Critical Miss: Dragon Age 2

[draythefingerless]

Another thing, the fact you have less choices now in dialogue is simple. Back then, games were smaller, and you had more flexibility for more stuff to put in. Now if you tried to be complex with the dialogue and choices, youd end up with a many many year development progress, cause its a shitton of things to voice act, code, etc etc,

 

[pezwitch]

I get tired of the Welsh jokes, atleast have somthing to back up the things, like Americas obesity problem.

It's funny, because I have this crazy feeling you haven't even been to America, so you only have news outlets to rely on for the "obesity problem".

The definition for obesity used in the US is based entirely on weight-height ratio. Not body fat percentage, or anything reasonable. Most bodybuilders are considered "obese" under the US definition. Even though people like to talk about how "One fourth of Americans are obese", I'm sitting in a room of 40 people, and not a one of them looks in the least bit fat.

I'm about to start raging here, so I'll cut this off.

Watch the documentary "Fat Head". It explains the whole "obesity epidemic" far better than I ever could.

it's funny because i have this funny feeling you haven't been to wales so you only have idiots on the internet to rely on for "sheep shagging"

but dude seriously he was making a point that if your gunna stereotype someone you can also be stereotyped.

OT: T'is a shame whats happening with DA2 the demo was fun and it looked good but all this shit thats piling up about it is working against its favour.

I am from a rural state in the US and 8 times out of ten when I mention it I get a sheep joke. It's not just Wales that has that stereotype, it's a pretty universal rural stereotype. I think the elf flirting with the sheep is a based on the way the new elves look, not a racial stereotype.

Spoiler: Some people think the new skins for the Elves look like sheep, and I think that is where they were going with the joke, at least that is where my mind went.

 

[Tharwen]

Wait... so did they not announce the SecuROM beforehand or something?

The drama mask in the speech wheel should be a troll face... :3

I think it's meant to be already.

 

[Googooguru]

Lol.. great work .. thanks for the good laugh

 

[Nimcha]

Seems to me that the players of this game is divided into a couple of camps:

The players who went into it guarded, but with open minds and willing to suspend their expectations and were willing to engage the game on its own terms. These people all seems generally positive and pleased. (Also, there are fanboys, but who the fuck cares about them?)

Then there are the people who keep thumping their chests in righteous indignation at the game for failing to live up their personal, and very specific, ideas of what a Dragon Age game is supposed to be. As if they would know. Clearly, I don't need to point out intellectually dishonest, and outright arrogant that is. That they are disappointed is obvious, and irrelevant.

And then, of course, there are the people who keep pointing out the marketing blunders, as if it was important.

Hah, nice summary. Just goes to show how polarized the gaming community is these days. :/

 

[The Wooster]

Seems to me that the players of this game is divided into a couple of camps:

The players who went into it guarded, but with open minds and willing to suspend their expectations and were willing to engage the game on its own terms. These people all seems generally positive and pleased. (Also, there are fanboys, but who the fuck cares about them?)

Then there are the people who keep thumping their chests in righteous indignation at the game for failing to live up their personal, and very specific, ideas of what a Dragon Age game is supposed to be. As if they would know. Clearly, I don't need to point out intellectually dishonest, and outright arrogant that is. That they are disappointed is obvious, and irrelevant.

Or there could be, you know, people who dislike the game because of it's rather large flaws.
I quite like the game, but accusing people who don't of being "intellectually dishonest" and arrogant isn't an argument. It's simple name calling.

 

[xscoot]

This is so unrealistic because the dialog wheel shows what your character would actually say.

Realistically it would be:

It's not illegal if the president does it
DRM doesn't exist
End of Line

 

[CrystalShadow]

...And this is why PC gaming is dying: because you don't have to deal with this shit with the consoles.

Linux, bitches! It's the shizzle! Can ya dig it?

