Bioware are getting really lazy as of late. (Possible Mass Effect 2 spoilers)

[DarthInfernus]

Even with your skewed down numbers of the weapon count, so way to fail at whining by the way, it's still considerably more weapons than four. No assault rifle or pistol or whatever acted any differently than any other, they just heated up faster and did more damage. So much better than actually having a variety of weapon types even within a weapon type to suit one's playstyle right? Oh wait.

The gameplay was more dynamic and difficult in the first? Are you stupid? The only reason it was more difficult was because it was LESS dynamic. Oh, until I have 6 or 7 skill points in a particular gun, balancing out point spending with guns, powers, skills needed to EVEN OPEN A FUCKING BOX, and charm and intimidate by the way, I can't even shoot straight. So let me clear this up. Commander Shepard, N7 super elite space marine, hero of the Skyllian Blitz/Torfan/sole survivor of a Thresher Maw, can't fucking shoot straight until 1/4 through the game? Makes perfect sense.

I played an Infiltrator in my first playthrough, and it was so easy because I could just snipe every goddamn idiot that shot at me. Yeah that's more difficult than actually having to conserve sniper ammo for when I need it. But then I played an Adept and OH THE AGONY. Instead of the nice universal 3-6 second cooldown so I can pump out powers at a nice steady rate, they have entire minute cooldowns each? The hell? So I can spam out a few powers and be helpless for AN ENTIRE GODDAMN MINUTE, or barely use any at all. So dynamic and fast paced.

Let's see, side missions, you like to point out the most boring ones in ME2 to make a point, so let's use the same heavy-handed skewed views on you! Scanning the Keepers for Chorban, yes, that was just a blast. Really interactive, emotional, and deep, that quest was. Oh, and collecting a bunch of stupid medallions for fuck-all reason. Hm, cookie cutter warehouse A, military base B, or camp with somehow the exact same tent setup as every other camp C. So unique. With the exact same unskippable scene of dropping the Mako on random planet D which somehow lands in the EXACT SAME FASHION every time.

And as for recruiting your team, there was practically NO character development or anything at all before all but one member of your party joined up in the first half hour of the game, and their personal missions were uninvolved and bland. Yes, side missions that give me more insight into the personality, motivations, and history of my teammates are lazy. More character development is bad.

Short Version: YAFM. (cookie for reference) I hope BioWare never takes a word of what you say to heart. For then we've lost the last great RPG developer out there.

 

[Vanguard_Ex]

ME2 was a failed renaissance of gameplay elements. This is not new.

Thank you for providing absolutely no interesting discussion to my post whatsoever. I wasn't whingeing about them "dumbing" things down and completely changing the game (like other people)
My viewpoint (if you had bothered to read) was whether or not you think Bioware are just getting lazy of late, and just riding their success of an already successful IP).

Well done for noticing he was supporting your point of view...

 

[Avatar Roku]

Actually, an imported level 60 does let you start as level 5. It also gives you 10,000 of every element and some amount of money I forgot (because you get a much bigger monetary bonus for importing a rich character).

And BTW the mineral thing also happens after you've beaten ME2 once. And it's 50,000 of each resource and 200,000 credits

No, you get different amounts for beating the game. For level 60, it's what I said above, it's less for lower level characters, and it's 100,000 credits for importing a rich character.

 

[Insideout Ink Demon]

The final choice also struck me as total bullshit, they really expect me to blow up all that Reaper tech when it could hold the key to resisting indoctrination, since it probably contains data on how Reapers work in the first place?! Are they kidding? Every important industrialized nation on Earth was trying to build a nuclear weapon during WWII, I wonder if ME 2's writer(s) have any clue why? (Hint it's not because they were evil.) There didn't seem to be this moral dilemma for the Turians when they carted off Sovereign's main gun and figured out how to make a miniature version of it, which you promptly bolt onto Normandy presumably because it kills things better.

The fact Shepard was focused on completing a potentially suicidal mission, was at the point of finalising the plan with the destruction of the enemy base, then is told to change the plan at the last possible moment, I think probably made it quite realistic to have doubts in Shepard's mind, especially if the player/Shepard did not trust the Illusive man with such tech.

 

[DevilSShadoW]

i think bioware went to the opposite side of the gaming genre spectrum with ME2 because they wanted to experiment. They want to know what worked and didn't with the 1st ME, what worked and didn't with the 2nd so they can make an amazing 3rd which makes perfect sense. Sure the game was not perfect. But it damn well is the best game i've played in the past 2 years.

 

[SextusMaximus]

So they are not be lazy, you just pointed out the flaws.

Now I'm not an authority on this, as I don't even have the game - but you said they were lazy but the game had excellent story writing as usual. Now perhaps the game was based on the story writing more so than gameplay, and from what I've heard, the gameplay is also very good.

But as I said, I'm not an authority on this - so I wouldn't know.

 

[WINDOWCLEAN2]

I think you may have had either a foreign or broken disc.

Mine had no spelling errors or glitches throughout and the guns only mattered if you didnt make full use of the biotic powers (which there were more of) so i think it may be that you just didn't utalise the game in an enjoyable way

 

[Daedalus1942]

What say you, Escapists? Are Bioware getting lazy as of late (provide examples) or am I just nitpicking on little things?

