Gun Nutella

LetalisK

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May 5, 2010
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antidonkey said:
Revolvers that fire semi-auto rounds use clips.
What are semi-auto rounds? >.>

Two-A said:
Elementary - Dear Watson said:
I was sure that it was this site that was constantly waving it's gun nut, hoo ahh banner with pride on an almost daily basis...

I am also surprised!

Maybe it is also a factor that people are less embarrassed by asking before googling/researching nowadays too?
The Escapist is a "gun nut" site now? What did I miss?

I suppose, it might also have to do with the fact that the main readership of this site are not that familiar with guns (myself included).

At the very least, I learned a couple of new things, and I'm happy about that.
Yeah, I don't even think we're even virtual gun nuts. Shooters tend to get pissed on around here.
 

antidonkey

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Dec 10, 2009
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LetalisK said:
antidonkey said:
Revolvers that fire semi-auto rounds use clips.
What are semi-auto rounds? >.>
I'm talking about a round designed for a semi-automatic handgun. For instance, a .45ACP is for a semi-auto pistol while a .45LC is for a revolver and you can't use them interchangeably.
 

Kennetic

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Jan 18, 2011
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LetalisK said:
antidonkey said:
Revolvers that fire semi-auto rounds use clips.
What are semi-auto rounds? >.>
Ammo that is meant for autoloading pistols. Revolver ammo uses longer casings (.38 Special, .357 Magnum, .44 Magnum,etc.) as they don't to fit in your palm. Semi-auto pistols use magazines that go in your palm so they need to use shorter casings (.380 Auto, 9mm, 40 S&W, and .45 ACP). A revolver can shoot semi auto rounds because they are shorter and can fit in the cylinder but need moon clips because the casing has a different rim. Revolver ammo has a wide rim so it sits flush with the cylinder whereas semi-auto ammo has a diminished rim so that the extractor can pull it from the chamber but this means that it can slide right through the cylinder of a revolver if moon clips aren't used.
Notice that the revolver cartridges (the longer handguns rounds, ignore the 2 on the right they are rifle rounds) have a wide rim compared to the semi-auto rounds.
 

Therumancer

Citation Needed
Nov 28, 2007
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Realitycrash said:
..The joke is that a "assault gun" doesn't exist and a shotgun fires shells, not bullets, right?
It might seem obvious to some of you, but I know little about guns, and thus I am unsure if I got the joke or not.
Well, I think it's mostly the use of "clips" (something to hold a magazine to you) as opposed to saying magazine. It's one of those things that actually makes me, and a lot of people, annoyed with enthusiasts. The whole thing is that in a lot of military organizations people would ask for "clips" because they were clipped onto a person and both would know what they meant. This was apparently fairly common slang, and picked up in a lot of action movies from the 70s through 90s where it entered the common vernacular where people would then imitate the characters and ask for a clip, or say slang-like that they have so many clips (as in mags clipped onto them). Even to this day where the actual use of the slang amongst those routinely travelling with magazines clipped on to them isn't commonly understood what is meant and the people taking objection to it are just trying to be annoying know it alls. Especially when you think about how it's slightly easier and quicker to say "clip" rather than "magazine" which is how it got started, but of course it seems "mags" or "mag" has become more common.

That said an assault weapon like the one shown there, if it did exist, would not likely use a magazine, but instead would likely be drum fed (or belt fed if it's older). The idea of someone actually having a magazine with like 1000 rounds lined up for something with that rate of fire is kind of ridiculous. Of course at the same time a single person carrying and using what amounts to a minigun/gatling gun is also kind of ridiculous, but at the end of the day such things do exist. More practically you'd probably have something like that toted by a two man team, one carrying the gun, the other humping the ammo, and you'd set it up on some kind of a brace or tripod.


With the shotgun, yeah, it's calling the "shells" bullets.

