i will asume you work all day and get back to some asshole demanding you help him move his sofa leaving you no time to realise that having payed many hundreads of pounds possibly £1200 (MY custome PC) you may not have any cash left for games. or and hears a thought, you did have money left at the time but your life has changed recently and you no longer have the same cash flowzehydra said:
video game piracy: a question
- Thread starter twiceworn
- Start date
Pirating a game is much like sneaking into a movie. You haven't taken anything away from the company, but you got to witness a performance everyone else paid to see. I see it as a morally grey area if you can't afford it, but it is still illegal.
For example: I'm pumped to play the new Deus Ex game. Problems: I don't know if it will even run on my laptop, I don't have the money since Student Loan companies want all my disposable income for the next 67 years, and if I rent it from Gamefly, it won't arrive for 3 months. (just got Alice: MR last week)
I could pirate the game, then I'd know if it ran on my laptop, (it probably won't) or I could wait until next year to play a game I've been waiting most of a decade to play.
For example: I'm pumped to play the new Deus Ex game. Problems: I don't know if it will even run on my laptop, I don't have the money since Student Loan companies want all my disposable income for the next 67 years, and if I rent it from Gamefly, it won't arrive for 3 months. (just got Alice: MR last week)
I could pirate the game, then I'd know if it ran on my laptop, (it probably won't) or I could wait until next year to play a game I've been waiting most of a decade to play.
Well, sure, but you're still in a good condition to be getting money, relatively speaking. Unless you're dead poor (which if you are, I'd wonder why you're spending your time playing video games), or live in a country that is has a very weak currency, getting the money shouldn't be a problem. If you have a tighter cash flow, but you can still afford other dispensables, then tough.twiceworn said:
Doesn't mean you can ignore the modern gaming market. Still, if publishers gave a fuck about piracy they'd adjust their prices accordingly.smearyllama said:
Good question. If a guy isn't a fan of a franchise and has plans on spending money on other ones then he'll probably download if he's curious about what that development team is offering. Demos? you can't see the whole extent of the work in a demo, imagine the game starts sucking half way through...yeah. Life isn't just about gaming, people need money for other stuff, so they are lucky those people can get to know their work. These dev teams want devoted fans? Work harder at making quality games that interest people. Quality over quantity. Besides, the "pirates" as they are so inaccurately called don't usually make money off the stuff they download do they? Some pirates.
So,
Free publicity for the devs if a person doesn't buy the game but downloads it and people get to know what's out there.
Or,
If the person buys the game the devs get money.
If anything the consumer is the one always losing. They lose money if they buy something, especially if they bite the bait set by marketing and don't actually enjoy the game. And they lose dignity by being called pirates when they don't buy it and download instead. Why would they insult people who are getting to know their work and might be future fans? If they didn't download the stuff the dev team wouldn't see money nor spread the word on their work.
I'm tired of companies using "piracy" as an excuse to justify their mediocrity. Gotta spend money (properly) to make money kiddies.
So,
Free publicity for the devs if a person doesn't buy the game but downloads it and people get to know what's out there.
Or,
If the person buys the game the devs get money.
If anything the consumer is the one always losing. They lose money if they buy something, especially if they bite the bait set by marketing and don't actually enjoy the game. And they lose dignity by being called pirates when they don't buy it and download instead. Why would they insult people who are getting to know their work and might be future fans? If they didn't download the stuff the dev team wouldn't see money nor spread the word on their work.
I'm tired of companies using "piracy" as an excuse to justify their mediocrity. Gotta spend money (properly) to make money kiddies.
Well, making games is expensive. Sixty dollars may seem expensive for a game, but when you think of all the work and money that's put in, it's understandable that they'd want more money coming out.AndyFromMonday said:
Hey, Turok for the N64 cost 80 bucks new, so I guess we shouldn't complain about prices.
The OP hurt my eyes. Run-on sentences are the real problem here.
You know what? Just for me, slap yo' Language Arts teacher, OP.
On your topic, you limited your question to precisely one viewpoint with an obvious answer. If someone who would not normally buy a game got their hands on a free version, the developers/publishers *might* not be losing anything. Oh hey, you got me to admit that piracy may not cause a developer to lose sales in one very specific and very difficult to definitively qualify for instance! Good for you, have a cookie.
