Zero Punctuation: Mailbag Showdown

[God8010]

In a world of bullshit and capitalistic objectives with condescending expectations of loyalty, Yahtzee is a golden refraction of light glimmering high above a monstrous pile of fan boy feces.

Would you please fuck my girlfriend, Yahtzee?

 

[Tyrannus Argumentum]

(1). For those of you who "did not like the review", do you believe, at some level, that you felt it was a personal attack?

I think that generally few people feel attacked by Yahtzee. Even when Yahtzee specifically attacks the fan boys, I feel like most of them just sort of shrug it off. They know when they begin watching that they're in for a satire, perhaps of themselves. At least, that's how I approach it.

So, the ones that do are the ones that post here? It may seem like common sense, but I assure you I am an academic and will wait until there's a clear verdict on this. Admittedly, I really want to believe that this is the case.

What happens, though, is that when you start reading the comments, you are definitely attacked by other people on the thread. This would have to do with the polarizing affect of strong opinions on the net -- if I love SSBB, and you happen to only mildly dislike it, then you will need to scream about how much you hate SSBB in order to be heard over my affectionate croonings for the game. Couple that with the fact that many people take a criticism of a game they love as some sort of criticism as a person, AND with the anonymity of attacking someone over the internet, and you have a multi-step, complex recipe for a 1000 reply thread.

Indeed. Logical fallacies abound, as I stated. Both sides. Most of the calls for neutrality are ignored, or skewed, I think. Neutrality puts the damper on one's desire to seethe, and it appears that some people just want to seethe. And then there are les enfants provocateurs who probably gush support (or vitriol) simply to get a response.

(2). If Y is simply preaching to the choir, and you were one of the ones who responded negatively to this piece, why did you feel the need to respond?

I agree entirely with the huge paragraph block that followed your question. Except I still feel like the person who exasperates all the attacks is not Yahtzee, but instead people within the thread on both side. Yahtzee is generally only mentioned in a sort of abstract context, and the comments are specifically directed at an opponent within the thread and not at Yahtzee.

You are correct. Beyond the video, what do we see in response from Yahtzee? Much like what do we see from Nintendo about critics of their games?

1. How does one's admittedly-biased opinion really affect the opinion of a game? If entertainment is truly subjective, how can we fault someone for coming up with a negative review?

We can't. But people tend to step down several maturity levels whenever they log on to the net, and because they can do whatever they want anonymously, they tend to go a bit crazy. So it doesn't really matter to me if you find me illogical, immature, etc, because the second I close this browser window you cease to exist.

Dare I mention that this seems to lend support to Penny Arcade's "Internet Fuckwad Theory". The real trick is distinguishing the provocateurs from those who have seriously identified with a game.

2. Why is cherry-picking e-mail responses for the purpose of entertainment "wrong"? He's entertaining his intended audience. That's his job. Nintendo's job is to profit from entertainment, and thus will do what they can to appeal to their intended audience, so would they not be guilty of the same practice? Is Nintendo going to intentionally put in bad things in their game that would alienate their audience?

A case of mistaking an attempt to entertain with something else, I feel. People see it as wrong because they misperceive it as some sort of organized attack on their opinion, as opposed to the satire that it really is. And attacking opinions is 'totally cool' on the internet. It's pretty much 90% of the activity on forums and blogs.

Is this more of a testament to a lack of critical reading/listening skills? I probably should say that people don't lack those skills... but immediately drop them when they feel their personal identity is being attacked.

Again, thank you all for the data, and thank you in advance to those who answer my questions. I have many more, but I figure I'll see what kind of responses happen from here on out before posting the next ones.

Eh, I realized after the second question that you're not really asking questions of anyone at all, but instead framing your argument in the form of questions. But I had already started answering them, so here we are.

Not necessarily true. I am putting in my own personal thoughts between the questions, yes, but I seriously would like them to be answered, especially from the groups they're targeting. I could draw conclusions from the lack of serious responses to those questions others may provide, in which case it would support the "fuckwad" theory.

I do this because part of my job is to analyze discourse between "competing" parties. Granted, my normal realm is intertribal conflict in African and South American communities... but gamers seem to have done well to set up virtual tribes of their own...

