lets collectively lol @ these "I need feminism because..." pics

[Piorn]

The sad thing is, I'm used to people having ...weird opinions on serious topics, so I can't even tell if these are real or not.

 

[VoidWanderer]

Ah ... Feminism

An interesting ideology constantly thwarted by any 'Teen Girl' Magazine or Magazines with articles on how to improve her sex life by making HIS better...

 

[BreakfastMan]

I find it very difficult to take feminists seriously.

Generally when you start off a debate with "I'm a feminist" or even using the word, my value in the next you say decreases quite significantly.

To ardently affix ones self as a "Feminist" is basically to say "I care about women's rights.", which is fine. But, what about Men's Rights? Some things in the world obviously favour females, likewise, some favour men, you can't ignore either.

To identify yourself as a feminist just paints the picture that you're completely out of touch with the issue, and unaware that it goes both ways.

So, yeah, to be blunt, if you call yourself a feminist, I automatically think you're wrong.

Being aware of both sides and working towards "Gender equality" is generally a much better term.

Feminist just strikes as self-interest.

Maybe if you define feminism that way. Thing is, many don't really agree with that definition of "feminism", to the point where the first line in the wikipedia article on the movement [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feminism] disagrees with you. Feminism is not the big, monolithic entity many think it is.

 

[Calibanbutcher]

Ultra-SNip

I approve of this message.

Some contributions:
on number 5: Being too fat is unhealthy and I refuse to support that.
And on the "only attractive women can achieve success"-point: I give you: Hillary Clinton and Angela Merkel.

 

[Padwolf]

Well. That second one is completely stupid. The university is named after a male because they achieved something. Are we to completely ignore the achievements of men now? My old university, St Mary's was named after a woman. Go to a different university if you don't agree that it should honour someone who achieved something great in their life. Really that one was just silly.

As for the "street harassment" one. What do they want? do they want men to harass women to make them feel more attractive? Really? Seems a bit more of a personal issues than anything. The armpit hair one too, that's more a personal issue than a feminist issue.

 

[The Lunatic]

Maybe if you define feminism that way. Thing is, many don't really agree with that definition of "feminism", to the point where the first line in the wikipedia article on the movement [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feminism] disagrees with you. Feminism is not the big, monolithic entity many think it is.

Generally speaking, one would assume somebody who goes around assuming to be aware of things being oriented towards a certain gender, wouldn't use a word that does exactly that to describe their gender-equal views.

 

[Crazedtraceur]

Trust me, you really don't. But if you'd like to read through some bullshit, you can start with http://everydayfeminism.com/2013/01/five-ways-rape-culture-exists-unnoticed/ and then move on from there. Here are some wonderfull bullshit solutions feminism has proposed as well; http://www.thenation.com/article/172643/ten-things-end-rape-culture?rel=emailNation#

In that first link you provided:
"It?s an easy trap to fall into ? this idea that we have the right to an opinion about someone else?s body."
"this idea that we have the right to an opinion"

Lulwut? I understand how the blatant sexist shit people do needs to stop, but so much of this extreme feminism is JUST as sexist. I'm supposed to feel guilty for rape just because I was born with a penis? In what world does that make ANY sense?

 

[Muspelheim]

Oh, faith and begora, would you look at all them lovely strawmen!

Don't worry, lads, I doubt evil hairy ladies will confiscate your dick in the dark of the night...

 

[bastardofmelbourne]

Those pics are pretty funny.

Thread's going bad places, though! As a side note, OP, I for one don't think you're making fun of feminism. Just some very silly feminists.

Of course, you're going to make the people used to constantly defending feminism really defensive, so they won't like you. You're going to attract all of the unsavoury, borderline-misogynistic reactionaries as well, and they're going to agree with you for the wrong reasons. And they're gonna word-punch each other until this thread hits twenty pages! It's the Thrilla in Manila, but with less black people and more neckbeards.

This thread's goin' downtown to crazy town and you're all invited

 

[Calibanbutcher]

Ultra-SNip

I approve of this message.

Some contributions:
on number 5: Being too fat is unhealthy and I refuse to support that.
And on the "only attractive women can achieve success"-point: I give you: Hillary Clinton and Angela Merkel.

And how are you sure that their weight was caused by overeating and an unhealthy lifestyle, and not a product of genetics or a disorder? If it's something they cannot change, then they shouldn't be judged for it.

