LoL and the surrender button.

[Tsukuyomi]

Normally I don't actually start surrender votes in League unless it's a complete and total steamrolling. I'll go along with it if say, my side is mostly level 12 or 13 and the enemy is almost all 17 or 18 and more than one has their full build of items. Sure, it's POSSIBLE to come back from such a thing, but that's if you're lucky, coordinated, and they make some serious mistakes. As it stands, the times I've tried to overcome such an advantage we've ended up feeding more kills to the enemy and by the time we're maxed out and a few of us are finished on our items, if ANYONE on their team didn't have something they needed, they had it then. Otherwise boots were being sold for the lulz to get that second Deathfire Grasp or something.

I usually try not to get into the "nope! one thing bad happened! we're done!" mentality but every so often something happens that's just....ugh. Like oh? Riven's been fed? Well damn, she's gonna be a pain. Jungle Hecarim just got his three core items and no one but me as the Nami Support is warding? Guess I better save my Qs then, but this is still gonna hurt. I won't surrender just BECAUSE those things happen, but I will consider it if they're following up properly and blowing everyone away and making or extending an impassable lead.

The only exception to this is if the enemy team is stupidly focused on kills as opposed to towers. If my team can hold them off or keep them entertained during late game long enough for me to backdoor their Nexus? Got no problems staying in. Otherwise....well, let's say I'm open to the idea of surrender if the logic is sound.

What really annoys me is the people who WON'T surrender simply because they either don't know enough about the game, or have this gleeful delusion that life is an anime and if we JUST PULL TOGETHER and they use their SPECIAL MAGIC SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE POWERS to suddenly be godly at the game, we can WIN!

.....oh is that true? Let me join you in a moment, then. Right now I have to find a disability cane because I've taken roughly ten Lux Lasers in the last ten minutes and I think I may be blind permanently now.

 

[ItsNotRudy]

I stopped playing because players would hit the surrender button less than 2 min into a game feels like it's quit so we can get ip quicker? ; ; I hate quitting even when i'm loosing.

Surrender treshold has always been => 20mins so I'm not sure what kind of hackers you get partnered up with.

 

[Vegosiux]

Why would you waste your opponent's time, or your own, simply making a game you've already lost into a less enjoyable experience for everyone.

So, if my opponent is incapable of pushing into my base, how do they deserve a quick win? Maybe they should just LEARN TO PLAY BETTER? instead of relying on me to concede the game for their benefit.

Honestly; if my team took 20 minutes to wrap up what should have been done in 5, I'm not going to get cranky on the other team for not surrendering, I'm going to say I wish we had played better.

And holding back an enemy that should have won already is a very enjoyable experience to me, mind. I think of it as me serving them some humble pie, and I'm a cynical, petty guy, so I like doing that.

It's different if you think you can swing back, obviously, but when you're done and know it allowing the match to conclude in a reasonable time frame is simple politeness.

If it's done and an immediate defeat is inevitable, surrender is largely irrelevant because it'll all be over in minutes one way or the other. But if the opponent holding positional advantage is unable to convert it into a quick victory through their own skill, they simply do not deserve a quick victory. Instead of whining about why I'm not surrendering when I've already lost, maybe they should play better and make sure I really have lost.


One of the best LoL teams in the world all but pushed back another team into their base, but were unable to make the final push. They proceeded to lose the game they had "wrapped up", with the situation looking "hopeless" for the other team.

As long as my opponent isn't crushing me quickly, I will not concede, as if they're incapable of pushing in, they're also open for a surprise attack. But if they are crushing me quickly, my surrender will shave off, what, 5 minutes of game time?

And, thanks to the MOBA communities being what the are, I'm simply going to force people who think they're better at the game than I am to prove that's really so. If they cannot actually push me back and win, they do not deserve to win quickly.

Actually, in such cases what I maybe would use is a draw button for cases of extended stalemate.

