Zero Punctuation: Eve Online
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
Recommended Videos
First of all: I did play EVE for a month, after a month I felt I didn't get into the game. That only says this: YOU WILL HAVE TO PLAY THIS GAME FOR A LONG TIME AND GET ADDICTED TO IT, thats how you get into the game. I normaly get addicted to every Spacesim I try, that includes: X2, X3, Freespace 1 and 2, X-wing alliance, Rouge leader, Starlancer, Freelancer and more. When I do not get addicted to what many people call the greatest sapcesim ever that tells me: No this is not the game for me, I did not like it enough! or as with EVE: ******** HATE IT!!!!
Secondly: So you can't drive a battleship and cruiser with a joystick? The Void server for freelancer lets you fly the huge spaceships in Freelancer, and you can DAMN well fly those with a joystick!! www.voidserver.com
Oh and I was also addicted to Jumpgate.
Secondly: So you can't drive a battleship and cruiser with a joystick? The Void server for freelancer lets you fly the huge spaceships in Freelancer, and you can DAMN well fly those with a joystick!! www.voidserver.com
Oh and I was also addicted to Jumpgate.
I find it ridiculous just how many people are flinging "If it takes two weeks to be fun, then it's not fun." or similar. I just can't help but laugh at the trend for people to instantly whine about a game being "too linear" and as soon as a game which isn't linear at all is put in front of them they can't comprehend having to make their own decisions about what to do.
EVE is the polar opposite to those games which hold your hand; taking you from place to place and showing you precisely when, where and how to have fun that everyone hates, including Yahtzee, because they don't give you any sort of freedom or control.
EVE is far from perfect, I'll definitely admit that some polish would be preferred over yet another content update but that's not the debate here. The reason that people log into a 14 day trial and don't have fun for an entire two weeks is because they think that the game is going to grab their hand and point into the horizon, shouting "THE FUN IS THAT WAY!". It's not.
With EVE you have to make your own fun. Before you start shouting about "Why would I pay for a game where I have to make my own fun, the game should be fun in it's own right!"; that isn't what I mean. EVE doesn't have quests, levels or even a significant loot table like WoW. There are no raids to grind and epics to collect. There are no set PvP arenas that you can go to.
EVE gives you the freedom that everyone seems to be looking for in MMOs, but perhaps it gives you too much. The average gamer will be thrown out into the cold at the start of the trial going "what do I do?!" and will ultimately miss out because they think that they HAVE to sit and mine ore in their newbie system or do dull repetitive missions.
I have no mining skills and I have never done any missions past the ones in the tutorial and one or two level one missions. The fun in EVE is whatever you make of it, you make your own goals. As an example, I PVP almost exclusively in tech 1 frigates with tech 1 equipment. The sort of thing that even a new player with a 14 day trial account can afford with a few hours of mining, mission running, scavenging or pirating. The trick is that I have a small pack of friends in similar ships, each having fittings which complement each other. We can easily take out small groups of cruisers, battle cruisers and even the odd battleship. You can do this right off the bat, all you need is a few friends and someone to give you a little bit of advice about which skills do what. It's not WoW; the higher "level" players are not immune to the lower level ones and they can be taken out easily with careful planning. We can win because our ships are small and fast, thus difficult to hit with larger, slower guns; and most of our ships have bonuses to electronic warfare, allowing us to effectively cripple our target, disable his weapons and hold him there until we pop him. It is far from just targeting, activating weapons and seeing who dies first; it's just a shame that the learning curve is so immense. I understand why it could be daunting to most people.
The only other thing that I really have to say in my defense is that I don't really care whether anyone here likes EVE or not. It's not the best game in the world and it certainly isn't everyones cup of tea; but I like it and that is all that matters. The reason that I am defending it so enthusiastically is not because of some desire to convince you that I am right and your are all wrong. It's because I have had a great time playing EVE once I stopped trying to play it as a single player game and I see reviews such as this one who don't even give it a chance and I feel that those people are totally missing out of something which they could be enjoying as much as I have enjoyed it. It's not in defense of the game or of my hobby, if you played EVE in the way that I am describing it and still didn't like it then that's fine. I just don't like when people miss out, is all.
This, strangely, is the first time that Yahtzee hasn't given a game a fair review. What he has done here is like playing portal and trying to play it without portal gun. You've missed out on the whole point of the game. EVE is ABOUT the social aspect, and the teamwork you get from joining a corporation (just another name for a guild, nothing like a second job at all.)
Never mind though, it was funny and I suppose that's the point. I'm hardly going to stop tuning into zero punctuation over it.
EVE is the polar opposite to those games which hold your hand; taking you from place to place and showing you precisely when, where and how to have fun that everyone hates, including Yahtzee, because they don't give you any sort of freedom or control.
EVE is far from perfect, I'll definitely admit that some polish would be preferred over yet another content update but that's not the debate here. The reason that people log into a 14 day trial and don't have fun for an entire two weeks is because they think that the game is going to grab their hand and point into the horizon, shouting "THE FUN IS THAT WAY!". It's not.
With EVE you have to make your own fun. Before you start shouting about "Why would I pay for a game where I have to make my own fun, the game should be fun in it's own right!"; that isn't what I mean. EVE doesn't have quests, levels or even a significant loot table like WoW. There are no raids to grind and epics to collect. There are no set PvP arenas that you can go to.
EVE gives you the freedom that everyone seems to be looking for in MMOs, but perhaps it gives you too much. The average gamer will be thrown out into the cold at the start of the trial going "what do I do?!" and will ultimately miss out because they think that they HAVE to sit and mine ore in their newbie system or do dull repetitive missions.
