Harm Bunnies in Yahtzee's Newest Game

[snave]

Yeah, control remapping is needed.

Whilst its ok for me on this current machine (I have trouble moving left, but the platformy bits thus far have all gone right), it'd be unfinishable on any previous keyboards I've owned. Basically, later on you get a double jump, and to execute it you need to hold two buttons, in addition to your current movement. A vast number of keyboards are simply incapable of the button combinations required and would need a remap.

A couple of other minor oddities in the map design (a bit in the mines where you can get stuck and forced to reload if you're too curious springs to mind).

Otherwise, a nice little game, but nothing we haven't seen before.

 

[Diego Floor]

Initial impressions of this game were excellent - something like "A Very Yahtzee Cave Story".

As the difficulty grew, the game seemed to exhibit a strange dichotomy... The dialogue and characters were very inviting, but the brutally high difficulty felt exactly like the game was just giving me the middle finger whenever I died. It's like some strange hybrid of I Wanna Be the Guy or Super Meat Boy and the aforementioned Cave Story, and my brain is still trying to figure out how I should process that combination.

Overall, the game provided some solid entertainment, and some solid yelling at my monitor. It's a great game with a lot of character, but I feel it could have used more time in beta for bug testing and smoothing out the not-uncommon insane difficulty spikes. For some reason, I keep finding myself coming back to the game even despite how much it seems to hate my ass.

That sums up my opinion perfectly.

I think I'm close to the end. The game is captivating enough to keep me coming back, but the difficulty is extreme, especially with a few miles between each checkpoint.

 

[Shadeovblack]

I've played a little bit of it and so far I think it's awesome

 

[MelasZepheos_v1legacy]

Not particularly fun I have to say. For all of his complaining about the faults of other games he seems to have gone out of his way to then make exactly the same faults in his own game. To hear him talk about his own experience in Extra Punctuation it would seem like he knows what he's doing so to receive something like this is a little disappointing.

Z, X and Space Bar should not be in the same control system, espeially for a game requiring fast action of both shooting, grenades and jumping, sometimes combined. The map is entirely useless, and there are numerous control errors.

I think the thing that most annoyed me is that it gives absolutely no hints about what to do or where to go. I'm not looking for handholding, but when I end up backtracking through every single room dodging the luck based challenges just to try and find the door to the next area we've moved from 'challenging' to 'boring.' Also, the needlessly finicky jumping puzzle in the library, the lack of a decent save system and the absolute dearth of necessary save points...

I almost feel like taking on Yahtzee's voice here:

'Did you think every other game had save points after bosses or particularly difficult jumping sections just because of peerp pressure and because all his mates told him too? No, it's because once a player has finished your puzzle he wants to know that he won't have to do it again because a first level bat blindsided him in the next room.'

And of course, opening the map doesn't pause the game. I have counted four separate occasions in Yahtzee's own videos where he has condemned games for this very flaw. Why then Yahtzee, did you include it in your own game? Is it because you wanted it to look like a bad game?

 

[viking97]

Trapped in the room where you encounter the infinitely respawning bunnies after the first Dark One...idk what to do, I'll go back to it later.

heh, i got stuck there too. just stay on a platform where the bunnies can't get you under one of the vents and shoot them out of the air until they stop spawning, then just shoot all the ones on the ground.

Now somebody needs to make a ZP style review of this game.

i'd advise against that based on his response to the guy who did a zp review of his previous game, art of theft. great game btw, doesn't seem to work with windows 7. or maybe it's just my computer, all i know is it worked fine on my previous one.

 

[Diego Floor]

Z, X and Space Bar should not be in the same control system, espeially for a game requiring fast action of both shooting, grenades and jumping, sometimes combined. The map is entirely useless, and there are numerous control errors.

I think the thing that most annoyed me is that it gives absolutely no hints about what to do or where to go. I'm not looking for handholding, but when I end up backtracking through every single room dodging the luck based challenges just to try and find the door to the next area we've moved from 'challenging' to 'boring.' Also, the needlessly finicky jumping puzzle in the library, the lack of a decent save system and the absolute dearth of necessary save points...

I agree with some of that, especially the difficulty spike. But what's wrong with the control scheme? You're not the first to mention the keys, so I'm curious. I got used to it in the first 60 seconds, a finger for each key. Also, how can the map be useless? it shows where you are and what to do with huge red Xs. Most metroidvania games are way harder to navigate!

 

[Kapitan_Jack]

I agree with some of that, especially the difficulty spike. But what's wrong with the control scheme? You're not the first to mention the keys, so I'm curious. I got used to it in the first 60 seconds, a finger for each key. Also, how can the map be useless? it shows where you are and what to do with huge red Xs. Most metroidvania games are way harder to navigate!

Not everyone has full desktop keyboard. I played it on my laptop which has really small directional arrows and because of this I use WSAD keys even for platformers and such. I got used to it eventually but God, was it pain in the ass. The ability to remap keys should be standard (not to mention some internetional keyboard layouts keep moving Z key all over the place).

Finished the game on 100%, got Good ending

Spoiler

(I even spared all the bunnies in the beginning)

but I have no idea what to do for secret ending.