The probability of obesity being caused by a genetic condition is quite slim and though there are possible explanations, overeating is still the most likely explanation.
Genetics or a disorder causing obesity are quite rare.
If however they do have a disorder, they do have my sympathies and I would advise them to go seek medical attention and maybe the help of a dietician.

 

[Calibanbutcher]

Ultra-SNip

I approve of this message.

Some contributions:
on number 5: Being too fat is unhealthy and I refuse to support that.
And on the "only attractive women can achieve success"-point: I give you: Hillary Clinton and Angela Merkel.

i'd advise you to change angela merkel with someone else. she is quite incompetent in her job.

take Meg Whitman (CEO eBay)

or Cathie Lesjak (EVP and CFO Hewlett-Packard)

both of them kick ass more that angela can ever dream of.

I don't know, Merkel seems to be doing something right, seeing as germany is still doing quite well, considering that we do live in a recession etc..
If you want to elaborate though, please do so via pm, since we would probably derail this thread otherwise.

 

[Boris Goodenough]

So you're saying women will stop calling me ugly in the street if we had more feminism? How lovely that would be.

 

[PsychicTaco115]

Fuck me then, I don't see the lolz everyone's talking about >.>

Would someone care to explain to a confused teen male?

He's an asshole who thinks laughing at people he disagrees with is a good time. And he gets extra wood from it because he knows shitbags like him are part of the reason feminism is needed in the first place, and that makes his assholery even better to him.

I don't know much about it, but I recall a quote: "Don't have extreme views on things you know nothing about."

I'll hear people out though! I swear! >.>

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

Your feelings... are your fucking problem. What he wants, and what you want, are universal social acceptance. This will never happen; it *cannot* happen in a free and democratic society. I whole heartedly reject feminism as an ideology that promotes thought control through emotional manipulation.

Oh wait... you want to control other people's thinking, I keep forgetting that. Now do tell, how do you intend to ethically justify thought control? Because it hurts people's feelings?

Please stop. Thats not even making sense.

Wanting to change opinions on something isnt thought control. That isnt the only way to change peoples minds. It isnt the primary way. It isnt a way anyone wants. I dont know how you honestly typed that out and believed it. I want creationism out of schools. Is it "Thought control?" to put forward reasonable arguments against it to change peoples minds? I want gay marriage to be legal. Again is it the same?

From my definition of Feminism how you solve the problem and change peoples minds is this:

"So bloke A likes some pretty traditionally female things. It might feel natural to look down on him and laugh at him. But why do you do that? Is there really a logical reason? Doesnt it feel weird to dislike or dirride something just because society says so and for no other logical reason? Id rather determine my own opinion on what makes a man, something distant from what a person enjoys in their spare time and more to do with depth of character"

Ask questions. Challenge peoples viewpoints. Use reasoned arguments. Sure its never gonna get GLOBAL acceptance but the basic idea is to say "Why do we laugh at people for that? WHY isnt that normal? Why is it forbidden or frowned upon? is there a REAL reason other than "Its what my dad did?""

No one can control thoughts. Im super confused why you mentioned it. No one wants to because its blatantly impossible. It makes as much sense as accusing me of wanting to commit genocide on creationists just because i want to change their point of views. You cant just assume the most violent/unreasonable method is the one thats going to be used. How about reasoned dialogue and arguments?

In my version of "Feminism" or whatever you want to call it i seek to make people realise when you hate something for a valid reason (It does harm to people) and when you hate something just because its the way its always been done. We are dropping our ridiculous standards on what is and isnt taboo. I think we CAN reach a "Better" point even though i agree that total universal acceptance is impossible i still think we can make progress. I dont really like calling it feminism because i use the same logic and thinking to justify the legalization of drugs and the removal of creationism. My viewpoint is basically a dislike if mindless irrational tradition in ALL forms. "Feminism" is just a smaller part of that.

After all its now appropriate to see a womens ankle in public or for her to become rich and successful or get a real education, how much "Thought control" did that require? Surely if you think it IS thought control you should resist by beating women like they did in the good old days BEFORE all this thought control. My point is that progress was made on making harmless things acceptable before WITHOUT thought control. Why cant we do that now?

 

[Beffudled Sheep_v1legacy]

I was being sporting in the other thread, not going to be so friendly here...

#1- Feminism is all about creating equity between the genders, and a part of what feminism promotes (heavily) is smashing down old fashioned patriarchal stupid bullshit ideas of masculinity. Like feeling ashamed because you like things up your bum. So yea. Feminism actually has a lot to do with that.

