Zero Punctuation: Webcomics

[ComradeJim270]

If assholes had their own religion Tim Buckley would be one of their saints. Way to go on the CAD-bashing. Easy, but fun. My own take on CAD is that anyone who likes it either has a terrible sense of humor, an IQ below 90, or both. Anyone who thinks CAD is funny has something wrong with them, and should give some serious thought to their problem.

CAD is never intentionally funny. It is only funny when Buckley somehow deviates from his usual shit, and it is then funny only for that reason. It becomes an inadvertent non-sequitur. It's funny like someone who eats at Burger King regularly going into McDonalds and ordering a Whopper, actually believing that McDonalds sells Whoppers. You laugh because he's fucking clueless, not because he himself is funny.

As for gaming webcomics I actually like, PA is the only one, because it's kind of funny. Every other gaming webcomic I've seen is very much hit or miss.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

I read CAD for probably two or three years, having found it on a webcomic site of some kind where it was ranked #1 in popularity at the time (on their database). I checked it out, found it actually hilarious at times in a kind of "heehee Ethan did a dumb" way. Always found attacks on the guy unfair and all that.

The miscarriage angle just plain pissed me off. I'm sorry he had to deal with that, but if every webcomic author dumped their own personal tragedies into their comics, we'd need something to read to get a break from the fucking comics. We've all dealt with tragedy. Deaths, illness, bankruptcy, the works.

Someone mentioned Strong Bad. When The Brothers Chaps' father died, did they insert a father-death angle into H*R? No, they took time off and came back. Why? Respect for their fans and a realization that while we all DO care about them as people, we don't want that to infiltrate the comics/cartoons we love.

It doesn't help that Buckley's writing was so inept it was just painful.

 

[Satoz]

I like CAD, and people saying oh well you have to be dumb to like it etc etc are really friggin closed minded. Okay so someone put some real life issues into a comic, into their work or form of expression, is that so surprising? I'll admit CAD isnt always amazing, and many a strip has left me feeling empty, but still it has its moments. To insult the comics writing is a fruitless effort, because he has so many fans already, and comics online of that variety are not well known for being amazing tales. People who get pissed off by such inserts of issues etc need to realize that you wont always like what someone puts out, and that you can just skip it. It shouldn't piss you off, its not like anyone owes you anything.

However I do agree with yahtzee in that alot of the comics are pretty lame, easy to do, and lack a certain amount of real creativity, not to mention there are so many clone strips, such as the mario and luigi gay thing etc etc. However these things will thrive because we are creatures of habit

 

[ComradeJim270]

I like CAD, and people saying oh well you have to be dumb to like it etc etc are really friggin closed minded. Okay so someone put some real life issues into a comic, into their work or form of expression, is that so surprising? I'll admit CAD isnt always amazing, and many a strip has left me feeling empty, but still it has its moments. To insult the comics writing is a fruitless effort, because he has so many fans already, and comics online of that variety are not well known for being amazing tales. People who get pissed off by such inserts of issues etc need to realize that you wont always like what someone puts out, and that you can just skip it. It shouldn't piss you off, its not like anyone owes you anything.

However I do agree with yahtzee in that alot of the comics are pretty lame, easy to do, and lack a certain amount of real creativity, not to mention there are so many clone strips, such as the mario and luigi gay thing etc etc. However these things will thrive because we are creatures of habit

Appealing to popularity? That's a form of fallacy, in case you didn't know.

I maintain that CAD is not funny to anyone with a well-developed sense of humor. Finding CAD funny does not neccesarily mean you are unintelligent, but I believe it means you do not have a good concept of humor. Comic timing in particular is apparently an alien concept to Buckley and his fans. For some reason, he also feels compelled to explain the obvious, perhaps because some of his fans really are just a bit too slow to get the joke otherwise. He also tends to make jokes that have already been made (and better) all over the internet, though he only does this on occasion.

Even if it was funny, it would probably be just as much so without any images, because Buckley seems to be unwilling or unable to exercise any artistic talent beyond the mediocrity he has shown the world so far.

