What do people think about Bioware right now?

[Snotnarok]

How do I feel? They're a developer who make good RPGs with over priced hoodies and stuff. I don't get why people hold favoritism with companies.

Yeah! I also don't get why people follow authors. Or directors. Or musicians.

That's a BIT different I mean that's a person so you can sort of relate to them, however a company, Bioware, Nintendo whatever is a company and they want your money and have no real interest in you the lowly consumer you know?

 

[FieryTrainwreck]

Bioware games have become far too formuliac. I broke down and purchased SWTOR, and I sorta hate it. Why? Because the gameplay is (as expected) WoW all over again, and everything else (story, characters, dialogue, etc.) is Bioware 101. They take no fucking chances anymore. If you haven't been slogging through the ME/DA series, maybe it's not so goddamn tedious. But for me? It's honestly hard to stomach. I find myself whipping through all of the predictable, cliched dialogue as quickly as possible just so I can get back to playing the game... only the game part was lifted entirely from another MMO I played five years ago.

Bioware badly needs a "return to form" game. Something dark and strange and inventive that doesn't conform to their current template.

 

[risue]

Bioware use to be one of my favorite developers, they have gone down sense for a few reasons. The biggest reason is not because of DA2, EA or their business model (which may or may not be related to EA) The biggest issue Ive had is their quality of writing in their games. And to be fair, with as broad of a scope as they put on their games, I can imagine that writing these games can be really difficult. But I still don't see that as an excuse to use the same plot device 7 times in one game as they did in ME2. "Shepard meets person X, person X seems somewhat shifty but they work together, at an important moment person X betrays Shepard, Shepard fights his/her way out" (SPOILERS though.. its been out for a year and a half.. whatevs) obtaining Jack (the warden) , Miranda's loyalty (niket), Willson in the begining, Illusive man (on several occasions though indirectly), Jacob's father (also indirectly), the Arrival DLC, the beginning of the shadow broker's DLC, and several other instances both big and small... all with the same plot structure. Dont get me wrong though, it was a fun game, i enjoyed it and played through it at least 6 times, super fun. But the writing... i'm all for a good plot twist but they got predictable.

I am also annoied at how... "merchandise-y" they have gotten. I dont want mass effect or dragon age toilet paper, plush dolls, or hand towels (I really hope at least one person got the reference) I just want them to make good games, and love them for making games I like. and the whole Bioware pulse thing??? what? I guess that appeals to some.. but just give me the fancy behind the senses interesting bit and let it stand on it's own awesomeness no need to jazz it up with jellybeans.

now i never played DA2, loved DA:O but DA2 looked like a flop from the beginning teasers and screenshots so aside from that i cant legitimately give it criticism, and there is already plenty of it out there, which in and of itself does enough to bring BioWare down.

ME3 is what BioWare's reputation as a developer is hinging on for me (and apparently a lot of people) those who think that's dumb... well, there are plenty of people who see it that way so while it may be somewhat arbitrary its real enough for me. That being said, i never got into the C&C games so regardless of how good ME3 is... i will not be playing the new one. that means after ME3 it will be a while before i buy from BioWare again.

EA also has its fair share of "bleh" to add to BioWare.. I have been very unimpressed by Origin. call me a Steam/Valve fanboy if you want, ive got roughly 100 games on steam, i like it there. Using Origin wont be the end of the world but it wont get any business from me otherwise. still is an annoying "meh" that i'll have ME 1 and 2 on steam but ME3 on Origin.

anywho that's my two cents on Bioware

 

[Tsaba]

I'm gonna go ahead and say it, I love Bioware games, I like the games they make.

I think the problem a lot of people are making here, is that they are comparing them to other Bioware games, and demanding that they live up to this invisible standard. I think they are fun and enjoyable games and should be judged as games.

Honestly, that's what we are all here to do, enjoy ourselves playing video games, not stare at it and be, "now that's a piece of art." Now if you excuse me, I have to go take a shower, so many snobs around it's making me feel dirty.

 

[AetherWolf]

If it wasn't EA holding their reigns I would probably have a different say on them.

 

[Savber]

Bioware is EA's most powerful brand right now in terms of critical reception.

However, there's signs that Bioware is beginning to crack under EA.

ME3 and DA3 will be the turning point for many Bioware fans.

