Blizzard Attacks StarCraft II Cheat Developers
- Thread starter Tom Goldman
- Start date
I have always been a fan of Blizzard since I first played Diablo and Warcraft II. I eagerly followed the news of Starcraft II since its original announcement. Unfortunately they have taken the stance of being total dicks on this issue. Their argument regarding the "Prestige and weight" of single player achievements is BS. Achievements have no effect on online play, they do not affect ladder standings and they do not give any bonuses when in an online match. Since they can obviously detect these trainers all they have to do is disable achievements the same way they do if you were to use the built-in single-player cheats. When people start cheating in legitimate multiplayer matches they can ban them all day long for all I care but punishing someone for cheating in single player beyond disabling or removing achievements is only going to hurt Blizzard in the long run in my book.
And for those who keep bringing up the EULA, a EULA is not enforceable unless it is able to be read and agreed upon before the sale of the product. When you add that to the fact that many game stores will not allow the return of PC games once the shrink wrap has been broken Blizzard hopefully will find this to be a losing battle.
I have no pity for those who cheat in multiplayer and receive just punishment but banning for the use of cheats in single player is way over the line.
And for those who keep bringing up the EULA, a EULA is not enforceable unless it is able to be read and agreed upon before the sale of the product. When you add that to the fact that many game stores will not allow the return of PC games once the shrink wrap has been broken Blizzard hopefully will find this to be a losing battle.
I have no pity for those who cheat in multiplayer and receive just punishment but banning for the use of cheats in single player is way over the line.
Oh and you think people flock to this board, to hear your insults and flagrant dismissal, of those who have a problem with what is happening? To paraphrase you. Do yourself and everyone else a favor by bringing intelligent non fan boyish comments to the discussion.Zeeky_Santos said:
Now onto the real issue.
What angers me the most is it seems like no one is READING what is going on here. Most are treating this issue like a EULA. They are scrolling to the bottom and clicking I agree. So lets see if I can make some of this clear. When blizzard says people are using these cheats in the online portion of the game, most people are thinking OMG, WTF, GTO BAN THESE HACKERZ!. What Blizzard is failing to mention is the online portion they are referring to is the single player campaign. Not online multiplayer like allot in this thread think is happening. (Cheaters in multiplayer need to be shot. Drug into the street and shot. Drawn and quartered. I loath online cheaters. They destroy the fun of playing online, because you can't sit back and enjoy a game without some 12 year old hooting into chat that he just owned you with his 1337 skills. This is why I no longer play online in any game. It has stressed me out to much that I had actual health problems from it.) So when you log on to play single player, and you are not using the guest acct, you are in blizzards eyes playing online.
So let me pose these questions. And see how many people will actually answer them, and answer them honestly.
Everyone talks about the EULA, but how many people here read their EULA before clicking I AGREE? I'm willing to bet very few to none. Everyone wants to just play the game they just purchased.
Second question. How many people even noticed the Guest acct when starting their game and playing? If you did notice it did you even bother to click on it or did you just want to get to playing as soon as possible?
I'll tell you my answer here and now. No I did not read the EULA. It is long, and filled with legalese. My time is better spent playing the game. Even if I don't agree to what is listed in the EULA I have no recourse on the matter. I can not return the game even though the EULA says I can. No one will take a return on opened pc software, and Blizzard isn't going to give me a refund. So I click I agree, and play the game how I have played every pc game, no matter their EULA, since the 1980's. How I wish.
Answer to the second question. Hell no. I didn't notice the guest acct. I think I finally noticed the option about after a week of play. Even then when I saw it I thought it was something meant for friends to play the game so they don't mess with my game.
So here are the two problems blizzard created. Because you can try to twist it anyway you like, but these are self made problems. The first one was linking single player game achievements to the online play of the game. This one makes little sense. I can not understand what their thinking is to have single player affect online leader boards. Leader boards have always been a problem in every game that uses them. And that is just from the online people. Adding single player to the mix is just dumb founding.
Problem number two is the guest acct. If they really wanted people to know this is a offline game mode it should have been listed as so. Another self made problem. A little forethought would have stopped either of these problems from happening. Instead Blizzard goes on a hissy banning customers, and suing the people who make single player hacks. Yeah, that's the way to stay classy Blizzard.
