BioWare Co-Founder Promises Closure For Mass Effect 3

disgruntledgamer

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krellen said:
Don quixote said:
This is a complete shame. One of the few times Bioware tries to do something legitimately artsy
I don't think "take the ending of another game (Deus Ex) and paste it on ours" qualifies as "legitimately artsy".
No that qualifies as legitimate plagiarism. How Bioware thought they could get away with it and no one would notice is beyond me, and the fact that Ken Levine was sad over the whole ordeal tells me he planned on ripping off another developer as well instead of coming up with his own ending.
 

maninahat

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Kevlar Eater said:
Oh, dear gods, would it kill them to be upfront about their intentions? All I read out of that was "hurr durr artistic integrity, blah blah passionate fans, something something dark side".

He speaks to us as if we can't see through the PR smokescreen.
putowtin said:
Dear Bioware:

Stop talking in bloody riddles!
[sub] and give me an ending that makes sense[/sub]

Thank you

Putowtin
"Upfront about intentions"? "Riddles"? The guy is simply saying "we heard that your bitching, and we'll consider the complaints whilst making the DLC you're now guarenteed to buy". I doubt he is able to pull out a list from his back pocket and tell you exactly what is going to be going in to it, and he wouldn't anyway.
 

Knight Templar

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I hope they really do intend to provide some closure, because as time goes on that becomes my biggest problem with the ending.
 

Zeraki

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I've honestly had enough time to get over the ending at this point. I still don't like how it ended, but I find myself getting invested in the universe again now that I started reading Revelation.

That being said... I still wouldn't mind a bit of tweaking on the ending. I'd like to know what my crew does after I throw myself into the Space Magic machine. That and an explanation why the Reapers didn't make a beeline for the Citadel first, to deactivate the relay network.
 

Sonic Doctor

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disgruntledgamer said:
Sonic Doctor said:
Under this logic no one would be allowed to return anything ever and they would have to accept they bought a broken or rotten product.
I'm fine with returns, only proper ones where the product is actually broken physically or technically. ME3 can be played start to finish without any problems, so it isn't broken. Returns are for legitimately broken items.
 

Thammuz

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Honestly, this whole business sounds kinda fishy to me. It is very much weird that they would actually do something, but maybe that's just me being jaded and used to the abuse, much like a battered husband to a 6'2" russian karate blackbelt drunkard.

Still, in the interest of fairness, this IS the most definite answer we had on this whole debacle, and it is, all in all, a confirmation that they're trying to fix it without losing their face in the process, which is to be expected.

If they just came out and said "We fucked up, sorry!" they'd never be able to make up for their lost reputation, at least in their PR department minds, and that's why he's covering their collective ass with the whole "artistic integrity" bullshit.

I'm sorry, if artistic integrity meant anything to you people, you wouldn't have tacked on a completely superfluous multiplayer mode to the end of a trilogy that has consistently been a strictly single player experience, you wouldn't have diverged funds from interactive dialogue trees to do it in a story heavy game whose crown jewels have always been the characters and you wouldn't have claimed that the multiplayer component was going to have no impact on the single player when you were going to make it impossible to earn the best ending without playing it or buyng DLC that is not even avaible yet. Bioware has clearly succumbed to EA's point of view on artistic integrity, also known as "Sorry, I don't know whtat that is"

I play single player games, because i like the experience and the story, and i don't want a bunch of hooting dickholes ruining my experience. I played the Mass Effect series because they are great single player games, despite the flaws in gameplay. I was betrayed by the deliberate intrusion of the multiplayer component, which i loathe. Doubly so by the fact that i was made to shut up about this when it was first revealed with false promises of distinctly separate experiences between multiplayer and single player.

Whatever the outcome of this, i will have serious reservations when buying a new Bioware product in the future, and will more than likely rent it before buying it, to ensure the experience is actually worth full retail price. Also, I will not trust Bioware's PR again on the content of a game, since they clearly have no remorse about straight up lying to their customers and plagiarizing other intellectual properties in the process, no less.

That said, i compiled a handy to do list of things to fix in the ending:

- Add a check to ensure that the characters that were on earth with you don't show up on the normandy during the final cutscene or explain how they're there unscathed while i'm dying on the citadel.

- Explain why Joker was running from the battle like a little *****, or better yet remove that part altogether.

- Flat out remove the whole relay explosion bullshit, it's not consistent with the extablished lore and fucks up the universe beyond repair, effectively nullifying all your efforts by locking everyone in the sol system. No ending is worth pursuing if it invariably ends with all the quarians and all the turian fleet starving to death or dying of infection and the rest killing eachother for a little room on a mostly-destroyed earth.

