Your video game hot take(s) thread

[TheMysteriousGX]

Even before discussing the Zelda league, they were already blacklisted from Nintendo by something else. They literally lose nothing. I don't like coming for Kotaku's defense. I don't like coming for Kotaku's defense, but Nintendo has their own screw-ups as well, and I don't like how to handle the recent people who leak stuff. They go way too far, and expect everybody to be their bitches.

I don't like defending Kotaku because generally speaking Kotaku has done nothing wrong, so when I invariably read a Kotaku article to see what people are getting pissy about this month I say "wait, that's it?" and I am mad that I have once again been bamboozled into reading a Kotaku article.

I only ever read Kotaku articles when people are mad at Kotaku. I generally find it really easy to not read Kotaku articles otherwise. People who get mad at Kotaku should really follow my lead.

But seriously, I haven't read this Kotaku article. I will not read this Kotaku article. Unless Nintendo retcons their extremely stupid Skyward Sword plot points regarding Ganon, there is nothing even remotely important to spoil that hasn't already been spoiled *by Nintendo*

 

[Old_Hunter_77]

I don't like defending Kotaku because generally speaking Kotaku has done nothing wrong, so when I invariably read a Kotaku article to see what people are getting pissy about this month I say "wait, that's it?" and I am mad that I have once again been bamboozled into reading a Kotaku article.

I only ever read Kotaku articles when people are mad at Kotaku. I generally find it really easy to not read Kotaku articles otherwise. People who get mad at Kotaku should really follow my lead.

But seriously, I haven't read this Kotaku article. I will not read this Kotaku article. Unless Nintendo retcons their extremely stupid Skyward Sword plot points regarding Ganon, there is nothing even remotely important to spoil that hasn't already been spoiled *by Nintendo*

Yeah, this,. The problem with Kotaku is that it's just boring and lame, like most web sites. That's kind of what Sterling is getting at- that some keyboard warrior gamrs make it this holy crusade is just laughably pathetic.

 

[Old_Hunter_77]

This is a dumb take. I'll be watching all the GoG movies more than playing the game.

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Well it's a dumb take because wed don't have to choose lol

I think Guardians of the Galaxy and Spiderman are the only MCU characters left I sort of care about, and it's just how likeable and fun the characters are. Ms Marvel could be that, too, but I don't trust them to see that through.

I liked the game very much, but it's very much a one and done kind of thing for me. I'm the first one to praise and favor linearity and narrative games but I will admit the disadvantage is that there is no incentive to replay (which is why game studios are pushed to put in more crap like open world and NG+ and bullshit collectibles).
And I'll watch the new movie- not in the theater, but to "stream" wink wink.

These days I only go to the theater for:
- Star Wars, cause space-'splosions and lightsaber go bbbbrrrr
- Creed, cause I'm a sucker for boxing montages
- Quirky indy horror films, cause my wife is a huge fan and seeing them with her is the best

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

Every possible story has already been told. We're just repainting the sets and making new props.

That’s because we’re stuck within the confines of what we already know. And what we don’t, even if imagined, people likely wouldn’t “get” anyways. Kinda like how a musician could play the most impressive piece of music nobody’s ever heard before and get nothing but blank stares. We humans need emotional attachment to give meaning to things.

 

[BrawlMan]

liked the game very much, but it's very much a one and done kind of thing for me. I'm the first one to praise and favor linearity and narrative games but I will admit the disadvantage is that there is no incentive to replay (which is why game studios are pushed to put in more crap like open world and NG+ and bullshit collectibles).
And I'll watch the new movie- not in the theater, but to "stream" wink wink.

Precisely why I'm not interested in the game. Plus, Western developers really need to learn how to do replay value correctly. If most Japanese developers can do this in the blink of an eye, then Western AAA developers can do this too. They have before, but most either don't know, or keep falling in the same dumb trends over and over again expecting the same thing to happen with success. That's not getting into the smaller games or Indie games that pull this off successively nearly every single time.

We humans need emotional attachment to give meaning to things.

I call it trying something new and different, everyone. It's either I'll be attached to it or not. If I'm not, it doesn't mean somebody else can't be attached to it, and vice versa.

