Zero Punctuation: Silent Hill: Downpour

[BehattedWanderer]

And yet he wonders why some of us enjoy new Zelda or Mario titles where they remain as fun and amazing as they've been, managing to slightly change the formula here and there while keeping the core of it intact, even occasionally being better than the heavy hitters in our nostalgia. Be careful of that pedestal, it might not last as long as you think.

 

[PrototypeC]

Wow, everyone's really mad at and/or critical of Yahtzee today.

I'm glad that he brought up a lot of the things that were bothering me (the monsters being a big one) but the things that made stop playing and peer at the screen quizzically with my mouth open were more completely unsubtle. For instance, the invisible cop cars that become un-invisible when you get close enough to them so that their sirens go off and monsters appear. NOT SO SILENT NOW, IS IT?

Perhaps the mannequin ghosts. Not even kidding. There are MANNEQUIN GHOSTS. I think they're supposed to be projections from the mannequin, but you know what's scarier than attacking mannequins? Real mannequins. Anyone who can tell me why something unmoving and non-threatening will almost always be scarier than one clearly out for blood will win the golden horror award. Two paragraphs minimum.

Another thing that's still bothering me; you just run into people. Who's that? Oh, it's some dude, he'll commit suicide later. Who's that? Just a homeless guy who will open a door for you in a sidequest, little else. Who's that on the radio? A DJ. He's not important and kind of annoying, like if Three-Dog came to Silent Hill. Feeling lonely yet?

 

[PrototypeC]

Contradiction #1763: You complain that an inherent plot point in Downpour changing based on your actions cheapens the experience. How is it then different from your Heavy Rain review, where you argued that the big revelation should've been different each time? Could you maybe clarify once and for all what form of story-telling you incline to?

Heavy Rain ends the same way, leaving no room to re-play except to kill or not kill characters for giggles. I guess you get different endings, sort of, except the killer is the same. The purpose of the game is to understand the mystery and survive challenges. There's no point doing either of those again.

Previous Silent Hill games allowed for replayability by being so dense that you enjoy the game even MORE the second time around because you're understanding things like symbolism that went over your head before. Unlockable weapons and outfits were just a bonus. This only works if the "twist" remains constant in the story, like Silent Hill 1 and 2, while Downpour has many "twists", each more "twist"-y than the last and changing every time you play.

Contradiction denied.

 

[PunkRex]

Im starting to think I should play SH2. Subtle hints here and there you know?

 

[Look-a-Hill]

Love the quip about Blackpool. Totally right!

Pfft, it's the English Las Vegas and you know it.

 

[Nieroshai]

One of the things I liked about Downpour was that it showed a protagonist not drawn in by his sins but his regret. It added a new twist, even if the theme was slightly touched on in Origins. As much as I love the Silent Hill formula, seeing the Town "get it wrong" is kind-of refreshing. I could go on more, but meh.

 

[Nazrel]

I am surprised to hear him say positive things about this game since from what I have seen from other reviews there's been a lot of negative things that have been mentioned. Still his general opinion of the game seemed to indicate that he didn't like it very much so *I think I might give this one a miss.

If you read the details, the complaints in most reviews amount to "This sucks because it's a survival horror game." without the writer realizing that's what they're complaining about... and some choppiness in the Xbox version... and all but 3 monsters looking pretty generic.

 

[Therumancer]

As I've said before, horror is beyond the abillities of current game designers because anything thta is horror to horror fans (jaded) is going to be deeply offensive to the mainstream.

"Silent Hill 2" is the result of a time period before horror gamers had fully sold out, it's right on the line. I have refused to give Konami any money for it because they censored it based on complaints about the demo, but it still has the remnants of being a game designed to be really freaky in it, which shows through. Later "Silent Hill" games, and arguably most horror games in general, were designed around what wasn't going to push too many buttons with the mainstream... as a result they have more or less re-treading what they had already gotten away with, rather than trying to push the envelope and risking public ire.

At the time when I first had gotten my PS-2 it was all over the place that the Silent Hill 2 Demo had groups up in arms over all the bludgeoning of those skinless children that were in the original SH bestiary for example.

Right now, we're unlikely to see anything that good again, until the game industry regenerates it's nuts which it has allowed to be cut off.

In short we should be happy that we managed to get the "Fatal Frame" games when we did, especially seeing as the last one (for the Wii apparently) never made it to the US apparently for similar reasons, and due to the attention the previous games got. Granted they tended more towards the "Creepy" than outright horror.

That said, I would like to see Yahtzee marry a copy of Silent Hill 2, we had an Japanese guy marry a video game character

http://articles.cnn.com/2009-12-16/world/japan.virtual.wedding_1_virtual-world-sal-marry?_s=PM:WORLD


We also had an Aussie marry a dog.

http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/ktla-man-marries-dog,0,210566.story

I think Yahtzee, despite being in Australia, should take this finale step for british pride, flying the Union Jack proudly as he does.

I fear what the US will one day do to join this club.

 

[Yopaz]

I am surprised to hear him say positive things about this game since from what I have seen from other reviews there's been a lot of negative things that have been mentioned. Still his general opinion of the game seemed to indicate that he didn't like it very much so *I think I might give this one a miss.

If you read the details, the complaints in most reviews amount to "This sucks because it's a survival horror game." without the writer realizing that's what they're complaining about... and some choppiness in the Xbox version... and all but 3 monsters looking pretty generic.

