Zero Punctuation: Webcomics

Ragamuffin

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Jun 15, 2008
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TerraMGP said:
As for contraceptives, well, as shocking as it is that I am the one to explain this to everyone they do not always work. Everyone makes mistakes, and just because its unplanned and would have been bad for the two of them does not mean that he was not saddened by the miscarrage in some way.
See previous post about contraceptives, as for him feeling saddened? He openly says he "saw the emotions it can bring up first hand, and I saw how it could truly hurt someone." Saw. Not experienced.

As for make up sex? Once you consider a relationship "toxic to begin with", if you think any kind of sex will help make up, you're an idiot and sadly deluded.
 

TerraMGP

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Jun 25, 2008
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I.E. human. Your faulting him for a mistake in that regard. Your not an idiot for trying to save a relationship that is doomed to fail or unhealthy you are simply letting your emotions get in the way. The majority of people do that. If you want to call him an idiot then do so but the fact is most people are when in a relationship good or bad. Maybe he only knows now how toxic it was. Maybe he can see clearly that it was dead from the start and could not then. THats just how it is. He has that on his mind, he has to live with the child he will never have because of a misscarrage and with the conciquences of that both good and bad. That is how we grow as people.

He had sex with a girl he was perhaps at the time still convinced he was in love with, or at least SHOULD be. She got pregnant. the pregnancy showed him for sure that it was dead and then even as he was preparing to go though with it either way, misscarrage. Now in the end he is guilty of being human, nothing more. Maybe I am wrong about him but I honestly feel that its none of my buisness in the end. Only two people on this planet need to really deal with the issue on a serious level and nobody here is among them.
 
Nov 28, 2007
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Ragamuffin said:
thebobmaster said:
What makes you think he wasn't using a rubber, or any kind of birth control? Because she got pregnant? Well, not sure if you realize this, but no birth control is 100% effective. However, you want to believe that Tim Buckley is truly evil, willing to force a miscarriage to get out of a relationship, be my guest.
A condom has about 2% failure rate when used properly, if your girlfriend is on the pill too that chances of unwanted pregnancy are in the decimals. Still, it's nice to see you pick on the idea of birth control over what a little scum bag his is for still screwing a girl in a relationship he openly called "toxic" instead of doing them both a favour and ending it.
I'm not defending him, I'm just saying that you shouldn't assume you know everything there is to know about the pregnancy from one newsblog post. And yes, if you take numerous precautions, the chance of them failing is in the decimals. Guess what? That doesn't mean there is no chance at all.
 

ohellynot

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Jun 26, 2008
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i noticed that you made an erlier reference to CAD in a previous video mentioning too many words as well, you really hate tim buckly don't you. oh well it is sort of right in a way but i still enjoy it so up yours ;-)
oh and it's just a comic stop getting so worked up about it
 

Ragamuffin

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TerraMGP said:
I.E. human. Your faulting him for a mistake in that regard. Your not an idiot for trying to save a relationship that is doomed to fail or unhealthy you are simply letting your emotions get in the way.
Which is a stupid things to do as it'll only cause pain in the long run.
TerraMGP said:
Maybe he can see clearly that it was dead from the start and could not then. THats just how it is. He has that on his mind, he has to live with the child he will never have because of a misscarrage and with the conciquences of that both good and bad. That is how we grow as people.
Read what he wrote, he says it didn't affect him much. Guess it's only tragic when a wanted baby is miscarried huh?
TerraMGP said:
Maybe I am wrong about him
Possibly and possbily I'm just too cynical about such things.
thebobmaster said:
I'm not defending him, I'm just saying that you shouldn't assume you know everything there is to know about the pregnancy from one newsblog post. And yes, if you take numerous precautions, the chance of them failing is in the decimals. Guess what? That doesn't mean there is no chance at all.
Obviously. But just what do you think the chances of that are? You're talking about less than .01 of a percent and it just happened to happen to this guy who'd go on to make a webcomic about it? Those are some awfully long odds.
 