Linux sucks. BSD FTW. ;p

 

[A_who]

I'm just really glad I didn't preorder the game. I mean they threw all those goodys out and didn't deliver on them if I have the story correct. That is just bullshit even if it was a terrific game, to mean it seems solid but not necessarily living up to the hype, I wouldn't take not having my preorder signature edition.

 

[MeTheMe]

NOOO! Don't say ANYTHING bad about EA or they will ban you from their site and screw up so that you can't play any of their games either! Then them and Bobby Kotick will abuse your right to play games! Shhhh!

 

[darthricardo]

Is there an elf, flirting with a sheep in the background?

Oddly enough, that was the very first thing I noticed. No joke.

 

[Cory Rydell]

I feel sorry for all the idiots in this thread like you that actually think this is valid satire. Seriously, is this what people think is funny?

And who ever tried to claim it was the "RPG of the decade" as no such line came out of Bioware. (They are far prouder of ME2)

http://dragonage.bioware.com/

you can scroll down a bit to their news feed to see that PC Gamer are the people who brought up the "rpg of the decade" bit. Bioware doesn't have to say it for the comment to be refuted. Even when it is brought up with a question mark it still is a fairly bold statement.

Seems to me that the players of this game is divided into a couple of camps:

The players who went into it guarded, but with open minds and willing to suspend their expectations and were willing to engage the game on its own terms. These people all seems generally positive and pleased. (Also, there are fanboys, but who the fuck cares about them?)

Then there are the people who keep thumping their chests in righteous indignation at the game for failing to live up their personal, and very specific, ideas of what a Dragon Age game is supposed to be. As if they would know. Clearly, I don't need to point out intellectually dishonest, and outright arrogant that is. That they are disappointed is obvious, and irrelevant.

That some reviewers may have swung hard against so much love for Da2 is in some ways intellectually dishonest to their craft but glowing reviews for a game that may otherwise be considered an 8 (maybe even a high 8 which is still amazing just when you see a lot of As it can be sad to see a B) are also intellectually dishonest. Arrogance seems unrelated but what they do seem to be is presumptuous. The fact they are disappointed is not irrelevant, by providing more criticism the developers are able to grow and learn more about what they may have done wrong. To not say anything would be a disservice.

Or there could be, you know, people who dislike the game because of it's rather large flaws.
I quite like the game, but accusing people who don't of being "intellectually dishonest" and arrogant isn't an argument. It's simple name calling.

It's not name calling in the least. It's a statement at how flawed their thought process is. MatsVS post is one of the most intelligent dealing with DA2 I've seen yet. And humor me, what "large" flaws are there? Everyone that has claimed that so far is nitpicking to an extreme degree like Mats pointed out that something minor they don't like is "broken."

So go ahead, what massive flaw broke the game?

Notice Grey never said the game was broken. Even to say it has large flaws may be overstating it from how I understand it. I would say it has some downfalls in design that keep it from being super-awesome-orgasmic. These are a few legitimate complaints about the game as I see it, though they use some more powerful language that can distract from the actual criticism the points are still there.

http://geekrevolt.com/2011/03/14/kirkwall-dragon-age-2%E2%80%99s-biggest-flaw/
http://donthatethegeek.com/2011/03/15/geeky-game-review-dragon-age-2/
http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/6531015&lf=8

I also feel that I should point out that I drew this up during finals week so I was fairly preoccupied with other business and I asked Grey to throw together something short, its the reason an elf is fingergunning a sheep. We do what we can.

 

[Jennacide]

*snipped for page size*

I respect you guys for bothering to respond to me, and maybe I should apologize for how irate I'm getting. But honestly I'm sick and tired of all the hyperbole being spewed out over DA2, and how everyone and their brother is trying to nitpick every little thing. Like seriously, the overreactions to a Bioware member posting a user review and a forum ban accidently carrying over to a user ban. The former happens all the time and nobody has cared, it's just the raging fans trying to use it as ammunition. The latter was an accident, that EA issued a public apology for and fixed.