Your feelings... are your fucking problem. What he wants, and what you want, are universal social acceptance. This will never happen; it *cannot* happen in a free and democratic society. I whole heartedly reject feminism as an ideology that promotes thought control through emotional manipulation.

#2- This is definitely the one that makes the least amount of sense. Even then, I can still see how it can make many people uncomfortable to have to be in spaces named for men who were VERY much part of the patriarchal oppressive society in the day, especially when in many ways we are still living in said patriarchal oppressive society. Who wants extra reminders of that shit? Still makes the least amount of sense.

Let's take an example; the George Washington University. This guy lead the American Revolution against The Empire back in the day. He was so oppressive; he turned down the opportunity to become king of America because he believed in freedom and a democratic republic. Now you'll still sit there with a straight face and tell me he was an oppressor because he didn't do enough for women and that our society is an oppressive patriarchy? Is the entire basis for this oppression social expectation; that *women* share half the burden of perpetuating?

#3- As Bloated Guppy pointed out, many men (and a lot of women) consider sexual harassment to be something positive, i.e "You should be glad men find you attractive enough to harass you." I completely agree with this woman. I need feminism to get rid of this bullshit too. There are just so many fucking problems with this way of thinking...

Then don't think that way. Holy shit, that was a tough fix! What's next on the agenda?

Oh wait... you want to control other people's thinking, I keep forgetting that. Now do tell, how do you intend to ethically justify thought control? Because it hurts people's feelings?

#4- Yea. That's a thing. Male, female, whatever, we live in a rape culture. And unless you are a genius on the level of Kruppe the Arcane you have contributed to it unknowingly. And the only way we are going to get rid of it is, yes, with the dreaded feminism. This world will never be a good one to live in until we finally get rid of the idea that one gender is "prey" for the other gender. Even when we try to mean it harmlessly.

Except that there are two fundamental and important flaws behind rape culture theory...

A. Rape is a crime. Now no doubt you'll attempt to counter this will various "facts" that have been proven to be misrepresented over and over again feminism lost a great deal of integrity. Something along the lines that most rapists aren't jailed (ignoring the preponderance of evidence required for a conviction in our innocent until proven guilty legal process) or that the social stigma prevents victims from seeking help, which leads to the next issue...

B. Rape is universally despised as an immoral act. Even rapists know this. Making a joke about it doesn't affect it anymore that making a Jewish oven joke affects the holocaust. Humor is the human condition overcoming and commanding a great injustice dealt to them.

Now you might snap back some other retorts that I'm familiar with and simply don't care to get into, but using your asinine logic; we live in a murder culture, a genocide culture, a pedophile culture, and a culture culminating every single atrocity you can fathom. So would you please stop contributing to infanticide culture by ignoring that it's women committing 100% of the decision involving bringing another person into this world? (That was an abortion joke by the way; dammit... I just contributed to abortion culture, gah!)

#5- People should be able to do what they want with their bodies, and if it isn't harming anyone else, they should have nothing but support and acceptance. Where feminism comes in to this, is that women's bodies are FAR more controlled by the patriarchal male dominated society then men's bodies are. If a woman wants to grow out her armpit hair, the "positive" reactions she gets are still basically people telling her she shouldn't have done it, or that her first concern should be how men will react to it. And that's wrong. That's really really wrong. Especially when you realize that men can do whatever the fuck they want with their armpit hair, and society doesn't care.

People can and do whatever the fuck they want with their bodies. But they do NOT deserve support or acceptance from society as a whole for it. Society can accept what they did by shrugging their shoulders, but that's all they should be required to do. Aside from the abortion issue (which is a whole bag of worms itself), exactly how is the patriarchal male dominated society controlling women's bodies? By having beauty trends that change with the current social paradigm? Did you know during the Great Recession larger women were deemed more attractive? Did you know that the negro culture supports women with bigger booties?

I don't like hairy arm pits on women, and this wonderful country allows me the right and privilege to maintain that opinion. You, in your infinite wisdom, seek to rob me of expressing my individual tastes that happen to conflict with other individuals world views. I'm allowed to say; "I don't like it." She isn't entitled to positive reactions for everything she does from everyone who she tells. That's bullshit.

#6- This is a tiny bit more difficult, because of the whole "healthy" thing, but even so she still has a very good point. See the above point number five about women's bodies being more controlled than men's. Women are expected to look a certain way for men, and when they don't, they are considered worthless. No. Really. That's why you can get pudgy male politicians and lawyers who are very successful, but you'll never see a pudgy woman successful in law or politics to the same degree. Ever. Look at the successful politicians and lawyers today. Look at the men and women. Look at how most of the men have fat, and most of the women look like they fight it constantly. THAT'S WRONG.

