Kickstarter Video Project Attracts Misogynist Horde

[socialistmath]

Did you... Did you really compare Hollywood failing to portray women well, to black face? We are done here. No. jsut no. Shut the fuck up and never speak to me again.

Actually, they're both based upon a lack of respect and on harmful stereotypes of a minority. So...

 

[hentropy]

We should move beyond it the same way Hollywood moved beyond blackface and other racist stereotypes and depictions.

Did you... Did you really compare Hollywood failing to portray women well, to black face? We are done here. No. jsut no. Shut the fuck up and never speak to me again.

No, but you seem rather convinced I did so I'm not going to argue with someone who can't properly comprehend things that they read and then react angrily and immaturely when they come to the wrong conclusion.

She's a 14 year old orphan and civilization has collapsed. So she'll need help. It's not a plot against women.

A "plot" implies intention and planning, I don't think anyone consciously wishes to plant these stereotypes in media and I should be fair and say that the Last of Us might still be a good game that doesn't totally reinforce these stereotypes. But it is a fictional story and they did choose an older copy-pasted grizzled hero to lead her alone instead of an older woman who might be just as capable, or even a small group of people. Why not a story about a mom trying to lead her kid(s) through the end times? It feels wrong to most people because guys can be the only ones who are strong and resilient enough to provide leadership in such a situation, where women always have to be under their wing.

 

[Dominus Nox]

So by the looks of that video, she already has recording equipment and an audience for her works, I'm not sure why she needs $6000 for research?

 

[maninahat]

...Yet here I watch a video that doesn't care about the story of Prince of Persia with the Prince and Elika and their reliance on each other to survive and the hard choices they make to try and save the world.

Actually, though they are co-dependant, Elika gets the short end of the stick in terms of characterisation. Prince of Persia is no different from the countless games which cast the man as the sword fighting, badass protector, and the girl as the frail, nurturing healer who follows behind. No one expects it to be any other way around. Prince of Persia borrows a lot from Ico, which as good a game as it is, doesn't exactly go out of its way to show the female as anything much other than a cute piece of baggage that needs to be lead by the nose and constantly protected.

 

[hentropy]

So by the looks of that video, she already has recording equipment and an audience for her works, I'm not sure why she needs $6000 for research?

Can't say for sure, but if she wants the documentary to look professional she'll need professional design and editing (which you have to pay people for) as well as possibly paying interview subjects for their time and/or paying people to do proper camera work and lighting. Doing online reviews where you sit in front of a camera or play clips of games is a whole different league than making longer, slick-looking documentaries.

 

[Davroth]

I hate pretty people. I find it disgusting how they are treated, just because they are born a little more appealing to the eye then the average person.

I'll start start writing elaborate lists of all the ways ugly people are misrepresented in media, and then I'll make a kickstarter and collect money to turn in into a documentary.

What? You say noone feels guilty about treating beautiful people better then others? Well that's terrible. I think I have to raise more awareness to remedy that.

 

[Ultrajoe]

So by the looks of that video, she already has recording equipment and an audience for her works, I'm not sure why she needs $6000 for research?

Because research costs money. Interviews, travel, equipment, personal wage. She's doing an academic project, she needs to eat, pay rent and cover other costs while she's doing it. In Comparison: Scientists and universities have all of their equipment and labs, why do they need research grants?

Same principle, it's actually a marvel she's only asking for $6000.

 

[PurePareidolia]

The stupid thing is, I've watched her videos and she actually provides really good commentary, so I have no idea what these people could possibly have a problem with.

Yes, she exclusively focuses on female tropes, not male ones, so? That's the subject she's interested in talking about, if people want a video series on male stereotypes then they can make one. Additionally, she focuses on harmful stereotypes - most male stereotypes in gaming aren't exactly negative. It's not as if the lack of decent female characters is in any way shocking if you have even a cursory knowledge of the games coming out these days. I'd even argue some of the positive examples she uses (like Chell) are still the bare minimum of effort.