I have no mining skills and I have never done any missions past the ones in the tutorial and one or two level one missions. The fun in EVE is whatever you make of it, you make your own goals. As an example, I PVP almost exclusively in tech 1 frigates with tech 1 equipment. The sort of thing that even a new player with a 14 day trial account can afford with a few hours of mining, mission running, scavenging or pirating. The trick is that I have a small pack of friends in similar ships, each having fittings which complement each other. We can easily take out small groups of cruisers, battle cruisers and even the odd battleship. You can do this right off the bat, all you need is a few friends and someone to give you a little bit of advice about which skills do what. It's not WoW; the higher "level" players are not immune to the lower level ones and they can be taken out easily with careful planning. We can win because our ships are small and fast, thus difficult to hit with larger, slower guns; and most of our ships have bonuses to electronic warfare, allowing us to effectively cripple our target, disable his weapons and hold him there until we pop him. It is far from just targeting, activating weapons and seeing who dies first; it's just a shame that the learning curve is so immense. I understand why it could be daunting to most people.
The only other thing that I really have to say in my defense is that I don't really care whether anyone here likes EVE or not. It's not the best game in the world and it certainly isn't everyones cup of tea; but I like it and that is all that matters. The reason that I am defending it so enthusiastically is not because of some desire to convince you that I am right and your are all wrong. It's because I have had a great time playing EVE once I stopped trying to play it as a single player game and I see reviews such as this one who don't even give it a chance and I feel that those people are totally missing out of something which they could be enjoying as much as I have enjoyed it. It's not in defense of the game or of my hobby, if you played EVE in the way that I am describing it and still didn't like it then that's fine. I just don't like when people miss out, is all.
This, strangely, is the first time that Yahtzee hasn't given a game a fair review. What he has done here is like playing portal and trying to play it without portal gun. You've missed out on the whole point of the game. EVE is ABOUT the social aspect, and the teamwork you get from joining a corporation (just another name for a guild, nothing like a second job at all.)
Never mind though, it was funny and I suppose that's the point. I'm hardly going to stop tuning into zero punctuation over it.
vlanitak post=6.70442.698496 said:
Yes, you can easily say it has its own genre as there are no other games as complex or with the same mechanics as eve. By your logic, defender or space invaders is a space sim. If EVE is any type of sim, its a war sim as combat is more than just doing loops with your joystick. It involves industry, logistics, millitary intelligence, planning, coordination and execution.
Yes defender and alien invader are spacesims. they are maybe not the best spacesims, but they are still spacesims.
I will say that EVE is a combination of a spacesim and a gigantic war strategy game (a bit like the Hearts of Iron series which in my opinion is AWESOME) But as I decided to rethink the words I said before I have come to conclusion: I do not like that combination. The thing of mixing spacesims with extreme strategy is in my opinion a failure. Sorry for this but if it was up to me, which it is not, EVE would never excited.
Oh and I like the meaningless looping in spaceships TBH
I will say that EVE is a combination of a spacesim and a gigantic war strategy game (a bit like the Hearts of Iron series which in my opinion is AWESOME) But as I decided to rethink the words I said before I have come to conclusion: I do not like that combination. The thing of mixing spacesims with extreme strategy is in my opinion a failure. Sorry for this but if it was up to me, which it is not, EVE would never excited.
Oh and I like the meaningless looping in spaceships TBH
Is there any way the Escapist or Yahtzee would make these videos available for hdd download? Thanks to an infrastructure blackspot, the best net connection I can get is 56.6k dialup. I love Yahtzee's work, and enjoy watching each episode repeatedly, but it's extremely painful to have to wait 45 to 90 mins for each episode to load to the point where I can start playing it.
Thats why I can't wait for JGE, its like EVE but its faster and theres more to combat than click and walk away. Also navigation doesn't suck like EVE which turned me right off EVE in the trial
By my logic, as you said, alien invader and defender are sapcesims, galaga to are a spacesim I might add.
I don't have anything against thinking game (thats why I play Hearts of iron 2), but in my opinion the mix of the two doesn't fit well. the thing of thinking while having to concentrate on flying a spaceships (which in f.eks Freelancer and Freespace have controls that needs your attention). Oh wait, I forgot, in EVE you don't fly your spacship, you point and click. So then it's only a strategy game where you have a spaceship. WOW I think we just found the only Spaceship game that isn't a spacesim!
My last post here, tired of arguing.
I don't have anything against thinking game (thats why I play Hearts of iron 2), but in my opinion the mix of the two doesn't fit well. the thing of thinking while having to concentrate on flying a spaceships (which in f.eks Freelancer and Freespace have controls that needs your attention). Oh wait, I forgot, in EVE you don't fly your spacship, you point and click. So then it's only a strategy game where you have a spaceship. WOW I think we just found the only Spaceship game that isn't a spacesim!
My last post here, tired of arguing.
vlanitak post=6.70442.698612 said:
I think you need to work on your genre understanding.
Yes yes you have said this before, I'm asking you why you come to that conclusion. Please, allow me to say it for you, the reason why you think its a bad combination is because when you see space, your mind makes referances to x-wing and freelancer which is error on your brains behalf as they are completely different type of games.
It's like you dont like hammers because they dont work in the same way as screwdrivers.
Yes you forgot, finally you are starting to get it.
Finally.
EVE:Empyrean Age was "fun"
Since I already had a massive fleet (Amarr Empire) from Trinity, I just logged into the new game and kept playing. I only do this for the fun of it. It isnt Guild Wars, but it isnt WoW either. It's a "good" game, if you like Homeworld 2 and World of Warcraft that is.
Since I already had a massive fleet (Amarr Empire) from Trinity, I just logged into the new game and kept playing. I only do this for the fun of it. It isnt Guild Wars, but it isnt WoW either. It's a "good" game, if you like Homeworld 2 and World of Warcraft that is.