As for those who are upset that these trainers are sold, lets clear some things up. What is sold is membership to the website. What this membership pays for is the upkeep of the website, the paying of the banwidth, and updating up the trainers through game patches. If you have a problem with these companies providing a product that is aftermarket, then you also have a problem with auto part stores as well. They are doing the same thing by making money off supplying parts aftermarket, cutting out the profits of the manufacturers. With that said lets talk precedent. Nintendo tried sue to stop the makers of game genie from selling the product. Making some of the same claims. I'll post in quotes for those who dont want to actually search for it.
With that said I'll point out the real problem here. That is one of the precedent. If Blizzard should win this case it will set a new precedent. One of which will be far reaching, and allow any company, not just blizzard to start lawsuits against people they claim are hurting their sales by their actions. Lets face it Blizzard is not being hurt. In fact they have grown so large and wide spread to be a monster of a company. This is part in part the problem. Power corrupts, and with that power blizzard is wielding a mighty sword that can devastate the freedoms you currently enjoy with your games. It doesn't matter if they are doing it with good intentions. The pathway to hell is paved with good intentions.
A Win in this case could bring an end to a era of playing a game how you want to play it. Imagine if Valve had feared that Counter Strike would damage its image. If they would have shut them down, what would online shooters be like today. How about Team Fortress. It started its life a a Quake mod. There are so may mods that broke the mold of the original game, and changed it in ways that the company that made the original never envisioned. The more control a company has on the software you payed for, the less freedom you have in modding it, and making the next DotA (Defense of the Ancients). Mentioning that last one makes me wonder if Blizzard is currently thinking up how they can file a lawsuit against the makers of DotA2 now that it has broken free of just being a mod off one of their games, into being its own game now.
I know you may be thinking that is quite a leap from suing people who make trainers, but in reality it isn't. What it will do is give them a wider choice in legally doing what the company pleases. Even if that choice makes little sense. They have so many people throwing money at them currently, they think they can do no wrong. So when people like Monster User, and I stop giving them our money, it is but a drop in the bucket. I know my few dollars aren't going to matter to them, but I know that no more of my money will be used by Blizzard in a hissy to file lawsuits.
I may be a drop in the bucket to them, but this is a list of the blizzard games I own, and the ones I no long intend to buy.
Battle Chess
The Lost Vikings
The Lost Vikings II
Rock 'n Roll Racing
Blackthorne
Warcraft
Warcraft II and expansion
Warcraft III and expansions
Diablo
Diablo II and expansion
Star Craft
Star Craft II
World of Warcraft and both expansions (also 4 years of play so around 700 or so dollars.)
Those are games I still own from them. That is almost 1600 dollars. Not a drop in the bucket to me. But at least I know that I wont be spending money on the games below. so roughly that is about 230 dollars blizzard wont get from me plus any money that would be made from a monthly service to WoW.
WoW Cataclysm
Diablo III
Scar Craft II expansions
I guess Blizzard should sue themselves. They have only their own actions to thank for losing a customer of 18 years. I know I'm not the only one either.
+1 to you. That was a very good post. It speaks tot he heart of the issue without getting to vocal like I did =)Ken Sapp said:
Lovely how people consider this a bad thing. Really, how can someone consider this a bad thing unless he's a cheater / hack user or distributer?
These people create hacks and even sell them for profit. And Guys like Daft Ghosty support that?
Why would you do that?
And of course people get banned for using cheats in single player to get achievements. Those are fucking retards anyways if they cheat in order to get achievements, amiright? If they just want to play through the game because it's too hard or whatever (lawl considering there are a lot difficulty settings) then they can use the cheats implanted by Blizzard.
There's NO WAY you're supporting cheaters and hackers unless you're one yourself. So thanks for outing yourself everyone
I play Sc2 at a pretty competitive level myself and I'm glad for every son of a ***** cheater that gets smacked. And I throw a party for every hack developer biting the grass.
These people create hacks and even sell them for profit. And Guys like Daft Ghosty support that?
Why would you do that?
And of course people get banned for using cheats in single player to get achievements. Those are fucking retards anyways if they cheat in order to get achievements, amiright? If they just want to play through the game because it's too hard or whatever (lawl considering there are a lot difficulty settings) then they can use the cheats implanted by Blizzard.
There's NO WAY you're supporting cheaters and hackers unless you're one yourself. So thanks for outing yourself everyone
I play Sc2 at a pretty competitive level myself and I'm glad for every son of a ***** cheater that gets smacked. And I throw a party for every hack developer biting the grass.
