Jimquisition: Go Fish
- Thread starter Jimothy Sterling
- Start date
Recommended Videos
I learnt how to spot bullies pretty quickly while growing up and I think Fish is one of them. He acts like a dick, putting people down to make himself feel better, and then he throws a fit when other bullies bully him worse. If you behave like a ****, bigger cunts will attack you, especially when you're not very good at handling it. I don't blame him for lashing out at Beer or anyone else who insults him but that's not all he did, is it. We've all seen his little "Japanese video games suck" video by now, in which he insults a man who can barely speak English and then his friends laugh. Is that the kind of guy anyone should feel sorry for? Is there no way to dislike Fish AND the people who insulted him? Is it not possible the only victims are the people Fish insulted and the innocent people insulted by Fish' "attackers"?
Bottom Line: Fish behaved poorly and attracted worse behaviour. He should seriously grow the fuck up.
Bottom Line: Fish behaved poorly and attracted worse behaviour. He should seriously grow the fuck up.
There is no karma for people uniting against a common enemy, and he simply made too many enemies in his short time with us. No, I don't agree that two wrongs make a right, but I am also not surprised in the LEAST at the conclusion this took. You reap what you sow. The guy lathered his naked body with chum, and jumped into a pool of piranhas. Are we really supposed to feel bad about that? Are we supposed to blame the piranhas? People can only stand so much before they get pissed, and what you could be mistaken in suggesting is they should have kept their mouth shut and just took the beating he was dishing out. "Gamers are horrible people", "this ethnicity is stupid at making video games", etc. Should non-anonymous (and famous) people be able to bait everyone so thoroughly and come out totally unscathed? Is that really a more idealistic world?Necromancer Jim said:
Being so antagonistic himself, I can only surmise he thought the fact that he made videogames was a satisfactory shield against such opposition. The utter arrogance and sense of privilege that implies is just insane. When you talk to the world like you're a 14 year old 4chan poster, expect the world to talk back like 14 year old 4chan posters; that goes with ANY TOPIC. People really need to just try and be more decent human beings if they want the world to treat them better, because at the end of the day people really can surprise you in good ways. All you have to do is treat them with a bit of respect and decency, and convey controversial opinions in civilized manners.
As for the death threats? The whole "anonymous internet tough guy thing" is just that. We all know no one is hunting down his family, sending an alien invasion fleet to his house or anything so ludicrous. Taking people's insane claims on the internet as fact is a childish thing to do, especially given the context that this guy is just getting reverse trolled. People were just shouting disturbing things at him to try and get under his skin, and given his reaction, it worked. That's as much his fault as it is theirs, given he's a professional troll himself.
When your great debut to the world of gaming is "Fuck all ya guyz", you can expect the rest of your career here to be filled with """abuse"""(there simply isn't enough quotation marks for that word). That isn't 'an eye for an eye', it's reality.
That video I posted? He might not have committed a crime against humanity there, but he made himself out to be the absolute most loathsome kind of person imaginable, just in personality traits alone. You have to understand, what he did was the equivalent of beating up a physically disabled person (or anyone else who literally couldn't throw a punch back). When someone who has traveled so far comes up to you, and makes it clear they don't fully understand your language, the absolute worse thing you can do is immediately talk shit to them and then proceed to make-fun of them. Fish elaborating on his opinions didn't help either, because remember, that japanese guy barley understood English... so how the hell was he supposed to argue or defend himself!? *spoiler warning* he couldn't. They attacked someone who couldn't possibly have defended himself in front of a crowd, then pointed and laughed. Yeah, he both consciously and subconsciously advertised to the entire world from then on he was the worst, most pathetic kind of person. People remember this kind of stuff forever, so every incident he incited from then on got over-reactions.
Hello Jim,
Thanks for taking the time to make this video. I always enjoy additional content from them.
I think in the case of Fish in particular, the problem is with a widely percieved issue of arrogance on his part alongside a consistent failure to produce work in any reasonable timeframe. And not the kind of show arrogance that makes your videos so entertaining. The real, "I'm a golden god" sort of thing is what people imagine when thinking about Fish. That being said, whether the percieved arrogance is performance (yours) or evident (his), the effect is still the same. I'm sure a lot of the complaints against him strike home for you. I'm sure a lot of the asses that don't get your work levy the same complaints/threats against you so you can see a fellow victim in Fish. A minor difference being that you have people who do get and love your work to fall back on who actually understand your intention. When you're attacked, it's actually a stage version of you being insulted (although I'm sure some insults hit you personally even if aimed at Stage Jim). Fish doesn't have that luxury.
