Funny events in anti-woke world

Silvanus

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The ability to incubate a child does in fact exclusively belong to the female sex.
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I'd still kind of like a proper answer regarding someone losing their reproductive organs through accident or assault. If they seek to have a surgeon recreate/reattach, your two "premises" are exactly as applicable to that scenario. By your own logic that person is being "contradictory" if they consider themselves a man and also want the surgeon to recreate/reattach a penis.
 

McElroy

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Or maybe it's none of our damn business. That's the point I'm trying to get across here. Why give a shit what someone's name is? There's no essence to a name, it's just a word we use to designate individuals. If that cashier is a Jessica, what difference does it make to you?
People communicate through their appearances, even the stuff they have no control over. What kind of a prize do you want for being above it all? Or don't answer; nobody truly is above judging appearances. Except blind people and those with neurodevelopmental conditions. Interesting speculative fiction on the topic, btw.

People can be introspective about it. I believe I am so and better off for it. I think I've elaborated enough on my position.
 

Silvanus

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People communicate through their appearances, even the stuff they have no control over. What kind of a prize do you want for being above it all? Or don't answer; nobody truly is above judging appearances.
Nobody here is actually claiming to make zero assumptions, or to draw zero conclusions from appearances. But that's not what you originally said. You were originally talking about cis- and heteronormativity: which is much more than just making personal assumptions, and steps into the realm of pressuring people to act in a certain way to abide by your own preferences.
 

XsjadoBlaydette

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I'm starting to think Foucault's Pendulum is prophecy now. For those of you who haven't read it, it's a book where a couple of friends begin making up a far reaching conspiracy theory as an intellectual exercise and partially as a joke, only for the real conspiracy nuts to get wind of it and get very, very upset that these new guys seem to know so much about the TRUTH. Hijinks Ensue.

It's written by Umberto Eco, who does a TON of research and applies it to his books(Compared to say "Dan Brown", who just cribs theories from someone else and then makes up shit to go with it), so it's actually a pretty good read as long as you're prepared for the fact that it is dense with information about history/occultism/etc. One particular bit had where one of the main characters pointed out that the drive train of a car was a dead ringer for the Sephirot, where the Kabbalist member of the group starts getting a bit concerned this might all be going a bit too far.
That sounds kinda reminiscent of Discordianism! It followed a somewhat messier but familiar arc.



 

tstorm823

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Sexes don't exist, remember. I thought you were above all our primitive notions of identity..
Sexes absolutely exist. There are distinct male and female reproductive functions. Yes, there is a lot of secondary baggage on top of those, but dismissing the baggage doesn't make the fundamental part any less real. The ability to impregnate or become pregnant are not social constructs. They are not an identity. They are physical reality, one which the continuation of the species relies on, as I've said a bunch of times.
The only reason I'm not doing it now is because I refuse to air genuine pain for the sake of your fun.
The reason you aren't talking about your personal experience is because, if I recall correctly, you've lived out exactly what I'm saying. The logical contradiction exists only in a person of one sex thinking they are innately the opposite gender, which is also the only line of thinking that leads to medically transitioning children. Nothing in my viewpoint takes any issue with people who would challenge or dismiss societal gender roles, who would choose to live outside of that binary.

Did you not begin that sort of transition, one to the other within the binary, before stopping that and settling down somewhere outside the two traditional gender roles? If I do remember your situation correctly, your lived experience is in rejecting the social categories you're claiming a person can't reject. My suggestions to someone who isn't comfortable with their gender socially is ultimately to act more like you.
I'd still kind of like a proper answer regarding someone losing their reproductive organs through accident or assault. If they seek to have a surgeon recreate/reattach, your two "premises" are exactly as applicable to that scenario. By your own logic that person is being "contradictory" if they consider themselves a man and also want the surgeon to recreate/reattach a penis.
Ignoring your picture, we're talking about people.

It's only contradictory if they continue to consider themselves a man while believing they need that penis to continue to be a man. They could consider themselves a man, but want a penis back, not because their identity relies on it but because they like having a penis. That's not a contradiction. And I've said a bunch of times: if someone wants to be the opposite sex, that's not a contradiction. If a woman wants to be a man and wants surgically constructed penis, sure, go for it. The contradiction is a person confident in their identity as a man who also thinks that surgery is medically necessary to be a man.
 

