Forget the Friend Zone, it's OK to be attracted to a friend

[BringBackBuck]

At the same time, if you're in your teens or twenties there's a good chance you'll be attracted to said friend at some level.

Why the age specification OP? I'm in my 30's with lots of female friends, some of whom I would love to plow till next july.

 

[theparsonski]

Okay, so I know that a lot of people use the friend-zone as a shield to protect themselves from blame, or simply from facing up to the fact that they just aren't the right type of guy for their friends, but I believe there is a friendzone. It's a lot smaller and more specific than many people claim, but it's still there, and it's still a thing.

My own experience of liking a girl who was my close friend ended in her essentially saying that she wasn't into me in that way but she didn't want anything to change in our friendship - hell, if anything we only grew closer as a result of me telling her.

However, she said to my other closest mate that if she wasn't such good friends with me, she could actually see something having happened between us. She just doesn't really believe that relationships with close friends work. That is being friendzoned, in my opinion. When the only thing that is getting in the way of a potential relationship is the closeness of your friendship.

Just my opinion; feel free to disagree.

 

[Doclector]

Logically speaking, allowing that feeling to exist is hazardous to my wellbeing.

let's just say for a moment that I'm not completely retarded and socially bankrupt, and I hit on a girl at a club. It fails, as usual, as always, but if nobody who would mock me witnesses it, there is no ongoing effect if I do not let there be one.

If I become friends with a girl and become attracted to her, it's socially unnacceptable to pretend we never met if I asked her out and failed. It's simply not done, for partially good reason, from her point of view, that's just crappy manners.

But if I stick around, I have to endure it. I have to remind myself why it's hopeless to try. I have to remind myself that I'm a piece of shit who nobody would ever be attracted to in order for things to not fall apart.

Every. Single. Time. we meet.

Thus the only logical option is to completely destroy said feelings. Not allow them to develop. That is far easier than controlling them. Allowing them to develop has no likely positive outcomes, only negative ones.

Ever considered that it's your self-loathing that makes you unattractive to women? There's no social grace required when you say "Would you like to go out to dinner with me?" to a friend. If she says no, you can say "I was being friendly". If she says yes, then you already know how to interact with her at the restaurant, it's a lot easier to end up dating her.

Well, I don't usually tell anyone I know unless I'm really depressed. I know, people can see it, but what am I supposed to do, lie to myself? Convince myself I'm not ugly, that I have some form of charm, that I have something that anyone else would want?

And they always know. They know the body language that's a complete fucking mystery to someone like me. They always know and they always talk about it when someone fails to attract someone. I've heard them talk about other, better people that way, so I know they'll be fucking laughing about me. No, if I fail, I have to leave that group of friends forever, because from that point on, all I am is a joke.

And don't go saying they're not real friends. That may be true, but I've never seen anyone who doesn't do this. I'll take at least a little company over complete isolation.

 

[FieryTrainwreck]

*snip*

*snip*

Hehe.

I think you're a bit over-analyzing this, considering it's just modern slang for "person doesn't want to be more than friends". No need to wax poetic about these perceived psychological implications,

especially since all supposed implications are entirely circumstantial.

NGOKC [https://sites.google.com/site/niceguysofokc/]

After a while, you begin to recognize the pathology.

Ew. Just ew. So much reaching. Comes off horribly, and I'm generally someone who enjoys calling folks out on hypocritical bullshit. The homophobia? Sure. Racist jokes? Totally depends. Shaved legs? That's an aesthetic preference, and maybe the guy is all about shaving himself, too. Preferring to date someone of your own race/background - we're punishing men for who does and does not give them a boner now?

What ALL of these ideas and theories fail to mention is that every person and every relationship is unique. There might be similarities here or there, but you can't throw a blanket over the term "nice guy", or "friend-zone", etc. without invariably missing something.

I will tell you what I do hate: the idea that anyone is perfect. And I don't just mean physically or financially - I mean mentally. Folks have issues. Some guys are very supportive, very sweet, very generous, and very jealous. Some guys are both incredible friends and ridiculous hornballs. Some guys are confident and independent and secure but withholding and miserly. Same goes for gals, all points. So when I see a site that's railing on guys for claiming they are "nice", only to list a bunch of stuff that qualifies as "not nice" on a purely subjective level (like it or not), it comes off... bleh.