Spoiler

Perhaps not killing any of the possesed Blemings in the library? Is it even possible? Also, how to pick up Zero Suit Derek and/or Lord o' the Manor?

 

[Diego Floor]

Well, I'm not sure I can finish it. I'm trying to beat what appears to be the last part (don't want to spoil) and I'm not very excited about trying again anytime soon. So I'll lay down my final opinion anyway.

It's a solid design. Innovative in the way it takes the metroidvania gameplay, tone down the exploration aspect and accentuate the action aspect. Instead of calmly navigating through the environment, listening to some soothing piano, I'm always shooting, jumping and running like a maniac.

Aside from a few particular situations, the controls respond well. Shooting in four directions is a feature well explored by the level design; you can frequently find ways to defeat an enemy without necessarily sharing the same tiny platform they stand, shooting up or down (by jumping over it). A few problems: Leaving water with the abilities of wall jump and sink is a nightmare. What aggravates this is that several parts have the water level right in the intersection between two screens, and the transition "forgets" the commands you were sending (if you were moving to the right when changing screens, it forgets so). Also, and this is not a bug, the controls would benefit by being able to control how high you can jump. But the level design takes care to avoid situations where you NEED to jump just a little bit.

As is common in these kind of game, you gain new abilities as you progress. This is nicely done, as each new ability allows you to further explore places you've been before (or not). For example, after being able to sunk in water you try to remember all the places with water you've been through, and they usually reward you well. The abilities are also really clever In the artifacts part, it could be clearer (hinted in some way) what order would be better, in my opinion.

All right! One cannot talk about this game and not mention the story. Yahtzee's previous games, books, reviews etc are a definite hint that this is his strong point (even though my favorite is Trilby: the art of theft, which is heavily gameplay based). Both the story and story telling are incredibly engaging. Can't say much about it.. it's definitely the strong point of the game. Too bad I didn't get to see the end, yet.

Now to the major flaw of the game, in my opinion: who the hell beta tested this game? D.A.R.Y.L?? The level design undermined with unforeseen dangers that force you to memorize them. I mean, memorize them when the level is kind enough to present you with a pattern, because some parts are filled with unforeseen AND random dangers. So instead of the challenging kind of difficult, it's just plain frustrating. And I say this having played with a very large life meter and the power to exchange mines for life.

At first I thought "hey, this is a cool save system!" But considering the above problem I would prefer something more compact, like a flag you cross or something.

So that's it. Honestly, I think anyone complaining about anything else but the difficulty is just blowing off steam from a recent rage quit. The whole gameplay design is very good and the story - and related aspects - is awesome. The level design needs to be polished though. Too hard and too unforgiving.

 

[MelasZepheos_v1legacy]

Back again to just say, really not worth it. Frustrating kind of difficult instead of actually challenging and interesting. Terrible save system and not particularly well paced save points. Controls are finnicky at best and downright unhelpful at worst. Enemies are basically all Goddamned Bats. Feels like it wasn't playtested at all to make sure there weren't glitches.

If you like IWTBTG and forcing yourself to learn by muscle memory and luck the right route to take through a game the sure, but otherwise this is a poor entry from the man who once made such greats as the Trilby series.

 

[repeating integers]

Not particularly fun I have to say. For all of his complaining about the faults of other games he seems to have gone out of his way to then make exactly the same faults in his own game. To hear him talk about his own experience in Extra Punctuation it would seem like he knows what he's doing so to receive something like this is a little disappointing.

Z, X and Space Bar should not be in the same control system, espeially for a game requiring fast action of both shooting, grenades and jumping, sometimes combined. The map is entirely useless, and there are numerous control errors.

I think the thing that most annoyed me is that it gives absolutely no hints about what to do or where to go. I'm not looking for handholding, but when I end up backtracking through every single room dodging the luck based challenges just to try and find the door to the next area we've moved from 'challenging' to 'boring.' Also, the needlessly finicky jumping puzzle in the library, the lack of a decent save system and the absolute dearth of necessary save points...

I almost feel like taking on Yahtzee's voice here:

'Did you think every other game had save points after bosses or particularly difficult jumping sections just because of peerp pressure and because all his mates told him too? No, it's because once a player has finished your puzzle he wants to know that he won't have to do it again because a first level bat blindsided him in the next room.'

And of course, opening the map doesn't pause the game. I have counted four separate occasions in Yahtzee's own videos where he has condemned games for this very flaw. Why then Yahtzee, did you include it in your own game? Is it because you wanted it to look like a bad game?

Wouldn't be the first time Yahtzee's contradicted himself, won't be the last. It's generally a good idea to remember that only half of his complaints are genuine, the others are just things he thought he could make a good joke out of.

 

[asacatman]

Is anyone on the oil rig level? FUUUUCK that pissed me off. The annoying thing is I LIKE the gameplay, but the severe lack of save points means that whenever I die, which is quite often on the fucking oil rig level, I have to do the same thing OVER and OVER, even though I've memorised the pattern and know exactly how to beat it, to get to the part of the level I'm struggling with!