Pirating a game is like stealing things from the candy rack in the supermarket. The supermarket won't go under if a few people do it. You're not hitler for taking a pack of gum. However, stealing the gum is still ethically wrong and the store has a right to expect to be paid for it's merchandise, no matter how small.
If it's free or if it's abandonware, it's not pirating. If you torrent or otherwise download a game that's still being offered at retail so as to avoid having to pay for it, you're an asshat. I've yet to meet a single person who has gone back and paid for a second copy of the game they got for free out of guilt or whatever. I can understand having money troubles. I know that keeping up with releases can be hard sometimes. I know there are at least 4 games coming out in the next 3 weeks that I want to buy but can't. I'm not going to pirate them, and neither should anyone else. I'm not saying you/they can't, just that you/they really shouldn't.
I think that there are two kinds of piracy, and one of them doesn't really get enough credit.
There is:
A) Piracy as defined, where you effectively 'steal' a copy of a game for you to play without paying for it. This is the kind that developers hate, gamers hate, I hate.
B) Piracy as a gift. See, I've often given my little brother/friends a copy of a new game that I've bought that I absolutely cannot get enough of, by letting them log in as me on steam and play it for a bit. Other times, we share CDs and CD keys. This is the kind of piracy developers need more of, because in 9/10 cases, my little brother/friends went and bought their own Steam version, or plan to when they get more money. It's caused the people around me to become interested in a developer's later work. This is the kind of piracy that people who defend piracy try to advocate.
It's important to note that in this day and age, almost every game either has a demo, a friend who can let you try it, or some gameplay videos or reviews that can give you a good idea of how the game is. "Try before you buy" is not a valid excuse for pirating. "I don't like the DRM" is also not okay. Either you boycott it or you deal with the DRM. If it's something rendering the game unplayable offline or something, a crack is fine so you can play your game that you paid for, but it's not okay to torrent the whole game. Anyhow, I'm going to go play some games on Steam, a service with games so cheap, I've never had to pirate a game.
You know what? Just for me, slap yo' Language Arts teacher, OP.
On your topic, you limited your question to precisely one viewpoint with an obvious answer. If someone who would not normally buy a game got their hands on a free version, the developers/publishers *might* not be losing anything. Oh hey, you got me to admit that piracy may not cause a developer to lose sales in one very specific and very difficult to definitively qualify for instance! Good for you, have a cookie.
Pirating a game is like stealing things from the candy rack in the supermarket. The supermarket won't go under if a few people do it. You're not hitler for taking a pack of gum. However, stealing the gum is still ethically wrong and the store has a right to expect to be paid for it's merchandise, no matter how small.
If it's free or if it's abandonware, it's not pirating. If you torrent or otherwise download a game that's still being offered at retail so as to avoid having to pay for it, you're an asshat. I've yet to meet a single person who has gone back and paid for a second copy of the game they got for free out of guilt or whatever. I can understand having money troubles. I know that keeping up with releases can be hard sometimes. I know there are at least 4 games coming out in the next 3 weeks that I want to buy but can't. I'm not going to pirate them, and neither should anyone else. I'm not saying you/they can't, just that you/they really shouldn't.
I think that there are two kinds of piracy, and one of them doesn't really get enough credit.
There is:
A) Piracy as defined, where you effectively 'steal' a copy of a game for you to play without paying for it. This is the kind that developers hate, gamers hate, I hate.
B) Piracy as a gift. See, I've often given my little brother/friends a copy of a new game that I've bought that I absolutely cannot get enough of, by letting them log in as me on steam and play it for a bit. Other times, we share CDs and CD keys. This is the kind of piracy developers need more of, because in 9/10 cases, my little brother/friends went and bought their own Steam version, or plan to when they get more money. It's caused the people around me to become interested in a developer's later work. This is the kind of piracy that people who defend piracy try to advocate.
It's important to note that in this day and age, almost every game either has a demo, a friend who can let you try it, or some gameplay videos or reviews that can give you a good idea of how the game is. "Try before you buy" is not a valid excuse for pirating. "I don't like the DRM" is also not okay. Either you boycott it or you deal with the DRM. If it's something rendering the game unplayable offline or something, a crack is fine so you can play your game that you paid for, but it's not okay to torrent the whole game. Anyhow, I'm going to go play some games on Steam, a service with games so cheap, I've never had to pirate a game.