In any event, people love to see the arrogant fail. So Fish is confronted on two fronts. One by scathing reports/media people who have nothing better to do than generate news by prodding him to see what he'll say next (I mean, think about it, how much publicity did poor little Beer get here? Hah), and again by onlookers who view him as a one-hit wonder being crushed under the weight of his own ego who think he deserves that nonesense. I'm not saying this to take a side or anything like that, I'm just examining the public reaction. I think people are taking cheap shots at Fish and he's been under clear duress from them for years. I don't know many people who wouldn't have cracked under that kind of persistent pressure. I also don't know the guy, I have no idea if he's actually arrogant or not and that's no reason for me to want him to suffer and certainly not to see him fail. The only complaint a person could bring against him is merely the way he lashed out and not that he lashed out.
Hopefully he'll be able to adjust and learn how to swim with the sharks. Or even better, maybe he can become an unapologetic shark himself and give us an entertaining personality who eats and poops reports that try to snipe at him. The best response Fish could have given is an unrepentant, "When I told him to kill himself, I specifically meant he should stuff his head up his own ass until he suffocated or choked on feces." I mean, he was angry, sure, but he might as well own it. It's not like an apology would matter to anyone. Kudos to you for speaking out on this. I appreciate your work.
Thanks for taking the time to make this video. I always enjoy additional content from them.
I think in the case of Fish in particular, the problem is with a widely percieved issue of arrogance on his part alongside a consistent failure to produce work in any reasonable timeframe. And not the kind of show arrogance that makes your videos so entertaining. The real, "I'm a golden god" sort of thing is what people imagine when thinking about Fish. That being said, whether the percieved arrogance is performance (yours) or evident (his), the effect is still the same. I'm sure a lot of the complaints against him strike home for you. I'm sure a lot of the asses that don't get your work levy the same complaints/threats against you so you can see a fellow victim in Fish. A minor difference being that you have people who do get and love your work to fall back on who actually understand your intention. When you're attacked, it's actually a stage version of you being insulted (although I'm sure some insults hit you personally even if aimed at Stage Jim). Fish doesn't have that luxury.
In any event, people love to see the arrogant fail. So Fish is confronted on two fronts. One by scathing reports/media people who have nothing better to do than generate news by prodding him to see what he'll say next (I mean, think about it, how much publicity did poor little Beer get here? Hah), and again by onlookers who view him as a one-hit wonder being crushed under the weight of his own ego who think he deserves that nonesense. I'm not saying this to take a side or anything like that, I'm just examining the public reaction. I think people are taking cheap shots at Fish and he's been under clear duress from them for years. I don't know many people who wouldn't have cracked under that kind of persistent pressure. I also don't know the guy, I have no idea if he's actually arrogant or not and that's no reason for me to want him to suffer and certainly not to see him fail. The only complaint a person could bring against him is merely the way he lashed out and not that he lashed out.
Hopefully he'll be able to adjust and learn how to swim with the sharks. Or even better, maybe he can become an unapologetic shark himself and give us an entertaining personality who eats and poops reports that try to snipe at him. The best response Fish could have given is an unrepentant, "When I told him to kill himself, I specifically meant he should stuff his head up his own ass until he suffocated or choked on feces." I mean, he was angry, sure, but he might as well own it. It's not like an apology would matter to anyone. Kudos to you for speaking out on this. I appreciate your work.
They were not attacking the man, just giving their views on modern japanese games which is exactly what the guy asked. All of the designers are on record many times saying that they dislike modern games as a whole, not just japanese ones, but the question was narrowed to modern japanese games. Were these people supposed to lie about their views? I think most people stopped watching this video as soon as Fish said his thing given the amount of "what about Dark Souls?" comments popping up. His comments about Zelda are spot on.xPixelatedx said:
Developers make games for a living, most of them do this because they love games. I don't know many steel workers who love working in dangerous, hot and downright tedious conditions. Phish is a hipster douche, who should be happy that people pay any attention to him at all. He should grow a pair OR do the smart thing and ignore the masses. Just make his games, try to make some cash, and enjoy the praise from the people who actually like the guy.
The problem with the game industry is not the backlash from fans but rather the sense of entitlement at every level. Developers think they deserve academy awards for making mediocre games, or in that rare instance where they actually make a great game, they think everything else they touch will be gold. Publishers think that every crappy story/concept is a franchise and fans are too stupid to speak with their wallets as opposed to railing against some wussbag hipster like Phish on twitter.
In the real word, accolades and respect often have to be earned through hard work and by giving what you expect for yourself to others.
Let Phish go work at best buy or something like the rest of the worthless 20 somethings.
The problem with the game industry is not the backlash from fans but rather the sense of entitlement at every level. Developers think they deserve academy awards for making mediocre games, or in that rare instance where they actually make a great game, they think everything else they touch will be gold. Publishers think that every crappy story/concept is a franchise and fans are too stupid to speak with their wallets as opposed to railing against some wussbag hipster like Phish on twitter.