The thing is though that I think this is a double whammy, sort of also making the point that at the end of the day the terminology only really matters to someone who is intentionally being anal about it, especially in a video game. I mean when your out to destroy the other guys, I doubt they much care if your calling the ammo for your shotgun bullets or shells as they rip through them, and really unless the game is making a big deal about trying to be realistic in terms of carrying capacity, the number of reloads for your weapon is what matters, not the term used for those reload. I mean sure, maybe we call the ammo for some kind of massive rate of fire "assault gun" drums to make someone happy, but at the end of the day it doesn't much help realism when someone might wind up carrying 10 or more of the bloody things along with their other presumed kit. Sort of like how in the more recent fallout games ammo has no weight (unless you play on a hardcore/survival mode) so I might be carrying around hundreds of missiles and thousands of rounds of ammo for different weapons... very few people really stopped to think or care about "how do I realistically carry 50,000 rounds of assorted ammo...".
 

Elementary - Dear Watson

RIP Eleuthera, I will miss you
Nov 9, 2010
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Two-A said:
Elementary - Dear Watson said:
I was sure that it was this site that was constantly waving it's gun nut, hoo ahh banner with pride on an almost daily basis...

I am also surprised!

Maybe it is also a factor that people are less embarrassed by asking before googling/researching nowadays too?
The Escapist is a "gun nut" site now? What did I miss?

I suppose, it might also have to do with the fact that the main readership of this site are not that familiar with guns (myself included).

At the very least, I learned a couple of new things, and I'm happy about that.
There was no offence meant chap... it was satire about a time we had, well... must have been about a year ago at least, where we had daily topics involving gun law that used to get really heated.
Daystar and I were just essentially reminiscing! Don't take it the wrong way... I was being flippant and sarcastic!
 

Two-A

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Aug 1, 2012
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Elementary - Dear Watson said:
Two-A said:
Elementary - Dear Watson said:
I was sure that it was this site that was constantly waving it's gun nut, hoo ahh banner with pride on an almost daily basis...

I am also surprised!

Maybe it is also a factor that people are less embarrassed by asking before googling/researching nowadays too?
The Escapist is a "gun nut" site now? What did I miss?

I suppose, it might also have to do with the fact that the main readership of this site are not that familiar with guns (myself included).

At the very least, I learned a couple of new things, and I'm happy about that.
There was no offence meant chap... it was satire about a time we had, well... must have been about a year ago at least, where we had daily topics involving gun law that used to get really heated.
Daystar and I were just essentially reminiscing! Don't take it the wrong way... I was being flippant and sarcastic!
Don't worry, I wasn't accusing you of anything. I just took your post at face value (a common problem with written communication). I haven't been active in the forum for that long.
 

UNHchabo

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Dec 24, 2008
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Kennetic said:
I think it's better illustrated in profile:




LetalisK said:
antidonkey said:
Revolvers that fire semi-auto rounds use clips.
What are semi-auto rounds? >.>
Moon clips are used to shoot rimless cartridges out of revolvers. These look to be .45ACP:

Generally revolvers use rimmed cartridges and semi-auto pistols use rimless cartridges, but it isn't exclusive in either direction. In addition to moon-clip-fed revolvers, there are also some pistols that shoot rimmed cartridges: .22LR is a rimmed round, and a few pistols have even been made for the heavier revolver loads, like .357 Magnum and .44 Magnum -- the Desert Eagle is available chambered for these rounds, for instance, in addition to the .50AE for which it's famous.
 

Major_Tom

Anticitizen
Jun 29, 2008
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Actually, you don't load "bullets" into anything, you load rounds. Bullet is the part that flies out. Also, shotguns can use slugs which are technically big bullets.
 

Xan Krieger

Completely insane
Feb 11, 2009
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I hate how COD is creating a generation of kids who think they know everything about guns but in reality don't know crap. My neighbor told me the PPSH-41 was an assault rifle. The worst part was he was totally serious. It's one of the world's most famous submachine guns. I was so pissed at him especially when I laid out why he was wrong and he refused to believe me because he figured the people who made the game knew better than me.
 

Therumancer

Citation Needed
Nov 28, 2007
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Xan Krieger said:
I hate how COD is creating a generation of kids who think they know everything about guns but in reality don't know crap. My neighbor told me the PPSH-41 was an assault rifle. The worst part was he was totally serious. It's one of the world's most famous submachine guns. I was so pissed at him especially when I laid out why he was wrong and he refused to believe me because he figured the people who made the game knew better than me.
Well, to be honest I'd say based on it's size and appearance it can blur the distinction. If I had seen one without knowing much about it, I probably wouldn't have called it an SMG either given the relative size and handling of current SMGs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PPSh-41

Picture of one on display, size compared to a uniform shirt there.

