Ghostbusters Director Calls Out "Assholes in Geek Culture"

[klaynexas3]

When was the last time there was a riot because geeks weren't happy about something?

You're shifting the goalposts. You're conflating severity of an action with frequency. That you can point to a smaller group doing worse things doesn't validate the "I don't know why people single out geeks as (insert pejorative here)," unless said pejorative is rioters.

Meanwhile, a certain subset of geeks has been having a temper tantrum for five straight years now. It shouldn't be hard to see why geeks are singled out.

No football fan has ever doxed me for not liking their team, and I'd be surprised to find there were more than a couple of cases of this ever. Meanwhile, there are geek culture sites that actively promote it. It's a routine event, unlike rioting.

When did I set the goalpost at frequency? I never mentioned frequency, so it's hardly shifting of a goalpost when it was my initial intent to begin with, and yes, I will use it to validate asking why geeks are seen as somehow worse than other cultural groups on the sole fact that there are other cultural groups that act and do far worse things in the name of their cultural group. If higher frequency is what you require to say whether a culture is bad or not, then I suppose that's fair enough for you, but that's not how I see it. It's not hard to see why geeks could be singled out by some people, I just don't agree with it that the geek community is somehow the cesspool of humanity. I'm not saying that that's what you're saying, I'm just saying that there are plenty of people that act like that.

My whole point is simply people on the whole are assholes and that the geek community isn't conducive of it anymore than other cultures on the whole. Yes, geeks are probably worse on the whole than a few other cultures, but there are also plenty of other cultures that are absolutely worse than geeks. I think it's problematic to single out geek culture because it fails to realize that almost any culture is a conducive environment for assholes. If we're going to look at different cultures for issues that happen within them, then yes, singling out geek culture is a problem because it gives other assholes a pass because they aren't in geek culture. I'm not saying that that means we as a community shouldn't look at what the issue is and work on it, I just think it's interesting that by looking at the issue, most people tend to think that means the entire community is a lost cause and must be removed off the earth.

Upon finishing writing this, it's becoming easier to see why people aren't a fan of the geek community. Often times it's the community they run into the most, at least the ones that would visit the sites I would visit, or say the director of this film, and so they're very likely to run into more assholes that are geeks than any other kind of asshole. Asshole geeks are abundant, it's and issue, and it's not hard to see why they do get singled out, I just don't agree that it's something that should be done. The community should be called out when its inhabitants are being assholes, but I don't agree that it should be treated as though it harbors more awful people on average than other communities. Maybe this isn't the discussion to be bringing up in this thread, maybe I'm just turning this into some pissing contest going "well other people can be just as bad," so I'll bow out of this part of the discussion.

 

[Naldan]

Theater?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/black-hermione-harry-potter-play_us_56784a40e4b014efe0d6389c

I mean how come it's always geek culture that has a problem with writers writing something or even worse; women and minorities.

Fans of SciFi are often considered geeks, just for liking SciFi. So you have authors writing SciFi. What else should they do when they write, right? Then you've fans outraged by all kinds of things.

I for example have massive problems with plot holes and inconsistencies. I also am a big fan of Dragon Ball.

I'd be really confused/angry if Son Goku (protagonist) would become black/female/gay/alien/green/transgender/whateverthatisinconsistent. Wouldn't make any sense. Bam - I'm a "racist." Or Mr. Satan would become white or whatever.

I mean I don't remember massive movements created at JK Rowling to rewrite Harry Potter.

Why Harry Potter? Is Star Wars considered geek culture? If so, why not Harry Potter? And just ask some people how they feel about the prequel-saga or the rewriting of episodes IV - VI.

I don't remember people kicking up a massive fuss in sport because a player happens to be a minority.

Dube, what!? Racism in sport is a massive problem. Just google it for I presume you'd call it soccer. And this is just from the top of my head.

Hell in this thread alone someone brings up Johnny Storm from Fan4stic, look what they say:

Yeah, just like those of us who wanted an accurate Human Torch are racists, right? Go fuck yourself shitty directors who take something people care about and twist it for your egotistical "look how progressive and trendy I am" needs.

Maybe take a page from the Dragonball guy who eventually realized they dun fucked up.

The director never called people racist. That's a straight up lie. His problem is Storm being a minority, and he lies and says the director called people who didn't like it racist to "prove" his point.

The one you quoted also compared Dragon Ball Evolution to Fant4stic, which are apparently (haven't seen Fant4stic) very different kind of train wrecks.

The director of Fant4stic, as far as I know, didn't say this. Yes, here you're right. But so many, including you apparently, call people racist for having a problem with that. Including a lot of media.

I haven't seen the movie, though. It didn't help that he also had a white sister. But again, maybe it's just because people feel like it was a "continuity error"?

Imagine if Spider Man had a green and pink suit for no reason in a movie.

But I want to say something about this in specific at the end.

He then goes on and says that a writer should have to apologise for writing something. How bonkers is that? Actually thinking that people should have to apologise for writing something? That's nuts.

Have you ever seen, by chance really, Dragon Ball Evolution?