You are just nitpicking on a lot of little things. Also, a few of your points are outright not true. For instance:

They took out the inventory system and micromanaging of mods and upgrades completely, gave you 3 shotguns (one of which only Grunt can use, 2 sniper rifles, 2 smg's, 2 pistols and 2 assault rifles ( 3 IF you bought the Collector's edition).

It's 4 Snipers, 4 Shotguns (and the player can use Grunt's shotgun as well), 2 SMGs, 2 Pistols, 5 Assault Rifles and you left out Heavy Weapons. This is in contrast to the FOUR weapons total that ME1 had. But yeah, it would be nice to have mods back.

Beyond that, the rest of your post is either nitpicking about minor things (spelling in a few subtitles, really? Let's ignore the excellent voicework and focus on a few spelling errors...) or simply your personal prefference.

For instance, the Recruitment and Loyalty missions that you discount so easily are in my opinion awesome. There's plenty of variety in them and they serve to make the characters deeper and get you to care about them more. Mordin's Loyalty mission is especially thought-provoking IMO. These missions are as much a part of the game as the "main" story is.

Overall, I'm sorry you didn't like the game, but I also think you're watching the first one through rose-colored goggles and ignoring its glaring flaws, many of which the second game fixes. Yes, there is still room for improvement, but overall ME2 is a superior game to ME1. You have every right to disagree, but I have every right to think you're wrong.

I didn't ***** about the characters at all. I bitched about the lazy introductions of the characters from the first game (if you'd bothered to read) and the lame sidequests they made you complete for your previous crew members. I actually thought the new crewmembers were fleshed out quite well and that wasn't my ***** about it. My problem was the game was literally collecting your teammates and then thhe suicide mission.
There was no underlying plot this time just "Collect people to fight for you and then possibly die defending the whole galaxy."

 

[Doug]

I liked Mass Effect 2. A lot. There really wasn't much I could find wrong with the game. In my eyes you are just nitpicking, but we all have our opinions.


Oh, and in response to your comment about the final boss,

Spoiler

It's just basically a reaper fetus, which explains why it's powers don't compare to Sovereign's

Agreed on both counts.

Some of the "flaws" you mentioned were things I either loved or didn't care about, and the rest I never experienced. At all.

In my opinion, Mass Effect 2 was an interactive masterpiece.

Agreed.

 

[Daedalus1942]

I think you may have had either a foreign or broken disc.

Mine had no spelling errors or glitches throughout and the guns only mattered if you didnt make full use of the biotic powers (which there were more of) so i think it may be that you just didn't utalise the game in an enjoyable way

I bought the Collector's Edition from EB Games. I broke my rule of never shopping there for that game, and it disappointed me in many ways. My disc was not foreign. Play through again, I dare you. There were a crap load of spellings errors in ME2 and hardly any in Dragon age.
It's like they fobbed off their best IP to work on a new IP no-one had heard of. Yes, dragon age was good (though a bit long in the tooth) but they didn't need to abandon the quality of ME2 to make DA:O good...

 

[Jandau]

I didn't ***** about the characters at all. I bitched about the lazy introductions of the characters from the first game (if you'd bothered to read) and the lame sidequests they made you complete for your previous crew members. I actually thought the new crewmembers were fleshed out quite well and that wasn't my ***** about it. My problem was the game was literally collecting your teammates and then thhe suicide mission.
There was no underlying plot this time just "Collect people to fight for you and then possibly die defending the whole galaxy."

What sidequests for previous crew members? Liara had that optional Hacking quest, but that was pretty much that.

And what do you mean there was no plot this time? It's like saying ME1 was just "Chase Saren around for a while"...

 

[Doug]

I didn't ***** about the characters at all. I bitched about the lazy introductions of the characters from the first game (if you'd bothered to read) and the lame sidequests they made you complete for your previous crew members. I actually thought the new crewmembers were fleshed out quite well and that wasn't my ***** about it. My problem was the game was literally collecting your teammates and then thhe suicide mission.
There was no underlying plot this time just "Collect people to fight for you and then possibly die defending the whole galaxy."

What sidequests for previous crew members? Liara had that optional Hacking quest, but that was pretty much that.

And what do you mean there was no plot this time? It's like saying ME1 was just "Chase Saren around for a while"...

Agreed. Really, I don't see where all this bitching is coming from. Well, aside from the standard level of internet bitching about anything that dares to be released. Ironically, this technically means Duke Nuke'm forever has had the least hated heaped on it for any video game in the whole of gaming history

 

[Daedalus1942]

I didn't ***** about the characters at all. I bitched about the lazy introductions of the characters from the first game (if you'd bothered to read) and the lame sidequests they made you complete for your previous crew members. I actually thought the new crewmembers were fleshed out quite well and that wasn't my ***** about it. My problem was the game was literally collecting your teammates and then thhe suicide mission.
There was no underlying plot this time just "Collect people to fight for you and then possibly die defending the whole galaxy."

What sidequests for previous crew members? Liara had that optional Hacking quest, but that was pretty much that.

