A few thoughts about January 6, 2021

[Breakdown]

Then I'll ask you in all fairness... if you're not willing to do more than surface research of a subject and use that as an excuse on not having anything else to say when pressed, why voice an opinion?

I've gone over this sentiment several times in efforts to not make it sound rude. I really did. But it never came out right. I'm really not trying to be rude, but I don't know how else to phrase this. So apologies beforehand.

There are a TON of things that UK people here post about the UK and the like. And I really have not enough information to comment. So I don't. I sit back, I read a little, and I try to absorb.

It would be like me voicing an opinion on Boris Johnson simply due because he looks like the British Donald Trump. Given that every once and a while he does a cock-up that makes the news here, and then I'll wade into any conversation with the UK forum members and slag on Johnson as if it adds something to the conversation.

Respond in kind? Do you even know about the Occupation of Malheur National Wildlife Refuge? Where a rancher and his militia buddies took over a federal building for 40 days in efforts to 'get federal land turned back into the hands of the people' in January 2016? And who did a similar thing two years prior?

How about the El Paso shootings, where an alt-right radicalized boy took a rifle and ended the lives of 23 people in 2019?

If we're going to stick to BLM protests, what about the Boogaloo Bois who were arrested for actually being the ones who shot up the Minn. Police station? Or the Three Percenters? or Possibly the Hell's Angels Biker Gang?

Or, you know. The nearly 1000 accounts of Police Brutality during the Protests against Police Brutality. It would be funny if it wasn't tragic.

We can go on and on and on about how the alt-right has been the face of terrorism in the country for too long to count. And if BLM is modeling their efforts and protests to what came prior.... well, we're very lucky they are doing such a bad job at it. If you care to actually look through our history, you'll see that the American Right has a lot of time for Alt-Right Provocateurs. Bundy is still a good example. Or how conservatives backed and cheered when Provocateurs staged an Armed Siege on Michigan's state Capitol... or when militias plotted to kidnap the Governor of Michigan

Oh, here's a fun thing! That Armed Siege happened May 14th 2020. George Floyd was killed May 26th 2020. A whole twelve days before the Armed Siege. So, it really does look like the Left was 'learning' from the Alt-Right.

What you are doing is taking a bit of information due to what seems like personal bias and stopping there, with an opinion that is only half formed but seems good enough for you. This is exactly how people get radicalized. I don't know you from Adam or Eve, but taking time to voice a half baked opinion and then stating it's based on what one could consider an apathetic attempt to gather and delineate 'information' leaves me wondering what is the point of trying to be a part of a conversation when you're admittedly not that interested in it? Or are not prepared to engage it in good faith?

I generally don't get involved in threads about US politics, but as I said I have watched the news. And I know about history. This isn't in the same league as 9/11. And it was pretty predictable, based on the events of the past year.

Perhaps I'll have more to add to the discussion when I'm fully radicalised though, eh?

 

[ObsidianJones]

I generally don't get involved in threads about US politics, but as I said I have watched the news. And I know about history. This isn't in the same league as 9/11. And it was pretty predictable, based on the events of the past year.

Perhaps I'll have more to add to the discussion when I'm fully radicalised though, eh?

Once again, I'm talking about an event that hasn't happened on American Soil for an untold number of years. Decades. Generations. Who knows. I've mentioned that a number of times.

But hey, I can wait until until that time when you get fully radicalized. Or you don't have to. Both are decent options. Conversations will be nicer if you don't, I suspect.

 

[deleted20220709]

DELETED

 

[CriticalGaming]

I feel like this is poignant.


But you know...I dunno nothing.

 

[happyninja42]

Once again, I'm talking about an event that hasn't happened on American Soil for an untold number of years. Decades. Generations. Who knows. I've mentioned that a number of times.

The last time someone attacked the capital was, sometime around 1804-1817 I think? I've seen it mentioned in a few videos related to the events in DC.

 

[Agema]

Trump must be the most gutless, hypocritical coward that ever existed. Even for delusional conspiracy nutjobs it makes you wonder how they keep worshipping this turd.

He's just utterly self-centred. When you're useful to him, he lavishes attention like you're his favourite person in the world. When you're not, he drops you like a snotty rag.

But like a kicked dog, they'll still come back to him.

 

[Kwak]

I feel like this is poignant.


But you know...I dunno nothing.

Is that guy pro-trump now or something? Or is he just being 'edgy'?