 

[gabrieldevue]

I really, really, really enjoyed this 4 Minutes of Yahtzee, because I am able to apply it to other situations as well. Since I know so much about life, I just want to say one thing: If it wasn't that funny and entertaining (so much that I watch any review, no matter if I know the game or not), I don't think Yahtzee goes the right way in defending himself. He usually is very, very honest with a game and since many people enjoy it, he elaborates its faults deeply (oh geez, my English). Somebody with such a harsh opinion should move on like one of these ships that crush Ice - who cares, what comes behind, don't heed the hatemail but please, please quote it again : D

The most important fact for me was the numbers thing. I am very fortunate to have a class about art and computer Games (not the technical approach, but the "are Video Games Art" approach) and one of the discussed factors is, that for Games to be established as art form, they also need real critics, not numbers and technical reviews.

If you see, what all gets placed as art (I LIKE modern art, I am not one of the "oh, i can do that, too people), video games do not have such a long way to go. It is about how we percieve them. People like Yahtzee have such a "to the ground"-manner of going about it in the right way. I am sorry, I can't really say it in English.

Thank you for your reviews in general.

 

[Vault Citizen]

i can't believe that there are ppl fighting and flaming over a review
its so sad -_-

so you've gone to the extra effort to complain about people complaining about something you see as small? huh forgive my ignorance but if it isn't that important surely your comment is just as bad?

 

[Uszi]

Not necessarily true. I am putting in my own personal thoughts between the questions, yes, but I seriously would like them to be answered, especially from the groups they're targeting. I could draw conclusions from the lack of serious responses to those questions others may provide, in which case it would support the "fuckwad" theory.

I do this because part of my job is to analyze discourse between "competing" parties. Granted, my normal realm is intertribal conflict in African and South American communities... but gamers seem to have done well to set up virtual tribes of their own...

Maybe I'm jaded, but my expectation is you'll get few responses to your actual question. Not only are too many people too busy griefing each other or soap boxing, but it's generally hard to enlist the support of any forum community for any cause... Accept maybe griefing/soap boxing, as you see in Anonymous, or when Penny Arcade invaded that one zombie game.

 

[tobyornottoby]

I disagree. The whole function of the word and is to connect different parts of a sentence together. The point of a full stop is to end a sentence and everything after that is a whole new sentence. By having a line that has goes '.and' your both disconnecting and trying to connect two different sentences at the same time

You're mixing 2 things up now
Sentences & subjects. The full stop is there to end the sentence. The word 'and' is there to connect with the subject.

 

[Neural.Rust]

Second time viewing this ezine, first time was the brawl review which i thought was pure brilliance, and obviously the second time being this one,

and all i have to say is;
You Fucking rock.

best hate-mail response I've seen.

 

[Xilam]

I must admit he does make a good point. I mean face it people nintendo (as much as I love them) do make shit games. Fact of life. Brawl is nothing but a bad melee clone. Instead of getting rid of the clone characters they added more and just copied everything again. Grow some originality nintendo. Also wise up all of those people that wrote in. Take the criticism with some dignity. All power to Yahtzee.

 

[woutervoorhees]

i can't believe that there are ppl fighting and flaming over a review
its so sad -_-

so you've gone to the extra effort to complain about people complaining about something you see as small? huh forgive my ignorance but if it isn't that important surely your comment is just as bad?

i dont really care that ppl are fighing over a review
i just think its wierd
but i have noting more to say in this thread

 

[GokoWildheart]

Brillant as always. You've brought a smile to this unwill and sick brit with your A+ review , smacking fanboy's and also showing us that scoring games is a crap idea cause not every one is gonna like the same piece of pie.

Keep them coming and try not to get sucked to deep into GTA that you stop reviewing for weeks on end ^^

 

[Kaos Incarnate]

I must admit he does make a good point. I mean face it people nintendo (as much as I love them) do make shit games. Fact of life. Brawl is nothing but a bad melee clone. Instead of getting rid of the clone characters they added more and just copied everything again. Grow some originality nintendo. Also wise up all of those people that wrote in. Take the criticism with some dignity. All power to Yahtzee.

Wii-fit is original I would say. Only because I refuse to defend a game I haven't played, unless I have some knowledge on that game.

Also originality is all well and good, but if we got it all the time, we would get bored of it. People look for familiar faces and situations to identify, hence why Mario, Zelda and Final Fantasy etc. are still popular today.

