Well this thread caught fire just when I decided to get sick and my cooling solution quit... I'll do my best to answer questions presented already posed, but be aware they're from my point of view.
thaluikhain said:
Hmmm...been wondering, what's the better way of saying something like "born a boy, but is now a girl"?
That depends. Partly on weather or not the person in question had, or is going to have GRS... But personally I'd just say trans, or transgender. It applies well enough to everyone who is trans, doesn't sound judgemental on face value. Now if you want to get specific things like FTM or MTF are the easiest way to define a trans person from on the basis of their birth gender, to their identified gender.
ShyGuy said:
I must admit that I have some difficulty understanding transgendered people, so I have some questions. Please do not take them the wrong way, I mean no offence and I would hate to cause any, since you seem really nice and reasonable. I always wondered, do you think it should be viewed as a psychological disorder? Do you think it could or should be cured (for lack of a better word)?
Also, this is somewhat unrelated, but you mentionned that there were people born with two Y chromosomes and no X. How functional are those people? I seem to recall that the Y chromosome is much shorter than the X chromosome, and therefore, such people would lack an important amount of genetic information.
Gender disphoria can be considered a mental disorder. The DSM changed the definition to not class it as a mental disorder in the last edition released. I personally think it's a personality trait more than anything else. As for a cure? Well since every trans person is different, and has different objectives just being trans, I don't think a cure would be okay. It'd be making a fundamental personality change to someone, there are all sorts of moral issues with that. Now if you could make someone into the biological gender they identify as, that would d be neat, but not every trans person would want that.
People with two Y chromosomes is an interesting subject. I'd assume they'd tend to be haemophiliacs and color blind more often than virtually anyone else. Some assert they tend to be more violent, but it's not proven... But as far as I know they tend to be the same generally as people with typical genetics. Here's a fun fact though. The Y chromosome is the fastest evolving in humans.
TranshumanistG said:
What I find hard to wrap my head around is how transgenderism(I'm probably misusing the term, but what I mean is identifying one's gender as opposite of the assigned gender but don't wish to do any reassignment surgeries) fits in with feminism, particularly, the rejection of gender roles and not letting the gender define how one should act and live. For instance, if you conflate identifying as a female with 'feminine' behaviour, doesn't it support a gender role stereotype? Or is this completely different from how transgender people put their self-identification into practice?
To be honest feminists are such a diverse group finding two who agree on the simplest things can be a chore. That said, there are transfeminists, who have ideology just as diverse as typical feminists. There is no easy answer for this question just because people are weird and have a hard time agreeing on anything.
JoJo said:
ShyGuy said:
Also, this is somewhat unrelated, but you mentionned that there were people born with two Y chromosomes and no X. How functional are those people? I seem to recall that the Y chromosome is much shorter than the X chromosome, and therefore, such people would lack an important amount of genetic information.
That part must be a mistake on behalf of the OP, it is impossible for a human to survive to even birth with no X chromosome, there's too many important genes carried only on the X. There are men with an XYY combination, so that may be what the OP means, the rest of what she said about XX men, XY women and such is all correct though.
No there actual cases of double Y chromosome people with no X chromosome. Humans can survive weird things. Some people actually survive with a single sex chromosome. Technically having three sex chromosomes should be lethal, same with broken chromosomes(Down's syndrome).
necromanzer52 said:
KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
or it can apply exclusively to people who want gender reassignment surgery.
This is actually something I've been wondering about lately. I've been reading a webcomic called validation, which is about a transwoman. It's been quite interesting and I've learned a fair bit, but one thing that confused me is that she mentions she still has a dick and has no intention of changing that. Now, obviously that's her choice, but it seems to me that if you feel like you were born as the wrong sex that having the wrong genitals would be one of, if not the most important aspect of that. Maybe you could shed some light on this?
It can be for some, for others it doesn't matter. I present full time as a woman, I have breasts, I've had some surgeries, but I don't intend to get gender reassignment surgery(GRS). For several reasons, for one it's a huge pain in the arse compared to changing something that I have no problem with. Also, though I don't generally do this, it's so convenient to stand to pee, and just being able to to it has saved me from peeing my self on occasion. Some trans people are alienated by their physical gender to the point where they need to change, some of us aren't. Identity doesn't control how comfortable we are with our bodies. Weird I know, but people are weird generally speaking.
Holy_Handgrenade said:
Hey, I am actually thankful for this opportunity, the few people I know who are transgender in real life I shy away from asking these questions for fear of offending. I fully understand and accept that people identify with a sex different from that which they were given at birth and we should help in every way we can for them to feel comfortable in their own bodies and be the sex they identify with. What I'm not 100% on is non binary this is largely just as I kind of view sex as pretty binary in that your parts can be male, female or in rare cases in between. I see gender as a social construct and that it doesn't really exist what sex you are exists and I think you should be able to change such. I see myself as possessing both traditionally masculine and feminine traits as I think almost everyone does but sex wise I identify as male. What I don't understand is when it comes to non binary people who are talking about gender why can't they say my sex is male or female but I have traits that are both masculine and feminine (if they want to literally be somewhere in between sex wise i.e hermiphrodite or some such that is A-Okay with me I was just wondering about the gender side). Also this might just be exposure to the more extreme opinions because no trans people I've met in person have said this but why are some trans people that against stating your sex in capacities where it is required such as medical in the UK under the NHS. Like just say I identify with this sex but currently I possess the physical attributes of this sex. Or if they have physically transitioned say I am now this sex but I was this sex? Thanks again if anything I've said is insensitive in anyway please call me out.