TerraMGP

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We don't know what part didn't affect him though... frankly I think it probably hit him harder than he let on or said, hit him enough to put it into his art, thats saying something. Granted it may hit harder if the baby is wanted, but for all we know the fact that it did not is what upsets him the most. All I am saying is you can't judge unless you are in the situation, hell unless you are the person it happens to.
 

Sylocat

Sci-Fi & Shakespeare
Nov 13, 2007
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Lord Krunk said:
http://www.homestarrunner.com/sbemail181.html
Gunkiller is actually a real-life friend of mine. I wish he'd taken Strongbad's advice to heart. ^_^;
 

spungemonkey

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May 7, 2008
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Helix08 said:
Yahtzee it appears you are running out of material here.
All credit too him, he has stated there is nothing coming out around this time... and I have to agree with him
 

Altherix

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Jul 3, 2008
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I kind of get the feeling people missed the main point of Yahtzee's, "Webcomics: How to make millions of gamers happy with the minimum amount of effort."

Honestly, it didn't strike me as a, "CAD, is the crappest Webcomic ever made and I hate it more then hate itself" but more, "Webcomics, need critics along with the whole internet"

As he said in his mailbag showdown, "Since the internet is almost diametrically opposed to the notion of quality control. In recent years it's been a lot easier to just assume everything is shit until it can prove itself otherwise."

He points out Webcomics suffer from the fact that you can find someone, somewhere on the internet that's going to think your crap is the best thing ever. Thus, the author/artist believes they've reached perfection and improvement isn't needed. Anyone who says different is automatically an asshat and can be ignored.

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it." - Josheph Goebbel.

That's what I got from this, Yantzee himself would have to quote on this to let me know if I hit the target.

This isn't a "Anti-CAD" feature but a, "Artists, need to stop listening to yes men and start listening to critics so their art can improve instead of being lazy and stuck on Mediocre Avenue."
 

Imperial Avenger

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May 31, 2008
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Altherix said:
I kind of get the feeling people missed the main point of Yahtzee's, "Webcomics: How to make millions of gamers happy with the minimum amount of effort."

Honestly, it didn't strike me as a, "CAD, is the crappest Webcomic ever made and I hate it more then hate itself" but more, "Webcomics, need critics along with the whole internet"

As he said in his mailbag showdown, "Since the internet is almost diametrically opposed to the notion of quality control. In recent years it's been a lot easier to just assume everything is shit until it can prove itself otherwise."

He points out Webcomics suffer from the fact that you can find someone, somewhere on the internet that's going to think your crap is the best thing ever. Thus, the author/artist believes they've reached perfection and improvement isn't needed. Anyone who says different is automatically an asshat and can be ignored.

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it." - Josheph Goebbel.

That's what I got from this, Yantzee himself would have to quote on this to let me know if I hit the target.

This isn't a "Anti-CAD" feature but a, "Artists, need to stop listening to yes men and start listening to critics so their art can improve instead of being lazy and stuck on Mediocre Avenue."
That is precisely the point Yahtzee himself made in his article "You CAD" over on FullyRamblomatic.com. He even emboldened the quote that sums up that very argument.
 

Kovash86

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May 23, 2008
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Triffid said:
The hell? Is this thread still going on? Are we still debating about CAD sucks? Please tell me we at least reached a conclusion in that area
No, the fanboys refuse to believe that a story about a miscarriage is considered a faux pas in a "comedy" web comic.
 

Tempdude0

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Jun 27, 2008
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TerraMGP said:
You know, I could say SO much, but all I can say is that its funny how some people bash these other comcis for 'not being funny' or have personal issues against the authers when they defend this one to the death. ZP has gone downhill fast, and no matter how many rambling blathering incoherant text walls people put up the bottom line is that he is simply bashing other people in the same field he is. What gets me though is not that this week bashes Webcomics I like per say, as I don't like all he noted, its that he seems to be going out of his way to find something bash-worthy in his eyes. I miss psychonaughts. There, I said it. I miss it when the man felt like he gave a damn and wasn't just putting up crap because it would tick people off. I miss when he would drag up the name of some amazing game or even one he found amazing and just say "You know what? This kicks ass" instead of just picking the most popular game of the week and ripping it a new in the most ass backwards way he can just because, well I'm not sure why anymore.