Don't get me wrong, there is often something to the "nice guys are delusional" phenomena that has risen up to combat the "girls only date assholes" nonsense. But that's precisely my point: both theories are sometimes true and sometimes not. Such is the case with almost every sweeping theory about male/female interaction. So what value do any of them really have other than categorization after the fact? And how would you ever hope to eject subjectivity from such evaluations?

Also, I've used the term friend-zone more than a few times in reference to a situation where I had feelings for a girl who did not return them. At no point did I view her as being responsible for what happened between us. I've always taken responsibility for my feelings. That's probably when I always phrase it as "in the friend zone" as opposed to "she friend-zoned me". It's a natural phenomena to me, something that just happens when random chance decides that two people should meet and hit it off but only one of them wants something more.

Edit: btw, reading that blog further, there's some decent cognitive dissonance going on. On the one hand, people are lambasted for answering "yes" to the question "should a woman be required to shave her legs" (when I think it's a fair bet that a number of the respondents mean to say "I prefer shaved legs"). On the other hand, people are similarly trashed for answering "yes" to the question "can someone have had too many sex partners" (where an equally literal approach obviously allows for some very legitimate ideas about "too many" - for instance, several thousand).

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

The Friend Zone should only refer to a 2km wide area that runs the entire length of the US-Canada border.

 

[TJC]

I'm sick of you guys complaining about this 'friendzone'. If you are not a suitable mate, then go and man up.

I'm also sick of these friendzone threads. There are already many of them on the database of the Escapist. Also, please see my response above.

You...quoted yourself agreeing with yourself. wat?

I'm more curious whether this obvious and sad ego boost causes a notification in his own inbox. A mystery that could easily be solved by directly asking but I'm somehow not exactly burning with desire to engage with said individual.

NGOKC [https://sites.google.com/site/niceguysofokc/]

After a while, you begin to recognize the pathology.

AHAHAHAA, this site is hilarious. At times I'm wondering whether it's only some of the dumbass questions that makes guys look like Nice Guys? (I mean, I don't think women should be obligated to shave their legs but I do like it :C ) but then you find these golden moments of their own rants and questions that are obviously homophobic and shit and it's just pure hilarity. In any case, thanks for giving me another plump fruit of procrastination here.

 

[Nickolai77]

At its core, the friendzone is simply a more modern variant of unrequited love- where the romantic feelings held by one friend are "not reciprocated or returned in kind" by the other. Both males and females can be friendzoned. I've been friendzoned more times than i care to count, but i've also friendzoned girls in the past as well. The reason why it tends to be guys who get friendzoned is because guys are a lot more easy-going in falling into romantic relationships with female friends, hence it's a generally lot easier for a girl to turn a friendship with a guy to a relationship than the other way round.

I think there's also a lot of unfair criticism said against "nice guys" who fall into the friendzone. It's something that i went through and looking back to when i was a young teenager i can't blame myself for it. Societal expectations are that guys should make the first move in initiating a relationship, which is a far more complicated and difficult process than simply "asking a girl out". Things like flirting as well don't come naturally to many people either, so its difficult to make your intentions known, or subtly investigate if your feelings are are shared or not. It's not hard to see how many guys remain just friends with girls they fancy. It's all part of climbing an emotionally difficult learning curve in understanding romance.

You can interpret this to be sexist and misogynist because "nice guys" believe that by simply being nice to a girl they deserve to get into a relationship with her. But what else can teenagers, who aren't exceptionally attractive or confident do? Not develop those romantic feelings in the first place? Attempt flirting? Get rejected in asking them out and break all contact with them? In the end, you're just nice to them because that's the only thing you can do- and fundamentally, you love them as a person, so being nice to them comes naturally.

It's fair to criticise how some "nice guys" emotionally respond to the fallout of such an experience. It is wrong of them to expect they deserve a relationship for being nice, or think that girls are only attracted to assholes- but to me the frustration is certainly understandable. By all means explain why their wrong in thinking those things, but don't shout them down for being "nice guys". It's like shouting down a toddler trying to learn to walk. Given the way men and women are, and the way society expects them to behave, there's inevitably going to be a lot of disappointed young "nice guys."

 

[Dusty Fred]

At the same time, if you're in your teens or twenties there's a good chance you'll be attracted to said friend at some level.

Why the age specification OP? I'm in my 30's with lots of female friends, some of whom I would love to plow till next july.