- Remove the whole "destroy all synthetic life" bullshit and replace it with "destroy the reapers". It makes no sense that the godkid would have such a generic power over things it has not had any part in creating. Tell me who exactly wouldn't have destroyed the reapers if it weren't for that absolutely bullshit clause.

(Also, can you tell me when synthetic vs organic became a major dilemma of the series? ME1 didn't have much in the way of that, it just so happened that the main enemies were synthetics. ME2 pitted you against organics modified by synthetics, while giving you insight on the Geth's motivations and behaviour. Nobody could have ended ME2 without realizing that the Geth were not as different from organics as they looked in ME1, so why is that an issue now? How can you put the Bicentennial Man's subtexts in a plot and then act like composition, rather than self-awareness, is what matters?)

- Give a sense to the godkid's motivation or remove it altogether. We don't need a motivation for an eldricth abomination from beyond the veil of space and time to come and destroy us all, that's just what they do. If you must work one in, make sure it is worth telling. If it would make Sephiroth piss himself in laughter, it's not worth expanding on.

- Actually give closure on the main characters from ME2 other than the three pathetic lines in the comm room.

- Actually give closure to the characters, period.
 

scorptatious

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Well that's good news. I hope Bioware does fix this issue so I can proceed to rank ME3 as a contender for my game of the year.
Leximodicon said:
I'd patch in about 2 minutes of text saying all this shit that characters did after the explosion, then told everyone to fuck off. The game isn't perfect, live with it.
I can live with that. So long as I can get some closure.
 

mschweiz

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OK, so technically the choices mattered, in that all they did was fill up a FUCKING BAR!!!!! that's just unacceptable. I just wanted something like ME2 where a different cut-scene showed how all your assets, or lack there of, paid off. just show a few Rachni ships blowing up a reaper or some shit, and if you didn't save the Rachni, maybe the crucible would get a little damaged, making it not work as well. you don't need to explain the reapers, because of their whole "we are beyond your comprehension" thing. the end doesn't even need to be happy, everyone could die and get decimated even if you do everything perfectly, we just want to be shown what happened. saying that, I recommend the game to everyone who asks and say that the first 99.5% of the game is perfect, and I mean it.
 

CoL0sS

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Goddammit I'm so divided in this discussion. I can't fully agree with either side.
A part of me thinks ME3 ending was poor and that little explanation would be nice. On other hand it was the ending we were given; open to discussion and speculation and we should take it for what it's worth. Bioware acknowledging our concerns was respectful and considerate but possibility of them changing their work, caving in to pressure of loud minority seems staggeringly spineless. Not standing behind your creation sets a dangerous predicament.

I'm certain of one thing though. I wouldn't want to be Bioware at the moment. Surrounded on all sides by game critics and analysts, concerned fans, whiners and howlers and getting all this media space....poor PR guys.
 
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Explaining why the Normandy was mid jump while a war was still raging on would be a nice start. Maybe DLC to hide Liara's time capsules by order of Shep just before he makes his final push on the reapers.

the rest of the ending? i wouldnt know where to begin. keep one n make a few different one, it was the similarity rather than the somber mood that turned me off

complete failure for low galactic readyness maybe?
 

disgruntledgamer

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Sonic Doctor said:
I'm fine with returns, only proper ones where the product is actually broken physically or technically. ME3 can be played start to finish without any problems, so it isn't broken. Returns are for legitimately broken items.
Yeah it can be considered broken like if Lord of the Rings ended with Frodo learning that all this was a dream and they were in a computerized Matrix and he was the chosen one.

People would walk out of this nonsensical crap and demand their money back, same thing here but with Deus EX's endings.
 

SpaceCop

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BioWare can end the series however they want, and we can't get mad because ART--what kind of an argument is that? Since when has appeal to artistic integrity precluded criticism of a piece? If that's an acceptable defence why the fuck do art critics still exist?

And the idea of a DLC epilogue does rub me the wrong way--more so because it further demonstrates what a mistake the current shoestring ass-pull ending we have now was, but also because I've never been a fan of tacked-on narrative. Still, I think this sentiment that "it's only art if it's a finished product!!" is a damn silly idea too.

If the word "art" applies only to finished products that aren't changed post completion, that definition excludes the Last Supper, the Mona Lisa, the Venus de Milo, every one of Shakespeare's works, Blade Runner, Crime and Punishment, the Maoi, the Louvre, the Lascaux paintings, etcetera, etcetera...
 