And to all of those Yatzee fanboys who defend him I hope you guys really love the direction it is going because you are going to be the majority of his fan base soon. For the past few weeks he seems to have just taken the easy way out,m aybe longer. To be frank it almost seems like he does not care anymore. I for one have no reason to sit here and watch a man just start ragging on things anymore. When he seemed to have some credability, some insight, some vision beyond the norm it was great but the more he opens his mouth lately the more it just seems like hes blurting out more nerd-hate and less actual insight. Oh he doesn't think Penny arcade is funny. Wow... Thats just so amazing. Even if he hates it so what? I really don't give a damn about his opinion on web comics. I could care less what Yatzee does in his free time in regards to what he reads/watches. Next hes going to do a ZP on why he hates hats other than the one he wears or something. WHO CARES?

The man is losing it, and I really hope he gets dropped so that he can go on to something that makes him happy again because its obvious he does not like this job anymore with the lack of work he puts into it.
Woo, Terra is back. That means the discussion is back to "head in your own colon" levels and I can berate a few tards. Wee-ha!

You could say sooooo much, yet you don't. Nice argument there.

As for "not being funny" or having "issues with the author" If pig-like and BALD ever became twats we would call them on it. The problem is that Buckley is, and has always been so far up his own ass I'm surprised he hasn't warped physics and vomited up his own head.

...And he found GTA 4 fun and went back to play it some more. What more do you want? He gives his opinion, and just because it doesn't line up with your malformed views doesn't mean it's not what he thinks. Then again, you're either a troll or an idiot, so who cares?

An easy way out, yes, because that makes sense. Arguing popular games are bad based on flaws contained within' as opposed to inane comments like "ecksbawks hueg!" and "Mario is kiddy." If you have no reason to sit around and watch it, don't. If you want to sit around and complain about it, then fine, whatever. Make a point here and there that's relevant and everyone can have a nice discussion.

As for Penny-Arcade, it's on his list of good comics. Nice try on making an ill-conceived point there. Nice to see nothing has changed.

If you don't care so hard, why post? At least those of us posting have an interest in some way, shape, or form. If all you've got is apathy, why even comment. You add nothing to discussion and don't even present an opinion. I'd say you're less than useless, but that's not possible so I'll just go with astoundingly useless.

ColossusReaver said:
for anyone who wants to see the original version of the comic: http://www.ctrlaltdel-online.com/comic.php

it's a comepletely different thing than that piece of excrement that someone photshopped out of their sick mind

and btw that John Soloman guy is worse than Yahtzee at making a point and having a believable and interesting opinion....the guy just goes on a little tantrum about very little other than the fact that he doesn't like CAD and he's going to be as much of a forum whoring douchebag as possible to get that point across, if that's even a point
He may be a hate filled venom sack, but Soloman always made accurate assessments of the problems in the comics he talked about. Despite his asshole-ish tendencies, he was always spot on even going so far as to reference actual comics to make his point.

Say what you will about his writing style, but his points can't really be faulted when he's al literally attempting to choke you with evidence backing up his statements...Except when he's taking personal shots, that's just the icing on the mercury laced cake.

TerraMGP said:
I find it kind of sad that anyone would go after Buckley for an error most people make. I know several people who are in relationships and have sex when its doomed to fail. Hell from what I understand sex is usually the last thing a couple has when the relationship is When the love is gone most people seem to try and patch things up with sex as its one of the few things they have in common. As for contraceptives, well, as shocking as it is that I am the one to explain this to everyone they do not always work. Everyone makes mistakes, and just because its unplanned and would have been bad for the two of them does not mean that he was not saddened by the miscarrage in some way. Sometimes people do diffrent things to deal with such issues. I just find it sad that people are jumping to conclusions about an issue that is very personal and the way an artist chose to deal with his emotions. Its not your life, you don't know what youd do in the same situation or how you would feel.