If ME3 turns out to be another DA2, Bioware's reputation would be utterly done for. An overreaction? Not quite as Bioware's standing among many people have become downright shaky especially considering the company's former near-perfect reputation.

DA3 will need to prove that it's a return to form and that they haven't forgotten the old RPG crowd.
ME3 needs to prove that Bioware can balance the hardcore/mainstream.

That said, Bioware HAS been way overstreched. 4-5 different teams? One of them will just eventually drop the ball. Even top developers like Blizzard and Valve aren't making 3-4 games at the same time.

 

[Bat Vader]

In my opinion I think they are doing good. I liked Dragon Age II and I am loving The Old Republic. I thought Dragon Age: Origins was better but I don't hate Dragon Age II. I think Bioware will do a great job with Mass Effect 3.

 

[Infamous Boss]

In general, I think they've grown too big and stretched the original team that made Bioware great too thin. Add to this the oversight by EA which has pushed them into several questionable directions and it's not looking too great...

Mass Effect 2 was a good game. But even here, the damage was starting to show. The main plot was kinda crap (and by "kinda" I mean "real fucking") and the RPG elements were a bit too streamlined. However, the gameplay was better, the subpolots were good, the characters were interesting and the excellent background of the ME universe held it together.

Then came Dragon Age 2. This is where it became evident that there was a problem. The game simply didn't have the production values or the quality that other Bioware games had. It was inferior to Dragon Age 1 in visuals, writing, plot, characters, gameplay, pretty much every department. The cut corners were pleantiful and obvious, with content being reused over and over and over again. Add to this a very small number of locations (which were also reused constantly), lazy combat design (nonsensical wave combat and health-bloated bosses) and a slew of other problems, you get a game that was obviously rushed by Bioware's B- or C-list team.

The likely reason for that was that resources were being shifted to The Old Republic. Yes, at this point someone will tell me that those were separate teams. Maybe, but that doesn't mean that they can't put all the good designers and developers on the TOR team. Also, it doesn't say anything about the funding or deadlines. I'm sure the DA2 people did what they could with what they were given, which probably wasn't much.

Now TOR's come out, and while the general reception is positive, the complaints make it fairly obvious that it too was dumped out too soon, likely to meet the Christmas deadline. From what I understand, crafting was only implemented a month before release, and as a result it's utterly crap, with most crafting skills being pointless and one of the wto good ones (Slicing) had to be nerfed in the first patch for being too profitable. There are plenty of other pieces of evidence that the game was shoved out the door before it was ready, like a raid where someone forgot to change the placeholder names for enemies, so they're named Boss Beast 1, Boss Beast 2, etc.

All in all, it has me worried. Worried for ME3 and DA3. Worried that they've taken on yet another project (C&C:Generals 2). Worried that the Bioware that I am a fan of no longer exists, its members spread across a bunch of substudios under the direction of EA.

At this point it could go either way. In the near future it all hinges on Mass Effect 3 and how well they'll fix TOR. If Mass Effect 3 manages to at least match ME2 in overall quality, that would be a good start. If the fixes to the broken parts of TOR are swift (crafting, ability delay, bugged class quests) and they also manage to follow up with some much needed features (dual specs, UI customization, mod support) and more endgame content to satisfy the hardcore crowd, that would be another good sign.

In the long term, the question is what will happen with Dragon Age 3. The ME franchise didn't suffer such a terrible drop in quality, so I'm less worried about ME3. But DA3 has to make quite a few big changes in almost every aspect to save itself from the wreck of DA2...

This said it best if me3 is not everything and more i dont think i can keep buying their game's.

 

[Talvrae]

Bioware always used the comment from the forum to help in developement and i think part of the problem of DA2 come from there. But i still like them, they are still didnt made a bad game... DA2 wasnt great but it was good

 

[Thaius]

Haven't played the Dragon Age games yet (the first one is among a pile of games in my backlog right now), but I love the Mass Effect games. All they're trying to do in "appealing to the Call of Duty crowd" is make the games more accessible (not a bad thing in its own right) and make the gameplay based more on player skill than pure stats (as opposed to games like Bioware's own Knights of the Old Republic, which was a great game, but was based more on level and stats than actual skill). They overcorrected a bit with ME2, but the game was still overall a fantastic experience, and they look to be finding good middle ground with the third one. They're still one of the few developers that can create a compelling story with complex characters within the choice and freedom-based staples of Western RPGs.

