This thread seemed interesting until I got to the part were being a man means I probably haven't and never will experience sexism ever... I am literally too confused and saddened by such a massive declaration of ignorance. Such ignorance is... it's just too much?
Electronic Arts VP Says Sexism Complaints Are "Misguided"
- Thread starter Andy Chalk
- Start date
Well I never really thought there was specifically 'sexism' in the industry, I.E from employers/co workers, but more of just social pressure that 'women can only do ____'. But there is definitely sexism in the gaming community, just play an random online console game, and you're bound to see it a few times. Though I'll admit I havn't actually been in any workplace.
So it's not that you're not hiring that many women, it's that women are too shy to apply for the jobs.
No I'm kidding, I don't see any problem with this. Honestly. More males play games -> more males go into gaming jobs, it sounds logical to me. If the userbase was 50/50 it wouldn't make sense, but it isn't. I'm not getting into society vs nature here, but I think it's pretty safe to say neither side can prove where gender career trends come from. Especially in a modern society where you can study whatever you want.
No I'm kidding, I don't see any problem with this. Honestly. More males play games -> more males go into gaming jobs, it sounds logical to me. If the userbase was 50/50 it wouldn't make sense, but it isn't. I'm not getting into society vs nature here, but I think it's pretty safe to say neither side can prove where gender career trends come from. Especially in a modern society where you can study whatever you want.
I think it depends on your field - I mean, where programming is concerned - sorry ladies, but men are better at it, our brains are wired better for programming. Deal with it. But other fields like art, design, sound etc it's usually a much more level playing field.
I certainly don't mean that to be offensive, actually to be a good programmer I'd say people need some negative personality traits - like arrogance. Really there is quite a specific mindset that I think makes a good programmer, and it's just a case that there are more men with that mindset than women, and women with that mindset tend to do better in other fields - medical research for instance.
I certainly don't mean that to be offensive, actually to be a good programmer I'd say people need some negative personality traits - like arrogance. Really there is quite a specific mindset that I think makes a good programmer, and it's just a case that there are more men with that mindset than women, and women with that mindset tend to do better in other fields - medical research for instance.
If it's not sexism, why am I finding it excruciatingly difficult to find prominent women in the gaming industry?
Sure, I can agree with most of that. So, why is it that you guys get the wish-fulfillment fantasies while us women get female characters that are characterized and sexualized for the benefit of guys? This never struck you as odd?The Plunk said:
lacktheknack said:
Yeah, I can see the epic cleavage on the first two versions of her, that's for sure.
The third one is literally the one that you see if you've been trending towards the "Sleaze and Sirens" ending at the point. Hint: That's the "Harry was a horndog, and the reason Cheryl hallucinated them in the first place was because he was cheating on his wife, with all of them" ending. I had the middle Cybil in my playthrough.
Something that would be interesting to see is if EA or some other big game company put out some figures with an article like this. Something along the lines of "In the last five years we had X female applicants and we hired Y. The average for the industry is Z. Of those that were hired, Q went into development positions, R into QA, and S into other positions."
I think an article like this would have a lot more heft to it if there were numbers attached.
I think an article like this would have a lot more heft to it if there were numbers attached.
I'm pretty sure that sexism used to be worse, and that great strides have been made in the last 50-100 years. pretty sure sexism was pretty much a way of life for, o I don't know, the existence of the human race.Andy Chalk said:
just annoys me when people take this kind of stuff out of perspective, if you really want to help oppressed woman the west isn't the place where the most work needs to be done...
This is a little pet peeve of mine and I'm sorry to cut away the rest of your mostly-agreeable post to pick on it, but Catwoman's costume design in Arkham City is broadly identical to her contemporary depiction in the comics.Darken12 said:
I can't speak as to the zipper, but I get a little annoyed when I see people complain about the Arkham City devs "sexualising" Catwoman. Rocksteady's art department didn't really sexualise her or even change her that much at all - she's been drawn like that for years now. I mean, yeah, a skin-tight catsuit with an inexplicably low zipper is obviously there for fanservice, and it's why they do it in the comics as well, but that's not Rocksteady's fault. They're just being faithful to the source material.
And if you want to talk about egalitarian fanservice...Batman is ludicrously buff in that game. And there are plenty of shirtless and very chiseled crooks around, if you're of the bad boy persuasion. I mean, I don't know if some sexualised guys cancel out some sexualised girls, but I can say that when my sister played the game, she used to deliberately try and position Batman so that his cape blew aside and revealed his perfectly sculpted buttcheeks in their litte bat-underpants.
Everyone's a perv!
OT: What she says is mostly sensible, and as she's inside the industry I can't really dispute her credibility. Of course, she may be getting the push to say this by someone higher up in EA, but we'll never know that.
What I think is interesting is questioning whether women aren't getting into the industry because they're afraid the industry is sexist and male-dominated, or whether the industry is sexist and male-dominated because women just don't want to work for video game companies. Bit of a circular conundrum, there. If it's the latter I can't blame them; I would never be able to bear the shame of being a male nurse (the fact that you have to say "male nurse" speaks volumes about the gender rigidity). Peer pressure! Causing problems for people since the dawn of civilisation!
This... actually seems fairly reasonable? Wow. I need to go have a lie down.
It boils down to:
Women assume the industry is sexist because there are few women in the industry.
Therefore few women join the industry.
Which perpetuates the idea that the industry is sexist.
And on it goes.
Chicken, meet egg.
It boils down to:
Women assume the industry is sexist because there are few women in the industry.
Therefore few women join the industry.
Which perpetuates the idea that the industry is sexist.
And on it goes.
Chicken, meet egg.
She's the VP. There aren't exactly a lot of people 'higher up' to put pressure on her.bastardofmelbourne said:
I cant wait for feminism to die. Its just a bunch of crazy man blaming man hating anti men professional nagging under the guise of equality, when in reality the world will always cater to women and always has.
And I wouldn't have it any other way.
And I wouldn't have it any other way.
Missing the point. Characters like Bayonetta aren't designed to appeal to women, they are designed to appeal to men. Even Alyx Vance, the usual figurehead for good female characters, was written explicitly to appeal to male gamers. Not all men might like the male characters presented in all games, but that doesn't change the fact that just about every character in most games is designed to appeal to men, not women. Not even female protagonists are designed with the intention of appealing to women and if they do so it is more out of pure chance than actual effort from the developers.The Plunk said:
Don't you see the problem? Because for me, as a woman, it is quite clear.