g31st said:
You can certainly say that, but I disagree. Yahtzee did not address many of the more valid points in his "showdown". Like I said, since its his inbox, he could cherry pick the emails to make the "opposition" seem like total twats, and that's what happened. I didn't read the entire Brawl review thread (christ, but it's long), but there were a few things I spotted that were not in his latest video at all. For instance, he did not address his incorrect factual statement about having to play the single player to unlock everything. It's just not true, and he didn't own up to it at all. Maybe he can't admit when he makes mistakes.
He also claimed (more than once) that Brawl is a button masher and that no amount of practice would ensure your victory over someone slapping their palms against their controller. If you remember, he went into a big long rant about becoming "that guy" only to say, "but that doesn't happen in this game". Naturally, I don't know what's in his inbox, but you'd have to be crazy to claim that there wasn't a single email saying something to the effect of, "The fighting system in Brawl rewards patience and timing and punishes people who randomly mash buttons. As a matter of fact, it's even possible to kill yourself if you mash the wrong buttons. There's a shield button which thwarts almost every attempt at button mashing, and skilled players will be good at 1.) knowing when holes appear in their foe's defenses and 2.) exploiting them. If you really think this game is a button masher, why not go one on one versus a pro player? You should be able to win half the time, right?"
The majority of the posts I saw "defending" Brawl said something to that effect, and it's true. Anyone who's played the game seriously will tell you the same thing, yet Yahtzee gleefully glossed over anything of the sort in his "showdown". As a matter of fact, most of the emails were to the effect of, "You hateful person. Why don't you like anything? You always just point out the bad stuff in games," which is more a statement of the obvious rather than any sort of defense. Granted, if one side can choose what the other side says, it's not going to be much of a debate in the first place.
Be glad you didn't follow the whole Brawl thread. It was brain numbing at times. However, you didn't follow my argument here. The majority of the posts either pro-ssbb or anti-ssbb could be summed up in the emails he criticized. I could care less whether his points in the review of the game were valid or not. I've always enjoyed the SSB franchise and am sure that I will until the day that Nintendo decides to stop adding to it. Which, with its current success, will be the day after never. So, I have no need to debate you on that matter.
What I was stating is that a large number of the posts made in the SSBB review and this one have one thing in common. They could be summarized by those emails that he chose for his responses in his most recent post. There were indeed some well reasoned responses to his review, but they were by far in the minority. There were also some well reasoned responses to those who didn't like his review, but again, they were by far the minority.
The case, for me, isn't that he chose not to answer those with valid critiques. He never does. It is that he chose to make fun of those people who chose to dive off the cliff into the raging sea of insane raving. Just as he caricatured those who rabidly disagreed with him, he could have as easily caricatured those who rabidly defended him and it would have been equally as funny. I thought of both groups while watching the video and laughed accordingly.
Being a fanboy of something is bad, right? If you're going to lend any credence to 90% of this thread, fanboys are one of the lowest forms of vertebrate lifeforms on the internet. My memory may be hazy, but I don't think I've seen a single post in this thread so far which a.) mentions fanboys and b.) doesn't disparage them in some way.
You said that he claimed his review wouldn't matter because people already knew if they liked the game. That's true, but here's the actual quote:
"Reviewing Smash Bros. Brawl is pointless. There's a simple test. When the name Nintendo Wii was first revealed, did you ever seriously try to defend it on an internet forum? If yes, you will enjoy this game whatever its faults and you might as well start spamming my email address with hatred right now you miserable. fanboy. twat."
At the same time as he was speaking these words, there was a picture of a Wii player gleefully unaware that his T.V. was on fire and another in front of a computer with the words "HUR HUR IGNORANCE" above his head.
A bit more than merely saying, "My review won't change your opinion," he says, "Not only will my review not change your opinion, if you like the game you will hate me for giving it a bad review, because there's no other reason that you would like the game other than the fact that you enjoy Nintendo wanking off in your face. You're gleefully ignorant of what's really going on, because anyone with a brain would know that this game has almost no redeeming features." Forget any kind of middle ground that allows for someone who isn't a fanboy to enjoy the game because it's a good fighting game. Yahtzee's review immediately polarizes the entire world into two categories - the ignorant twats who like Brawl, and the enlightened few who can see Brawl for what it really is. Hell, he even plays Green Day's "Minority" at the end of his review. There really isn't a better way to make people angry than drawing a line in the sand, especially if there doesn't need to be one in the first place.