Danzavare

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I suspected that we'd get a new ending or more likely, get quests where you play as squadmates via DLC that are meant to tie up all the loose ends. I have yet to play it, but general consensus seems to say that outside of the ending ME3 is a great and long game. If that really is the case, I won't mind eventually purchasing the DLC to have a more 'complete experience'. To accommodate that though, I think I definitely will have to wait a while before buying the game.

If that's the case I am worried about the implications of Shepard's final decision on the story in the DLC. (Particularly because it'll be a narrow decision uncharacteristic of the Shepard I've played so far) It also means I'll have to spend money for a month subscription to Xbox Live to get the points needed to
keep Shepard alive
.

The company has really been listening to the fans though. They're reacting to every reaction we have to their public statements at a quick and timely manner, I'm certainly impressed~!
 

SamuelT

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I found the ending I chose rather appropriate though, I might even go as far as to say I liked it. Weak, of Bioware to not stick to their guns.
 

Seatownstriker

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I see alot of people mad about no closure, and no choices. I saw plenty of choices through the game. I agree it might have been better they had not made all those promises and you just played the game. As far as closure goes, yeah it would be nice to have that. But what if they didn't do it because they were making another game. I just remember hearing something about this was just the end of Shepard's story and not the end of the Mass Effect universe. But that could be me just dreaming.
Nothing is ever set in stone. But would more choices make the ending that much better? If it was indoctrination, I would almost consider that more badass that he overcame something, nobody else had. Something that had been improved upon over thousands, even millions of years, and Shepard overcame it?
 

Yoshisummons

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Valanthe said:
Is anybody else beginning to see the words "Artistic Choice" and "The right to suck" as being synonymous?
Without a doubt, it reminds me when George Lucas said the Phantom Menace was artistically designed to have four things going on in the climax, but we should do our best to lessen that artistic choice.

Something along those lines, either way I'm getting tired of these buzz words.
 

Agente L

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SPOILERS ABOUT ME3 IN THIS POST.

People saying "Hollywood made shitty ending since ever, why are you all complaining" have absolutely no idea what the are talking about.

Cinema and Video games are ENTIRELY different medium. The main difference: One is interactive, other is not. Stop comparing both.

ME3 was a bad ending. That's not even a opinion. It's shat all over the canon, pretty much destroyed the intergalactic community, ignored the entire series premise. Also, fell short of everything bioware promised. "You can't say it's A, B or C ending", "Each choice will matter".


It doesn't. There are 3 endings. The destroy have 3 "different" endings, control have 2 and synergy has 1, IIRC

The only one with a noticeable difference is the Destroy - Vaporizatization ending, which instead of the Reapers being "shocked" and falling down, show a dust wave covering the Earth. And it's only the first half of the ending. The second half (the Mass relays parts) is identical.

"This will result in a story that diverges into wildly different conclusions based on the player's actions in the first two chapters"


THIS backslash is what you get for lying to your fanbase. If turning video games into an "Art Form" means this, being lied to by the developer, arbitrary "choices", and others I sure as HELL prefer we never reach "Art" state.

I'm ashamed of all "journalists" crying about how "the medium was set back", "gamer entitlement", "arrogant gamers", "self entitled gamers", and things like that. I've never been more DISGUSTED by a medium like the Gaming Journalism after this
 

Bocaj2000

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Denamic said:
Really?
They're surprised?
It's strange to them that a great story that players literally have hundreds of hours invested in angers players when there's literally no good ending no matter what you do. You just pick an ending at the end, and nothing you've done so far will be reflected upon even slightly.
Sheppard die, relays blow up, all species stranded where they are, including the Kogan in Sol, which will not only doom Tuchanka, but inevitably Sol as well due to virtually guaranteed overpopulation. And then there's the Quarian and the Turians, who can't eat human food and will die of starvation eventually. And the crew of the Normandy is stranded on some jungle planet for some reason.
Sheppard dies, everything's the same as in shitty ending A, except now everyone's apparently machine hybrids because Sheppard committed suicide in a magic beam of light. I dunno.
Genocide of the Geth. The 'best' option, because Sheppard survives and the reapers are destroyed, but the problems of eventual Krogan overpopulation and Quarian/Turian starvation remains. Still, as we've seen in the earlier games, Reaper copses are still dangerous, and now there's billions of them.
There's a difference between a bittersweet ending and a complete bullshit cop out that not only does not leave an untold number of things unanswered, but prompts even more questions.
Really? That's it? People are bitching because the story ends a tragedy? Maybe the point is that it doesn't matter what you do. I think that it's a valid artistic statement. You "fans" have to stop your bitching.