Extra Punctuation: Why No Couples in Games?

[CardinalPiggles]

You could go and play Leisure Suit Larry *wink*

Also, dare I mention the ME2 DLC Lair of the Shadow Broker? I found the ongoing Shepard-and-Liara relationship in that surprisingly endearing.

I tapped that in ME1 Giggity goo. [sub]I feel dirty for saying that[/sub]

ARGH! SEX ON THE BRAIN!

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

Come on. We all know that the reason Mario was socking away all those coins was so that, once he finally got that daft bint back from the overgrown lizard, he could go out and enjoy the... uhm, "services" of one of the Mushroom Kingdoms "female escorts". You think they're cheap over there?

I for one don't see why we couldn't have an action game based around a family- a husband (retired Marine, two tours of duty in the Middle East) and a wife (decorated city cop) running off to find their daughter in some sort of widespread emergency. It'd make for pretty good co-op too.

"Wait! Wait! Honey, stop!"
"What?"
"I think I left the oven on. I... hm. No... no. I turned it off. Okay. Never mind."
"You do this every time we go out."

 

[mental_looney]

Gonna come in again with a DA2 comment the relationship was pretty good with Anders for me, as after a certain point there is less drama in the relationship and it's just going out to do things together and coming home and sleeping together at night, sex optional.

Got to mention LA Noire though Cole Phelps is married and has kids and I didn't realise until the end but it's a very weird snapshot of his life and you don't get much overall details.

 

[xdiesp]

There are no functional relationships because then the product would be aimed at a mature public, already grown up enough to sustain emotive and financial committment... not compatible with playing videogames full time in your spare time, or even working with them (see Yahtzee's own case of describing himself as a loner lunatic).

 

[The Deadpool]

I know it's passe to like jRPGs nowadays (and most of them are as guilty of this as any other genre, often more so) but you know what game did romance AWESOME? Wild Arms 2.

Yup. The one NO ONE played.

WILD ARMS 2 SPOILERS.

First off, Marina (main character's girl)? Not a party member. Childhood friend, runs a bakery with her mom, Ashley (main character) rents the room upstairs and helps them man the store on his time off. So right off the bat, this isn't the usual "boy meets girl" story. They've known each other for a WHILE. This relatinship of theirs has been a long time coming...

Ashley is training to be some sort of soldier/mercenary/adventurer/special ops kinda guy. He goes off on dangerous missions, and training routs and whatnot. Early in the game he's off to some ceremony and she tells him she doesn't care if he's the best special ops or the worst, or if he passes or fails, or rich or poor or whatever. She just wants him to come home in one piece. That's all. And he promises her that no matter what, he'll come home.

And that promise becomes the lynchpin of the game. To the point that me (and many other players) had a tendency to go back home to visit her after EVERY mission... Cuz that's what we promised. When the ceremony goes awry, and Ashley tries to draw the holy sword, the spirit of the sword asks him if he wants the power to destroy his enemies, or to save his life. Ashley says he wants the power so he can KEEP HIS PROMISE. Their love saves his life, their love is what keeps him moving through all the shit he goes through in the game.

And the heart of the game is a search to what it means to be a hero. Every other character (seriously, like a dozen of them) is a foil for Ashley, each with their own view of what it means to be a hero (to give up your freedom and reputation for the cause, or your morals for the cause, or your life for the cause) while Ashley blunders to find his answer. And he does. To him a hero is a guy who's going to get the job done... And remember to duck long enough to survive it. It's the guy who saves the world and then COMES HOME TO HIS FAMILY.

The romance is dealt with class and respect throughout the game. She is NOT a party member. The plot isn't to save her from kidnappers. She stays home, bakes bread and worries about him. And the scene when the two finally admit their feelings and consumate their love is also dealt with subtlety and taste.

Overall, it was a good, well thought out romance that added to the story rather than distract from it.

