You don't get it, they have to be made to sell it or they're censorshipping! We have to impinge on their right to run their business freely, so that we can prevent them from becoming part of the SJW Jew Media!Helter Skelter said:Because they like to sell millions of units, not a hundred thousand or so?
Yeah, no. You made the point. You give the examples. That's how logic and burden of proof work. You don't want to back up yours side, that's fine, but don't expect me to do your job for you.slo said:There are tons of examples, it's just you refuse to see those and need some very fancy rare and specific one. Find it yourself.Dr. Crawver said:1) All these games listed came out. This is not an example for your point, it's a different point.slo said:There are tons of examples, it's just you refuse to see those and need some very fancy rare and specific one. Find it yourself.
And since you can't just look around on your own have this fine link: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFItIX8SIs4zqhJCHpbeV1A/videos
Should be enough.
2) I've looked through the first page, and fuck no. This isn't censorship. Some of it is localisation issues, some of it are the company did it on their own terms (I mean seriously, are we still touting the R.Mika butt slap not being center screen as censorship? Really?)
3) I'm really not going to watch every video, so unless there's one or two specific ones that actually do argue your point (that there are games that would have been made if it wasn't for people decrying it due to prudishness), you're going to need to pick them out, because expecting someone to go through a channels catalogue is unreasonable and actually a pretty shitty discussion technique.
4) Also good job at addressing the other points I made. Like who are meant to be these people blocking the way anyway?
It has everything to do with Japanese culture. To them, sexuality is something to be practiced in the privacy of your own home, hence why public displays of sexuality is frowned upon.EternallyBored said:Honestly, I've always found Japan to be more on the repressed side, publicly at least, especially public displays like clothes and displays of affection. Although, Japanese strip clubs are pretty wild, very explicit, that might just be Tokyo though.
Generally, I think the reason things like DOAX don't appeal as much to Westerners is that the teasing low end stuff is generally disregarded in favor of just straight up porn, or at least soft core toplessness. The more open attitude towards publicly sexual displays and dress in the West directly competes with at least some of the audience that games like DOAX draw in Japan. Westerners can step outside in most warmer areas and get the same effect from real women that you can get from the kind of fanservice DOAX provides, sans the groping of course.
Its more a cultural attraction/aversion to teasing than anything to do with prudishness, Western audiences seem to want to just cut to the chase when it comes to fiction, while Japanese audiences are more open to teasing without anything actually happening. Varies by region of course, someone in Shibuya ward in Tokyo, or Castro district in San Francisco is obviously going to be different than the general audience living in a rural area.
Well, let's agree to disagree, then.Smithnikov said:The first one.Davroth said:Mmmm, have you actually ever played a DOAX game?
I know it's not. But it's purpose, titillation, is also much easier and cheaper to attain.Calling it pornographic is reallllllly stretching it. What I'm trying to say is there is no money shots of any kind.
A simplistic way to put it, but not wholly inaccurate, my overall point is that I don't think its really prudishness that makes teasing games like DOAX or the various fan service animes unpopular in the West, well, not so much unpopular as less popular with so many Westerners asking what the point of such games is.Davroth said:It has everything to do with Japanese culture. To them, sexuality is something to be practiced in the privacy of your own home, hence why public displays of sexuality is frowned upon.EternallyBored said:Honestly, I've always found Japan to be more on the repressed side, publicly at least, especially public displays like clothes and displays of affection. Although, Japanese strip clubs are pretty wild, very explicit, that might just be Tokyo though.
Generally, I think the reason things like DOAX don't appeal as much to Westerners is that the teasing low end stuff is generally disregarded in favor of just straight up porn, or at least soft core toplessness. The more open attitude towards publicly sexual displays and dress in the West directly competes with at least some of the audience that games like DOAX draw in Japan. Westerners can step outside in most warmer areas and get the same effect from real women that you can get from the kind of fanservice DOAX provides, sans the groping of course.
Its more a cultural attraction/aversion to teasing than anything to do with prudishness, Western audiences seem to want to just cut to the chase when it comes to fiction, while Japanese audiences are more open to teasing without anything actually happening. Varies by region of course, someone in Shibuya ward in Tokyo, or Castro district in San Francisco is obviously going to be different than the general audience living in a rural area.