 

[wadark]

I really enjoyed this...I guess some people missed out on the whole thing where this is his JOB. Yahtzee isn't just bashing games because its fun(ny). And besides, think way back to the Bioshock review, the first words being "If my Psychonauts review taught me anything, its that no one likes me when I'm being nice to a game." Apparently, a great many of you just don't like him regardless. It's probably all the crazed viewers like those featured in this video that made Yahtzee go from hating about 1/2 the population to hating us all.

So, keep making videos Yahtzee, because whether I agree with your stance or not, they're always F***(sorry)ing hilarious.

As a side note, they should make a DVD of Yahtzee's reviews. Itd sell better than a hooker...I'd buy it.

 

[katsabas]

That is a good idea but wait for the reviews to grow in number. But wow, this video got more comments than Halo. How about that?

 

[spungemonkey]

Okay, Yahtzee pissed me off with his Devil May Cry 4 review and all but completely lost my viewership with his Brawl review, then made me lose faith in the entire human race when he actually gave God of War a GOOD review when I was deeply hoping he'd rip it a new one

I, in my opinion, find this post a bit silly, basically what you're saying is that you hate his reviews because he doesn't agree with you?

 

[The Thief]

Way too many conflicting onions in this thread, it's making me teary eyed. This is a message to the more outspoken few in both this and the SSBB thread, so don't be offended if this isn't you.

To those who liked the ssbb review and hated ssbb, you trolls are no better than fanboys. In fact you are worse. It's more understandable for somebody to defend something they liked than put down something they hated, yet here you are.

To those who hated the ssbb review and liked ssbb, don't let Yahtzee's onion or his fanboy army sway your beliefs. I agree it was a shit review, and that I enjoyed ssbb, but that doesn't make me a fanboy or have incorrect taste in games. I've enjoyed some of the games he's put down, yet that review was just flat unfunny and rant-er-ific. They are just his own onions, so don't take his criticisms as indisputable fact. If you did you would be a Yahtzee fanboy, which is much worse.

To those who liked the ssbb review and liked ssbb, you have got a lax sense of humor in my onion. Keep it up!

To those who hated the ssbb review and hated ssbb, you are very hateful and should seek help.

To Yahtzee, you have to let this one go. Face the fact that a lot of people, including some which have watched since the beginning, thought your review wasn't that great. It didn't have anything to do with your dislike of the game (well, mostly), but your reviewing style and lack of funny. But there were lots of people who did like the review, if only to satisfy their hate for a game, so you shouldn't be upset.

And to everyone else, why are you here??

PS. Again, I will say this review was fucking fantastically funny, but the ssbb review was total shit n' onions in a blender. So I guess I don't care how much my onions differ from Yahtzee's (mine are bigger), so long as he makes it funny.

 

[The Thief]

Simon TR, why the hell do you think I CARE about what you think?

I come to Yahtzee's site to see his brutally honest reviews of videogames, and if he destroys the pathetic arguments of a few nintendo fanboys, so much the better. The game was overrated, and I'm been a Nintendo fan for longer than most of these recent nintendo fanboys have been alive.

And Simon, answer your own question, why the hell are YOU here, if you don't like Yahtzee's humor?

I think you CARE about what I think because you are willing to respond to it... dur.

So you come to yahtzee's site, (the escapist), to see his reviews, yet here you are trolling the forums? I smell liar.

I am here because I don't fit into the everyone else category, since I liked ssbb and disliked his ssbb review. I do enjoy his humor, as I said in my first post and in my last post.

 

[The Thief]

At the end of the day, the internet losers with nothing better to do will endlessly discuss something like this.

The reality is thus: people CARE about what Yahtzee says, and they DON'T CARE about what YOU say.

Do thousands upon thousands of people come to YOUR site to see what YOUR opinion of a game is?

NO. So shut the hell up and keep your worthless,insignificant opinions to yourself.

So you're saying only the popular onions matter, and everyone else should just shut up and agree with Yahtzee? Who's the loser, really.

 

[Stjimmy888]

[/quote]So you're saying only the popular onions matter, and everyone else should just shut up and agree with Yahtzee? Who's the loser, really.[/quote]

you are for thinking you can gain something by fighting on the internet. you know what they say about winning an internet fight.

 

[Kaos Incarnate]

Just ignore Patronizing, he is worse than any fanboy.

 

[The Thief]

So you're saying only the popular onions matter, and everyone else should just shut up and agree with Yahtzee? Who's the loser, really.

you are for thinking you can gain something by fighting on the internet. you know what they say about winning an internet fight.

I'd rather be a retarded winner than a retarded loser. ; )