And it's actually interesting, in-depth stuff - it's academic in quality, occasionally funny and generally pretty well researched. Her reasons for addressing the media specifically are well reasoned and if people pay attention to them, it will improve storytelling as a whole, given people may one day be able to represent 50% of the human race with something approaching basic competence, which kind of seems important if you think about it.

Also she realizes how awful and incredibly sexist Sucker Punch was, which puts her in terms of insight and ability to recognize the bleeding obvious above people who are actually paid to write things on this very website. That's got to count for something.

Captcha: Better Half

 

[Don Savik]

Here's a hint: consider how gamers are represented in wider media. When we're shown on the news, in (non-gaming) magazines or TV shows or (non-games industry funded) studies we're fat, spotty, basement-dwelling virgins who live with our mothers. Or we're mass-murderers waiting to happen. Crazy psychos honing our shooting skills on CoD or Gears of War or Halo, waiting for the day when we will crack and shoot up our schools. Or we're hilariously socially awkward manchildren. We're "crazies", as you put it.These things are true of a tiny minority of people who play games

Now apply that same logic to feminism (and pretty much any group you find unfavourably presented in mainstream media).

That example is more true than you think, because I've never seen any such demonizing, except in exceptionally crappy sensationalistic media, and even they only silently imply it. The only place I've ever seriously seen crap like "Play this game and [awfull stuff] will happen to you" was very extremist Christians who warned for demonic possession from games that contain magic or paganist themes.

So if we apply that to feminism, you're right we get a perfect parabel: A tiny minority think gamers are crazy, many gamers get worked up about the stereotype, and in the meantime, there isn't really any real problem.

Much in the same way feminists cry oppression, a tiny minority of religious extremists indeed opress women, but in reality there's not really any problem going on because egalitarianism has become deeply rooted in society.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head there. I think not much else needs to be said on the topic.

And can we please stop this topic? We went from a post on youtube trolls to movie bob's review of suckerpunch. Its derailed past the pointing of giving a damn to be honest. At this point we're just throwing insults back and forth at each other to make ourselves feel less sexist than others. We have better things to do with our time, even posting on a thread about what would you do if you were your avatar would be more beneficial. I don't mind a good debate, but we've become a youtube comment section at this point.

Y'all stared too long into the abyss my escapians.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Unless you're some kind of statistical anomaly or actively avoid all human contact, you know many feminists personally.

Uhm, nope. Just women dubbing themselves like them.

Oh, so all the "true feminists" that you've never personally met (and are somehow distinct from all the people you have met that identify as feminist and have views that can be accurately characterized as feminist) are down at the pub drinking with the True Scotsmen. Gotcha.

 

[Nautical Honors Society]

The bigoted and misogynistic comments are quite disgusting...but do you really need $6000 for a video blog?

I mean she's not even providing a unique service. There are many blogs and videos on the internet discussing feminism and gaming that don't ask for a donation.

Frankly because it isn't needed...

 

[Nautical Honors Society]

Unless you're some kind of statistical anomaly or actively avoid all human contact, you know many feminists personally.

Uhm, nope. Just women dubbing themselves like them. Like I said: anything prominent seems to be with the crazies. And it's not looking, just what you pick up if you keep up with stuff. Again: read what it says, not what you'd want it to say.

So where are the non-crazy ones?

Because even what you brought up as an example of good, is just a crazy feminist who's just looking for things to grab and confirm her prejudices and preconceived conclusions. The one posted here earlier, she even goes so far as to say a certain haircut on a female character is proof it's not empowering.

That's right, if you're a woman and you're not shaved bald except for a bright red mohawk, then you are not empowered... Well, you are in her world anyway. Let's all inhabit reality instead.

Yikes...

Dude a feminist is simply someone who believes that women should be on equal footing as men. That's it.

I am man and a feminist. And I am sure you are one too...at least I hope.

Radical feminists are a very different story...

 

[Moromillas]

I think the documentary is a good idea. BUT, I really don't think "feministfrequency" should be doing it, no not at all.

It's going to turn out biased and you know it, which is not what a documentary is supposed to be. If it's anything like her other videos, it will just be "feministfrequency" expressing her opinion, not a documentary. Really not the right person for the job.