The outrage over this decision perplexes me.
People aren't just innocently using hacks in single player to "better enjoy the game." They are doing it for free achievement points and character portraits. There is no other reason to use these "trainers."
Want to cheat in single player? Do it with the in-game cheat codes that disable achievement points. Want to tweak game speed or unit ranges? There are custom games and a map editor for that.
I am so weary of this self-righteous attitude hack buyers have. No, you aren't sticking it to the man, and no, you aren't robbing from the rich and giving to the poor. You are PAYING to have an unfair advantage over other players and ruining their experience. You are damaging the longevity of some players' favorite games by driving legitimate players away!
People aren't just innocently using hacks in single player to "better enjoy the game." They are doing it for free achievement points and character portraits. There is no other reason to use these "trainers."
Want to cheat in single player? Do it with the in-game cheat codes that disable achievement points. Want to tweak game speed or unit ranges? There are custom games and a map editor for that.
I am so weary of this self-righteous attitude hack buyers have. No, you aren't sticking it to the man, and no, you aren't robbing from the rich and giving to the poor. You are PAYING to have an unfair advantage over other players and ruining their experience. You are damaging the longevity of some players' favorite games by driving legitimate players away!
So wait this isn't about the news?ciortas1 said:
People are just posting random conspiracy theories against Blizzard completely unrelated to the actual news? Oh god forbid, I'm sorry then.
The old Lan argument doh
No player likes the fact that lan is missing. And yet I can understand and follow their decision to not include lan. Why is that? Because millions of people played pirated versions of Wc3 / SC via Hamachi, Garena and other Lan clients because there's nothing you can do against that once you implanted a Lan modus to your game.
But why would I want to dive deeper into this. The topic is about Blizzard going to Law against some scrubby Hack developers.
And if someone has a problem with that that person is a Hacker himself. No question about that.
I've seen a couple of comments about this and i'm gonna have to agree,
When I'm done with a game's story etc, It does keep me interested in single player for a bit longer if I can mess about with god modes and stuff like that (Oblivion's developer console for example), I'd rather not have to possibly pay for/ download any sort of program for this though
But obviously hacks and mods for multiplayer are just unfair and a bit silly really
When I'm done with a game's story etc, It does keep me interested in single player for a bit longer if I can mess about with god modes and stuff like that (Oblivion's developer console for example), I'd rather not have to possibly pay for/ download any sort of program for this though
But obviously hacks and mods for multiplayer are just unfair and a bit silly really
Let's see how other companies have handled cheaters
Valve: Removed items from the backpacks of people who used idling programs in TF2, rewarded those who didn't cheat
Bungie: Reset the points of people who exploited daily challenges in Halo:Reach, eventually moved onto two-week bans
Blizzard: LAWSUIT LAWSUIT LAWSUIT
So excuse me if I think Blizzard is not only overreacting but sending a bad message.
Valve: Removed items from the backpacks of people who used idling programs in TF2, rewarded those who didn't cheat
Bungie: Reset the points of people who exploited daily challenges in Halo:Reach, eventually moved onto two-week bans
Blizzard: LAWSUIT LAWSUIT LAWSUIT
So excuse me if I think Blizzard is not only overreacting but sending a bad message.
Perhaps they are overreacting, but Blizzard wasn't well known in the past for dealing properly with hackers and the like. If they're overreacting, then it's probably because they're trying to shape up their image against these people they consider threats.AceDiamond said:
I'm not saying that a lawsuit was necessary, but I can understand why Blizzard did it in the first place. The fact that they're doing anything at all is good. The fact that it's a lawsuit? Perhaps going overboard. Then again, the guys who sold these cheats did make money off of it.
Other games companies can do it, even ones where the games have been out for YEARS and the crackers/hackers have had years to slowly take the games apart piece by pieceSubstance-E said:
maybe if blizzard actually employed some good coders or security people, instead of using outsourcing to get the game running on time, and then fixing stuff later by updates/expansion packs
All the people in this thread defending blizzard should have a good long look at themselves in the mirror, people like you are helping ruin the games industry, not the crackers/hackers. Their damage can be undone in seconds by well set up servers or good coding, The support you are giving blizzard over this will make them think its OK to treat their customers like dicks and last for many years