Ukraine

[CM156]

their schism is essentially ecclesiastical rather than theological

I would argue the dispute is equal parts ecclesiastical and theological, because those two are hard to separate from one another. Also there's the whole Filioque dispute which is a 100% theological issue.

All Protestants are viewed as theologically off-course by the Catholic Church, and I presume therefore also by the Orthodox, although I don't think the Orthodox have ever cared that much to make statements about it.

Interesting history behind that.

 

[Ag3ma]

I would argue the dispute is equal parts ecclesiastical and theological, because those two are hard to separate from one another. Also there's the whole Filioque dispute which is a 100% theological issue.

The Filioque clause is something of an issue, but many believe it is theologically trivial: notably, the Orthodox Church has never officially declared it heretical, and the Catholics can't deny that the official position of the early church councils was to omit it. Its severity is more historical, wildly overblown by the antagonistic decay of Eastern-Western relations in the early medieval period. Interestingly, I think Protestant churches that believe in ecumenical tradition side with the Orthodox position and also omit it on the grounds it should have been decided by ecumenical council.

 

[tstorm823]

The Roman Catholic Church recognizes all the sacraments of Orthodox Churches. It does not do the same for Protestant sacraments, only sometimes baptism. That's pretty illustrative of where the actual theological divides are.

 

[Chimpzy]

I was worried that once the war was over, Ukraine would have to go through an extensive demining operation

... but seems the Russians are doing it for them. How considerate.


Less funny

 

[Thaluikhain]

I could certainly see an argument, given that it's presumably the Ukranian military that is filming them, that they absolutely don't want to stop and make themselves a stationary target for Ukranian artillery, and accepting some vehicles losses as a lesser evil.

Excepting that they seem to be on an open plain and I don't know why they'd not try going round? Worried that the minefield is wide, but hoping it's not deep?

 

[Dalisclock]

I was worried that once the war was over, Ukraine would have to go through an extensive demining operation

... but seems the Russians are doing it for them. How considerate.


Less funny

I mean, that's one way of clearing a minefield. A very expensive and inefficient way, but eventually you'll clear a path. You just may not have any tanks left by the time you're through.

Russia, I pose my question to you in meme form.

Excepting that they seem to be on an open plain and I don't know why they'd not try going round? Worried that the minefield is wide, but hoping it's not deep?

Maybe someone told them the minefield was like a Bethesda game "Wide an an ocean, deep as a puddle"?

 

[Chimpzy]

I mean, that's one way of clearing a minefield. A very expensive and inefficient way, but eventually you'll clear a path. You just may not have any tanks left by the time you're through.

Murphy's Laws of Combat #6: If it's stupid, but it works, then it's not stupid

Of course these Russian troops got their own version "Dmitri's Guidelines for Becoming Hero of Glorious Soviet Union" ( it might be a little out of date). Their #6 is "Step on mine and become hero of glorious Soviet Union'. Most of them are like that.

 

[BrawlMan]

Of course these Russian troops got their own version "Dmitri's Guidelines for Becoming Hero of Glorious Soviet Union" ( it might be a little out of date). Their #6 is "Step on mine and become hero of glorious Soviet Union'. Most of them are like that.

​

 

[Dalisclock]

Murphy's Laws of Combat #6: If it's stupid, but it works, then it's not stupid

Of course these Russian troops got their own version "Dmitri's Guidelines for Becoming Hero of Glorious Soviet Union" ( it might be a little out of date). Their #6 is "Step on mine and become hero of glorious Soviet Union'. Most of them are like that.

For all the man's faults(and he had many), Patton(allegedly) had a particularly good counter.

No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

I was worried that once the war was over, Ukraine would have to go through an extensive demining operation

... but seems the Russians are doing it for them. How considerate.

I'm waiting for our resident apologist to tell us how this footage is deepfaked, since Glorious Leader Putin would never, ever, EVER send out barely-trained, poorly-led working-class Russian men to die solely for the sake of his ego.

 

[Dalisclock]

I'm waiting for our resident apologist to tell us how this footage is deepfaked, since Glorious Leader Putin would never, ever, EVER send out barely-trained, poorly-led working-class Russian men to die solely for the sake of his ego.

Something Something the US nuked Japan something something Central American coups something something.

 

[Ag3ma]

I was worried that once the war was over, Ukraine would have to go through an extensive demining operation

... but seems the Russians are doing it for them. How considerate.

Oh. Oh wow. That is... astonishing.

The one where they try to go round that already knocked-out tank feels like an RPG game where there's a large scorch mark and a corpse in the dungeon, as a clear signal to any player with half a brain "CHECK FOR TRAPS!" I can excuse the first AFV that tried to go round it, but the minute that went pop, the others should have stopped or reversed out the way they came.

 

[Satinavian]

Really looks like they lost too many experienced tank crews in the beginning of the war. Well you can't mothball/retrieve drivers the same way as you can tanks.

 

[CM156]

Something Something the US nuked Japan something something Central American coups something something.

Fellas, fellas.
I don't think you truly understand that the USA has done bad things, too. So our only option is to let Russia do bad things.