 

[wetnap]

You just described everyone I know personally who could be described as "feminist," and probably everyone you know personally who could be described as "feminist." If, on the other hand, you look on the internet for crazies, you'll find crazies. It's silly to pretend, however, that the crazies you find on the internet when you specifically look for crazies (or that you know about because, originally, a right-winger somewhere wanted a convenient strawman) somehow represent everyone who falls under a very broad umbrella term.

I also find little but crazies in magazines, lobby groups, news reports, studies...

So where's the non-crazy ones?

Here's a hint: consider how gamers are represented in wider media. When we're shown on the news, in (non-gaming) magazines or TV shows or (non-games industry funded) studies we're fat, spotty, basement-dwelling virgins who live with our mothers. Or we're mass-murderers waiting to happen. Crazy psychos honing our shooting skills on CoD or Gears of War or Halo, waiting for the day when we will crack and shoot up our schools. Or we're hilariously socially awkward manchildren. We're "crazies", as you put it.These things are true of a tiny minority of people who play games.

Now apply that same logic to feminism (and pretty much any group you find unfavourably presented in mainstream media).

Bingo, if you need to find it, you will find it.

Thats the problem with girls like her who take on a cheap version of feminism that is all about fueling their own teenage rage.

Course this goes to another level because such "feminists" have found a way to monetize it now, the trash tabloid link bait feminism has become the new thing. Take outrageous stances, or scream hysteria seeing sexism everywhere, generate page views, generate rage, which generates more page views, generating responses to rage and on and on, its a nice cycle of raking in the money.

 

[Chemical Alia]

Reading this thread made me go donate a few hundred dollars of my hard earned tf2 hat money. Holy shit.

 

[wetnap]

The stupid thing is, I've watched her videos and she actually provides really good commentary, so I have no idea what these people could possibly have a problem with.

Yes, she exclusively focuses on female tropes, not male ones, so? That's the subject she's interested in talking about, if people want a video series on male stereotypes then they can make one. Additionally, she focuses on harmful stereotypes - most male stereotypes in gaming aren't exactly negative. It's not as if the lack of decent female characters is in any way shocking if you have even a cursory knowledge of the games coming out these days. I'd even argue some of the positive examples she uses (like Chell) are still the bare minimum of effort.

And it's actually interesting, in-depth stuff - it's academic in quality, occasionally funny and generally pretty well researched. Her reasons for addressing the media specifically are well reasoned and if people pay attention to them, it will improve storytelling as a whole, given people may one day be able to represent 50% of the human race with something approaching basic competence, which kind of seems important if you think about it.

Also she realizes how awful and incredibly sexist Sucker Punch was, which puts her in terms of insight and ability to recognize the bleeding obvious above people who are actually paid to write things on this very website. That's got to count for something.

Captcha: Better Half

The obvious problem is her thought is half baked. Why are womens magazines filled with attractive women, even womens fashion/fitness or whatever magazines/media out there, because people like looking at attractive people. So is this clearly a case for a quota of fat and ugly people in media? Of course not, it is the way it is because that is what people actually want. Feminists like her want to go against human nature, based on their particular preferences. We need more pudgy plain female protagonists why? Because she said so, not for any other reason.

Everything is selected for quality. How many games have you playing as a sniveling loser?..one who stay a sniveling loser. No, your protagonist tends to go on an epic heros journey, not end up as a walmart greeter at the age of 65, we need to stop kidding ourselves, there was and always was selection going on, people want fantasy, aspiration, something more in their entertainment and stories, not drudgery of reality. That is why avatars and characters in games are exaggerated for greatness/attractiveness/strength/ability. Getting on a high horse over these differences from reality shows she like so many totally miss the point of games and entertainment.


And her videos aren't academic in quality, they reek of feminist dogma taught in colleges these days. Where it isn't important whether your stances are supported by facts, but only that they are supported by ideology and enough nodding from your compatriots. Its why so many of them failed to understand why the WNBA wouldn't take off, they looked around at themselves and their friends, none interested in watching, but their ideological brainwashing did not let them consider this, only reason for the WNBA's failure, sexism, sexism in society and the rest, nothing else can be considered.