To be totally honest while you are right, I wouldn't get all that upset about it, to be honest one would expect the guys doing research for a really successful game franchise, to the point of modeling them (presumably) based on real ones to have the basic facts straight. Off the cuff if I had to trust some guy that I didn't know, or a gaming company that went so far as to model something, when it comes to basic info like that, I'd side with the gaming company for information as well. I'd be wrong, just saying it's understandable enough not to get upset over.

Personally I only know as much as I do about vintage firearms (which probably isn't much) from playing and GMing lots of PnP RPGs including settings like "Godlike" and "Weird World War II". The former being a World War II era super hero game, and the latter being a sort of campy "horror" game which I in turn took ideas from for my own mash ups and creations. Truthfully while "famous" to an extent I don't think knowledge about 1940s Soviet firearms, even one that survived decades as surplus, can exactly be considered common.
 

EightGaugeHippo

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Apr 6, 2010
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Pfft, don't really care if you know the vocabulary, whats important is weather or not you know how to properly hold, fire and maintain a firearm. You can call a shell a bullet all you want, it doesn't change what it is.

You know the saying "you can talk the talk, but can you walk the walk?"

For example, If you know the difference between a mag and a clip, but call on Captain Hook to do your shooting...


... please remove yourself from the range, nobody is impressed.
 

Icehearted

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Jul 14, 2009
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Nice one!

I got a pretty good reaction from a friend of mine, while not an enthusiast per se, definitely took some pride in his knowledge of firearms, when I wrote a story and referenced a shotgun shell. First to admit I know little about guns, but I had no idea until that conversation how sensitive people can be about terminology with those things. Like, even non-enthusiasts are kind of anal about it to surprising degrees.
 

acosn

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Sep 11, 2008
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Realitycrash said:
..The joke is that a "assault gun" doesn't exist and a shotgun fires shells, not bullets, right?
It might seem obvious to some of you, but I know little about guns, and thus I am unsure if I got the joke or not.

"Assault gun" isn't a thing. There's assault rifles, and bloviating liberals like to pretend that "assault style weapons" actually means something when really it's just civilian variants of commonly available weapons that are modified to look scary. So liberals then try to jam legislation through congress, disrespecting the democratic process, which typically ends up being bills which ban modifications for guns which tends to be related to ergonomics. You know, things like barrel shrouds, flash hiders (which the US armed forces has pointed out is more useful for protecting the user's eye sight when used in low light environments more than anything else) and forward grips. Heck, the assault gun ban made the hand gun's weight a legal definition for "assault weapon."


Shotguns fire shells, which contain many smaller BB's. In a sense it'd be accurate to say they hold MANY bullets, but its accurate to just say shells.


To my knowledge, there is no assault rifle which is loaded using a clip. Assault rifles almost always use detachable magazines to load. If you've played a WW2 shooter, you've probably used the M1 Garand, the Lee Ensfield, or the Mosin Nagant. These are three examples of clip (or stripper clip) fed rifles.

Therumancer said:
Xan Krieger said:
I hate how COD is creating a generation of kids who think they know everything about guns but in reality don't know crap. My neighbor told me the PPSH-41 was an assault rifle. The worst part was he was totally serious. It's one of the world's most famous submachine guns. I was so pissed at him especially when I laid out why he was wrong and he refused to believe me because he figured the people who made the game knew better than me.
Well, to be honest I'd say based on it's size and appearance it can blur the distinction. If I had seen one without knowing much about it, I probably wouldn't have called it an SMG either given the relative size and handling of current SMGs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PPSh-41

Picture of one on display, size compared to a uniform shirt there.

To be totally honest while you are right, I wouldn't get all that upset about it, to be honest one would expect the guys doing research for a really successful game franchise, to the point of modeling them (presumably) based on real ones to have the basic facts straight. Off the cuff if I had to trust some guy that I didn't know, or a gaming company that went so far as to model something, when it comes to basic info like that, I'd side with the gaming company for information as well. I'd be wrong, just saying it's understandable enough not to get upset over.