 

[Dalisclock]

Really looks like they lost too many experienced tank crews in the beginning of the war. Well you can't mothball/retrieve drivers the same way as you can tanks.

*Russian Necromancy program intensifies*

Initial results have been encouraging.


I'm not sorry.

 

[Dalisclock]

Oh. Oh wow. That is... astonishing.

The one where they try to go round that already knocked-out tank feels like an RPG game where there's a large scorch mark and a corpse in the dungeon, as a clear signal to any player with half a brain "CHECK FOR TRAPS!" I can excuse the first AFV that tried to go round it, but the minute that went pop, the others should have stopped or reversed out the way they came.

I remember playing Steel Panthers as a kid and doing stupid shit like driving my tanks into buildings to get at the infantry ambushes(which disables the tanks for the rest of the mission). Keep in mind I was a kid playing a computer game and not a presumably trained soldier whose life was actually on the line in a tank.

 

[Dalisclock]

Russian army has lost up to half of key battle tanks, analysts estimate

Experts say Moscow has large number of cold-war era models in storage so can continue war in Ukraine for some time

www.theguardian.com

Using this source because it's not paywalled but it's been picked up by other outlets as well.

While Russia has a massive numerical advantage over Ukraine has as far as armored vehicles go, losing 40%-50% of your more modern MBT forces in a year is bad. Cataphoric even. I believe the proper term might be Pyrrhic.

I've also seen suggestions that 80% of Russian ground forces are currently committed to the Ukraine war at this point and it looks like they're currently pushing an offensive in the Donbass.

My personal opinion is that if Russia can't force a breakthrough in the next month or so, they're not going to be able to if they keep taking losses at this rate. If they can't use their T-72's and T-80's properly, throwing more Retrofitted T-64's into the mix isn't going to do them much good. Doubly so considering more modern western tanks will be arriving over the next year or so and T-64's are going to have a harder time against those.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Russian army has lost up to half of key battle tanks, analysts estimate

Experts say Moscow has large number of cold-war era models in storage so can continue war in Ukraine for some time

www.theguardian.com

Using this source because it's not paywalled but it's been picked up by other outlets as well.

While Russia has a massive numerical advantage over Ukraine has as far as armored vehicles go, losing 40%-50% of your more modern MBT forces in a year is bad. Cataphoric even. I believe the proper term might be Pyrrhic.

I've also seen suggestions that 80% of Russian ground forces are currently committed to the Ukraine war at this point and it looks like they're currently pushing an offensive in the Donbass.

My personal opinion is that if Russia can't force a breakthrough in the next month or so, they're not going to be able to if they keep taking losses at this rate.

I came across an interesting idea a while ago, suppose that the Russian leadership recognised the problems they had with the quality of their troops early on in the war and took some units off the line for intensive training, while keeping others fighting until they were ready. In theory, we could see a suddenly influx of competent Russian forces at an time now.

No idea if this is something they may have done, though.

 

[Dalisclock]

I came across an interesting idea a while ago, suppose that the Russian leadership recognised the problems they had with the quality of their troops early on in the war and took some units off the line for intensive training, while keeping others fighting until they were ready. In theory, we could see a suddenly influx of competent Russian forces at an time now.

No idea if this is something they may have done, though.

I mean, it's entirely possible that true.

OTOH, Russian elite units have been getting thoroughly chewed up throughout this war, despite some people trying to claim that Russia is holding back their best units for.....something. Among them the 1st guards tank army, which apparently is supposed to be one of thier best, got gutted last year. I've also been hearing stuff that the VDV(paratroopers) have also been taking heavy losses as well. So unless Russia has changed their Training/operating MO, who knows if that will make any difference.

Russia may have lost an entire elite brigade near a Donetsk coal-mining town

‘Almost the entire brigade has already been destroyed near Vuhledar,’ Ukrainian official says.

www.politico.eu

A Hundred Wrecked Tanks In A Hundred Hours: Ukraine Guts Russia’s Best Tank Army

The Ukrainian army’s counteroffensive around the city of Kharkiv in northeastern Ukraine starting on Sept. 6 destroyed half of the best tank division in the best tank army in the Russian armed forces.

www.forbes.com

A hundred wrecked or captured tanks in a hundred furious hours. That’s how much destruction the Ukrainians inflicted on the Russian 4th Guards Tank Division, part of the elite 1st Guards Tank Army, the Russian army’s best armor formation.


Now the 1st GTA is retreating north in order to preserve what remains of its front-line divisions. But the damage the tank army has suffered could have lasting implications—and not just for Russia’s 200-day-old wider war in Ukraine.


The 1st GTA “had been one of the most prestigious of Russia’s armies, allocated for the defense of Moscow, and intended to lead counterattacks in the case of a war with NATO,” the U.K. Defense Ministry explained. “It will likely take years for Russia to rebuild this capability.”

 

[Dalisclock]

Just gonna leave this here for no particular reason.


I'm not sure Dark Comedy does this justice. Is there a term that encompasses both "Funny" and "Horrifying Tragedy"?