Make more save points! Keep the same difficulty, but don't make me do the same thing time after time!

GAH.

 

[Keswick Gallagher]

So Somebody had to...

I feel dirty that it was me

Zero Punctuation style review of the game

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38AxI60_sjM&feature=plcp&context=C497ed1bVDvjVQa1PpcFNaASkEItD2Ze_MqrIVYKTfkk-oL4EL2T8=

 

[snave]

Also, how to pick up [Completion Rewards]?

Walk to the right at the start, towards New Game and shoot the ones you wish to equip.

Yeah, I suspect the secret ending involves either not killing anything or sparing the bit-before-the-boss relevant monsters. Or maybe even just not trying saving your game in the dark room. In fact, Im pretty sure it has something to do with that area because the real final boss is the

Spoiler

Master of the Abyss, well presumably based on the background. It's actually shown in the trailer.

Having said that, the story still makes utterly no sense because the first damaging monster you encounter immediately after falling down the hole (before meeting Rebecca) is a Dark One possessed rabbit.

I almost feel like taking on Yahtzee's voice here:

'Did you think every other game had save points after bosses or particularly difficult jumping sections just because of peerp pressure and because all his mates told him too? No, it's because once a player has finished your puzzle he wants to know that he won't have to do it again because a first level bat blindsided him in the next room.'

Wouldn't be the first time Yahtzee's contradicted himself, won't be the last. It's generally a good idea to remember that only half of his complaints are genuine, the others are just things he thought he could make a good joke out of.

Actually, this is handled incredibly well. I'm guessing you never actually died after a boss battle. Whilst the game doesn't save save, you do get a temporary checkpoint after a boss (like you do in the final part of the game each room) so you can have another crack at that Goddamned Bat [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GoddamnedBats].

 

[Toasty Virus]

So Somebody had to...

I feel dirty that it was me

Zero Punctuation style review of the game

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38AxI60_sjM&feature=plcp&context=C497ed1bVDvjVQa1PpcFNaASkEItD2Ze_MqrIVYKTfkk-oL4EL2T8=

Loved it, very well done sir!

Especially liked the intro and outro!

 

[Formica Archonis]

Nope, sorry, I'm done at 53%. Jumping puzzles are one thing but putting a hard-to-kill knockback enemy on a platform I CAN'T SEE until I'm at it so I have to redo the puzzle perfectly at least twice more (and I'm a half dozen jumping puzzles from a savepoint in either direction) is leaning dangerously close to Kaizo territory.

Oh, and sequences like jump/shotgun-jump/wall-jump/shotgun-jump would be problematic WITHOUT the surprise teleporting spikes. Similar mechanics on wildly different button sequences (space or down+X) require me to focus on the controls instead of the game, and any game that makes me think constantly about the controls is just unimmersive. It's like a typing tutor with less real-world use unless you're doing data entry for a company that rates porn movies.

So I'm just gonna wait for the inevitable Let's Play.

 

[Kapitan_Jack]

Having said that, the story still makes utterly no sense because the first damaging monster you encounter immediately after falling down the hole (before meeting Rebecca) is a Dark One possessed rabbit.

The terms of the treaty CLEARLY and EXPLICITELY state that no Spirit nor Dark One shall make a compact with a HUMAN. There is nothing about bunnies. Consider yourself outnerded.

 

[gyroc1]

[...]
Yeah, I suspect the secret ending involves either not killing anything or sparing the bit-before-the-boss relevant monsters. Or maybe even just not trying saving your game in the dark room. In fact, Im pretty sure it has something to do with that area because the real final boss is the [...]


Having said that, the story still makes utterly no sense because the first damaging monster you encounter immediately after falling down the hole (before meeting Rebecca) is a Dark One possessed rabbit.

The not saving hypothesis is broken because the game won't let you progress past the part until you save your game.

Furthermore, when saving Rebecca, you have to kill the 3 bunnies on near her in order to progress.
so that one guess about not killing any bunnies at all is ruled out.

Having beaten the game, I do not agree that the difficulty is comparable to I Wanna Be the Guy. It's closer to VVVVVV or a tamer Super Meat Boy.

 

[Kermi]

Boring and unamusing. Controls are counterintuitive. Jumping is clunky. Background platforms you can walk through for some reason block your shots. Fix any one of these issues and I might bother to play it past the first boss, as it stands now, well, let's just say I'm glad it didn't cost me anything.

 

[snave]

I'd say the difficulty is actually below that of VVVVVV (especially considering the optional bits for 100% completion), except for those with keyboard incompatibilities. It is possible to still get by with rapid button taps, but the difficulty ramps up a lot if you luck out that way. Having said that, isn't the entirety of the forest after getting the double jump completely optional?

Hmm... the trial bit only has you fighting unposessed bunnies, so the possibility that you have to not kill bunnies nor pink guys in the library still remains. I didn't know about the inability to walk past the save point. I naturally did as expected of me and ran in to "save". By the way, what happens if you load at that point? The save did something because my saved progress dropped for 85%ish to a clean 70% at the final save point.

Also, anyone got the "bad ending"? Can you even enter the Dark Realm without finding all the tea?