What I really find disturbing is that you people can judge him, but I don't hear anyone here praising Jerry Holkins or Mike Krahulik for Childs Play. That was a wonderful thing and I can honestly say the only sad thing is that it is not spreading as far or as fast as it should. But no, you take an expression of someones mixed and confused feelings and use it to say they are a bad person. You don't find it funny thats fine but you all have just as much wrong with you, and I do too.

And Ragamuffin, it can still happen. As I said sex is usually the last resort of a failing relationship and he may not have wanted to admit to himself that it was toxic at the time. He may have been fighting to get himself to see the good in a person he thought he wanted to be with. Again I find it disturbing that you are trying to judge a situation that is personal and that you know NOTHING about.
And here I was thinking I would have to cut a rant short.

Guess what, that error still makes HIM an ass, and makes your buddies assholes as well. The idea is that one person knows it's doomed to failure and is just stringing the other person along, somewhat like Lucas...Hmm, big shocker there.

The contraceptives thing is just stupid all over. Condom + Pill + spermicidal lubricant = pretty much not getting pregnant except through an act of God. The odds of it are so small this shouldn't even be debated unless you're that one unlucky bastard who it happens to.

So personal he whores it out in a storyline. Sorry, but you loose all rights to something being a personal tragedy when you start whoring it out. If it's personal, you play it close to the heart or perhaps explain it in a well thought out manner, not in between gag-strips where it's sure to lose all impact.

We don't reference Childs Play because it's a wonderful program and everyone knows that. This isn't deviantart, we don't need to sit around in a circle jerk. You can't even use it in conjunction with a point. Oh, and those "mixed and confused" feelings would be A-OK if he wasn't, again, whoring out a personal "tragedy" for the sake of a joke comic...And did you just say you were as bad as everyone else? I'm not even sure where that last sentence is going.

Yes, because sex never happens between two people in a healthy relationship...NEVER! At least your next line is fun. Why do you assume he's telling a non-bias version? Last I checked people who come out of unsatisfactory relationships always skew things in their favor. Even if he is telling the truth, why would you go out of your way to tell people about it? "So, I was with this *****, and she was a *****, right? Right, so like, she miscarried and I was all sad and shit. Her? Who cares, she was a ***** and the relationship was toxic." The douche plays it up like it's some great loss to him when he states, in advance, that he knew it was doomed to failure and "toxic" so either he's an ass or he's an idiot.

TerraMGP said:
I.E. human. Your faulting him for a mistake in that regard. Your not an idiot for trying to save a relationship that is doomed to fail or unhealthy you are simply letting your emotions get in the way. The majority of people do that. If you want to call him an idiot then do so but the fact is most people are when in a relationship good or bad. Maybe he only knows now how toxic it was. Maybe he can see clearly that it was dead from the start and could not then. THats just how it is. He has that on his mind, he has to live with the child he will never have because of a misscarrage and with the conciquences of that both good and bad. That is how we grow as people.

He had sex with a girl he was perhaps at the time still convinced he was in love with, or at least SHOULD be. She got pregnant. the pregnancy showed him for sure that it was dead and then even as he was preparing to go though with it either way, misscarrage. Now in the end he is guilty of being human, nothing more. Maybe I am wrong about him but I honestly feel that its none of my buisness in the end. Only two people on this planet need to really deal with the issue on a serious level and nobody here is among them.
Yes, we fault people for making human mistakes. Bigotry, racism, stupidity, gender bias, all are human mistakes...and yes, you are an idiot for trying to save an unhealthy/doomed relationship, hence the "unhealthy" and "doomed" part. He stated he knew it was toxic, so that next point goes out the window, just like your logic.

You know, I'm doing a Godwin and...No, actually, better idea, Mao Tse-Tung is human and all his mistakes are human. As such we should think no less of him. Same with Stalin. He was awesome if you overlook all the "human mistakes". In fact, he's even more awesome because of it.