 

[Old_Hunter_77]

I don't understand this idea of not wanting to play a game once because you won't want to play it twice- that is so weird to me. I mean, as we always say, you do you and play what we want, etc, I just don't get it.
I certainly get it from from a value perspective- like I get not wanting to play a significant chunk of money for such a game. But even if it's cheap, or part of a sub or a deal, not even play it once? I don't get it. *shrug*
But I'm coming from a place where I replay two game 100x and play everything else once so... I dunno

 

[BrawlMan]

I don't understand this idea of not wanting to play a game once because you won't want to play it twice- that is so weird to me. I mean, as we always say, you do you and play what we want, etc, I just don't get it.
I certainly get it from from a value perspective- like I get not wanting to play a significant chunk of money for such a game. But even if it's cheap, or part of a sub or a deal, not even play it once? I don't get it. *shrug*
But I'm coming from a place where I replay two game 100x and play everything else once so... I dunno

I spend my time however I want. I used to be a bit more lenient to one and done games (especially when a lot of them at that time were at budget price), but most from the AAA sector have those crappy forced walking sections (which are always a detriment on repeat playthroughs), or the quality is not there for the high price. Especially if many of these games charging top dollar or $70 now. The one dones might as well just be played at $20 or less now. And sometimes they're not even worth the $20. I look for a game with strong or decent replay value with extra modes and bonuses to keep the player engaged. Like how it always was back in the 16-bit era, PS1 era, and PS2 era. Extra modes to keep the player engaged, and not be cut off as some crappy DLC. Or just not to bother putting anything in.

 

[Old_Hunter_77]

> those crappy forced walking sections (which are always a detriment on repeat playthroughs
Very fait point there.
This is where "presentation" matters so much, and what impact my personal enjoyment so much. And where mileage my vary.
I've discussed before how I replay Witcher 3 constantly but I would never recommend that because not only is the game long but there is a LOT of talking and I think it's my own weirdness that I can watch these cut scenes over and over.

I'm playing Jedi Survivor and yeah I paid full price, fortunately I can afford to do that, but I would never recommend this for anyone who is either more budget conscious or has literally anything else to play (a couple of games I was really looking forward to disappointed me greatly). It is for sure a one and done.

But, come to think of it, it does not have a lot of force walking sections! Even better is that when you are with NPCs, they join you in combat and help with platforming. I think this is a hopeful trend. Pacing is really good.
The Jedi games are trend-followers, so maybe this is a good trend, something to be hopeful for.

 

[Old_Hunter_77]

So... A.I. *sigh*
My general feeling is to restrain from the fear-mongering about AI taking over and whatever. I feel that if a student can command an AI to write a paper that gets a good grade, either the assignment was dumb or the student put as much thought and effort into managing the AI as she would have to just write it. Except without citing resources, which is bad anyway (my wife is a prof. so dealing with this stuff).
Or if scripts are written by AI then they'll get worse and worse because they're just drawing from existing sources. Already so much feels like it's written by AI, whatever...

But I was listening to a popular leftist podcast that had a someone reporting from the writer's strike protests and talking about what some of the actual meeting between union and companies have been like. While most of the attention is on residual payments and the transition to gig economy practices, one of the demands from the union is to limit AI. According to this journalist, the AI demand was something they figured would be the first the companies would be open to, kind of a small stakes negotiating term. Instead, the studios offered to have an annual meeting to "monitor the situation with AI."

This anecdote suggests that studios are more interested and invested in AI than many thought.

So now I'm more scared of AI- not because of the tech, but because of the companies and some of the consumers. My skepticism of AI in entertainment is that it would create shoddy entertainment. But now I'm thinking- so what, it's shoddy, when has that stopped them before? Enough people watch crap- not necessarily because they"re "dumb" or have bad tastes, but also memeing and hate-watching and "it's so bad it's good" or whatever. Trends change and the pendulum swings back and forth but now also there is so much content to fill the fractured media environment.

And whether we like it or not, video games and movies and TV all effect each other. I have defended hacky game plots but of course those will be easier with AI. And I won't mind it so much with generic looter shooters or whatever (from a consumer standpoint, sucks for writers), but now I'm thinking about a game like Starfield, which despite the entire gamer culture, I'm still excited for. Story and characters are important. But I can just as easily see them generating AI dialogue that fits templated quest structure, and that would SSUUUUUCCCKK.

 

[meiam]

Ai writing will suck until it won't and I think were much closer to that point that a lot of people realize, within a decades or so AI will be able to write a perfectly fine quest line that no one will be able to differentiate from human crafted one. More than that, because they're eating not just quest script but also books/TV show and so on, I think they'll be able to make good quest that only the best of writer will be able rival. Considering the average game writing is really bad, I'm okay with that. I'll take a good AI quest over a bad human quest anyday. If anything, I imagine AI writer will be too good, most player want simple straightforward quest where you don't really need to think about it to get the point (ie shitty book sell better than well written book), I imagine AI script will need to be punch down for awhile so I don't foresee human writer disappearing anytime soon.

As for student turning in AI essay, the problem is when you have 20-30 essay to grade you don't really have the time to check if each one was hand written. It might sound easy, but for having graded a lot of essay pre AI, it'll be incredibly hard because most student are just awful at writing and its impossible to say whether this terrible essay is AI generated or poor student generated. But this is also a temporary issue, AI are getting better very fast, soon they'll be making essay that are just flat out better than even the top scorer. At this point school will have to completely change how student are graded, it simply won't be possible to ask student to write an essay on their own time anymore.