 

[Mount]

I think it as supposed to be Tifa since Cloud met Aeris for the first time during the game and she died about two hours of gameplay later.

OMG SPOILERS! ^_^

Now for real content: A stable relationship is BORING to anyone who isn't in it. Yay, you're happy, you had a wonderful vacation, and your kids are brilliant, please shut up. Story-driven games (and movies) depend on drama to move them; if your relationship is so bloody wonderful, then why would you want to change it? Stable relationships tend to change (and thus produce drama) only due to external stressors -- kidnapped child, cheating spouse, zombie uprising...

The things that typically motivate humans are; Lust, Greed (for wealth or power), Wrath/Vengeance, Duty, Idealism/Dream. (I think there were a couple more that were mentioned in my college writing classes, but that's been a loooong time back.) Yes, the roaring-rampage-of-revenge is hackneyed and cliche, especially when we-the-gamers have only known the spouse/victim for 45 seconds, and they were so paper-thin that they were apparently born via origami. Simply put, it's MUCH easier to write a character who's motivated by negative emotion than positive. "Rrraugh they killed my dog and must PAY!" is easier (and probably more believable) than "I don't wish to kill them, but my liege/the state/Mom said they have to die, and I am honor-bound to obey!"

BioWare has done a lot in making in-game relationships deeper and more believable, but in the end, the relationship plots in ME and DA are still of the "forced together by the Plot" variety; if it weren't for the Big Bad, you'd likely have never MET those characters. And anyway... SOME of us are still annoyed that we didn't get to boink the dwarf.

 

[CrawlingPastaHellion]

- He really does need to get laid... (Solomon Moto)
- Big time! (Tristan Taylor)

I don't have anything against fleshed out romantic relationships in games as long as they bring something to the story, thus are more than just an afterthought.

As much as I hate "Shadow of the Colossus" the bond its protagonist was chained by to his lover was a powerful driving force behind all of his actions. I even got his character, as his motivations were as clear as a good vodka: no matter the cost he would resurrect that girl. I felt respect for him, one of the few game characters I felt respect for.

 

[tzimize]

"I need to get laid". Nice.

WAIT WAIT!! I need something so I don't get whacked for low content. Er....Great post?
I liked the couple in sands of time?

Yeah, that'll do. (No, I really did like it. The dialouge there was superb. Why did they fire whoever wrote that before making sequels?!?!)

EDIT: Ouch, Vamp! Not so rough!

One of my favorite game couples as well. I also liked the pair-interaction in Enslaved: Odyssey to the west. The start of the game sets a very interesting scene as the girl eventually holds power over the guy, and he MUST help her.

I wish they'd explored their relationship a bit more than they did though, it could have been a 10.

Khalid and Jaheira has also been mentioned. Their relationship was awesome, and Khalids following death was equally devastating. It was also extremely interesting to woo Jaheira afterwards and see her struggling with the guilt and thoughts of Khalid.

Fuck I need to replay Baldurs Gate

 

[ChupathingyX]

Personally, Meng Huo and Zhu Rong have always been my favourite video game couple...


...because although they love each other they also constantly fight. And isn't that what real couples do all the time?

 

[Strazdas]

Well, fallout series had a few NPC-to-NPC relationships.

 

[FlipC]

Jackie Estacado and Jenny Ramano in The Darkness perhaps?

 

[Griffolion]

I agree that this lack of true relationships in video games is silly and it stops video games from being taken seriously as a medium. Your examples remind me of Aeris and Tifa in Final Fantasy 7. I could never tell which of them was supposed to actually be Cloud's girlfriend/love interest so I didn't really care at all when Aeris died.

I think it as supposed to be Tifa since Cloud met Aeris for the first time during the game and she died about two hours of gameplay later.

Twas a love triangle. Tifa has always liked Cloud since they were kids, but I think that when Cloud met Aeris, he fell for her a bit. In one of the special features of the Advent Children Blu Ray, there's a small video where you see Cloud finally ask Tifa out on a date.