1200 pounds, seriously? I game on a $400 laptop that I paid for with scholarship money. That's equivalent to about 250-300 pounds, if you didn't know. I have to agree with the guy above: if you can afford to drop the equivalent of over $2000 on a gaming PC, when $600 will get you something that will run everything at full settings for several years, you've got the money to buy games. If not, you should have bought a more reasonable machine. The "I can't afford it" argument goes more to people with a mid-range PC which they have to have for school or work anyway, and is still capable of playing some games on the side. Talking about a 1200 pound beast doesn't help on that end.twiceworn said:
Food and videogames are different, but if we are going to treat them with the same sense of importance in everyday life, then what would happen to somebody who decided to rob a grocery store? Would they get special privileges because they couldn't buy it? People forget that piracy is the stealing of somebody's work because they were too stingy/poor to buy it.AndyFromMonday said:
On a different note, pirating the humble indie collection is just wrong. The money gained from it didn't just go to the developers, but to Child's Play as well. Pirating those games is similar to stealing from the Cystic Fibrosis Foundation, and I don't see how anyone can justify that.
Except,as I pointed out above, we're talking about a copy of a game that was made using resources not connected to the company, so that specific copy cost the company nothing, compared to food that somebody had to buy before it could be given away. This is also why copyright infringement is a different crime, and a much less serious offense, than theft.zehydra said:
wow are you in the wrong place....and aparently have read the wrong post as i said at the start that piracy is wrong and that nearly all excuses were bad, no the exect word was bullshit, my question was is there a good reason (legal resons aside) that somone in the circimstances i described SHOULDNT DO IT i even said i was sure there was a reason i just couldnt think of one and now you blast at me because you cant think of one, my question is now this if you didny have an answer to my question WHY POST i asken for an answer dont have one DONT POST, i am not suporting piracy i am looking for a way in which that kind of piracy hurts the industry so i can put to bed the last argument FOR piracy and if you dont have an answer but decide to make vailed insults i must asume you sir are an ASSHATINF1NIT3 D00M said:
Not theft, copyright infringement. Conflating two different crimes isn't helping anyone here. As for the HiB, yeah, pirating it was a dick move, but the interesting thing about it is that the Humble Bundle guys knew a percentage was going to pirate it, so they put up an official torrent so those guys could pirate it without taking up HiB bandwidth -- they even suggested that that was a better option than paying a penny to get it legally, like so many people wound up doing. Since it was going over a peer to peer network, instead of eating up their bandwidth, it actually didn't hurt them, and the pirates wound up hurting less than the assholes who paid a penny and then still ate up bandwidth downloading the games.Landshark1 said:
All arguments for piracy are stupid.
If you had no intentions of buying the game, you do not deserve to own it. Simple as that. You are cheating the system by getting the game for free. It's a slap in the face to the developers who worked hard on the game. If you want to play it but don't want to own it, rent it or borrow it from a friend.
If you can't afford the game, you do not deserve to own it. Have no money? Get a job. Have a job but no money? Save.
Just because someone is too lazy to think of a rational solution to their problem does not mean that piracy is ever justified. Theft is theft. You do not have a mandatory entertainment quota that has to be filled every so often. If for whatever reason you do, set money aside for entertainment.
You wouldn't ask a plumber to come fix your pipes and then decide not to pay him because you can't afford it. That would make you an asshole. Why would you download a collection of several people's hard work and then decide "oh naw it's ok. I never planned on buying it in the first place."?
The real world doesn't work like that.
If you had no intentions of buying the game, you do not deserve to own it. Simple as that. You are cheating the system by getting the game for free. It's a slap in the face to the developers who worked hard on the game. If you want to play it but don't want to own it, rent it or borrow it from a friend.
If you can't afford the game, you do not deserve to own it. Have no money? Get a job. Have a job but no money? Save.
Just because someone is too lazy to think of a rational solution to their problem does not mean that piracy is ever justified. Theft is theft. You do not have a mandatory entertainment quota that has to be filled every so often. If for whatever reason you do, set money aside for entertainment.
You wouldn't ask a plumber to come fix your pipes and then decide not to pay him because you can't afford it. That would make you an asshole. Why would you download a collection of several people's hard work and then decide "oh naw it's ok. I never planned on buying it in the first place."?
The real world doesn't work like that.