And it's appreciated. It never ceases to amaze me how civil and intelligent a conversation we can have, regardless of the number of participants, when all parties are committed to rational discourse, rather than poop-flinging.Merlynn said:
Zero Punctuation: Halo 3
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
Here's my little throw-in to the console vs PC argument, as I can't be arsed to read essays worth of fanboy babble on either side.
The X-Box 360 is controlled by a company called Microsoft.
That's it. That's all of my factual argument. Now for the analysis...
Now it's not any of my direct hate towards Microsoft...it's my hate towards companies. Companies that dictate how something should move, because normally their goals are to get more money. If a decision does not result in more sales, they don't bother. Case in point...
On the 360, they're called Xbox Live Arcade games. Classics like Geometry Wars and Doom for about $5 each. No one can deny they're very fun for the amount of money they're worth.
On the PC, they're called independent games. Classics like Narbacular Drop, Echoes and Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory. They're FREE. That's because no one wants money here, they just want you to play their game, and sometimes donate.
Anyone remember Valve putting out Half-Life 2: Lost Coast just because they thought people might like it? People who bought HL2 didn't get it with any notion that they'd get an extra map later on. On the Xbox, a Halo map pack is some 20-odd dollars. Granted, that is a number more maps than Lost Coast; but something in me tells me if it was one map, it would still cost $2.
Then there's problems with cross-platform play. On the PC, you do what you want. GTASA actually BECAME a multiplayer game through a mod. On the Xbox almost everything you can or can't do is dictated by Microsoft (such as Halo 2 cross-platform multiplayer). If you don't like Microsoft's decision schemes, you have to BUY A NEW CONSOLE.
There's just this unnerving feeling that one day Microsoft will say something ludicrous, such as "to play Halo 3 singleplayer anymore, you must have an Xbox Live Platinum account" Obviously this makes little sense whatsoever, but the fact is they COULD do it. This isn't the case on the PC, where not only are there a MILLION game companies, all of which can make their games as they please, and if one of them suddenly makes said ridiculous statement, people would just go on playing someone else's games.
In conclusion: One company to control the Xbox. A million to control the PC. Power struggle makes business good.
The X-Box 360 is controlled by a company called Microsoft.
That's it. That's all of my factual argument. Now for the analysis...
Now it's not any of my direct hate towards Microsoft...it's my hate towards companies. Companies that dictate how something should move, because normally their goals are to get more money. If a decision does not result in more sales, they don't bother. Case in point...
On the 360, they're called Xbox Live Arcade games. Classics like Geometry Wars and Doom for about $5 each. No one can deny they're very fun for the amount of money they're worth.
On the PC, they're called independent games. Classics like Narbacular Drop, Echoes and Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory. They're FREE. That's because no one wants money here, they just want you to play their game, and sometimes donate.
Anyone remember Valve putting out Half-Life 2: Lost Coast just because they thought people might like it? People who bought HL2 didn't get it with any notion that they'd get an extra map later on. On the Xbox, a Halo map pack is some 20-odd dollars. Granted, that is a number more maps than Lost Coast; but something in me tells me if it was one map, it would still cost $2.
Then there's problems with cross-platform play. On the PC, you do what you want. GTASA actually BECAME a multiplayer game through a mod. On the Xbox almost everything you can or can't do is dictated by Microsoft (such as Halo 2 cross-platform multiplayer). If you don't like Microsoft's decision schemes, you have to BUY A NEW CONSOLE.
There's just this unnerving feeling that one day Microsoft will say something ludicrous, such as "to play Halo 3 singleplayer anymore, you must have an Xbox Live Platinum account" Obviously this makes little sense whatsoever, but the fact is they COULD do it. This isn't the case on the PC, where not only are there a MILLION game companies, all of which can make their games as they please, and if one of them suddenly makes said ridiculous statement, people would just go on playing someone else's games.
In conclusion: One company to control the Xbox. A million to control the PC. Power struggle makes business good.
I am not responsible for your misunderstandings if you read things into my message that are not actually there.ccesarano said:
I have no issue with that at all. I can easily accept people that tell me KB/M is more comfortable for them, and I know this is the case anyway. What I can't stand is when people tell me to my face that keyboard and mouse is better, and in some respects it might be, but my performance with a controller is much better with a controller. So I don't like my preference being called wrong since, if KB/M truly is better without a doubt, I should perform better on it.
But you are responsible for your wording.
So what, he's speaking for all of us now? Yeah, he raises valid points, but honestly, when it comes to a lot of his opinions, I don't give a crap.
Just say it's nice that someone else agrees with you instead of wording it like only fratboy dick heads enjoy this title.
What is even happening in this thread. I don't know. Keep up the good work, Yahtzee! And might I recommend, next week, taking this huge audience you've accumulated and introducing them to something so obscure that even you haven't heard of it before?