Let's say for a minute that what he said is true. Pretend that the people who play Brawl and Melee only play it because it's a Nintendo game with Nintendo characters in it. If you remember, he asked why unlocking Marth was such a big deal in his review. The truth is, Marth was considered a "top tier" character along with a handful of others in Melee, meaning that he was one of the best characters to use in professional play due to his speed and fighting style. Almost every tournament player learned to use Marth, and I can assure you it wasn't because they were all Fire Emblem 1 fanboys. Leaving him out would have pissed off the old Melee players to no end, because his style of fighting was very much about speed, technique and control, and it proved to be one of the most effective ones in tournament play. If Brawl's only appeal is fanservice, why the hell would people be so nuts about a no-name character?
Long story short: If the requisite for liking Brawl is being a Nintendo fanboy, and I like Brawl, it must mean I'm a Nintendo fanboy, which is both insulting and an unfair representation of the game as a whole.
Ok, I will concede this point...to a point. However, I would say that liking the game would not necessarily make a person a fanboy or fangirl. In fact, even being a fan of the game wouldn't qualify. When I think of fanboy and fangirl, I think of those people of whom he made fun in his response. Fanboys and fangirls are those who have taken the aforementioned dive off the cliff and submerged themselves in the sea of insane raving. With that said, you must admit that many of those who have hit the forums after the SSB review and are still going on in this one do fall under the derogatory term of fanboy/fangirl. If those were unedited mails to him, then I'd definitely file them under the fanboy rating. Of course, the biggest fanboy in this discussion is Yahtzee himself. There's no bigger fan of Yahtzee who is willing to go to insane lengths to defend Yahtzee than Yahtzee himself.
Mythbhavd said:
Wait a minute...I know what's going on here! I'm getting sucked into a he-said, she-said argument! Lol! Bad g31st! No donut for you!
g13st said:
It's okay, I had some last weekend.
You had donuts! Bummer, wish I had some!
g13st said:
You're a growed up and you can go watch the Halo 3 review and look for a similar quote in that video. Don't be surprised if you don't find one.
No need to get snide. Let's keep this civil. And, ironically, I did watch it just before I read your reply. While I dislike the halo series with a passion, I went to watch the video again to see if he was as rabid against the fanboys of Halo (many of whom seemed to lay low during the response period in the forum) as he was against those of SSBB. He definitely wasn't, although he was expecting much the same response. It's apparent from his reference to fanboys widdling in his mail slot.
Mythbhavd said:
As I said before, "let's get back to the good old weeks when we could watch a review, laugh about it, and discuss it like the reasonably well-adjusted crazy people we are."
g13st said:
I agree. That's the reason I like Yahtzee. At the same time, I'm not a rabid fanboy. I've never tried to proselytize Brawl to anyone, and I've never gotten on anyone's case who's played it and decided they didn't like it. Despite all of this, Yahtzee's review told me that by liking the game (for whatever reason), I was one of those unholy fanboys that people are so keen to hate. Maybe I'm in the minority who doesn't just lay down while someone who I've never even met in real life tells me I'm an ignorant twat for liking a certain video game.
I would certainly classify you as a fan; perhaps even a rabid fan (knowing the stats of which character the majority of professional gamers choose frightens me...of course, I can be as rabid with Star Trek: TOS, so go figure). Based on your response, though, I wouldn't say you were a fanboy. Just someone who really likes the game. So, I don't even know that you'd follow under his classification of a fanboy (one who has seriously devoted themselves to defending the WII online (or as I took it, diving into the sea of raging insanity)).
thahat said:
hey, look, someone with a brain ^^ *makes snapshot before it goes away*
anyone ever noticed btw that all the people who don't like brawl, and i do mean like, 70-80% at least ( so okay, not all :\ ) have never actually PLAYED brawl
?
That seems to be true of several of the games I've seen reviewed on here. Of course, I've seen quite a few defenders of a game who haven't played it yet either.
On another note, I found this quote in the Halo 3 section from Zera from back in October and in light of the recent two forums worth of trolling found it funny:
Zera said:
Well this site is probably the most intelligent when it comes to gaming. You shouldn't find any trolls here.
You spoke too soon, Zera!
)