 

[rookie411]

Recently I've been playing the Ghost Recon Online beta and what I've found is that my team either dominates or gets dominated, there are rarely closely fought games that you often see in other multi player shooters, maybe because of the more emphasised team aspect, but because of this in balance many rage quits occur between rounds or even mid game

 

[PN8]

I play Dota 2, a game where the surrender button doesn't exist and I think there should be a surrender button but not like the League of Legends' one. I find that Dota 2 is slower paced than League of Legends so 20 minute is too early for Dota 2. For that reason, unless they find a better system, I think surrender button should be available in Dota 2 after the 40 minute mark.

Why 40 minutes? It's from my own experience with the game. If a game does turn around it starts to happen after the 40 minute mark. There were many times where we were losing and managed to score victory and it always happened after the 40 minute mark. If you are at the 40 minute mark and the game doesn't look like it's turning around you should be able to surrender and not waste another 20-30 minutes.

 

[Tsukuyomi]

And, thanks to the MOBA communities being what the are, I'm simply going to force people who think they're better at the game than I am to prove that's really so. If they cannot actually push me back and win, they do not deserve to win quickly.

Actually, in such cases what I maybe would use is a draw button for cases of extended stalemate.

You know, I rather like that logic. Everyone I meet seems to have the idea that everyone else is Noobs and idiots and they CLEARLY belong in Challenger Tier but they're held back by all these Noobs and Trolls.

 

[Thyunda]

If it's unwinnable, surrender.

Do not fucking waste twenty minutes of my time for no good reason.

I'm thinking of Smite here, not LoL or DOTA, but the basic idea is the same.

Fuck your time man, I'm humiliated over here. I feel silly for getting beat in a fight I chose to get into. Damn right I'm going to make your victory leave the sourest taste I possibly can.

Okay I'm not being entirely serious there. I don't surrender on principle - I fight to the bitter end. However there is a practical use - you don't know your opponent. You don't know if they're fighting on a full stomach and a good atmosphere or if they're trying to get the fight over with so they can eat or go to bed.
If it's the former, your defeat is just going to come faster. But the latter, if you keep fighting and make it as hard as possible for them to win, there's every chance they'll make a mistake and you'll get the upper hand. You haven't lost until the results screen appears.

My proudest victory was in Halo 3 Team SWAT - I'd post something relevant but I'm not very good at LoL - where my team were dying every second and the enemy's score was just flying toward the limit. Now I'm very, very good at SWAT, and I yelled at my team to stay somewhere safe. Yeah. I ordered them to camp on Cold Storage, but it was out of necessity, man! With just one member of the team vulnerable, it meant that for every time they killed me, I'd have killed them at least two or three times. Now our score was advancing at three times the rate of theirs.

I still only won with one point to spare. It was tense. I sat back in my sweat and glory and hoped for some kind of praise because I'm full of myself like that.

Everyone left the lobby. Fucking everyone. Wankers.

 

[The Wykydtron]

Well, a certain someone in my LoL team would promote a surrender @ 10 patch...

*anything negative ever happens*

"Right, we're done! Done!"

Yeah I have a friend like that. It's rather frustrating because if you don't surrender he stops paying attention and starts feeding.

Btw I have seen you speak about LoL quite a bit on here. You NA or EU?

I'm on EU West, y'know the most unstable one?

EU Servers are down? Better give NA RP!

Normally I don't actually start surrender votes in League unless it's a complete and total steamrolling. I'll go along with it if say, my side is mostly level 12 or 13 and the enemy is almost all 17 or 18 and more than one has their full build of items. Sure, it's POSSIBLE to come back from such a thing, but that's if you're lucky, coordinated, and they make some serious mistakes. As it stands, the times I've tried to overcome such an advantage we've ended up feeding more kills to the enemy and by the time we're maxed out and a few of us are finished on our items, if ANYONE on their team didn't have something they needed, they had it then. Otherwise boots were being sold for the lulz to get that second Deathfire Grasp or something.

I usually try not to get into the "nope! one thing bad happened! we're done!" mentality but every so often something happens that's just....ugh. Like oh? Riven's been fed? Well damn, she's gonna be a pain. Jungle Hecarim just got his three core items and no one but me as the Nami Support is warding? Guess I better save my Qs then, but this is still gonna hurt. I won't surrender just BECAUSE those things happen, but I will consider it if they're following up properly and blowing everyone away and making or extending an impassable lead.