In the real word, accolades and respect often have to be earned through hard work and by giving what you expect for yourself to others.
Let Phish go work at best buy or something like the rest of the worthless 20 somethings.
Yes, there will be karma for them but we won't see it or know about. What goes around comes around. That is the concept of karma.Necromancer Jim said:
You act as if a good chunk of the world aren't assholes to each other already. There are multiple reasons the internet can be such a hateful and spiteful place, this is one of those reasons. The problem with a lot of us is we lack the sense to look at the bigger picture. You and I could stumble into a thread and find something like what is above and pass judgement on it. But the thing is, what we see is only salvo #14 of a conflict that has been ongoing for who knows how long. Things happen for reasons. Fish was an asshole, thus people react in kind. Nothing happens without a reason or cause, nothing. We may deem the cause childish, ignorant, stupid, foolish, asinine, irrelevant, or any other thing, and we may be correct. But there is still a cause.
What happened was to be expected. The people who threatened Fish and his family are reprehensible, but Fish brought himself down to their level by that "go kill yourself' quip. By doing that, he gives himself considerably less and less ground to stand on. Actions have consequences, he made himself a future victim when he opened his mouth.
Regarding death threats - surely we can all agree that threats of violence are completely inappropriate to either side of any online debate, especially anything having to do with games. Yet they happen all the time. It's the most casually accepted WTF of gaming culture.
Why don't we here ( or somebody / anybody anywhere, really ) come up with something like Godwin's law ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law ). A "a memetic tool to reduce the incidence of inappropriate hyperbole," if you'll pardon the paraphrase. The way I've seen Godwin's law applied - and this is anecdotal, so correct me if I'm wrong - is that when it's cited it instantly discredits whoever made the offending comparison involving Nazis or Hitler. It wards against lazy arguments.
I feel like the same thing should be done with death threats. I'm not saying they will go away or must be verbotten, but culturally we need some phrase to reference as a shorthand for thread readers to say of a post 'You've got to be kidding me, dial it back because you've lost all credibility,' thereby creating a disincentive to throw death threats around as a rhetorical device.
@ Jim - Great bit, and please add me to the chorus of Jimquisition fans who also like this more casual format.
Why don't we here ( or somebody / anybody anywhere, really ) come up with something like Godwin's law ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law ). A "a memetic tool to reduce the incidence of inappropriate hyperbole," if you'll pardon the paraphrase. The way I've seen Godwin's law applied - and this is anecdotal, so correct me if I'm wrong - is that when it's cited it instantly discredits whoever made the offending comparison involving Nazis or Hitler. It wards against lazy arguments.
I feel like the same thing should be done with death threats. I'm not saying they will go away or must be verbotten, but culturally we need some phrase to reference as a shorthand for thread readers to say of a post 'You've got to be kidding me, dial it back because you've lost all credibility,' thereby creating a disincentive to throw death threats around as a rhetorical device.
@ Jim - Great bit, and please add me to the chorus of Jimquisition fans who also like this more casual format.
*applause* Well put, man! I hadn't thought about it in quite that way before.Mcoffey said:
Meh, don't know the guy and "his" games are not my type but for situations
like this i generally say: "Suck it up princess." don't boohoo about random internet guys it's a sticks and stones kind of thing.
There are plenty of people who appreciate but you just don't hear from them.
like this i generally say: "Suck it up princess." don't boohoo about random internet guys it's a sticks and stones kind of thing.
There are plenty of people who appreciate but you just don't hear from them.
As someone who has often gotten a lot of flakk for having especially violent outburst when angered, this does speak to me quite a bit, in ways I'm not entirely sure of in their true scope
Thanks Jim, I feel this was something that was very much needed to be said
Thank Lain for Jim
Thanks Jim, I feel this was something that was very much needed to be said
Thank Lain for Jim
Jim,
In Phil's final responses he actually singled out Marcus AND YOU for being 'terrible stains of the internet.' I was surprised that you didn't even mention this. Any reason why? Also, I'm quite a fan of how this was such an extremely calm and rational episode. It's a sensitive situation and being able to handle this with care shows a great amount of class that most people don't think you have!
In Phil's final responses he actually singled out Marcus AND YOU for being 'terrible stains of the internet.' I was surprised that you didn't even mention this. Any reason why? Also, I'm quite a fan of how this was such an extremely calm and rational episode. It's a sensitive situation and being able to handle this with care shows a great amount of class that most people don't think you have!
I'd never heard of this guy before now. After doing some research I have to say on one hand its sad to see the guy throw his entire career away like a child kicking over a checkers board and storming out of the room. But, on the other hand he's been guilty of some pretty bad behavior of his own so I personally feel he's just reaping what he sews.