I didn't mean to exclude anyone, but I didn't want to generalise either. I'm 25 so I felt reasonably confident that I could speak for people my age. The fourth decade is uncharted territory for me, so I didn't want to stray beyond what I could speak from experience on. That's all.
I'm open to any and all input, regardless of age, gender, outlook or species!

 

[Gunjester]

Arguments for the Friendzone would be that they're not attracted but they "love" her and that's why it hurts so much. I'm slower to believe that because I feel like common society has no f*cking idea what love actually is, but hey, if they're true about it that does suck.

I myself thoguht I was in the friendzone with a girl I hadn't hit on, I'd given up before I'd tried. However, last summer I had resolved to be more confident and blunt from now on and then I told her how I had felt for the last four years. We've been dating for almost six months now, going pretty well.

 

[gazumped]

'Friend-zone' makes no sense to me because I cannot understand why being friends would hurt romantic prospects.

I understand I may be in the minority here, but if I'm not interested in someone, it's because we're not good enough friends. The closer we are, the more attractive I find them, because it shows that we're compatible. It actually makes having platonic best friends tricky for me but nonetheless, it makes the term 'friend-zone' completely meaningless for me.

And I'm sure I can't be the only person who thinks like this. If someone doesn't think of you as a romantic partner it's not because they think of you as a friend... the two things are in no way mutually exclusive.

 

[Entitled]

The concept of friendzoning is found in both genders :S why is it when it's discussed male this and insecure boys that are always mentioned?

Not equally, no. The vast proportion of people complaining about the friendzone are male. While I would agree that some women use the term, they are a very small minority. And they too are being immature when they do that.

I think it's more common with men simply because women are more culturally expected to repress their sexuality.

Just like when you see a youtube video with a man and a woman in it, and all comments are about how hot the woman is, but there are none about the man.

It's the same deal with friends. Men usually feel more comfortable openly exclaiming how attractive they find any of their female friends, and how they would be intersted in a relationhip with them if possible. Meanwhile, women are more guilt-tripped into acting all chaste and asexual, so they are more likely to deny that they might possibly look at anyone else that way.

Then again, some members of both genders subvert these norms. But whether or not the word "friendzone" is actually used to describe this by either of them, is mostly just coinciential.

 

[thesilentman]

I have never understood this whole friend-zone deal. It's perfectly fine to be friends and not be attracted, and also the inverse. I repeat, THERE IS NO ISSUE WITH THIS. If you're attracted to a friend of the opposite (or same, depending on your preference) gender, it is not the end of the world.

Now if someone can explain to me why this is an issue, I'll be greatly appreciated.

 

[Hagi]

The Friend Zone should only refer to a 2km wide area that runs the entire length of the US-Canada border.

I fear I must disagree.

Henceforth I proclaim the Friend Zone shall refer to the nearest red lights district. It shall make all Friend Zone related conversations much more hilarious.

"Man... I just got friendzoned again..."

"Ah... You did use a condom right?"

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

The Friend Zone should only refer to a 2km wide area that runs the entire length of the US-Canada border.

I fear I must disagree.

Henceforth I proclaim the Friend Zone shall refer to the nearest red lights district. It shall make all Friend Zone related conversations much more hilarious.

"Man... I just got friendzoned again..."

"Ah... You did use a condom right?"

I did consider this but discarded the idea because I've never paid any of my friends to have sex with them.

 

[Fidelias]

The "Friend Zone" is a lot more complicated than people make it out to be, because, well, people are complex, and romance is doubly so. (Yeah, that sounded a little douchey to me too, but let's keep going.) Actually, this whole idea of the friend zone, created by "Nice Guys" is really stupid. If you were actually a nice guy, you wouldn't think this crap. You give actual, genuinely nice guys a bad name.

So, yeah, obviously, if you have a friend you find physically attractive, you're obviously going to have feelings for her. This isn't actually a bad thing, but you have to keep in mind that people sometimes want something different from their significant others than they want from their friends. Besides that, you have to try to understand exactly how you think of her. It could very well be that you are only pursuing her because, for lack of a better word, she's conveniant. She's pretty, and you get along. But she might not really be right for you.

About the whole, "once you're in the friend zone, you can't get out" bullshit, this isn't true at all. My friend told me that her best relationships developed from year-long friendships. She doesn't like to become romantically involved with people she just met, she actually likes to spend some time with them first, and get comfortable with them.
A GIRL, who you have a higher chance of romance with the longer you've known her, and the more you and her get along! Crazy, right? Is this the Twilight Zone!?