Yeah, I think I know what you mean. It's an artists' freedom to do whatever they want. In principle, I'd agree.

But if you take the reins for an established fictional universe, people invested in this fictional universe expect you to be "respectful" of the lore, which means that you hold the established rules and don't create additional plot holes and hold the canon true. If you for one would pick up a franchise, it isn't yours. You'd be just a successor of the one who created it.

Hell I just went to check the trailer for Pixels: 87k likes, 12k dislikes. That terrible movie with its terrible trailer that uses things from the 80's? Suspiciously nowhere near as much dislikes as a trailer that has women in a new movie from a dead franchise.

Excuse me, but I don't understand. What franchise? That short film it's based on from 2010?

Or do you mean every random asset from the 70's to the 80's game characters, which don't have massive lore behind them?

It's another Adam Sandler movie with a retro-video-game-coat on it. Who takes him and these seriously to begin with? In addition to the characters being bland in comparison to decades of written stories for specific franchises.

Or in the case of Ghost Busters, 2 movies (which provide much more background than every Pac-Man game combined, including New Adventures on the SNES) and maybe an animated series.

If you care to know why I personally would downvote the trailer if I'd care to begin with: It's not funny to me and is another fucking reboot. Both previous movies were funny to me and were no fucking reboots.

---

But to be honest, you do really detestable things here so many people do, including those you show your contempt here: You generalize millions of people, especially nowadays when everybody and their mother is considered or considers themself a "geek". You also blend together, as so many do, racism/misogyny with criticism for different reasons as for example continuity, plot holes, laziness.

What about those, for instance, who say that Fant4stic was a miserable movie, but Michael Jordan's performance was the best part in it?

(I think that a more frequent switch in ethnicity from arc to arc at random would solve this issue, comic- and movie-wise to be honest. That way, the ethnicity wouldn't be a factor at all after a while, which it shouldn't imo)

Why are you extreme yourself with damning extremists? With you behaviour, you're watering real racism and misogyny down, and as a side effect, bolster real racists and misogynists with people who are really into the source material.

I don't mean to be rude. But this, in large, is what happens all over the (western) world at the moment and is within my political party a massive problem. And stuff like exactly this polarizes unnecessarily.

 

[Winthrop]

I dont post much anymore, but my only problem is with Melissa Mccarthy. Dont get me wrong, if this movie ends up being good, I'll be the first to say it, its just that every McCarthy movie I've seen so far has been un-watchable garbage...the best lessons we can learn come from history.

I'm with you on this. She is my least favorite comedian. I haven't enjoyed a single thing I've seen her in. I feel like she always tells the same joke and its not a joke I enjoyed the first time. And I'm actually less critical of the trailer than most people I've heard on here, I thought the new gear looked pretty cool actually. But since shes in it, even if it does well I'm still not planning to see it. I've been down that road before.

 

[Davroth]

Thing is, "at least they don't start riots and kill people" isn't really a defense.

As someone else pointed out, the Westboro Baptist Church hasn't killed anybody either. Does that make them not awful?

If I complain that I have a bad toothache and you reply "Well at least you aren't starving to death", does my toothache go away?

And yes, sports culture does indeed house some right petty, violent fuckers. I assumed this was widely known.

I'm sorry, you are comparing geek culture to the Westboro Baptist Church? Don't you think that's just the tiniest bit hyperbolic?

To compare is not necessarily to wholly equate. But I suspect you know that already.

I am comparing them only so far as they both can be awful to people without killing anybody and pointing out their lack of body counts does not excuse their respective awfulness. Which was the first thing I said in the section you quoted, and presumably read.

If the comparison upsets you I'm sure I can come up with something else. Let's see...

If I were to bully, harass and stalk a workmate that would be a bad thing, yes? If someone were to call me out on my horrible behaviour and I were to reply, "Hey, I didn't kill anyone", would you consider that a sound and successful defense of my conduct?

Success of your defense wholly depends on your horrible behavior. If your horrible behavior consists on thumbs downing a movie trailer, I'd probably say that you didn't exactly need to defend your conduct. Disliking a movie trailer is not exactly the same thing as bully, harass and stalk someone, now is it? And of course, you are going to say what's happening to Paul Feig is somehow harassment, but seeing how he courted that behavior with his inflammatory behavior, I have trouble spotting an innocent party here. Hell, I even saw one of the actresses talk about how confusing the trailer was. Not sure how that is supposed to reflect on geek culture, though. Based on what metric are you associating this whole thing with the geek culture being awful?

 

[Sexual Harassment Panda]

It's just his opinion based on his experiences. Fair enough...

Put your head down and make the best thing you can, since you're in a position to do what many of us only dream of. Don't waste your time with the losers on social media. That would be my advice.

 

[Naldan]

I don't mean to be rude. But this, in large, is what happens all over the (western) world at the moment and is within my political party a massive problem. And stuff like exactly this polarizes unnecessarily.

You say things are polarising, so where would the compromise be for Ghostbusters for example? People hated it when they heard it was going to be an all women cast before they were even announced.

Do you think the polarising people are the ones saying that hey, who cares if it's an all women cast it's not like it affects the original movies in any way. Or is it the ones screeching from the rooftops about women Ghostbusters?