I still don't feel any aspect of the game is a "large" flaw. Large in my vocabulary would indicate it's a major hinderance to the game, which DA2 suffers no such issue. There are a lot of questionable design changes, but I'd hardly call any of them flaws. What it boils down to is the game is still a solid 8 or 9 (on a REAL scale, not a reviewer 7-10 scale), it's an above average game compared to most of the rubbish that keeps coming out. But like ME2, it diverged a little more than some would of liked, and anyone defending it now is being treated like a heretic.

As for finals, hope they went well. I guess I'll stop arguing at this point as I know how hectic my week was prepping for my midterms and 2 finals.

 

[Ajna]

but dude seriously he was making a point that if your gunna stereotype someone you can also be stereotyped.

No he wasn't. Did you read his post?

 

[Kilgengoor]

*snipped for page size*

I respect you guys for bothering to respond to me, and maybe I should apologize for how irate I'm getting. But honestly I'm sick and tired of all the hyperbole being spewed out over DA2, and how everyone and their brother is trying to nitpick every little thing. Like seriously, the overreactions to a Bioware member posting a user review and a forum ban accidently carrying over to a user ban. The former happens all the time and nobody has cared, it's just the raging fans trying to use it as ammunition. The latter was an accident, that EA issued a public apology for and fixed.

I still don't feel any aspect of the game is a "large" flaw. Large in my vocabulary would indicate it's a major hinderance to the game, which DA2 suffers no such issue. There are a lot of questionable design changes, but I'd hardly call any of them flaws. What it boils down to is the game is still a solid 8 or 9 (on a REAL scale, not a reviewer 7-10 scale), it's an above average game compared to most of the rubbish that keeps coming out. But like ME2, it diverged a little more than some would of liked, and anyone defending it now is being treated like a heretic.

Aye. I can't possibly understand why everything regarding Dragon Age 2 has been so fiercely ripped apart from right on day 1. The people downloaded and seemed to enjoy the demo, and even though it was a similar, if not better in my opinion, than the first game people didn't wait to spew all kinds of rage over it while comparing it to games like Planescape which this game clearly isn't, or games like KOTOR which DA2 is based on and furthermore improves in many ways.

The EA ban shit has been so overblown I can't really wrap my mind about it.

1- Bioware uses EA activation system
2- People need EA account for playing game
3- Person gets banned on Bioware forum, ergo EA.
4- They rescind their whole user, so he can't play game.
5- They revert the error, user can play.

Easy, right? I still can't get why there's people treating this like it's the new Apartheid when it's clearly a mistake in EA's part. and regarding why that guy was banned, well, forums have their rules. Deal with it.

And i'd like to think the SecuROM shit wouldn't even be mentioned if bashing on this game hand't become so cool for now.

I really can't understand how DA2 would be up to the expectations. Release the best RPG in history when it's clear it was going to be pretty much like the first only slightly different? Expect Bioware/EA's webpage to work flawlessy when help.bioware.com 404'd me a couple weeks ago for days at an end?

Hater's gonna hate and shit, but... I still can't tell why all the rage.

Oh, and about the Metacritic reviews? Those guys were morons to use a username with such evident ties to their real identities. I don't think anyone should deal with their idiocy other than themselves.

 

[EllEzDee]

...And this is why PC gaming is dying: because you don't have to deal with this shit with the consoles.

Linux, bitches! It's the shizzle! Can ya dig it?

Windows =/= PC.

 

[MatsVS]

Or there could be, you know, people who dislike the game because of it's rather large flaws.
I quite like the game, but accusing people who don't of being "intellectually dishonest" and arrogant isn't an argument. It's simple name calling.

You misunderstand.

Clearly, disliking the game for legitimate reasons is fine and presenting said reasons as a well-conceived argument is even better. Obviously. That's helpful. It's also not been the case.

Going into the game with a preconceived notion of how the game ought to be and then complaining when the game falls short of said expectations most certainly is not. Well, it would be if they did not proceed to point to their own personal disappointment as solid proof of the game's lack of objective quality. You judge a game on its own merits, its own premises, and as a blank slate. Anything less is intellectually dishonest.

