "stole" the same game hurdled those same hindrances.

I "get" it. Piracy is a real problem, especially in nations where people can afford legitimate merchandise but choose to go with piracy because it's easy, free, and/or convenient. But whatever data Ubisoft has to base the tenuous claims of "success" of their DRM upon, I really can't help but wonder if they've entirely grasped the PR battle they may be losing in the process.
 

Rack

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I think the thing is DRM has come to mean in most people's mind "A stupid and annoying waste of time that does nothing to hinder pirates". On those grounds Ubi-DRM is a prime example, Steam doesn't tend to fit so much. It's not a technically accurate description but there it is.
 

Low Key

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Xan Krieger said:
Low Key said:
Grey Carter said:
Twilight_guy said:
You know what I want to see? an actual discussion of what this DRM means. I've seen lots of people who instantly sputter a gut reaction and condemn it immediately but that's incredibly short sighted. There are lots of issues to discuss here, not the lest of which is why people hate it so much (and don't give me that crap about you just hate DRM or your internet connection sucks there is more to it and you know it). I want to know why people keep blasting DRM and why stories keep getting put it. Its not about simply hating the thing, this is on the level of a zealot crusade and I want to know why. As far as I'm concerned though, it's never going to happen because people are just too angry to talk all they can do is yell. Ah well, maybe DRM should treat use like means spirited children, we sure act like it.
DRM is a pretty wide reaching term but usually when users condemn it they're talking about specific products, like SecuROM, Starforce or Ubisoft's DRM scheme. Quite often people's opinions on DRM doesn't extend to things like Steam or Battlenet, purely because they don't recognise them as such.
I don't know about Battle.net, but I know at least with Steam, a person doesn't have to be online to play the games they paid for.
No but you need to be to install them, that prevented me from playing Half Life for over a year after I bought it. That's some pretty harsh DRM and needs to go away.
What prevented you from installing the game?
 

Nazulu

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This is sad to see, I'll have to completely avoid Ubisoft games now (consoles included). I refuse to support this bull shit.
 

Strazdas

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when they did the DRM on assasins creed 2, and after buying the game i was unable to play it for 7 days due to thier fault while my friend pirated it and played it since day 1 i have drawn a line and now i do not buy any unbisoft product. such DRM does not only show incompetence but also does not allow to play while travelling (no internet) which is also unacceptable for me. Past few years tested my beliefs. ubisoft went from great company into idiots whole EA seems to regain my trust lately.
 

cgaWolf

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a) always-on DRM doesn't work, the titles still get pirated
b) i'm not buying Ubisoft titles that use this kind of DRM (out of principle & because i'm frequently without 24/7 internet connection). It's a bummer really, because Ubisoft does amazing games...

I don't mind DRM on principle (though i've seen no data that shows DRM actually works), just the ones that potentially inconvenience me as a legal customer. That crap is a showstopper, i'll bring my money to other companies instead (say... CD Projekt for example, who build up a well earned reputation of being a pro-customer company where DRM & Support is concerned + the Witcher games are awesomesauce :p )