maninahat said:
That's where the problem lies: Skyrim encourages players to take part in a behaviour that has become associated with the oppressors of womankind, by turning slut-shaming into a mission objective. As I mentioned in a previous post, game progression requires you to do this mission, and outside of not doing the Thief quests, there is no choice. You are expected to do this deed and get rewarded for it. In so doing, the player has to endorse slut-shaming as much as they endorse any of the other thief guild activities. Presumably, the devs thought you'd have as much fun doing this as killing or stealing.
Um. No, game progression absolutely does not require you to do this mission, nor is it a Thieves Guild quest or required to progress with the Thieves Guild. I'm sitting on a Nightingale who never did it and another working toward Nightingale who never did it. The Thieves Guild requires you to play the role of enforcer in a protection racket-- you have to go hassle business owners to pay their debts to the mob, basically. Haelga is one of the ones you need to collect from to progress as a thief. You can either beat her up, as with all three of the business owners, or you have an optional method of threatening her statue of Dibella (IIRC, you threaten her statue, break the Pawned Prawn guy's ugly sculpture, and threaten the Argonian innkeeper's family for the optional quests. Or, you can skip the optional persuasion methods and just hit them. Actually, depending on the order you did it in, the third merchant will usually hear about what you did with the other two and just hand you the cash. Haelga was my third, so she caved the minute I walked through the door.)
The slut-shaming quest is completely outside the Thieves Guild mission, it's simply a single quest from her (very grudgy) niece. You absolutely do *not* need to do it to progress in the game or with the Thieves. You can decline it and nothing happens to your game. I agree that it's a nasty quest, my first character did it and it's on my mental list of "quests that made me feel so oogy I'm never doing them again", but you're way overblowing it here. I really don't know what the devs intended, since on one hand they made Haelga kind of a joke character (look under her bed!) but on the other hand they made the niece who gives you the quest *really really clearly* lazy, unpleasant, ungrateful, and completely deluded about the sleazeball guy she has a fixation on.
TwistednMean said:
So the "isms" are only worth debating if there really is an issue. Accusing a woman of having three sexual partners in Skyrim? Sorry, folks, it's part of the narrative. Sure, it's sexist, but that's the Redguard's misguided social norms, apparently. You can disapprove of the Redguard's culture, but it doesn't give you the right to get offended.
Where are you people *getting* this stuff? I'm starting to think I'm the only person here who actually did this quest, and hung around the Bunkhouse listening to the character-to-character dialogue (I think I was doing something out of game at the time and forgot to pause, but still.) There are no Redguards involved with this quest! The shamer is a Nord. The woman with the three partners is a Nord. Further, there is a Redguard priestess of Dibella in Markarth (the only Redguard woman you can marry, in fact.) I can't imagine where you pulled Redguards from, since there's nothing in the game of which I'm aware that hints at sexual prudery in Hammerfell-- if you've got something that does, please show the receipts because it's *definitely* not this quest.
Ultratwinkie said:
Whats the problem with the Skyrim slut shaming quest?
Isn't that, technically, par the course for a pseudo-medieval culture? Its not like Cyrodiil where everything is "civilized." This is the harsh northern territory we are talking about that is steeped in tradition and very "hand to mouth." Those cultures were never known to be open minded.
Yes, Skyrim is so "uncivilized" with respect to sexual prudery that it has an established temple to Dibella in a major holdfast, a sidequest to find the goddess' chosen Oracle, and an altar in the bloody *capital city* of Skyrim. It's totally cultural! Except for how it isn't. (Please don't get me on how the real life Vikings weren't that way either. Modern street prostitutes would consider what actual archaeology is finding was Viking women's dress too revealing, so...) Nor were the Vikings "medieval", and Skyrim is pretty clearly Viking-inspired.
The quest-giver in this instance is pissed at being asked to work to support the business that feeds her, and more to the point, angry that her promiscuous aunt dissed her wannabe boyfriend, so she wants a little revenge.