It really all depends about what you're looking for in a relationship, but if you really are falling in love with a friend, you really should do something about it. Ask her out, see what happens. It's much better than just bottling it up inside. But you can't use friendship as a crutch. So what if you've helped her, so what if you've been there for her? That does not mean she owes you. It definitely doesn't mean that you're right for her. If she doesn't think it's going to work, don't act like an ass. Take some time, sort yourself out, and move on.

So yeah, I find the idea of the "Friend Zone" utterly ridiculous. It's only the friend zone if you don't have the courage to say what you really mean.
And hiding the truth just because you feel it would be better to not shake things up will definitely come back to bite you in the long run. Besides the fact that you'll probably feel tortured every time you see her.

 

[Vegosiux]

'Friend-zone' makes no sense to me because I cannot understand why being friends would hurt romantic prospects.

I understand I may be in the minority here, but if I'm not interested in someone, it's because we're not good enough friends. The closer we are, the more attractive I find them, because it shows that we're compatible. It actually makes having platonic best friends tricky for me but nonetheless, it makes the term 'friend-zone' completely meaningless for me.

You're definitely not alone. That's very similar to how I approach relationships. I can easily be friends with women I'm attracted to, but being attracted to women I'm not friends with is often quite hard.

Ironically, I'd say that's exactly why the "friend zone" is possibly a thing. Talk about "friendship" when turning someone down...it's not a real reason, it's a cop-out. And that's why it aggravates me, because I do prefer it when people are straight with me. Because, for crying out loud, the first thing you do if you truly want to be a friend of mine, is be straight with me.

Also, I agree with that too, it's much easier to be attracted to someone you know than someone you have no clue what they'll seem like once their open their mouth for anything other than small talk....and I hate small talk.

 

[Hagi]

The Friend Zone should only refer to a 2km wide area that runs the entire length of the US-Canada border.

I fear I must disagree.

Henceforth I proclaim the Friend Zone shall refer to the nearest red lights district. It shall make all Friend Zone related conversations much more hilarious.

"Man... I just got friendzoned again..."

"Ah... You did use a condom right?"

I did consider this but discarded the idea because I've never paid any of my friends to have sex with them.

WHAT?

You mean all those adult friend finders are lies!?

HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN TO ME!

Ahem... nevermind... I'll just be over here...

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

I'm so confused. I feel like this is more 'OMG YOU HAVE FEELINGS HOW CAN YOU BE SUCH A TERRIBLE PERSON' responses that seems to be so keen on the interwebs.

However, when I learned about the term 'Friendzone', it came when women I was interested in said they could only see me as a friend. It wasn't some funny term to dismiss the feelings of the various women... it was the term that was used when women politely rejected you by saying you're only a friend. I don't even see how that's bad?

I mean, there were only a few times a woman I was interested in told me 'I don't find you attractive'. And I never turned around and said 'Yeah, she friendzoned me'. I said she didn't find me attractive. If the woman in question gave me a reason or told me that she wasn't attracted to me, I didn't use the term 'friendzone'. No one I knew did. If she did use the term friend, we said the term.

It's not dismissive to anyone's feelings if they used the term friend. It would be if he or she went on to say other things and a person used it as a way to save their ego. In all honestly, this all feels like the term 'friendzone' is tied up with the overwhelming distaste and vitriol with Nice Guys (tm).

 

[Vegosiux]

However, when I learned about the term 'Friendzone', it came when women I was interested in said they could only see me as a friend. It wasn't some funny term to dismiss the feelings of the various women... it was the term that was used when women politely rejected you by saying you're only a friend. I don't even see how that's bad?

One, being a grammar nazi I'm getting exasperated at the word "friend" being used when "acquaintance" is meant; and two, I do see it as bad if someone assumes about me that I don't even have the spine to handle some honesty.

It's not dismissive to anyone's feelings if they used the term friend. It would be if he or she went on to say other things and a person used it as a way to save their ego. In all honestly, this all feels like the term 'friendzone' is tied up with the overwhelming distaste and vitriol with Nice Guys (tm).

It's not dismissive, but again, the first thing you do if you want to be my friend, is be straight with me instead of sugarcoating stuff and being evasive.