Gaming Journalists Make No Damn Sense

Status
Not open for further replies.

Gordon_4

The Big Engine
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
6,401
5,662
118
Australia
Solo was the one with the feminist robot right?
No, her gag is more that she’s a sort of soap box Sadie for droid liberation and equality; she also wants to bang Lando. Honestly I thought she was hilarious, and considering they lacked the infinite well of charisma that is Harrison Ford at age 21, Solo is a pretty solid heist flick in space.
 

Houseman

Mad Hatter Meme Machine.
Legacy
Apr 4, 2020
3,910
760
118
So if that's what your requirements are for pushing a "progressive or radical feminist ideology"
It isn't. It's just examples of "progressive or radical feminist ideologies" in games. Games can contain those elements without being games ABOUT those elements. Those elements can also detrimentally impact the game to the degree proportional to their inclusion.
 

Worgen

Follower of the Glorious Sun Butt.
Legacy
Apr 1, 2009
14,937
3,809
118
Gender
Whatever, just wash your hands.
houseman is just your typical weeb who is angry the industry has moved on and no along amused by basic titillating content.
No, its worse than that, hes a conspiracy theorists. Which means its pointless to talk to him since its insanely difficult to logic someone out of that hole.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BrawlMan

Houseman

Mad Hatter Meme Machine.
Legacy
Apr 4, 2020
3,910
760
118
Still waiting on that list of top 5 progressive/radfem games because appealing to this demographic is such a good idea.
 

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
6,012
665
118
I mean, I'm pretty sure Gillette going woke and asking men to not be sexist bullies didn't convince a lot of dudes to start growing beards. (Funny as it is to see places like Law Enforcement Today get very mad at an add that says "please don't bully")
1) It's based on a load of stereotypes
2) That only only hold true for a small minority and
3) Comes off as boring and lecturing as though men are too stupid to get it otherwise.

501594b96f43f609bb880cbcd8d90491.gif

Betty from HR is who shops for her husband, son, etc. Gillette also sells women "branded" (ie: colored pink) razors.
Men don't have preferred brands and just go with whatever their wives pick out for them?

4chan is not the internet. You should probably broaden your experiences a bit.
Even twitter was roasting them lol


Oh dear God, not the DISLIKES. How will they ever recover as a company from this?!?!?
Which is an indication of how much people don't like it
 
Last edited:

Houseman

Mad Hatter Meme Machine.
Legacy
Apr 4, 2020
3,910
760
118
Men don't have preferred brands and just go with whatever their wives pick out for them?
That's such an old-fashioned view of women, doing all the shopping, taking care of all the domestics. How sexist! Sounds like he needs to watch a few more progressive commercials until he gets up to speed and joins us here in $CURRENT_YEAR
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dwarvenhobble

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
9,570
825
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
It isn't. It's just examples of "progressive or radical feminist ideologies" in games. Games can contain those elements without being games ABOUT those elements. Those elements can also detrimentally impact the game to the degree proportional to their inclusion.
I'm pretty sure there's no major games with said ideologies. Very few major games are about anything that you'd consider important let alone your very specific thing that you're looking for. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a couple of indie games that fit the bill but them selling or not selling isn't really surprising as that's indie games in general. Gamers decried that they don't want politics in their games (which is just asinine) and there's Disco Elysium winning best RPG at the most commercial game awards there is. Any commercial product with a radical view of anything is in very low quantity because why would a company would to instantly lose out on a large chunk of potential customers. Heck, Assassin's Creed's original historical fiction plot premise (I have no idea where the series plot is at now) is pretty shocking for a video game and that series has been extremely successful.

Still waiting on that list of top 5 progressive/radfem games because appealing to this demographic is such a good idea.
Still waiting on a list of major titles that actually fit your very specific and never explained requirements...

If none of these games exist, then there's no examples of them being either successful or unsuccessful and thus the opposite is true in that there's no example of it being a bad idea either.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gyrobot

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
6,012
665
118
I keep getting told that being offended at things is the literal worst. Cant be offended at Mohammed cartoons, cant be offended at Jewish caricatures, cant be offended at people grabbing women by the pussy, cant be offended at Nazi pugs, cant be offended at racial realism or knees in the back of necks etc.

When did being offended at something become okay again?
It's always been OK.