Well, trying to decipher your question (seriously, that's a grammatical nightmare), the reason why big budget developers don't create games based solely around teasing and scantily clad women is basically there isn't the market for it to justify their budgets. I've made my stance clear before, but I'll lay it out very clearly for you.slo said:It's not a claim, it's a theory. And if you don't like a theory, you need to come up with a better theory or find some flaw in the existing one. It's your job, not mine. Don't expect me to run around finding evidence for you to bravely dismiss.Dr. Crawver said:Yeah, no. You made the point. You give the examples. That's how logic and burden of proof work. You don't want to back up yours side, that's fine, but don't expect me to do your job for you.
Also again, bravo on addressing all the points I made. This feels less like a discussion, and more you with your fingers in your ears.
Now get your cards on the table. On what basis do you think things that are currently affecting big budget games with sexy content somehow don't apply to games in the making and don't prevent them from being done or get budgets?
Careful with all that straw, stuff's flammable.Ersetu said:You don't get it, they have to be made to sell it or they're censorshipping! We have to impinge on their right to run their business freely, so that we can prevent them from becoming part of the SJW Jew Media!Helter Skelter said:Because they like to sell millions of units, not a hundred thousand or so?
Wake up sheeple.
To be fair 500,000 hasn't been great since the ps2 era. What's more worrying is how a game can sell 8.5 million and be considered a failure. That is more terrifying.Metalix Knightmare said:As much as I hate to admit it, Jim Sterling is actually right on the money on this, and Helter has a point (Though I don't hate to admit that.). A LOT of devs and publishers have a really bad form of tunnel vision when it comes to games. It's either they want ALL of the money, or they won't bother.
Seriously, we currently live in an age where 500,000 units being sold can be considered a flop or a disappointment.
Excuse me, ONE?slo said:Now for the sales of DOAX. They don't matter because murder games are made in large quantities and there's like one sexy game to counter them.
Clearly.And that's it. Bored now.
Slo, the reason has been pointed out to you through logical arguments backed up by hard facts and sales data. There is no market large enough in the West to make it worthwhile for developers to drop a significant budget on this type of game. I'm sorry that you don't like that answer, but it is the truth.slo said:I knew this would be an issue.Smithnikov said:Excuse me, ONE?
Have you been on the internet very long? H games, ecchi games, eastern and western alike, are only a mouse click away.
Go look at the Onechambra DLC section at the Steam store if you don't believe me.
Action games with tits attached - we've got those alright.
Low budget visual novels - dime a dozen.
But when it comes to high budget games that are all of the Dionysus and none of the Ares, I rarely see those.
If there's a spot on the internet where they all gather, I've missed it.
So that's that.
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Does that make sense to you? It's not real, it's ridiculous, so I have to ask. If you don't understand basic macroeconomics, please stop making grand and ridiculous claims.slo said:This is a nice explanation. It is not wrong. But it also does not really explain anything. Today there's no market, tomorrow it might appear. The day after tomorrow it might vanish again.Avnger said:Slo, the reason has been pointed out to you through logical arguments backed up by hard facts and sales data. There is no market large enough in the West to make it worthwhile for developers to drop a significant budget on this type of game. I'm sorry that you don't like that answer, but it is the truth.
If you still refuse to acknowledge this, please back up your assertion that such a market exists with concrete proof, as in tangible evidence that doesn't rely on the assumption that "well of course it exists, it's just some silent majority-esque thing."
Well then, stop relying on memory and do some reading, it will help you, and by extension everyone else who has to interact with you, here and elsewhere.slo said:I remember when...
...So you've said before, and then (as now) you seem to find yourself with more to say. My argument wasn't by way of a demand, but just to say that if you keep up that unfortunate pattern, as least offer a sprinkle of content with your evasion and defensiveness.slo said:Why must you keep beating on this poor dead thread? Moreso why would you demand things from people on the internet?Sceadu said:snip
I've already said all I had to say,