Whoa, logic at the end there. The only two people who should have been involved in this are B^UCKLEY and his girlfriend with the low standards. Unfortunately, he involved everyone else by spouting off about it and using it as a plot point for his characters to become "DEEP!".

TerraMGP said:
We don't know what part didn't affect him though... frankly I think it probably hit him harder than he let on or said, hit him enough to put it into his art, thats saying something. Granted it may hit harder if the baby is wanted, but for all we know the fact that it did not is what upsets him the most. All I am saying is you can't judge unless you are in the situation, hell unless you are the person it happens to.
If he outright stated it didn't effect him, so we know it didn't effect him. What are you looking for here, a neon sign saying "I don't give a flying rats ass"

Lord_Seth said:
Jarannis said:
It's not like you get over a miscarriage in ten seconds flat,
Um...isn't that more or less what CAD did?
Yes...Don't try to think about it.

Kovash86 said:
Triffid said:
The hell? Is this thread still going on? Are we still debating about CAD sucks? Please tell me we at least reached a conclusion in that area
No, the fanboys refuse to believe that a story about a miscarriage is considered a faux pas in a "comedy" web comic.
That, and we have people like Terra up there going on about nothing in particular, making no points, and just being a generally unlikeable and nonsensical prick.

I would be in that category as well, but I saved up all my "not an ass when commenting" points from earlier just so I could blow the load on people like Terra...At some point I should think about getting a hobby besides taunting stupids on the interwebs.

...Screw it, SIMPLE PLEASURES AHOY! GOTTA WALL 'O TEXT LIKE A MOTHAFUGGA!

Also, surprisingly, the robot in todays comic actually made a good point. Perhaps Dorko the wonderboy might actually be improving, provided we ignore the last panel. Oye, way to kill the moment.
 

Takatchi

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Jul 4, 2008
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Y'know, I was gonna leave a comment about how I enjoy ZP's eloquence and delivery in generating a good laugh regardless of the subject matter, then I hit "last page" and saw people attempting to justify humor in a miscarriage.

Now I'm going to watch ZP every Wednesday -and- read these feedback threads! :D
 

TerraMGP

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Jun 25, 2008
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Ok tempdude, your talking rights are revoked until you can stop abusing them and start thinking. Seriously I can see why you like Yatzee this way, your just a sad, pathetic little man who wants to be angery at everyone and everything and curl up into your little ball of "I'm right your wrong" bitterness until the four hoursemen come and take us all. As far as I am concerned your just not talking anymore because you don't know what the hell you are talking about ever.

now ignoring Tempdude, who is apparently a high and mighty god and as such able to equate racism with letting ones emotions dictate a course of a relationship you don't want to admit is doomed, the larger point is that Yatzee is just losing it if he really thinks that he needs to police and critic everything. He has stopped being charming and insightful and now just decides "you know what? I think this sucks so I am going to tear it a new one." Why the hell can't he be posative once in a while? Why can't we have another review where he takes some really good obscure game and says "HAY! GUESS WHAT! this game kicks ass and you should all look for it because of this reason and that reason." No. Instead he is just taking things he personally does not like and picking the living hell out of them because he can. The internet does not need criticism, but if he really thinks that how about we start with ZP. How about we start with how his saterical high and mighty act seems to have taken on more serious undertones? The fact that even if he kind of has some things he likes about some games he seriously downplays them now and seems to focus on just being an ass. He has gone from a witty and funny to just self absorbed and vapid rather quickly. Now I know Tempdude is going to start twisting my words and bitching at me because he seems to have no idea what I am saying or chooses to ignore it so he can be a jerk and lift his ego but I am still going to say it. Yatzee is no better than TB.

Thats right I said it, he is no better than Tim because he is still stuck up his own ass. Any of you who say TB is a bad person for what he does or what he feels are too. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." well You don't know whats in the mans heart and even if he says he felt nothing how on earth do you know if thats really the case? Thats the thing that gets to me. If you people really don't find CAD funny thats fine. I am not trying to change anyones mind on that. You can make all the coments you want on his work and what you think of the positions he puts forward and his idea of humor and thats just fine because thats his work and you are the consumers and that is your job. However Finding out about a real situation like this and just making a snap judgement that he is a bad human being, whats more saying he is a bad human being for what may be simply the very simple desire to try and keep what he may have thought of at the time as a relationship he 'should' save is just wrong.