 

[CriticalGaming]

Is that guy pro-trump now or something? Or is he just being 'edgy'?

I've only seen a couple of his videos so I couldn't tell you. I think he is just satirizing the heavy-handedly left lean the media has taken over the past few years. But I am not sure, it's amusing though and he does point out facts that I think a lot miss, so take it however you will I guess.

 

[Worgen]

I'm pretty sure the reason any of this is happening is because people are bored, angry, and have no outlet to release their stress because of all the lock-downs. That's why the riots happened earlier last year, and that's why this happened, because people are out of work, have free time on their hands and nothing better to do than go to rallies and marches and spend all day listening to youtube conspiracy theories.

This wasn't an organized attack on democracy, this was a mob of idiots who got worked up but didn't know what to do once they got into the building because I don't think any of them actually expected to get that far.

This wasn't an organized attack, this was just a mob of idiots, but trump literally told them to do it and they did.

 

[Houseman]

This wasn't an organized attack, this was just a mob of idiots, but trump literally told them to do it and they did.

Oh and BLM was there, too, inside the Capitol, let's not forget that.

BLM activist inside Capitol claims he was 'documenting' riots, once said 'burn it all down'

A Black Lives Matter activist and former Olympic speed skater who entered the Capitol Building Wednesday alongside a mob of pro-Trump protesters said Thursday he wanted to “document” the events as they unfolded.

www.foxnews.com

 

[Kwak]

Oh and BLM was there, too, inside the Capitol, let's not forget that.

BLM activist inside Capitol claims he was 'documenting' riots, once said 'burn it all down'

A Black Lives Matter activist and former Olympic speed skater who entered the Capitol Building Wednesday alongside a mob of pro-Trump protesters said Thursday he wanted to “document” the events as they unfolded.

www.foxnews.com

ok

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

Yes, clearly that proves Ol' Joe Biden is more leftist than Antifa, and will start building gulags in no time. But please, tell me more about The Left always exaggerating things.

Also: You argue for changing minds if conspiracy theorist(i assume) in one post, and condemn "deprogramming" in another? What's the difference between the two in your mind?

Also, also: Are you against reconcillation with Trumpists? Cause i wouldn't necessarily disagree...

As I said it depends not on Biden but on factions in his party and how strongly he feels he has to give them what they want over what he wants.

I argue that such things wouldn't be actually good if they're controlled by the more extreme elements you wouldn't be de-programming anymore than China's camps are de-programming Uighur muslims really. It's just trying to replace one set of programming with another or acting to punish people.

The same with truth and reconciliation councils it can depend who controls it because they can rule how they want. Some people vehemently hate Trump so all actual fake news about him could be deemed to be true by such a court regardless of reality. If it were actually about bridging the divide then t would be good but the concern is who is calling for it because they seem it more as a way to make their truth official regardless of the actual truth.

E.G. Tump and the coy carp or Trump and the claims of him stealing a childs hat.

 

[BrawlMan]

I've only seen a couple of his videos so I couldn't tell you. I think he is just satirizing the heavy-handedly left lean the media has taken over the past few years. But I am not sure, it's amusing though and he does point out facts that I think a lot miss, so take it however you will I guess.

He might as well go after the heavy leaning right too, while he's at it. I don't like a lot of news channels in general, but at least left leaning news networks like CNN try. I can't say the same for Fox news will paint criminal actions in a positive or glorious light. I say this but I'm not a fan of CNN either. Or just plain outright lie that's already there.

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

About 375k. They will reach 400k before Trump leaves office. Almost 4K deaths per day

But, you know, its just a seasonal flu

Meanwhile, I'm going into lockdown for 3 days over 1 case

Yeh

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/03/bill-de-blasio-had-his-worst-week-as-new-york-city-mayor.html

With De Blasio's Blessing, NYC Nightlife Still Buzzing Despite Pleas To Self-Isolate

“The corona thing doesn’t seem to have really hit anyone yet.”

gothamist.com

But hey remember earlier this year where wearing a mask was being claimed by some to be a sign you were racist against Chinese people because the virus was all fear mongering etc

Glad we're past all that now

 

[crimson5pheonix]

 

[Worgen]

Oh and BLM was there, too, inside the Capitol, let's not forget that.