It's for posts like these where I wish you could upvote shit like reddit. Nevertheless, You've earned this.TheOrb said:
*TAKE IT*
So, Jim playing the good cop today? I like it. Well done, Jim.
Speaking from my own experience, it does not take much to feel intimidated by groupthink on the Internet. I think there's a natural, human drive to want to feel socially verified about what you do with your life, and there was very much a time when it was a good and positive thing to help us grow as a society.
These days, though, there's a couple of big problems with that I can see off the top of my head.
First, there's this driving idea of being "cool," it haunts kids from the day they're born and it's ultimately a bunch of arbitrary bullshit that only really serves to ostracize people. I'm old enough now that I can say, "Fuck being cool, I'm my own individual now," but I think there's still a lot of adults out there who never really come to this realization and end up acting the perpetual snobby frat boy for a significant amount of their lives.
Second, there's the media. If you never watched Charlie Brooker's Newswipe, I really recommend you do. (But then, I think should be aired as mandatory classwork to High School seniors, such is my positive opinion of it.) It basically comes down to a great little documentary about how news is not really about reporting the facts anymore. It's entertainment, and consequently it has been inflated with so much fluff pieces that would include lambasting people just to jump on the popularity train and give the lowest common denominator what they want to hear. Fish got caught up in that, he became a popular guy to be bashed by the media, and I think the media needs to be held accountable for its actions. It won't be, though, because it's the media, and freedom of the press is something we hold sacred enough that they can even report school shootings despite experts saying that causes more school shootings, if they want.
That said, take it from me, don't lose your cool, Fish. Getting angry at these people does not solve anything. They love it, they're just looking for things to report that get them viewers, and providing them that kind of spectacle just plays right into their hands. You should not even think of members of the media as people when they're doing their job, because they're certainly not acting the part; they're not attacking you as a person would. They're just objects of sensationalism seeking, hounding out whatever they think will garner them a little more popularity. Don't get mad at that, it's like getting mad at a mosquito for sucking your blood.
Finally, lemme point this out to you, Fish, if you're reading this. I don't think making games was just a job for you. It was not just a job for me, either, and I never actually managed to see a game through to completion. It's a creative passion, isn't it? Nobody should be able to take that away from you. Even if you end up developing Fez II, or whatever, in your garage, while you try to hold down a "real" job of some kind, do what you enjoy doing, and don't listen to the groupthink-aligned idiots who would try to tell you otherwise.
Speaking from my own experience, it does not take much to feel intimidated by groupthink on the Internet. I think there's a natural, human drive to want to feel socially verified about what you do with your life, and there was very much a time when it was a good and positive thing to help us grow as a society.
These days, though, there's a couple of big problems with that I can see off the top of my head.
First, there's this driving idea of being "cool," it haunts kids from the day they're born and it's ultimately a bunch of arbitrary bullshit that only really serves to ostracize people. I'm old enough now that I can say, "Fuck being cool, I'm my own individual now," but I think there's still a lot of adults out there who never really come to this realization and end up acting the perpetual snobby frat boy for a significant amount of their lives.
Second, there's the media. If you never watched Charlie Brooker's Newswipe, I really recommend you do. (But then, I think should be aired as mandatory classwork to High School seniors, such is my positive opinion of it.) It basically comes down to a great little documentary about how news is not really about reporting the facts anymore. It's entertainment, and consequently it has been inflated with so much fluff pieces that would include lambasting people just to jump on the popularity train and give the lowest common denominator what they want to hear. Fish got caught up in that, he became a popular guy to be bashed by the media, and I think the media needs to be held accountable for its actions. It won't be, though, because it's the media, and freedom of the press is something we hold sacred enough that they can even report school shootings despite experts saying that causes more school shootings, if they want.
That said, take it from me, don't lose your cool, Fish. Getting angry at these people does not solve anything. They love it, they're just looking for things to report that get them viewers, and providing them that kind of spectacle just plays right into their hands. You should not even think of members of the media as people when they're doing their job, because they're certainly not acting the part; they're not attacking you as a person would. They're just objects of sensationalism seeking, hounding out whatever they think will garner them a little more popularity. Don't get mad at that, it's like getting mad at a mosquito for sucking your blood.
Finally, lemme point this out to you, Fish, if you're reading this. I don't think making games was just a job for you. It was not just a job for me, either, and I never actually managed to see a game through to completion. It's a creative passion, isn't it? Nobody should be able to take that away from you. Even if you end up developing Fez II, or whatever, in your garage, while you try to hold down a "real" job of some kind, do what you enjoy doing, and don't listen to the groupthink-aligned idiots who would try to tell you otherwise.