 

[Vegosiux]

The BioWare that made Baldur's Gate and the BioWare that made Dragon Age 2 are two different things.

That's how I feel.

 

[ecoho]

In general, I think they've grown too big and stretched the original team that made Bioware great too thin. Add to this the oversight by EA which has pushed them into several questionable directions and it's not looking too great...

Mass Effect 2 was a good game. But even here, the damage was starting to show. The main plot was kinda crap (and by "kinda" I mean "real fucking") and the RPG elements were a bit too streamlined. However, the gameplay was better, the subpolots were good, the characters were interesting and the excellent background of the ME universe held it together.

Then came Dragon Age 2. This is where it became evident that there was a problem. The game simply didn't have the production values or the quality that other Bioware games had. It was inferior to Dragon Age 1 in visuals, writing, plot, characters, gameplay, pretty much every department. The cut corners were pleantiful and obvious, with content being reused over and over and over again. Add to this a very small number of locations (which were also reused constantly), lazy combat design (nonsensical wave combat and health-bloated bosses) and a slew of other problems, you get a game that was obviously rushed by Bioware's B- or C-list team.

The likely reason for that was that resources were being shifted to The Old Republic. Yes, at this point someone will tell me that those were separate teams. Maybe, but that doesn't mean that they can't put all the good designers and developers on the TOR team. Also, it doesn't say anything about the funding or deadlines. I'm sure the DA2 people did what they could with what they were given, which probably wasn't much.

Now TOR's come out, and while the general reception is positive, the complaints make it fairly obvious that it too was dumped out too soon, likely to meet the Christmas deadline. From what I understand, crafting was only implemented a month before release, and as a result it's utterly crap, with most crafting skills being pointless and one of the wto good ones (Slicing) had to be nerfed in the first patch for being too profitable. There are plenty of other pieces of evidence that the game was shoved out the door before it was ready, like a raid where someone forgot to change the placeholder names for enemies, so they're named Boss Beast 1, Boss Beast 2, etc.

All in all, it has me worried. Worried for ME3 and DA3. Worried that they've taken on yet another project (C&C:Generals 2). Worried that the Bioware that I am a fan of no longer exists, its members spread across a bunch of substudios under the direction of EA.

At this point it could go either way. In the near future it all hinges on Mass Effect 3 and how well they'll fix TOR. If Mass Effect 3 manages to at least match ME2 in overall quality, that would be a good start. If the fixes to the broken parts of TOR are swift (crafting, ability delay, bugged class quests) and they also manage to follow up with some much needed features (dual specs, UI customization, mod support) and more endgame content to satisfy the hardcore crowd, that would be another good sign.

In the long term, the question is what will happen with Dragon Age 3. The ME franchise didn't suffer such a terrible drop in quality, so I'm less worried about ME3. But DA3 has to make quite a few big changes in almost every aspect to save itself from the wreck of DA2...

i have to say i like your post, I might not agree with some of it but i can at least respect it.
So far TOR is doing fantastic if you copare it to any MMO that had just launched so fixes for that will be coming and some things cant be fixed till theyre found, its just the nature of mmos.
i agree DA2 was their poorest game but i have a theory. Bioware made that game to prove a point to EA. Now hear me out the peices are there for anyone to see. first they release DA2 it got bad reveiws got flamed and such, but imeditly afterword TOR and ME3 got delayed a whole year(well 6 months for TOR.) so my theory is my theory just a thought but it would seem to make since.

 

[implodinggoat]

Bioware is still my favorite developer.

I've played Dragon Age 2 (on Xbox) and it is shockingly mediocre for a game released by Bioware. The combat is mindlessly repetitive and dull yet all the strategy from Dragon Age: Origins is lost in the name of speeding up the combat and this is coming from someone who played on a console.

But; I'm not prepared to abandon all hope in Bioware on the basis of one misstep.

Besides Mass Effect 2 was the best game I've ever played. I had some issues with the story and the way they handled some of my favorite characters from Mass Effect 1; but the awesome combat negates all of that. The game gives you a really good 3rd person shooter and on top of that it gives you more diverse and clever abilities than Mass Effect 1 and more responsive and intricate squad commands to boot.

I am somewhat wary about the influence of EA on Bioware though and the retailer exclusive DLC they announced for Mass Effect 3 yesterday did piss me off.

Everything I've seen of Mass Effect 3 looks spectacular though, so I'm optimistic.