The issue is the reaction to it and the push (once again) that because some-one doesn't enjoy it it shouldn't exist.


In the case of Gillette people voiced their displeasure and if the what was it 7 Billion loss is anything to go buy at least in part stopped buying the thing. They didn't try to get the CEO fired as a sexist. They didn't try to drum people out of the industry


Just going to put it out there. Solo was a deliberate attempt to reserve the 'Go Woke, Go Broke' thing. It was the least progressive thing Disney put out in a long time. Did it work? Nope

But thanks for showing us how Cherry Picking works. Because things like Black Panther, Spiderverse, Captain Marvel and Endgame were all very woke. And didnt make them go broke
Black Panther = That had a huge push for it and a lot of gas-lighting in the media about being the first Black superhero film. It's a trick that can only be pulled once.

Spiderverse = People actually like Miles as he's seen as a character first and a skin colour second. Also his Dad's a Cop.

Captain Marvel = We may never know fully with that one with reports of empty screenings (how true they are who knows) and being sold as "the start of Endgame" or "A prequel bit with info relevant to Endgame"

Endgame = yes the final film in a huge phase of the MCU, other than a few moments it really wasn't that woke

Also Solo got a fair bit of media attention was due to Pansexual Lando and his Robot revolutionary girlfriend mostly.

But Ok lets play a game.

I won't even pick the games myself

For this lot of evidence I hall use New Normative a self proclaimed progressive gaming website and their list of claimed right wing boycotts against what are presumably meant as progressive games.


Ready?

Destiny = No evidence it impacted sales, though no actual evidence of an organised boycott either.

Wolfenstein 2 = Well PC Games N claimed sales were sluggish though Totalbiscuit did say the game was actually worse than the first

Bioware / Mass Effect Andromeda = Well they abandoned DLC plans so it likely wasn't profitable enough though better sales info is hard to come buy.

Gamefreak because of Pokemon Jinx changes = No but no real evidence of a boycott called for either

Insomniac Spider man over Trump Travel ban comments = No evidence of an actual call to boycott again.

Fire Emblem, removing one of the minigames = No evidence of an actual call to boycott again.

Life is Strange 2 = As found by users on Reset Era is launched with only 1/4 the number of people bothering to play it that most recent entry saw and 2,000 less people than even the first game

EA over BAttlefield V = The Layman covered the numbers on that one though my impression of the game was it hadn't advanced much since Battlefield 3 in terms of gameplay or engine capabilities.

Rockstar because in Red Dead you can Kill KKK members = No evidence of an actual call to boycott again. Funnily enough there was more anger and articles about a guy feeding a suffragette to crocodiles

Campo Santo for abusing DMCA against Pewdiepie = Well I dunno but Vale were able to buy them up and the new game they were working on is now on hold indefinitely.

Stardew Vallye = No but no real evidence of a boycott called for either

CDPR for apologising for a tweet = No but no real evidence of a boycott called for either but plenty of people keep yelling CDPR are transphobic online even to this day.

2K games due to communism = No but no real evidence of a boycott called for either
 

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
6,012
665
118
Not listed but also worth pointing to as possible get woke go broke moments. (if you want I can provide links for some of these but please say which)

the America Chavez stand alone series - character herself is fine the writing was apparently the big issue.

The captain Marvel comic series

Goddess Mode by DC and the Vertigo relaunch

In gaming:

Rumours Tacoma only didn't fail due to Microsoft exclusivity

Where the Water tastes like Wine failing to break even.

Revolution 60 failing to break even / selling poorly

Not Tonight the post Brexit dystopian game pushed by a number of places sold only ~8,000 copies in total.

The Chinese Room who were vocal in their support of Remain in brexit campiagns having to close their studio and go back to being a 2 person team working from their home.

Tale of Tales literally having to close down and leave gaming, until they got more arts council funding after their one non arts council funded game failed to sell enough to keep them going.

To be clear Woke and diverse are two different things. Wokeness tends to feel poorly thought out and artificial.

Take let say Killjoys the series, not considered woke really and not held up as something great:

Diverse cast

Black Female lead

She's a bounty Hunter

Takes down male characters bigger than herself with skill and technique.