"People hated it". What people hated it purely because it was all women? Or was it maybe because it got hyped because it was all women?

Who are you even talking about? Until recently, you were generalizing all of geek culture. Curiously enough, you snipped that out of my post without giving a statement about what I take issue with.

The compromise for the new Ghostbusters would be to decipher what makes the new trailer so disliked. Maybe it's just not funny and maybe that's the main issue for almost A MILLION people, even excluding bots!?

If you really need to find out in this particular case who is misogynistic (maybe you're also interested in who isn't), then you would in theory need to actually read the majority of comments and break each up into specific points.

Tell me who took issue with Furiosa being arguably the main protagonist for Mad Max: Fury Road.

Yes, you're polarizing with gross generalization. I'm sorry if I previously failed to communicate my point properly. If you lump up everyone in two categories through misconception, it's bound to happen. I hope this is more clear, English isn't my first language (obviously probably).

The "Ignore this and focus on the real problems" argument. It's used to silence and ignore actual problems, with the excuse that there's always something worse. Seen it happen a million times, it holds no weight.

Yeah. That's what people have said since decades in fact. If you don't care, then OK, sorry for wasting everybody's time.

 

[2012 Wont Happen]

Isn't geek culture home to some of the biggest assholes on the planet? It also has some great people in it, but I've encountered more damn drama and harassment campaigns in my cursory involvement with geek culture than I have in any other internet subculture, even the ones I'm more heavily involved in. Now, I don't know if the new Ghostbusters will be good. I think it looks funny, but it may wind up being utter garbage. I did, however, get a big chuckle out of him calling out the assholes in geek culture.

 

[wulf3n]

If I were to bully, harass and stalk a workmate that would be a bad thing, yes? If someone were to call me out on my horrible behaviour and I were to reply, "Hey, I didn't kill anyone", would you consider that a sound and successful defense of my conduct?

If calling you out was an assertion that you were up there were with the worst people on the planet... yes.

If the accusation is that "you are the worst" then all you need to prove is that you're not. Having not intentionally killed someone puts a lot of people above you in the "bad person" category.

Now I'm guessing most of the "nerds are the worst" statements are somewhat overzealous hyperbole, but this is the internet, and lot of that doesn't come through.

 

[Gorrath]

Pretending people have a problem with Ghostbusters because of the trailer is just that; a pretense. People had a problem with it because it was an all-female cast. Attempting to pretend it's because of the trailer is just historical revisionism. It's a scapegoat.

Obviously I can only speak for myself, but speaking for myself, this is nonsense. When they announced the all-female cast, I was not only excited by the prospect, I posted on these very forums how I was hoping Pohler and Fey would be interested and get the nod since they a re two of the funniest women in television. Then, that horrid looking trailer came out and I changed my tune about the whole project. So unless I'm a magical unicorn, and I very much think I'm not, then stating that there aren't people who liked or just didn't care about the all female cast but hated the trailer is horse manure.

 

[Bedinsis]

Oh, hey, the sourced article has been updated, due to people misunderstanding it:

This article has been amended to reflect that Feig's comments were made in 2015, and were in response to general questions about fan culture, not about Ghostbusters, as the original article implied. We regret the error

 

[CimmerianKing]

What is baffling is that he is insulting fandom, which is no way to get fans on your side when you hope to produce works within that area in the future.

There is a lot wrong with the new Ghostbusters film, and even a 5 minute google search can tell you that.


update: Only two minutes. This guy breaks down all the details of why the new trailer is bad. And it's funny too.

https://youtu.be/ZbA9fLiEfuo

 

[Leg End]

Pretending people have a problem with Ghostbusters because of the trailer is just that; a pretense. People had a problem with it because it was an all-female cast. Attempting to pretend it's because of the trailer is just historical revisionism. It's a scapegoat.

That's a pretty big generalization as the final topping of not-being-the-case.
I've got a problem with it because it felt like it was trying way too hard to be funny and misses major potential in what a lot of people are actually complaining about. They could have had a good run as a all black female cast being stereotypical angry women and embrace the style of Blaxploitation movies. Rename it, use that concept and you've got something I'd see several times on release day.

 

[Yuuki]

He claims that the all-female cast is a mere co-incidence: the funniest people he knows just happen to be women

1) Is he serious? He can't be serious. He must not know very many people then.

2) Getting angry at the audience/fanbase is only going to make things worse, when will people learn?

 

[Zacharious-khan]

Ok i just won't go see the movie then. Or anything he ever makes again.
No big loss to me.

 

[MetalheroDamien]

Or Mr. Satan would become white or whatever.

Is he not? I always saw him as either Ethnically Jewish or Mediterainian.

 

[GrumbleGrump]

Well, maybe you should consider making trailers that don't show the lamest jokes in years, Mr. Whatever. You should also consider not saying that the trailer reflects the movie, 'cos no one is going to see the fucking thing.

 

[Strazdas]

If the movie trailer is a fair depiction on what this director considers funny then ill be one of the assholes and say that he certainly deserves a good slapping to get him back to his sense.