 

[lewiswhitling]

I still think that bioware are a fantastic company - as one which has grown in a more usual way compared to say, Valve, it has done an impressive job of keeping the love of games and desire to persue ambitious objectives at the fore front of its business...

However, i think perhaps their objectives are a little misdirected atm. The desire to voice act everything is a little wierd.. as it inflates the cost of a project so incredibly massively, for a gain which seems fairly limited to me. Also, there seems to be confusion between the concept of streamlining experiences so theyre accessible to everyone, and simply reducing the complexity of a title. Which i feel is also a sad thing.

I think the company was built on ambitious enterprising ideas and a desire to push games into new territory, a passion which they still have. However, i think this passion could be redirected else where in the design of their games to fully realise their potential.

 

[Sangnz]

Bioware could probably kick me in the ball sack and I would still happily buy their next game. Until they let me down with a crap game I love em to bits!

 

[Vault101]

to be honest ive only played Dragon age orrigins and the mass effect games..I like them

as to how they will go in the future...you know as far as the dumbing down thing goes..who knows

mabye thir games will continue to be popular...but their original fans will get annoyed

EDIT: I also think one medicore game isnt enough to start predicting end timed for Bioare..*sigh* uh this probably isnt a debate worth having

 

[SpaceBat]

To me, there are two branches of Bioware. One makes Mass Effect, a third person shooter with great dialog and RPG elements. I like this branch of Bioware. The other makes Dragon Age, a series that has ranged from painfully mediocre at best to absolutely shit at worst, and employs this monstrosity.


The Dragon Age branch sucks. The Mass Effect branch is good. I buy the Mass Effect games. I do my best to stay away from the Dragon Age games.

I'm going to partially agree with this, aside from the dragon age part. DA2 was fairly bad, but I somewhat enjoyed DA1. It was a flawed game at best and I can't say I played through it with joy, but it was still miles better than the average RPG being released at that point.

I'm going to have to agree that the Mass Effect series is better than DA as well, in fact I enjoy them more than nearly any other game they've made. I can't say Bioware has decreased in quality for me and I don't look at them differently. They are still GENERALLY dishing out the same quality they have been for a long time.

BG series were their best work, but they've been going steady ever since. KotoR is overrated and in no way superior to the ME series. I am still trying to understand the incredible amount of love for this game.

 

[implodinggoat]

KotoR is overrated and in no way superior to the ME series. I am still trying to understand the incredible amount of love for this game.

Well you're opinion of KOTOR really depends on if you're a Star Wars fan or not. I am so I loved KOTOR because it let me really explore the setting that I fell in love with when I was a kid watching Star Wars on VHS.

Even if you're not a Star Wars fan though the storyline is really great and throws some big surprises at you, the characters are fascinating (particularly HK-47) and the environments are really diverse and interesting. The combat isn't very interesting or challenging though. Its not inane like the combat in Dragon Age 2; but it doesn't give you a lot of strategy (Dragon Age: Origins, Baldurs Gate) or action (Mass Effect 2).

For the story alone I'd recommend it to anyone even now 9 years after it came out. Although I still prefer Mass Effect.

 

[Xaositect]

Im 99.99999999% sure ME3 will be the last Bioware title I ever buy. And Ill buy it, as much as Im sure its probably going to be ME2 but twice as bad. The reason for that is for similar reasons when I watch my football team play the whole 90 minutes even when they are losing or follow them even if its a bad season. The big difference is that they dont decide midway through a season theyve had enough of being a football team and instead want to go racing, or do some other sport. For that reason I follow them again next season hoping for better.

As for BiowarEA, I pretty much agree with the OP. They are now dictated to by marketing dumbasses who are hankering after CoD style sales for games, and think designing games for dumbasses is the way to make money (just because it works with CoD fans - not always without complaint mind - doesnt mean it works for everything).

Maybe theres a character or two here or a relationship between characters that can help ease through Biowares new shitty approach to games. God knows, without Mordin and Samara, not to mention Isabela, Varric and Aveline for ME2 and DA2, there would have been no chance whatsoever I could finish the games.

Hopefully ME3 has similar small comforts to cling to before Im finally finished and can all in likelihood finish this long, drawn out and bitter farewell to what was once my favourite developer.

 

[Skoldpadda]

BiowarEA

I like this, because it sounds like "diarrhea".