Gay character who reveals he is kind of seriously kick ass

Bi character and one implied to be Bi-curious

Lesbian characters.



Then take Vagrant queen which was on the same network just after Killjoys ended and held up as some beacon of being progressive but came off as woke.

Black female lead whose also secretly an empress or something.

Implied to be bi / a lesbian

Another character on the crew is implied to be bi-lesbian.

Apparently features the colour pink a lot in the show.

Gets praised by most characters as her being badass.

Lead male character is described in the trailers as a deadbeat and she punches him when he says something that upsets her apparently.

Takes down soldiers bigger than herself by punching them in the chest and them fall over
 

Iron

BOI
Sep 6, 2013
1,741
259
88
Country
Occupied Palestine
You're mistaking you, personally, for intended audience. It's a bad assumption
I haven't, it's not something based on my personal opinion. You still haven't explained your perplexing accusation and assumptions from earlier, you just spouted nonsense and moved on.
 

Dreiko

Elite Member
Legacy
May 1, 2020
2,888
980
118
CT
Country
usa
Gender
male, pronouns: your majesty/my lord/daddy
I never played it. What's "progressive" and/or "radical feminism" about it?

From my few minutes of research, it seems like it's an RPG where you can be from any extreme of the political spectrum if you want.
Elysium is good because of the storytelling and deep systems. It has good writing and complex idea-based branching dialogue and a lot of freedom for doing things your way that the world reacts to in an intuitive and organic way.

It also is very political too, but it is not good because it is political.

I think that's the key point here. You can have a game be both political and good, but it needs to have a whooooooole lot more going on for it. For one, you can't just have one political viewpoint put on a pedestal. Because that veers from entertainment or enlightenment to propaganda. Elysium is good about this because you can be left or right or center or not give a damn about anything. There's a lot of other examples like MGS where they have a very severe anti-war message...but they deliver it in a context of Ninja cyborgs fighting mobile nuke robots and clone armies of hot ladies and a million other epic stuff, so it doesn't feel like it despises one side, rather, it respects it and finds it cool, but also is highly critical of it and thinks it is wrong. Showing this level of nuance is imperative if you wanna have a political game.


Much like with diversity, politics can be done right in games, but you can't have this preachy propagandistic approach with them. And you game needs to have more to it than just them to be good.

They're like a seasoning, a touch of salt can make a crappy meal into something tasty but you can't just subsist on salt.
 

Iron

BOI
Sep 6, 2013
1,741
259
88
Country
Occupied Palestine
No such games exist. No one does media like that in real life
Bloggers posing as journalists writing lists and getting paid stupid salaries because their company is running on a runway.
 

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
6,012
665
118
Elysium is good because of the storytelling and deep systems. It has good writing and complex idea-based branching dialogue and a lot of freedom for doing things your way that the world reacts to in an intuitive and organic way.

It also is very political too, but it is not good because it is political.

I think that's the key point here. You can have a game be both political and good, but it needs to have a whooooooole lot more going on for it. For one, you can't just have one political viewpoint put on a pedestal. Because that veers from entertainment or enlightenment to propaganda. Elysium is good about this because you can be left or right or center or not give a damn about anything. There's a lot of other examples like MGS where they have a very severe anti-war message...but they deliver it in a context of Ninja cyborgs fighting mobile nuke robots and clone armies of hot ladies and a million other epic stuff, so it doesn't feel like it despises one side, rather, it respects it and finds it cool, but also is highly critical of it and thinks it is wrong. Showing this level of nuance is imperative if you wanna have a political game.


Much like with diversity, politics can be done right in games, but you can't have this preachy propagandistic approach with them. And you game needs to have more to it than just them to be good.

They're like a seasoning, a touch of salt can make a crappy meal into something tasty but you can't just subsist on salt.
See people say MGS is Anti-War and it is but it's nuanced in it's approach and it also presents the "World without War" and how that can go horribly wrong. It doesn't pretend to have the true answers to how to end war.

I'm not 100% clear on the fully Metal Gear Solid through line but my understanding is MGS4 shows the issues of that world without war and it hasn't ended fighting it's just ended war. instead of war it's mercenary groups in constant skirmishes in various countries because the economy the Patriots have set up demands conflict of some kind thus war is ended because it's no longer got an end but is a perpetual thing going on.