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

Ai writing will suck until it won't and I think were much closer to that point that a lot of people realize, within a decades or so AI will be able to write a perfectly fine quest line that no one will be able to differentiate from human crafted one. More than that, because they're eating not just quest script but also books/TV show and so on, I think they'll be able to make good quest that only the best of writer will be able rival. Considering the average game writing is really bad, I'm okay with that. I'll take a good AI quest over a bad human quest anyday. If anything, I imagine AI writer will be too good, most player want simple straightforward quest where you don't really need to think about it to get the point (ie shitty book sell better than well written book), I imagine AI script will need to be punch down for awhile so I don't foresee human writer disappearing anytime soon.

As for student turning in AI essay, the problem is when you have 20-30 essay to grade you don't really have the time to check if each one was hand written. It might sound easy, but for having graded a lot of essay pre AI, it'll be incredibly hard because most student are just awful at writing and its impossible to say whether this terrible essay is AI generated or poor student generated. But this is also a temporary issue, AI are getting better very fast, soon they'll be making essay that are just flat out better than even the top scorer. At this point school will have to completely change how student are graded, it simply won't be possible to ask student to write an essay on their own time anymore.

When we consider the distinct possibility of AI enslaving/exterminating humanity at some distant point in time, the dilemma of whether written essays are of human origin or not (well, technically they all would be) feels rather inconsequential.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

As for student turning in AI essay, the problem is when you have 20-30 essay to grade you don't really have the time to check if each one was hand written.

The last time I was at uni they were using mass-dataset algorithims to check for plagiarism... which occasionally gave very derpy results.

 

[meiam]

The last time I was at uni they were using mass-dataset algorithims to check for plagiarism... which occasionally gave very derpy results.

Those work by comparing the essay between each others and the web (wikipedia and such), so long as people ask the ai in sligthly different way, they'll get unique essay that won't trigger the algorithm.

 

[BrawlMan]

RE4R - I find Blacktail better than the Red9. Yes, the R9 has more of the stopping power than BT, but it's only by 0.5 difference. Blacktail makes up for it by having a faster rate of fire, and being space friendly.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Video games can benefit from predictable, cliché story-telling.

This take is most recently inspired by Jedi: Survivor. Multiple reviewers have made fun of the predictable story beats, in particular as betrayal for an important NPC that they saw coming a mile away.

I think when it's executed well, the very nature of interactivity changes how I experience these types of story beats. If I'm just passively watching them in a movie or TV show- especially if they're executed in a boring way- then it's just kinda.. there, and probably boring, sure.
But with a controller in my hand, I get to DO the revenge, or justice, or fight, or whatever the hero thing is that we've seen a million times before. And that is very different.

I just think making fun of a big Star Wars game for story beats we've seen before is like making fun of beauty pageant contestants who give dumb answers to questions about like how to help the world or whatever- I mean, what are you expecting here?

Part of this for me also comes from Assassins Creed, a series whose best games feature the most simple, expected character journeys, and when they try to get sophisticated they end up tripping all over themselves (Assassins Creed 3 hello).

I remember something similar in reviews on Okage: Shadow King, and how so many people didn't seem to get further than halfway in the story because they thought it was cliche and uninspired despite that only being the start of the game where it uses "Hero off to fight an evil king" thing as more a comedic thing and in the last third of the game it reveals how the entire world is living in a fabricated play of sorts for a god-like being to entertain his daughter.

 

[CaitSeith]

Ai writing will suck until it won't

AI certainly will make Rogue-likes very interesting at that point.

 

[BrawlMan]

AI certainly will make Rogue-likes very interesting at that point.

Never!

​

Seraphim17

May 15, 2023 #SplinterCell #SplinterCellWasAwesome #SamFisher
I will take a risky sequel - even one I dislike - over this industries' obsession with taking something old and making it new again, with varying levels of quality and return. This Remake Era is going to do more damage than good and I want new games, not bastards of our elders.

I get where Seraphim is coming from, and agree to an extent, but I don't think the Remake Era is going to do much damage and hurt gaming in the long run. Those AAA games with "live-service", crappy season passes or DLC, making children gamble, and relying on FOMO have done far more damage than most video game remakes ever could or can do. The statement has "old man yells at cloud" energy, and filled with nostalgia goggles. If you don't want to play any of the remakes or future remakes, that's fine. Just say it and drop the pretense.