Also, Yahtzee, just a thought. For a video game, what's more fun. Kratos murdering basically everything, or seeing a bereavement counselor twice a week? "Press X to talk about that time in the park."

 

[hexFrank202]

Add me to your list of boys who don't 'possess it'. Largely, I cannot get aroused by people on my screen making out or having sex without character development; without weight to the event.

But enough of that, here's what I really wanted to say today:
Yahtzee, I am loving this journal more and more every week. Not just that it's covering topics even more interesting, but that it is getting to be ridiculously and unfathomably well-written. Not a single sentence is boring or predicted; it's the kind of razor-sharp, fully-alert writing I strive to produce myself. In this very paragraph, you can see how embarrassingly hard I am trying.

Yahtzee, you care to be excellent in everything that you do. I have a lot of respect for that.

 

[svenjl]

Speaking of which, didn't Red Dead Redemption feature a married guy whose family is still alive? That's a rarity right there. Meanwhile Relic takes it a bit further with a gruff dude who killed his wife (as well as everybody else on the planet) for heresy and believes he did the right thing.

Yeah, but for the main part of the game they only serve as a 'Princess Peach'. Although (spoiler alert) the last hour of the game obviously makes up for that to a certain extent. Then again, an ending like that pretty much makes up for every fault a game could possibly have, if you ask me.

I was thinking Red Dead too as I read the article. John Marsden (haven't played it for ages but I think the name is right) has to do the bidding of federal agents who are basically holding his wife and son hostage until Marsden takes out his former gang. It's pretty epic. I'm married and I found the scene *SPOILER ALERT* where Marsden rides back to his ranch to be reunited with them quite poignant. I also spent much of the game before that wondering if he'd end up with the ranch owner's daughter he hangs out with and helps a lot. It seemed like she had a real soft spot for him. Great game, brutal ending and you bet I had the son hunt down the old SOB fed who double-crossed Marsden.

 

[Truly-A-Lie]

The problem with Persona 4's relationships was how they weren't part of the main game. I enjoyed them and they were done well in-and-of-themselves, but nothing in the main plot changed based on them. Tell Chie she looks sexy while dating Yukiko? No problem. Try to pair up with the girl you're dating in any situation that seems like you'll be pairing up with someone? Sorry, they'd rather go with Teddie. Get the girl you're dating to sit in your lap during King's Game? She's just as embarrassed as if she hadn't been dating you for 5 months. They don't even give you special goodbye if you were dating them!

I can understand that they wouldn't want to record that much dialogue, but even in the text only parts they don't add anything. Your final goodbye to everyone you maxed out is the worst. Your girlfriend(s) don't change their goodbye at all. They don't even tack an "I love you" onto the end of the text. Ugh.

(If you couldn't tell, this bothered me periodically throughout my 80 hours of Persona 4)

Yeah that did annoy me too, I think the worst one for me was during the beauty contest and Teddie asks if they're seeing or liked anyone. I was in a relationship with Chie at the time, and she just got embarrassed and said nothing. I got angry, but I managed to stay in character. In my mind, she was ashamed to even publicly say we were going out and I took to thinking that it was over because she wouldn't even stop that bear's crazy advances.

I do really like the options that are there, and the build up to a relationship, but it does need to come together a bit tighter for Persona 5. Starting with consequences for dating 5 people at once. Besides that, other characters reacting to your status as "taken" would be nice and new dialogue options for when you are. Yukiko asked me out while I was going out with who was meant to be her best friend, and I couldn't even say "sorry but I'm taken."

 

[aescuder]

And yet this problem exists in all other media as well. And they have no excuse seeing how they've been around for so much longer. The answer to this problem is really, really simple. Happy couples have no real conflict and that's not interesting. Also, believable romance is incredibly difficult to write and the games industry, at least, still has the excuse of not always being written by professional writers.