None of us are above judgement. None of you are nor am I. I have to say that I am dissapointed in Yatzee for what I consider taking the 'easy way out' again and even more so for his apparent feelings that we need more real criticism on the expression of art for people because what it boils down to is he doesn't like those comics and I could give a rats ass about his opinion on something subjective. But what really gets me is when people here try and judge whats in a mans heart or what kind of person he is because of some situation that you really know nothing about. Its like watching a bunch of old ladies at church pick someone apart behind their back because of some situation they know something about. Just think about that people.
 

TerraMGP

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everyone keeps saying that. Again I ask you how the hell you people know if he was really over it or not. Maybe he was over it that fast, or maybe he simply said he was. Maybe the comic was his way of coping. Hell maybe he was over it that fast because thats what got him to realize the relationship was crap and he feels bad that he does not feel worse about it. I think its really easy for you people to all judge the man when the mirror is not up to you.
 

Digikid

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Mr. Smiles said:
Digikid said:
Simply put. To those who do NOT like CAD....screw you as you have no sense of good humor whatsoever and should be make into a paste.

Same to PA lovers. PA is not funny in the LEAST.
Paste which Buckley shall use to add hair and other features to his overused default character template, thus creating all his horribly identical cut 'n paste characters.

Also I have to assume your post is being sarcastic as no one over the age of about 12 could possibly be that stupid.
Let see here...I am 30 years old....being surrounded by a bunch of kids here that know nothing of good humor.

You do the math....dude.
 

Foolish Mortal

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May 5, 2008
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fierydemise said:
On the supposedly misogynistic storyline I thought that was one of the best ones he did, it was so dead on. How many of you wouldn't take your friends excuse to force him to go on a date with a really unattractive girl? The scene in the restaurant is so accurate, in that situation I'm sure most guys would be doing just like Lucas and probably thinking very similar things too.
Pretty much all of the rest of your argument was sensible and agreeable, but I have to debate this one. Basically what pissed me off is that the assunption that women are only worth as much as they look.

In essence: Oh god damn, a fat chick, I could never go out with this girl, and... no wait she's attractive. I suppose now she meets my high standards I will recognise her right to exist.

Okay, that was exaggerated, but come on?

Now to address the other side. Yes, Tim Buckley is a jerk. So is (apparently) Stanley Kubrick to the nth degree, but he made Blade Runner so everyone loves him.


EDIT: Stop talking about Tim's girlfriends miscarriage as if it's a goddamn relevant issue.
 

Kovash86

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May 23, 2008
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Wow...TerraMPG...what are you doing out of summer school? Don't you have to take summer school so they don't hold you back a year, for the 5th time? You can't even spell "angry" right, how do you expect us to respect your opinion? You don't cope with shit by expressing it in your art, that is how the guy who made Evangelion did it and even the Eva fanboys think Shinji (the primary medium through which the writer's issues were expressed) was a pansy little *****. Yahtzee stated his point at the beginning of the video, therefore doesn't need me defending him at all, you however need to pay attention to what you are typing and typing about otherwise you are going to continue gnawing on your foot because you don't know any better.
The difference in being a decent person and a bad person are typically gray in some matters, this definitely isn't one of them, if something horrible happens in your life you don't write an entire comic about it unless you section it off as something else don't just plug it into your standard continuity, especially if your comic doesn't typically deal with tragedies worse than how bad a game is, you can write a comic which is a true honest to god tribute to the tragedy and you make damned sure everyone knows it is clear and separate from everything else, otherwise it looks like you are trying to make fun of something which is truly horrible without giving time for it to settle (like the Steve Irwin incident, god bless that crazy Aussie. That's just an example.) you don't go out immediately and start spouting off about it.