Silvanus

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Ignoring your picture, we're talking about people.
You've missed the point I was making. When I said that a relationship between two things wasn't absolute, you then swung to "unrelated". My follow-up about female/male pregnancy was specifically about that logic.

Which is true? 1) In animalia, only females can ever incubate young; or 2) In animalia, the female sex is unrelated to the ability to incubate young?

The answer is quite clearly neither.

It's only contradictory if they continue to consider themselves a man while believing they need that penis to continue to be a man. They could consider themselves a man, but want a penis back, not because their identity relies on it but because they like having a penis. That's not a contradiction. And I've said a bunch of times: if someone wants to be the opposite sex, that's not a contradiction. If a woman wants to be a man and wants surgically constructed penis, sure, go for it. The contradiction is a person confident in their identity as a man who also thinks that surgery is medically necessary to be a man.
Right. But trans people do not generally believe that a penis is necessary to be a man. You're ascribing that belief to them, but I've never actually heard it expressed by a trans person. Hence why plenty of trans people never undergo the surgery.
 

tstorm823

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You've missed the point I was making.
I didn't miss the point, I ignored it. You're not a seahorse, dummy.
Right. But trans people do not generally believe that a penis is necessary to be a man. You're ascribing that belief to them, but I've never actually heard it expressed by a trans person. Hence why plenty of trans people never undergo the surgery.
Now extend this to a hundred other things. Puberty blockers, hormone replacement, name changes... none of these things are any more necessary than a penis to be a man. If none of these things are necessary, why are doctors prescribing them? I am focusing on the extreme end of beliefs, yes, because that's the place where "we have to drug children out of puberty or they'll kill themselves" comes from.
 

Silvanus

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I didn't miss the point, I ignored it. You're not a seahorse, dummy.
If you think "you're not a seahorse" in any way addresses the argument, then that demonstrates that you have indeed missed it.

Now extend this to a hundred other things. Puberty blockers, hormone replacement, name changes... none of these things are any more necessary than a penis to be a man. If none of these things are necessary, why are doctors prescribing them?
Each of these things are associated. Not required, but associated. And some of them get prescribed because of a demonstrated improvement to quality of life and treatment satisfaction. That's really all there is to it.

I am focusing on the extreme end of beliefs, yes, because that's the place where "we have to drug children out of puberty or they'll kill themselves" comes from.
You're focusing on an "extreme" belief that you've invented and ascribed to your opponents, though, rather than one they've actually expressed. Your opponents' positions are not coming from anything resembling the reductionist waffle you've cooked up.
 

Buyetyen

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I am focusing on the extreme end of beliefs, yes, because that's the place where "we have to drug children out of puberty or they'll kill themselves" comes from.
In other words, you make shit up.

This is not an isolated incident dude. You have a history of painting anyone who disagrees with you as a psychotic extremist who does stuff just because. You can't meaningfully engage with this topic because you have zero interest in learning the truth.
 
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XsjadoBlaydette

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Vox Populi, Vox Dei
Hah! Hoo shit. Well, this does more than confirm Chappelle is just an out of touch rich old dude coasting on his past laurels. Or Musk's paycheck was too juicy to ignore. Likely both. Attacking his audience for not fawning over Musk by implying they're poor, then to comparing them to civil unrest using the pejorative rhetoric the republicans use when trying to smear protesters before just resorting to an old fashioned witless "shut the fuck up" is a pretty fucking big tell he's comfortably cemented himself fully in the walled, gated community gardens of Elysium, leaving aside why anyone would think having Musk on stage there would be a good idea in the first place. Is a sad state of affairs tbh.

Anyway, with these guy's voiced opinions on "free speech" I am incredibly curious what they think of Musk just flat out deleting/permabanning people's profiles who shared these inspirational videos on twitter. Along with all the other banning of personal criticism and shit he's doing like loudly courting qanon crowds becaue of fucking course: all the talentless grifters float towards there. Masks are slipping.
 
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BrawlMan

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Vox Populi, Vox Dei
Looks like Dave Chappelle became another biatch in a box stand, willing to love his corporate overlords. You don't like Trump and his crazy fanatics, but you're willing to give Elon Musk a chance. Who is a said Trump fan boy, simp, and an egotistical tyrant when nothing better to do with his life.
 
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