However In MGS 3 it's shown the that to prevent war you sometimes needs to make sacrifices and that's how the series starts sort of with Snake being unhappy with the sacrifices and trying to find a better alternative of some kind.
 

CriticalGaming

Elite Member
Legacy
Dec 28, 2017
11,199
5,671
118
People who call Black Panther the first black super hero movie make me angry.

It is like the African American community doesnt support their own kick ass media.

Oh because Black Panther was mainstram and big? That's the only reason it was celebrated.

Nobody remembers Shaft, Spawn, or fucking Black Dynamite!!! I mean come on people ya'll is missing dope black led movies.

Oh and to hell with anyone who didnt like Shaquille O'Neil's movies. Those were awesome.

Oh what about Meteor Man staring Robert Townsend. That movie was also really cool.

Im white and i just farted these out off the top of my head.

Because the media wants to make black film leads a big deal as if they never happened before. But black led movies have been happening and awesome for a long time. But not that they are pretending it is a rare and crazy thing you would think we are still in the racist 1950's.

People have moved on from those views for the most part. The media just wants to make it seem like we havent because outrage and sensationalism brings in money.
 

Iron

BOI
Sep 6, 2013
1,741
259
88
Country
Occupied Palestine
People who call Black Panther the first black super hero movie make me angry.

It is like the African American community doesnt support their own kick ass media.

Oh because Black Panther was mainstram and big? That's the only reason it was celebrated.

Nobody remembers Shaft, Spawn, or fucking Black Dynamite!!! I mean come on people ya'll is missing dope black led movies.

Oh and to hell with anyone who didnt like Shaquille O'Neil's movies. Those were awesome.

Oh what about Meteor Man staring Robert Townsend. That movie was also really cool.

Im white and i just farted these out off the top of my head.

Because the media wants to make black film leads a big deal as if they never happened before. But black led movies have been happening and awesome for a long time. But not that they are pretending it is a rare and crazy thing you would think we are still in the racist 1950's.

People have moved on from those views for the most part. The media just wants to make it seem like we havent because outrage and sensationalism brings in money.
Hopefully this narrative jumps off a cliff once we go back to the new status-quo, pretend 2016-2020 never happened and carry on with our lives.
 

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Jun 21, 2012
9,007
3,017
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg
Imagine that. People that you lump into progressive because of their race/sex/sexuality. Just gonna put it out there but being a gay person doesn't automatically put you in as a progressive. Or trans. Or black. Because that is stupid

I think you've been Onioned, bro

I haven't, it's not something based on my personal opinion. You still haven't explained your perplexing accusation and assumptions from earlier, you just spouted nonsense and moved on.
The part where you advocated for burning things because you didn't like them? Here's a bit of a reminder:

Jordan was right. Republicans buy sneakers. This is a natural response, nothing sinister to it - you push too hard, you go broke.
Then you pretended you didn't because getting offended is bad

Yeah. I blew right past it because you aren't interest in having a conversation. Like what's the point? You just going to pretend your right and I'm wrong. I got it man, you think I'm wrong. Dont worry, Gillette will be fine without you or me
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gyrobot

Iron

BOI
Sep 6, 2013
1,741
259
88
Country
Occupied Palestine
Imagine that. People that you lump into progressive because of their race/sex/sexuality. Just gonna put it out there but being a gay person doesn't automatically put you in as a progressive. Or trans. Or black. Because that is stupid

I think you've been Onioned, bro


The part where you advocated for burning things because you didn't like them? Here's a bit of a reminder:


Then you pretended you didn't because getting offended is bad

Yeah. I blew right past it because you aren't interest in having a conversation. Like what's the point? You just going to pretend your right and I'm wrong. I got it man, you think I'm wrong. Dont worry, Gillette will be fine without you or me
Where did I advocate burning things because I didn't like them. Seriously there is a huge comms issue here.
 

Dreiko

Elite Member
Legacy
May 1, 2020
2,888
980
118
CT
Country
usa
Gender
male, pronouns: your majesty/my lord/daddy
I think the people who say things like Black Panther is the first black superhero movie are normies who think superhero movies started being a thing when the first Avengers came out, or Spiderman if I am charitable. I don't expect them to even know Blade is a comic hero even if they remember the movie existing.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.