I do get pissed off at Buckley as a person, too, but not because of CAD... just because he's an arrogant, narcissistic moron who seems largely devoid of any virtue.

 

[Blyr]

I didn't even know what CAD was, until I read the comments here.. and seriously, who puts a miscarriage in a joke webcomic.. that's just...wtf.

Anyways, this review made me lol the entire time, so true about webcomics.

 

[Booze Zombie]

Appealing to popularity? That's a form of fallacy, in case you didn't know.

I must thank you for posting this sentence, it lead me to a web site I feel much smarter for reading.

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/

 

[Jack Spencer Jr]

Quite frankly, I don't find most web comics all that funny. So it's a lot like the newspaper funnies section. I haven't laughed at them since I was eight. No wait. Not even then did I laugh.

Video game web comics are even worse because... Well, know how when you're hanging out with your friends and one other guy who's not usually part of your group is there and one of your friends says "orange marbles" and everyone bursts out laughing except the new guy because he wasn't there when whatever happened that involved orange marbles happened? Well, that's video game web comics in a nut shell. It's all one big in-joke. I have never laughed at Penny Arcade and fail to see why anyone would ever find it funny. it just has the worst comic timing ever, and it's a comic strip. Four panels, boom. How do you fuck that up? I don't know, but they do it with alarming regularity. Even after the joke is explained to me by some kind soul, it's obvious to me that the joke would have been better if it had been done... well, usually not at all, but done differently would have been an improvement if that wasn't an option.

As far as the CAD thing goes,... I have no idea what it is and if it's as bad or worse than Penny Arcade, I don't want to know about it. But the guy who draws it sounds like needs lit birthday cake candles dripping searing hot wax onto his flabby nipples.

 

[rebochan]

I maintain that CAD is not funny to anyone with a well-developed sense of humor. Finding CAD funny does not neccesarily mean you are unintelligent, but I believe it means you do not have a good concept of humor. Comic timing in particular is apparently an alien concept to Buckley and his fans. For some reason, he also feels compelled to explain the obvious, perhaps because some of his fans really are just a bit too slow to get the joke otherwise. He also tends to make jokes that have already been made (and better) all over the internet, though he only does this on occasion

Now see, I maintain that people who feel the need to lecture others on something as subjective as a sense of humor, decrying that one thing is "funny" and another "isn't" in some vague manner that ultimately boils down to "My opinion is the only one that is right and I am constantly threatened by the concept of disagreement" really lose the crux of their argument because they can't just stop at criticism of the work. They need to include base insults about its fandom.

 

[bandhelix]

Lol that was a spantacular video, had me non laugh laughing in the office (laughing in your head while gagging yourself with your hand as not to be found out for not working)....... xD

 

[Worsle]

Rebochan no humour is not entirely subjective, just like art is not entirely subjective. Humour does have rules, it might be a little loose with them but they do exist. Buckley does more make a good 4 panel joke, he will drop the punch line to early leaving the rest of the comic as a waist, timing is one of the most important things in comedy. Comics are also a visual medium, the art is important to the joke (does not have to be great but has to be fitting) copied art just does not cut it if you want people to identify with the characters. I would like to see you to go up to a professional comedian and tell them there is no such thing as a good joke only opinions.

Oh and the AD forums are back up. Buckley's reply? That he will never listen to criticism making him any thing but an artist.

 

[Copter400]

I maintain that CAD is not funny to anyone with a well-developed sense of humor. Finding CAD funny does not neccesarily mean you are unintelligent, but I believe it means you do not have a good concept of humor. Comic timing in particular is apparently an alien concept to Buckley and his fans. For some reason, he also feels compelled to explain the obvious, perhaps because some of his fans really are just a bit too slow to get the joke otherwise. He also tends to make jokes that have already been made (and better) all over the internet, though he only does this on occasion

Now see, I maintain that people who feel the need to lecture others on something as subjective as a sense of humor, decrying that one thing is "funny" and another "isn't" in some vague manner that ultimately boils down to "My opinion is the only one that is right and I am constantly threatened by the concept of disagreement" really lose the crux of their argument because they can't just stop at criticism of the work. They need to include base insults about its fandom.