This is a good one! Gender roles and behaviour are a social construct, but we all identify differently. I mean I have masculine traits, was born a male, but identify as a female. Simply put, it can be just preference, or how we're wired up in the brain. No one has given a definitive answer on this, at least to my satisfaction, so it's just another case of "people are weird." Now on the last part. Transgender gender people tend to get abused a lot, so outting ourselves can be a horrific idea. That's why we often refuse to address the subject, it's dangerous, it's scary, and it's uncomfortable. Personally I'm rather open about it myself, but I'm a big girl, I can take care of myself, and I'm usually armed, not to mention that I'm also rather upfront about my self. Not every trans person is as open I am, and not every trans person makes a habit(or legally can make a habit) of carrying a gun like I do.
Kanova said:
I find Transphobia isn't actually a phobia, more like the person hates and finds trans disgusting.
"I am not going to other myself by counting you as "normal" for being born and feeling one way"
Well, straights are normal, whether someone likes it or not. That is the way people are supposed to be, and how the majority of people are. So that makes it normal. Being anything else is arguably an error in your mind and body. Now, I fall into the uncomfortable around trans people category. I don't have anything against you people, but I just can't stand being in the presence of them. I just find it disturbing. If you are a man, no amount of dick taping or hormones will change that. And seeing men go to the extent some do to be a different sex is just weird to me. Just how I am, no scare, no problem.
Fair enough, it's fine that you have your own personal view. All I ask is that you not make it my problem. If we met you'd probably see me as a female, unless I told you other wise. If I did tell you in person, I'd appreciate being treated as the person I project myself as, if you don't agree with it that's fine, but it would be rude for you to refer to me as a male. So we can differ on opinion, just be nice, and even if it means going out of your way, respect who I am, how I present, and what my foundries are. You'd do the same for a cisgender person to respect them, so do the same for me.
Queen Michael said:
KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
We're all humans, but some people identify as non-human animals, or objects, for example.
Surely that must be totally different, though? I know several trans people, and they all actually behave as the gender they identify as. For instance, my pal Jacob goes to the grocery store, plays computer games, takes care of his pets and watches TV, just like other men do.[footnote]As do women too, of course, but that's beside the point.[/footnote] People who identiy as cats, though, don't act like cats[footnote]Except for sometimes making an active effort to be catlike by for instance meowing, which isn't the same thing as a cat meowing because it's the only way of talking that a cat knows.[/footnote] or think like them and -- no offense intended -- pretty clearly just want to be one, which isn't the same thing as being one.
Yes it's totally different, but at the same time it's a good analogy, and it's easy to understand. Alright? Also sometimes in person I respond to questions by tilting my head and saying: "Mew?" So we're all odd, the best we can do is try to understand eachother's oddness. By the way cats only meow to communicate a want, or need, to humans, isn't that strange?
Amaror said:
KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
Ok i have a question, or rather more your opinion on something.
Back in, what in America would probably be high school, we had a girl in our class that as it turned out identified as a man.
Now over the time this lead to various complications, mainly with certain things that were based on gender. For example the changing room before sport or the public bathroom at the school.
I'll just refer to the person as a girl from now on, since that's what i started with, i hope that's not insensitive.
So as the time went on and she started the transision, she didn't tell anyone but you could notice, there arose these problems. She had confessed her love for one of the girls in our class, that girl was her best friend before, so they didn't feel that comfortable having her in their changing room. But the boys didn't really want her in their changing room either, after all she was still a girl.
She ended up dressing by herself before sport.
This is just a short story of what happened, it was obviously more complicated with more "stages" in between. But i am curious about your opinion to this subject. Because personally i think a lot of people that are uncomfortable with transgender people are most uncomfortable with the transition. When does a person stop being female and start being male? When the person identifies as the other gender, but clearly still has the original body?
In all honesty, to a trans person we were never our birth sex to begin with, so it's kinda a wrong body situation. Yeah that can make daily life really complicated, but on the other hand it's just as complicated to use the wrong bathroom, or locker room, from a personal perspective. In other words, being trans is just plain complicated. Now here's a fun one from my side. I was made to use the girl's bathroom and locker room starting in middle school. Part of that is that I started presenting as a girl full time around them. Still the best excuse was, that because I dressed as a girl, boys would get weird about my undies. From my experience the girls on the other hand were kinda put off and confused about it at first, but it kinda worked to my advantage, as I got accepted, and the girls thought I was cute. Being trans kinda made me non-threatening in that case, and they had a boy who liked girl things right in the palm of their hands. That said, men kinda respond different(less comfortably too) on the subject than women do.
Phew! Long post was long! I'll try to address more questions as I go. But dang do I got some catching up to do. Thank you all for your patience, and I apologize for being absent as the thread got this long.