BLM activist inside Capitol claims he was 'documenting' riots, once said 'burn it all down'

A Black Lives Matter activist and former Olympic speed skater who entered the Capitol Building Wednesday alongside a mob of pro-Trump protesters said Thursday he wanted to “document” the events as they unfolded.

www.foxnews.com

And?

 

[Kwak]

With De Blasio's Blessing, NYC Nightlife Still Buzzing Despite Pleas To Self-Isolate

“The corona thing doesn’t seem to have really hit anyone yet.”

gothamist.com

But hey remember earlier this year where wearing a mask was being claimed by some to be a sign you were racist against Chinese people because the virus was all fear mongering etc

No?

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

If you plan to overturn an election result, getting the facts right about whether the election was objectively fraudulent is kind of important. There is no adequate evidence the election was fraudulent. Mass delusion is not adequate justification to storm the Capitol. At least to reasonable people.

See I agree with you that the election result likely didn't change due to fraud.
I do think there's a point to be made about the partisanship and positioning on show though. People claiming the election was 100% free of Fraud when you can actually fairly easily find reports of people charged with election fraud (and I have posted them before).
There is very much a case for looking into election security and checking for fraud but now it's not Trump winning and they can claim the Russians were behind the fraud it's not of any political interest to some because it's not about positions but partisan lines.
I think it was Tulsi Gabbard who said there was very much lines in the USA where the parties would happily vote down a bill saying something when the oppositive put it forward but then propose the exact same thing themselves and vote for it just because it was their side proposing it.

When some parts of the media are saying conclusively there was 0 fraud and yet you can point to actual cases of people being convicted of fraud it creates one hell of a dissonance and distrust that is easy to exploit because there are actual lies being told and look people can see that lie so the person pointing out said lie can then claim they are telling the truth even if they too are lying because who will call out said lie? The media who can't be trusted because they were just shown to have lied

They weren't even defending the constitution. The states have rights to choose their candidate and send their electors. Even Trump himself has been trying to utilise that, by badgering state politicians to overturn their state vote and return electors for him via legislative writ. If you think something is wrong with Pennsylvania's vote, you storm the Pennsylvania capitol. But that's much less showy, isn't it?


Rhetoric matters for this reason. Why do people believe the election was fraudulent, despite the fact no-one has shown any significant objective evidence? The answer is: rhetoric. We wouldn't be here if Trump and his political and media allies hadn't spent months making so many people doubtful and fearful of election fraud. Those fears have been ramped up vastly beyond the obervable reality of fraud, historical or current. That's why you're filling up a thread with claims, having completely lost perspective on how reliable the evidence is. That's why the circle of distrust has expanded from the Democrats and state election officials to judges, to state Republican officials, to federal politicians, SCOTUS, and even by now the vice president.

This is what Tstorm pointed out with the story about the conspiracy theorist. The facts are a minor component to many people's beliefs. They need a much bigger and wider psychological push to move them.

We wouldn't be here if the media had not decided in 2016 to spin the narrative Trump won by fraud and Russian interference and that he wasn't a legitimate president. I think I even said back then, investigate the Russian claims but it might turn out to basically be nothing but chasing ghosts.

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

And?

I mean yeh, though a BLM hardcore Trump supporter not that common a thing I'd think.

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

Yeah, someone like that is supposed to be charismatic and a master orator or something. That someone gets to be Cartoon Evil President by basically just turning up is embarrassing.

As I said before in some threads. Trump is because people think they've been abandoned and or are actively detested by certain people.

E.G. People like Robert Chipman who goes on a sort of rant at the start of one of his latest video


A lot of "The coastal people are just your betters accept it because they're richer and that makes them smarter".

Seriously how much American Media have you seen where most of the people in some small town are backwards hicks or monsters or stereotypes of some extremely religious pearl clutchers wanting to censor things and burn books?

I can probably name a fair few. It's basically a trope in it's own right at this point.

It's one of the sort of reasons I think Biden's idea of trying to reach out and heal the divide is a good idea if he actually means heal it. The issue being some of the more extreme people, the ones who spent months on about how flyover state people are worthless and stupid because they choose not to just move (Let them eat cake anyone?) have been very much saying the only way for things to heal is for people to kneel and do what they say otherwise they won't accept it and they're not willing to compromise at all because why should they compromise with inferior plebeians who just won't accept being told what to do by their "obvious betters"?

Compare Beautiful Creatures small town Hysteria about Witchcraft stuff


To Stargirl's Blue Valley