EDIT: I do find it funny he talks about risks being always being better than a remake, but refused to play RE7 and RE8, because "they don't belong in first person". Did you forget about RE: Dead Aim? He refused to touch the Doom 4. because it didn't look or play like a "true Doom game". He jumped on Doom Eternal just fine.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Somebody explain this to me like I'm 5.

A movie or series falls into development hell and everybody assumes the project is an out of control fiasco nobody quite knows how to approach and will probably have to be "saved" long after the fact. Reshoots, reediting, new hires, etc.

A book in a series takes forever to come out, if it even does come out, and people eventually assume the author is either lazy or uninspired or distracted with another book or just high on their success - resting on one's laurels and all that.

If you're not served at a restaurant within a certain amount of time you assume either the waiter forgot your order or they mixed it or they're breaking someone new or the order was ruined at some point. Something went wrong.

But if a videogame Just. Won't. Come. Out. And years go by in complete radio silence disturbed only by the rare news that the latest deadline will not be met anytime soon (or at any specific point in the future) then the reaction is PLEASE TAKE YOUR TIME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR MENTAL HEALTH DON'T OVERWORK YOURSELVES KINGS A RUSHED GAME WILL NEVER BE GOOD BUT A DELAYED GAME WILL BE AWESOME WITH EVERY DELAY YOU ENSURE THE AWESOMENESS OF THE FINISHED PRODUCT TAKE AS LONG AS YOU NEED I WILL PAY AS MUCH AS YOU ASK YOU DON'T OWE ANY EXPLANATIONS THREE YEARS AGO WAS A TOUGH YEAR.

What's up with that.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Somebody explain this to me like I'm 5.

A movie or series falls into development hell and everybody assumes the project is an out of control fiasco nobody quite knows how to approach and will probably have to be "saved" long after the fact. Reshoots, reediting, new hires, etc.

A book in a series takes forever to come out, if it even does come out, and people eventually assume the author is either lazy or uninspired or distracted with another book or just high on their success - resting on one's laurels and all that.

If you're not served at a restaurant within a certain amount of time you assume either the waiter forgot your order or they mixed it or they're breaking someone new or the order was ruined at some point. Something went wrong.

But if a videogame Just. Won't. Come. Out. And years go by in complete radio silence disturbed only by the rare news that the latest deadline will not be met anytime soon (or at any specific point in the future) then the reaction is PLEASE TAKE YOUR TIME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR MENTAL HEALTH DON'T OVERWORK YOURSELVES KINGS A RUSHED GAME WILL NEVER BE GOOD BUT A DELAYED GAME WILL BE AWESOME WITH EVERY DELAY YOU ENSURE THE AWESOMENESS OF THE FINISHED PRODUCT TAKE AS LONG AS YOU NEED I WILL PAY AS MUCH AS YOU ASK YOU DON'T OWE ANY EXPLANATIONS THREE YEARS AGO WAS A TOUGH YEAR.

What's up with that.

Development hell and production delays are two different things and games can very much be the former and not the latter. Duke Nukem Forever, for example. The main difference is whether nor not things are on fire behind the scenes. Frequently changing management, contradictory writing teams, getting passed around by Executive producer after Executive producer, getting your studio bough and sold and bought out from under you, etc.

Comparing that to, say, a restaurant is kinda weird because, like...you only cook a steak for so long. There *has to be* something else going on

 

[Absent]

Somebody explain this to me like I'm 5.

A movie or series falls into development hell and everybody assumes the project is an out of control fiasco nobody quite knows how to approach and will probably have to be "saved" long after the fact. Reshoots, reediting, new hires, etc.

A book in a series takes forever to come out, if it even does come out, and people eventually assume the author is either lazy or uninspired or distracted with another book or just high on their success - resting on one's laurels and all that.

If you're not served at a restaurant within a certain amount of time you assume either the waiter forgot your order or they mixed it or they're breaking someone new or the order was ruined at some point. Something went wrong.

But if a videogame Just. Won't. Come. Out. And years go by in complete radio silence disturbed only by the rare news that the latest deadline will not be met anytime soon (or at any specific point in the future) then the reaction is PLEASE TAKE YOUR TIME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR MENTAL HEALTH DON'T OVERWORK YOURSELVES KINGS A RUSHED GAME WILL NEVER BE GOOD BUT A DELAYED GAME WILL BE AWESOME WITH EVERY DELAY YOU ENSURE THE AWESOMENESS OF THE FINISHED PRODUCT TAKE AS LONG AS YOU NEED I WILL PAY AS MUCH AS YOU ASK YOU DON'T OWE ANY EXPLANATIONS THREE YEARS AGO WAS A TOUGH YEAR.

What's up with that.

I think the number of botched stuff released unfinished, incomplete, badly rushed, is bigger in videogames. Not as many books/movies/steaks that turned out bad because of deadlines.