Personally I only know as much as I do about vintage firearms (which probably isn't much) from playing and GMing lots of PnP RPGs including settings like "Godlike" and "Weird World War II". The former being a World War II era super hero game, and the latter being a sort of campy "horror" game which I in turn took ideas from for my own mash ups and creations. Truthfully while "famous" to an extent I don't think knowledge about 1940s Soviet firearms, even one that survived decades as surplus, can exactly be considered common.
The issue is these kids help perpetrate all kinds of bad stereotypes. If you're going to make grown adults ask if you're a psychotic killer in training, you may as well be knowledgeable about your hobby, rather than just a poser.


The PPSH-41 meets none of the basic criteria of an assault rifle except for a detachable magazine. And COD's made many mistakes and fudged many guns classifications. They also called BAR's in World at War a machine gun.
 

Primero Holodon

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Oct 18, 2011
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acosn said:
Realitycrash said:
..The joke is that a "assault gun" doesn't exist and a shotgun fires shells, not bullets, right?
It might seem obvious to some of you, but I know little about guns, and thus I am unsure if I got the joke or not.

"Assault gun" isn't a thing. There's assault rifles, and bloviating liberals like to pretend that "assault style weapons" actually means something when really it's just civilian variants of commonly available weapons that are modified to look scary. So liberals then try to jam legislation through congress, disrespecting the democratic process, which typically ends up being bills which ban modifications for guns which tends to be related to ergonomics. You know, things like barrel shrouds, flash hiders (which the US armed forces has pointed out is more useful for protecting the user's eye sight when used in low light environments more than anything else) and forward grips. Heck, the assault gun ban made the hand gun's weight a legal definition for "assault weapon."


Shotguns fire shells, which contain many smaller BB's. In a sense it'd be accurate to say they hold MANY bullets, but its accurate to just say shells.


To my knowledge, there is no assault rifle which is loaded using a clip. Assault rifles almost always use detachable magazines to load. If you've played a WW2 shooter, you've probably used the M1 Garand, the Lee Ensfield, or the Mosin Nagant. These are three examples of clip (or stripper clip) fed rifles.

Therumancer said:
Xan Krieger said:
I hate how COD is creating a generation of kids who think they know everything about guns but in reality don't know crap. My neighbor told me the PPSH-41 was an assault rifle. The worst part was he was totally serious. It's one of the world's most famous submachine guns. I was so pissed at him especially when I laid out why he was wrong and he refused to believe me because he figured the people who made the game knew better than me.
Well, to be honest I'd say based on it's size and appearance it can blur the distinction. If I had seen one without knowing much about it, I probably wouldn't have called it an SMG either given the relative size and handling of current SMGs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PPSh-41

Picture of one on display, size compared to a uniform shirt there.

To be totally honest while you are right, I wouldn't get all that upset about it, to be honest one would expect the guys doing research for a really successful game franchise, to the point of modeling them (presumably) based on real ones to have the basic facts straight. Off the cuff if I had to trust some guy that I didn't know, or a gaming company that went so far as to model something, when it comes to basic info like that, I'd side with the gaming company for information as well. I'd be wrong, just saying it's understandable enough not to get upset over.

Personally I only know as much as I do about vintage firearms (which probably isn't much) from playing and GMing lots of PnP RPGs including settings like "Godlike" and "Weird World War II". The former being a World War II era super hero game, and the latter being a sort of campy "horror" game which I in turn took ideas from for my own mash ups and creations. Truthfully while "famous" to an extent I don't think knowledge about 1940s Soviet firearms, even one that survived decades as surplus, can exactly be considered common.
The issue is these kids help perpetrate all kinds of bad stereotypes. If you're going to make grown adults ask if you're a psychotic killer in training, you may as well be knowledgeable about your hobby, rather than just a poser.


The PPSH-41 meets none of the basic criteria of an assault rifle except for a detachable magazine. And COD's made many mistakes and fudged many guns classifications. They also called BAR's in World at War a machine gun.
The BAR is a machine gun. it was often deployed as a squad machine gun in WW2.
 

Caiphus

Social Office Corridor
Mar 31, 2010
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Hey guys. Stop for a second. I've run out of pills for my noisy pain machine.