Agreed. Yet oddly enough, half the sitcoms out there are about the small conflicts within a married life or long-time relationships. I'm thinking of modern family, everybody loves raymond, king of queens, HIMYM, Arrested Development, etc. Videogame narratives can easily stretch out to 40 hours (at least old RPGs used to) so they have plenty of time to pander around 2-3 seasons of existing relationships. I'm wondering if its because the conflicts does not revolve around a grander scale or combat that videogames tend to stay away from existing relationships.

Even if it doesn't revolve around main gameplay mechanics (although it would be interesting if it could), a mini-game where you can banter/tease/argue with your long-time gf during a break from all the fighting can speak volumes.

But yes ultimately it is because of bad writers in the industry. Also game designers that can't design with/around complex relationship narratives.

 

[HoradricNoob]

Come now. how about Sam & Max. Those fuzzy little guys made a great couple.

 

[PlasticTree]

I also spent much of the game before that wondering if he'd end up with the ranch owner's daughter he hangs out with and helps a lot. It seemed like she had a real soft spot for him. Great game, brutal ending and you bet I had the son hunt down the old SOB fed who double-crossed Marsden.

Yeah, I kind of expected that his wife would die and that he would eventually get married to Bonnie, or something like that. The game also spends much more time in establishing the likable character of Bonnie and her relation with John than is the case with his wife (until the ending that is). There is also this scene near the ending where his wife (forgot her name) meets Bonnie, and I couldn't help to notice the difference between my attitude towards the two women and John's.

The fact that Bonnie remains alone and sad does help in making the story more grim/realistic and less fairytale-ish, though. Not that that wasn't clear yet, but still.

 

[fieryshadowcard]

It would be nice to see a game with the protagonist already in an established relationship with someone, a relationship that serves to add depth to the character but is not immediately used either as a plot tool or as the functioning premise of the game. Catherine (anime trope-isms and all-around lack of understanding of the way humans work aside) is a step in the right direction, but it's not what I'm getting at based on what I just described. Why not have a game where player control shifts between the player and the significant other depending on the point in the game you are at? And I don't mean as something level-based. It could even be manual, where the characters have different strengths that can either be instructed (though less effective considering it's AI) when you're not playing them or controlled directly when you are, where you jump between them and therefore have more control not over their gameplay but their interactions and responses? Why not have a game where the missus (or the mister for the politically correct) even as an NPC is not always off-screen as a goal or something to be obtained and instead serves as a constant interaction for a protagonist who does not have to be a silent husk--you know, a 3-dimensional character? In that regard, their relationship isn't what gets the game going, but keeps the characters accessible and compelling. Of course, that requires good storytelling and an understanding of all the possible ways a player might choose to interact with that person. Sounds like hard work, right? But are we really fine with not asking games to work harder to keep us interested 30-something years after gaming really took off?

You know what would be an awesome game? Think of a family like that in the Incredibles (no, I don't mean a game adaptation of the movie, just a concept of an entire family united for a common goal), and set it up where they all have individual pros and cons but all can be controlled by the player; I don't even necessarily mean that you need to give them powers, just things they excel at and whatnot. Make some parts of the game where you only have access to one, but most of the game where you have access to all of them. And make it so that there's no one correct way to go through the obstacles presented in the game. And make some choices easier or harder based on who you interact with and how. You know, it'd be like the Incredibles meets Sam and Max meets (at least from what I've heard about the game) Deus Ex.

The depth and complexity it would require to make such a game come to fruition is immense, I'm sure. But I cannot honestly think of such a concept not being a damn great, timeless game. Or at least the stepping stone for whatever game truly achieves that status.

 

[Hosker]

Having relationships in games would just be boring. How are they meant to be worked into the gameplay? Dragon Age does it best as all it takes are a few gifts and conversations and they're done. Once you're actually in the relationship it would be very boring: you would know just about everything there is worth knowing about that person, so conversations would be a chore.