Equating physical attraction to political power; now who's being oppressive to women? (Don't think I didn't notice your inner turmoil in accepting her health standards) Both sexes have social beauty standards. At any rate, Sonia Sotomayor seems like a woman with some meat on her bones. Elena Kagan certainly has some girth. And of course, everyone's favorite; Oprah! Granted she fluctuates a lot. But I find it rather odd you don't seem to account that women are more critical over each other than men are. Did this little factoid not come up in your women's studies?

#7- Women who do gender studies are looked down upon as unnecessary or feminazis or etc or whatever. One need merely look at this thread to realize that we desperately need more people taking gender studies.

What contribution do they represent to society? A self propagating liberal arts degree? It's valid insomuch she bought it with her own money, but not nearly as valid as a degree in... oh, I don't know; social psychology, criminal law, mathematics, nursing, engineering, media arts, etc.

Here's what tickles my fancy; women who go into gender studies to learn about how there aren't enough women earning degrees in male dominated fields. How's that for a fucking head scratcher?

#8- Yep!! They totally are!! See... Here is the thing. Male bodies aren't objectified when artistically nude because we live in a society that does not objectify men. Female bodies are still objectified, even when it is clearly art, simply because of the society we live in. It's impossible not to objectify them more than the men. Because women are objectified. They are treated as objects and commodities by society. AND THAT NEEDS TO CHANGE. AND THE ONLY WAY IT WILL CHANGE IS IF PEOPLE ARE FEMINISTS. I would like to see the day when male and female bodies can be in the nude without any objectification going on at all.

Ok, in what crazy screwed up school have you ever actually taken a nude drawing class? I've been in them, and never at any point were the models (both male and female) ever objectified as anything beyond the subject of the artwork being practiced. Quite in fact, the beginning of each class consisted of a brief understanding that people would be naked, the artists would treat this as serious and anyone found to be acting at any moment immature, or mentally fapping to the nude model would be thrown out of the class and *never* welcome back.

The very basis for your argument hinges on the difference of the models anatomy. A female model disrobes; students of both sexes draw her. A male model disrobes; students of both sexes draw him. So the difference is because... tits?

.../sigh

So, let's recap here...
1. You disagree with current social concepts of masculinity. You didn't actually discuss what they were, but "their bullshit". And feminism will fix this, again not actually discussing how.
2. Men are oppressive because we live in an oppressive patriarchy. And buildings being named after men make people uncomfortable because they helped build and maintain the oppressive patriarchy. (By the way, can you name me a legal right that men possess that women do not? Just curious.)
3. Because some people believe that sexually harassment is positive; we need to use feminism to make sure no one thinks this way. And how pray tell does feminism intend on doing this?
4. Rape culture. Feminism will fix rape culture by... making sure people can't joke about rape? By the way, you need to stop supporting rape culture; ok?
5. People should always get positive reactions to everything they do because the patriarchy controls women's bodies. I assume feminism will make a law that insures I'm required to high five people that choose to stop bathing?
6. Men control women's beauty standards, so women should be fat and get into politics. Will feminism dictate the weight requirements for political office?
7. I disagree with every single one of your positions, so we will use feminism to recruit more people into the program whom I will eventually disagree with; brilliant!
8. Female nudes are objectified because some guys like fapping to porn. So... feminism will ban porn? (I imagine you are one of those porn hating feminists) Or feminism will ban nude art?

Tell me, how are the "ladies" over at RadFemHub these days? They ever figure out that biological solution to the problem yet?

have contributed to it unknowingly.

I would enjoy it if you listed a series of examples of how one would unknowingly contribute to rape culture.
I do not seek to debate I seek to learn since I don't like doing harmful things, especially without knowing.

Trust me, you really don't. But if you'd like to read through some bullshit, you can start with http://everydayfeminism.com/2013/01/five-ways-rape-culture-exists-unnoticed/ and then move on from there. Here are some wonderfull bullshit solutions feminism has proposed as well; http://www.thenation.com/article/172643/ten-things-end-rape-culture?rel=emailNation#

Well thank you for answering my question! I appreciate it.

And I don't do any of those things. I must be pretty damn special *rolls eyes*

[Note: Condescending tone was not directed at you]