That some reviewers may have swung hard against so much love for Da2 is in some ways intellectually dishonest to their craft but glowing reviews for a game that may otherwise be considered an 8 (maybe even a high 8 which is still amazing just when you see a lot of As it can be sad to see a B) are also intellectually dishonest. Arrogance seems unrelated but what they do seem to be is presumptuous. The fact they are disappointed is not irrelevant, by providing more criticism the developers are able to grow and learn more about what they may have done wrong. To not say anything would be a disservice.

Indeed, and fair point. However, most of the glowing reviews I have read cited specific points to defend their position, such as the deep, visceral battle system, the effective use of storytelling, the interesting characters, etc, etc. There has been a whiff of, ahem, over-excitement, yes, but these are still valid points, and more importantly, actual arguments. Detractors seem content to resort to straw men (it's not the same as Origins), sensationalism (an employee wrote a review as a counterpoint to all the zero star reviews) and hyperboles (worst Bioware game everrrrr) that are hardly educational, which all good criticism, as you pointed out, should be.

I'd rather not get into which numerical value best represents the game quality, as I find that way of reviewing limiting, but I think I mostly agree with the donthatethegeek review you pointed out.

Then again, I smirked at the sheep-gunner, so what do I know?

 

[Irridium]

Semantics. The major problem people had with SecuRom was with all the services it was executing. Read the conclusion of reclaim your game, they are saying that using A PART of SecuRom is USING SecuRom. So yeah, they are right, by that definition they are. But if we become a bit more pragmatic, youll see that using a Release Control, a service that was present in SecuRom, isnt what pissed off people before about SecuRom.

In short, Reclaim Your Game is right that it is SecuRom by definition of the subject, but are wrong by reality, since the service in the game that was part of SecuRom isnt that big of a deal, it simply has the SecuRom name attached to it.

The game either features SecuROM, or it does not. Again, the reason this bit of news caught my eye is not because the game actually contained SecuROM (again. Not too bothered by it as a product.) but that EA stated categorically that it did not. They realized that SecuROM, as a product, has some seriously negative connotations and instead of using a different security product or attempting to explain to the relatively small section of users that actually give a shit what they were actually doing they instead chose to lie about it. A poor decision, in my opinion and indicative of EA and Bioware's utter PR failure when it came to DA2.

The game, however, is great.

Indeed it is. I think weve reached a point where gamers are now just becoming game snobs. This story is more down to earth, you have the same amount and depth in the characters, it can be difficult(FUCK THAT ROCK WRAITH IN HARD DIFFICULTY, FUCK HIM) and it builds upon its predecessor and tries sth different, wich is what a sequel should be ideally(lookin at you CoD).

There's a strange phenomenon that happens every time a sequel comes out. When Origins came out I remember people absolutely hating it because it wasn't what they thought it would be, namely a 3d Baldurs Gate (would have be sooo awesome) and it had a fair few flaws. The combat was wonky, it was buggy as fuck, the difficulty was all over the place.
Then when DA2 is announced all of a sudden Origins became the shining example of what RPGs should be. Oh it'll never live up to the sequel yadda yadda. I guess Bioware was handing out the rose tinted glasses.

Edit: If I have one problem with DA2 it's male Hawke's voice. He's like Alistair tuned up to 11. His dialogue choices are generally. SMUG/SMUG/SMUG.

And that is exactly what happened with Fable and Fable 2. Me thinks people forgot how awful Fable 1 truly was. Yeah I found it fun, but I remember shit-tons of rage about it. Then when Fable 2 came out it was suddenly a "fantastic classic" or something like that.

 

[RA92]

...And this is why PC gaming is dying: because you don't have to deal with this shit with the consoles.

Linux, bitches! It's the shizzle! Can ya dig it?

Windows =/= PC.

That was actually a jab at the PS3 to counter Gentleman's console love. I can install Linux in my PC, PS3 owners can't anymore.