Actually I have read reviews complaining about the combat, the story and the environment, but thanks for pointing out that I have read different reviews than you.

 

[Don Savik]

edit: delete this sorry

 

[Proverbial Jon]

Yeah, I was going to say they the monsters are fine, it's just that they're not utilized well. The should have given them different behavior patterns. The Weeping Bat and the ghost-mannequin-sex-doll-thing seem fine but more could have been done with the Screamers and Prisoners. If I would have done it I would have had the Screamers mope around crying like the Witch from Left 4 Dead, only attacking when you get near them. Prisoners I'd have wait standing and facing the corner of rooms like they're in timeout (Because, well, they are prisoners and they are being punished, makes sense to me /shrug) only attacking if you make a lot of noise or get close to them.

I also read that there's a sidequest that features a Screamer that's only visible through a mirror. Seems like they missed a golden opportunity for a really interesting enemy.

Honestly, some of the side missions are better than the actual storyline. I remember the one you mentioned and it was harrowing. I have a thing about mirrors as it is so it doesn't take much to terrify me with one. The screamer is completely invisible on your side of the room and you can only see her to attack if you watch her position in the mirror.

There was one moment within the main story, inside the prison, where I saw a prisoner coming towards me. I don't think he'd clocked my presence because he was walking, just STROLLING, towards me and it was horrible because it wasn't the usual pattern. Somehow it struck the right ballance of familiar and unfamiliar to be really unsettling. He broke back into normal attack mode once I engaged him so I'm not sure if it was intentional or a glitch.

I like your idea about the screamers a lot, Vatra missed a trick with that one. I still don't quite understand the significance of the sex doll but the multiple shadow versions that attack certainly make for some tense battles. Although I found myself avoiding enemies in the game mostly because of the clunky combat which meant they would land far too many hits on me and it wasn't worth the punishment I got. Besides, those prisoners can block a fire axe, with their arms! How does that make sense?

 

[Yeager942]

Dear Escapist, is the Silent Hill HD collection worth getting? I heard comments about them being in abysmal condition and I've never played Silent Hill before, though I am a huge survival horror fan.

 

[Kazedarkwind]

Dear Escapist, can you stop spoiling the video before i get to watch it? "Silent hill Downpour best western game but still shit" well gee that ruins a bit of the surprise factor of the video.

OT: Great video. love the sonic comparison because its almost to true. 3 good games and then bam never again!!

 

[maninahat]

You know what would be a creative use of the Silent Hill franchise? Having a game in which the character already escaped/passed through silent hill, and has gotten back into the real world before the game begins. From there, you control a character who slowly discovers that silent hill has "followed" him into the seemingly safe, populated cities and a bucolic countrysides.

That way, you can contrast the muggy horror of the previous games with an uncommon horror setting. You walk through a busy town market, only to see the other pedestrians transform into shadowy monsters that follow you. You enjoy a nice sunset in a meadow, which suddenly becomes thick with fog. You can capture a real sense of PTSD, only one which chases you and kills you with hooks and acid.

 

[Grahav]

Best point of the video is the need of a new horror line. We already know how the town works, so
much of the suspense is dead.

 

[mjc0961]

Thanks for including Sonic Adventure 2 in the burning pile of shitty Sonic games. Sonic Adventure 2 sucked ass, and was really the point for me where all of Sonic's games went to shit. I will never understand why people rave about that game, it's awful.

And yeah, like Yahtzee says he can't really call himself a Silent Hill fan anymore, for the same reasons I no longer consider myself a Sonic fan. So everyone who just had their panties bunch up over the preceding paragraph can take their "you're one of those fans" comments and shove 'em. I can't be one of "those fans" when I'm not a fan at all.

 

[6SteW6]

Is it just me or does yahtzee review games too often?

 

[FallenMessiah88]

So it's one step forward, two steps back eh? Well, maybe Vatra Games will get it right next time? That is, if there will even be a next time. I certainly hope so.

 

[Nazrel]

I am surprised to hear him say positive things about this game since from what I have seen from other reviews there's been a lot of negative things that have been mentioned. Still his general opinion of the game seemed to indicate that he didn't like it very much so *I think I might give this one a miss.

If you read the details, the complaints in most reviews amount to "This sucks because it's a survival horror game." without the writer realizing that's what they're complaining about... and some choppiness in the Xbox version... and all but 3 monsters looking pretty generic.

Actually I have read reviews complaining about the combat, the story and the environment, but thanks for pointing out that I have read different reviews than you.

I would have shrugged and said "fair enough"... but you brought up the combat, showing you have no idea what I was talking about. I guess I could have been clearer... but given this is a forum for a video that explains a least the combat part of that concept... I really shouldn't have had to.

The disempowerment of the player is a major aspect of Survival horror; I looked through as many reviews as I could find and this aspect factored heavily into the complaints of quite a lot of them, oblivious to the fact this is a defining characteristic of the genre.

For the sake of accuracy I guess I really should have said "many complaints in most reviews."

I assume they're confusing things like "Dead Space" and "Left 4 Dead" with survival horror.

Whether we read the same reviews or not is irrelevant, because it doesn't discount the trend.

 

[A Gray Phantom]

Minecraft is scary than most survival horror games I've played. Why? Because I actually have something worth losing, and creepers are like freakin' kamikaze ninjas 0_o;