Well, there were hints, notably from Steam, and especially with some products announced for the PS3, that episodic content and other addons would become shorter and more expensive. I remember that at some point, it was really getting absurd. I think such signs were spotted slightly more than one year ago, but the balloon vented and things remained reasonnable.Katana314 said:
As for Wolfenstein, it's more like there has been issues during the production iirc, notably with the editor I think, so they still decided to release it for free. It wasn't a bad move, as it let the game grow a solid community, which would greatly help for the future product in that franchise, known as Quake Wars.
A Halo Chaos Vortex. Spawns demons of all kinds.Bongo Bill said:
Valve has already admitted that episodic content was not such a good move (for them), and Episode 3 will be the end of it. (that's not to say Sam and Max Season 1 and 2 don't kick ass though!) That sort of "piece by piece" crap has shown up a lot more on consoles, whereas you need to buy more tracks and more cars for racing games, etc.Arbre said:
Also, as for the "unfinished code" thing with Wolfenstein: They didn't HAVE to release it at all, and it could have ended up like the OLD Team Fortress 2 or Prey, being completely discarded and never released for stuffed-up business reasons. Microsoft's style would have been to package it as some "beta" along with a game called BreakApart. (vague parody of Crackdown...) Let's not forget the entire Q3 code is GPL now; Open Arena certainly isn't helping id's sales.
Just a word of note. They haven't actually said that Episode 3 will be the end of episodic content, nor that episodic was 'not such a good move'. They have said that after Episode 3, they'll have the evidence they need to reevaluate the episodic decision. With three HL titles, plus TF2, plus Portal on the board, they'll have enough examples available to ask the community how they should refocus. I imagine that if everyone comes out gushing praise for the episodic model, that they'll be back doing it right away.Katana314 said:
Kazidoom said:
If the only thing you have to add is an insult to someone else, then you should probably keep that to yourself. Basic, kindergarten-level social interaction stuff, people.
/mod.
"DirectX 10"Katana314 said:
Just because Microsoft doesn't control the PC hardware doesn't mean they can't -try- to make you buy Vista to play your games (and probably more RAM so you can run Vista -and- all your usual stuff at the same time ;P). And Vista is what, between AU$125 and the price of an Xbox360, depending on the version?
One ring to rule them all ;P
Yes, because Microsoft still obviously CONTROLS everyone in that regard.zari said:
Epic games: Fuck you, GoW is coming to Windows XP. That's that.
Valve: DX10 is a joke. We're not going to alienate our customers, even in RAM requirements.
EA: Yeah, we'll make it a Games For Windows...but only because it passes the requirements for it. Vista-only? WHAT?
Microsoft is trying all right. But failing miserably.
You'll all be delighted to know that this discussion is now a featured item at Fandom Wank.
http://www.journalfen.net/community/fandom_wank/
Even now, people are mocking this discussion as they mock all fandom-related kerfuffles. Yahtzee, my sincere congratulations to you. Please keep riling people up. It's almost as hilarious as your reviews.
Edit (after reading the comments at Fandom Wank): Boy, the ladies over at FW sure do like Yahtzee. Dude, if you're ever looking for a date, I think you're covered.
http://www.journalfen.net/community/fandom_wank/
Even now, people are mocking this discussion as they mock all fandom-related kerfuffles. Yahtzee, my sincere congratulations to you. Please keep riling people up. It's almost as hilarious as your reviews.
Edit (after reading the comments at Fandom Wank): Boy, the ladies over at FW sure do like Yahtzee. Dude, if you're ever looking for a date, I think you're covered.
Because Halo 3 is the third in a franchise of games, and has thus far (pretending that we're still pre-launch here) promised to deliver on the same style of gameplay as offered before. Therefore, they have at least a small framework to work from. And while bashing isn't something I'd ever consider good, if someone has a bad opinion from playing the first two games, I find it totally reasonable that they can have a bad opinion about the third game without trying it. It just isn't what I'd call an informed opinion. Just more of an educated guess opinion.Easykill said:
Hmm, I really hope this wasn't a serious review, but judging on the time you put into this...
Then I think you have to learn how to make a proper review, excluding multiplayer for one, was a huge mistake; halo 3 has over 1 million players logged on as I type, so excluding multiplayer and saying no one cares about it makes you look ignorant. You can't judge a game based on a small part of it,(campaign) you have to judge it based on the whole package; and the mulitplayer is where it's at for halo 3.
I do agree that the campaign blew, and it could have been much longer than it was.
Then I think you have to learn how to make a proper review, excluding multiplayer for one, was a huge mistake; halo 3 has over 1 million players logged on as I type, so excluding multiplayer and saying no one cares about it makes you look ignorant. You can't judge a game based on a small part of it,(campaign) you have to judge it based on the whole package; and the mulitplayer is where it's at for halo 3.
I do agree that the campaign blew, and it could have been much longer than it was.
LOL!!!Alex Karls said:
Just because you've played the first two, doesn't justify bashing on a game you've never played... that just makes you look stupid.