Yeah. CAD is bad, because his fans are stupid. That's THE reason, and yes, ALL his fans are stupid.

Damn, it's hard to sound sarcastic through text.

 

[Baztrd]

Video was quite entertaining, but not as funny as the 850-comment thread that it spawned Yes the guy is ranting... that seems to be his "thing". I happen to like rants like that, but appreciate that some find them annoying (or so people keep telling me when I'm on one...)

CAD is, in my opinion, poorly drawn and very, very poorly written... From what I've read of it, the joke is usually "see the stupid gamer be a prick and be proud of it, haha". This is even less funny then normal when it's aplied to a subject such as miscarriage...

Most webcomics due truly suck, why? Well, if they were really good, would they still only be webcomics?

Personally, I only regularly check GUcomics and Applegeeks. Both because of the artwork mostly, though sometimes they can be quite funny as well. There might be more out there that are great, but I don't know them

What I don't get is why everyone is getting so upset about both this clip and Tim Buckley... Don't like the clip? Don't watch the next one... Don't like Tim? Don't read his webcomic... problem solved!

The internet has given many people a creative outlet, for better or for worse... Overall I'm happy with this, since amongst all the crap some gems can be found from time to time.

The trick is to find and appreciate the gems, and avoid the crap Just like in real life!

 

[TZer0]

This was pure awesome. CAD deserves getting kicked in the head.. in fact.. I'm going to make an exception.. I'm going to go on the CAD forums to see wether someone has reacted there.

 

[rebochan]

Rebochan no humour is not entirely subjective, just like art is not entirely subjective. Humour does have rules, it might be a little loose with them but they do exist. Buckley does more make a good 4 panel joke, he will drop the punch line to early leaving the rest of the comic as a waist, timing is one of the most important things in comedy. Comics are also a visual medium, the art is important to the joke (does not have to be great but has to be fitting) copied art just does not cut it if you want people to identify with the characters. I would like to see you to go up to a professional comedian and tell them there is no such thing as a good joke only opinions.

But see, those *are* valid critiques and I never said people shouldn't make them. My only beef is when someone feels that they haven't gone far enough and need to personally insult those who disagree with them. Well, that and the hatred for CAD shown here makes me wonder if Tim Buckley may have shot a few sainted mothers or instigated the Holocaust. Seriously people...it's just a webcomic.

Anyway, the main difference here is that one is an attempt to show why something is or isn't working. The other is just base insults against those who disagree. You may notice I never got on Yahtzee for this - because he's not exactly subtle that he's expressing his opinion and the entire short was his justifications for it. He certainly rips on fans, but when you describe yourself as a general misanthrope week after week, it's actually funny and not just a bunch of low blows.

Oh and the AD forums are back up. Buckley's reply? That he will never listen to criticism making him any thing but an artist.

He may be a forum nazi, but the last few times I got curious and dug through his forums, they were completely troll infested. No, it wasn't criticism - it was just rampant flaming. I had seen that threads of legitimate criticism (i.e. unrealistic, bad attempt to change tone) were not locked. Meanwhile there were at least five threads from the same self-righteous troll screaming about his freedom of speech being taken away because he couldn't start threads calling Tim a douchebag.

And you know, I do admit that the difference between "preserving the integrity of art" and "refusing to take criticism" always seems to fall under whether you like the artist in question. John Krisfalusci's prima donna antics are notorious, but he's hailed as a creative genius. Tim Buckley...not so much. Actually, I think somebody had the balls to compare him to Robert Mugabe in this thread. Yea...if you make a legitimate argument about the comic, like criticising its art, story direction, lack of humor, that's one thing. You compare the author to an African dictator, you're not exactly showing off your massive intellect there.

 

[Plowking]

I'd liken TB and CAD to a cult leader who has built up a congregation of worshippers controlled by their leader due to their own lack of identity, in such that they need to feel they belong and are contributing something to the said cult of CAD.