And what do you mean there was no plot this time? It's like saying ME1 was just "Chase Saren around for a while"...

Once again.... read.
I said no UNDERLYING plot. In the first there were a few, with Saren, the Geth, and Cerberus's own machinations (not to mention the Alliance's motives).
In the second game there was literally none of that. NOTHING else besides collecting your party members, and going out to obliterate the Collectors. The closest they came to fleshing it out more was the inclusion of the "Heretic" Geth, and the other Geth being non-hostile towards shepherd.

 

[Jandau]

I didn't ***** about the characters at all. I bitched about the lazy introductions of the characters from the first game (if you'd bothered to read) and the lame sidequests they made you complete for your previous crew members. I actually thought the new crewmembers were fleshed out quite well and that wasn't my ***** about it. My problem was the game was literally collecting your teammates and then thhe suicide mission.
There was no underlying plot this time just "Collect people to fight for you and then possibly die defending the whole galaxy."

What sidequests for previous crew members? Liara had that optional Hacking quest, but that was pretty much that.

And what do you mean there was no plot this time? It's like saying ME1 was just "Chase Saren around for a while"...

Once again.... read.
I said no UNDERLYING plot. In the first there were a few, with Saren, the Geth, and Cerberus's own machinations (not to mention the Alliance's motives).
In the second game there was literally none of that. NOTHING else besides collecting your party members, and going out to obliterate the Collectors. The closest they came to fleshing it out more was the inclusion of the "Heretic" Geth, and the other Geth being non-hostile towards shepherd.

I did read, and I still don't see your point.

Dark Energy, Quarians VS Geth, future of Krogan, Cerberus' long term goals, etc. etc. There were tons of plot threads and hooks. The fact that you choose to ignore them isn't the game's fault and not my problem.

 

[Daedalus1942]

I understand that but it doesn't really explain the significance of why they were building what they built. The thing was massive. It would have made more sense for the final boss to be about the same size as Shepherd and possibly even look similar (or Identical?) Now that would have been GREAT Storytelling!.

Maybe, but it would have been a pretty anti-climactic boss fight...

'Not just any Reaper, a human reaper....' Cue musical crescendo... DEN DEN DEEEEN...

Shepard and crew burst out laughing at the tiny terminator with no legs.

Yeah... no I was referring to the Utimate Reaper being a clone of Shepherd with the powers a reaper has. That would be lethal and no-one would have seen that coming if they had done that. If it was the same size as a human and identical to shepherd in every way think about it. It could easily indoctrinate anyone in the galaxy.

 

[Daedalus1942]

I didn't ***** about the characters at all. I bitched about the lazy introductions of the characters from the first game (if you'd bothered to read) and the lame sidequests they made you complete for your previous crew members. I actually thought the new crewmembers were fleshed out quite well and that wasn't my ***** about it. My problem was the game was literally collecting your teammates and then thhe suicide mission.
There was no underlying plot this time just "Collect people to fight for you and then possibly die defending the whole galaxy."

What sidequests for previous crew members? Liara had that optional Hacking quest, but that was pretty much that.

And what do you mean there was no plot this time? It's like saying ME1 was just "Chase Saren around for a while"...

Once again.... read.
I said no UNDERLYING plot. In the first there were a few, with Saren, the Geth, and Cerberus's own machinations (not to mention the Alliance's motives).
In the second game there was literally none of that. NOTHING else besides collecting your party members, and going out to obliterate the Collectors. The closest they came to fleshing it out more was the inclusion of the "Heretic" Geth, and the other Geth being non-hostile towards shepherd.

I did read, and I still don't see your point.

Dark Energy, Quarians VS Geth, future of Krogan, Cerberus' long term goals, etc. etc. There were tons of plot threads and hooks. The fact that you choose to ignore them isn't the game's fault and not my problem.

Dark energy was mentioned in two fucking quests (now you're nitpicking). Also the Quarian Vs Geth is established in every single game (and book) and was part of a crewmember's sidequest. The future of Krogan was barely skimmed on apart from the creation and welcoming of Grunt into the Urdnot clan. I didn't ignore these things. They were nowhere near as big as some of the plots for sidequests in the first game.
The first game had better writing and the second game is just picking up your team members and killing the Collectors, end of story.

 

[LiquidGrape]

The fundamental story of Mass Effect is a real travesty. What people mistake for a brilliant plot is actually the inspired setting and decent writing.
Think about it. Giant sentient machines allow organic life to reach a predetermined level of technological and cultural sophistication, and then wipe them out for no other apparent reason than being the token bad guys.
- Motivation? Qui vadis?
Overall, Mass Effect 2 felt to me like a very constrained and streamlined experience, and not in a good sense.
I don't lament the reduced focus on character management, but the depth of the experience was diminished by the linear environments and laughable machinations which forced you to cooperate with Cerberus.

It felt as if Bioware wanted to make the universe more accessible; at the expense of those of us who nurtured the original experience.

 

[LiquidGrape]

Holy shit, multipost. I have no idea how this happened. Sorry!

 

[LiquidGrape]

Holy shit, multipost. I have no idea how this happened. Sorry!