TB controls the image of CAD from within his boundries as best he can - meaning mass censorship. He has to maintain his position, and will never improve or get 'funny' due to his acceptance of his current status.

That is the basis upon which CAD has been built.

 

[Stammer]

I really don't see why so many people are getting so worked-up about this. He's not bashing CAD. In fact, he barely even hints about that as a specific web comic. He's talking about comics in general.

A friend of mine read an article that was almost the same thing as Yahtzee's review, though. He showed it to me and it actually looks like Yahtzee didn't really come up with an original video here... think maybe he plagiarized?

I'll get the URL to the article if I can find it again.

 

[rebochan]

I'd liken TB and CAD to a cult leader who has built up a congregation of worshippers controlled by their leader due to their own lack of identity, in such that they need to feel they belong and are contributing something to the said cult of CAD.

I can't help but see a similar mindset reflected here. Except with the added irony that the "cult leader" is pretty hostile to the concept and expresses it at every opportunity.

TB controls the image of CAD from within his boundries as best he can - meaning mass censorship.

Oh for god's sake...when Tim Buckley starts driving little black vans up to people's houses and kidnapping dissenters and harvesting their organs in prison, you'll have a "mass censorship" argument. But I'm sorry, no matter how many times internet drama queens cry "censorship!" when their posts are locked or deleted, that still does not violate their human rights. It does make them look like crybabies though. For god's sake, it's his bandwidth. If he wants to play forum police on his space, its his right. With all the free methods of communication out there, you'd think these internet slackers would have come up with a better method than crying about it. Even John Solomon knows how to set up a blog.

He has to maintain his position, and will never improve or get 'funny' due to his acceptance of his current status.

That is the basis upon which CAD has been built.

i.e. Webcomics are Serious Business.

 

[rebochan]

I really don't see why so many people are getting so worked-up about this. He's not bashing CAD. In fact, he barely even hints about that as a specific web comic. He's talking about comics in general.

The connection is mainly made because of the mention of the miscarriage plot that made the Internet explode, and because he's written at length in the past of his hatred of CAD in much the same terms. It's not unreasonable to assume this video was a logical extension of it. Though it's also incredibly sad how with the context stripped out, he could still be talking about any number of other webcomics out there.

A friend of mine read an article that was almost the same thing as Yahtzee's review, though. He showed it to me and it actually looks like Yahtzee didn't really come up with an original video here... think maybe he plagiarized?

I'll get the URL to the article if I can find it again.

Yahtzee did put together a rather lengthy editorial on his website about CAD, and he's written about webcomics before.

 

[Plowking]

@rebochan

I love it when things are taken literally - but the parallels stand.

He can do what he wants with his comic, forum, bandwidith, whatever - but the parallels stand.

I'm simply explaining, in a way MOST people can understand, the nature of the CAD operation. It's clear, and simple, and supported by the evidence of repeated behaviour.

So now, if you understand that as intended, you can make a more intelligent post than your previous one.

 

[Stammer]

I really don't see why so many people are getting so worked-up about this. He's not bashing CAD. In fact, he barely even hints about that as a specific web comic. He's talking about comics in general.

The connection is mainly made because of the mention of the miscarriage plot that made the Internet explode, and because he's written at length in the past of his hatred of CAD in much the same terms. It's not unreasonable to assume this video was a logical extension of it. Though it's also incredibly sad how with the context stripped out, he could still be talking about any number of other webcomics out there.
That makes a lot more sense now. Though, I really don't think people should take this quite so seriously.

A friend of mine read an article that was almost the same thing as Yahtzee's review, though. He showed it to me and it actually looks like Yahtzee didn't really come up with an original video here... think maybe he plagiarized?

I'll get the URL to the article if I can find it again.

Yahtzee did put together a rather lengthy editorial on his website about CAD, and he's written about webcomics before.

It wasn't Yahtzee. It was someone else. My friend showed it to me and told me that Yahtzee must have completely ripped it off, though I'm not sure quite how true it is.