The only exception to this is if the enemy team is stupidly focused on kills as opposed to towers. If my team can hold them off or keep them entertained during late game long enough for me to backdoor their Nexus? Got no problems staying in. Otherwise....well, let's say I'm open to the idea of surrender if the logic is sound.

What really annoys me is the people who WON'T surrender simply because they either don't know enough about the game, or have this gleeful delusion that life is an anime and if we JUST PULL TOGETHER and they use their SPECIAL MAGIC SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE POWERS to suddenly be godly at the game, we can WIN!

.....oh is that true? Let me join you in a moment, then. Right now I have to find a disability cane because I've taken roughly ten Lux Lasers in the last ten minutes and I think I may be blind permanently now.

Y'know taking 10 Lux Lasers in as many minutes is kind of too many. Considering how every Lux in existence fires one off down the middle of mid like clockwork and how it has a decent wind up, I would expect to walk slightly out to the side of them half the time. Though expecting your team to do the same might be going too far

Also that Hecarim better have gone Mobility Boots, Brofist and Spirit Visage as his first three items because that is Pony critical mass. Several times we have won by a fed person building badly. One was a Hecarim who built squishy and even yesterday the 7/0 in 15 minutes Lee Sin built full on support tank instead pure instakill everything damage.

I suppose people just have to learn how to play from behind. Hug towers, split push (but don't get caught) ward your own jungle because people love to lurk and so on.

A l little while ago I went 0/2 within as many minutes because fuck Blitzcrank invades and fuck Irelia walking through my lane >.> and I felt perfectly fine about the situation. For whatever reason, i'm in my element when i'm playing catch up and there is god damn no way that could have gotten any worse. Things can only get better from 0/2 in 2 minutes!

We won that one by the way, as expected >.<

 

[Zhukov]

If it's unwinnable, surrender.

Do not fucking waste twenty minutes of my time for no good reason.

I'm thinking of Smite here, not LoL or DOTA, but the basic idea is the same.

Fuck your time man, I'm humiliated over here. I feel silly for getting beat in a fight I chose to get into. Damn right I'm going to make your victory leave the sourest taste I possibly can.

Actually, I meant when I'm on the losing team and my teammates refuse to surrender. That annoys me.

I've had teammates refuse to surrender while sitting out the fight at the same time.

If my opponents are losing and wish to stick it out then good on 'em, I respect that.

Also, the "it's not over till it's over" thing doesn't apply as much to MOBAs as it does to, say, shooters. MOBA game reward success (kills, objectives) with resources, which in turn makes further success more likely. So if the enemy team have 20 more kills than you, they're not only doing better, they are rendered more powerful in terms of hard stats.

(Don't mean to patronize you here if you already know this, but your answer suggested that you don't play MOBA games.)

Yes, reversals are possible. But there comes a point where the dwindling chance of such is outweighed by the fact that my leisure time is being wasted.

 

[Zepherus14]

Although the surrender button is useful in some situations like if you were 2 vs 5. I rarely use it unless it's become completely hopeless. There have been far too many games I've played where we actually won even though we were losing before. Maybe its just late game comps or whatever, but I don't use the button often.

 

[Some_weirdGuy]

I must be a masochist cause i tend to have more fun on the games where my team is losing than on the games where my team is stomping. Making a comeback or trying to fight the uphill battle are the best bits.

 

[Risingblade]

If you reach the point where they can turret dive and score and ace then yeah it might just be time to call it quits. Sure most games can result in a comeback but sometimes your teammates are so negative that you don't really wanna put in the effort to help them win.

 

[Thyunda]

If it's unwinnable, surrender.

Do not fucking waste twenty minutes of my time for no good reason.

I'm thinking of Smite here, not LoL or DOTA, but the basic idea is the same.

Fuck your time man, I'm humiliated over here. I feel silly for getting beat in a fight I chose to get into. Damn right I'm going to make your victory leave the sourest taste I possibly can.

Actually, I meant when I'm on the losing team and my teammates refuse to surrender. That annoys me.

I've had teammates refuse to surrender while sitting out the fight at the same time.

If my opponents are losing and wish to stick it out then good on 'em, I respect that.

Also, the "it's not over till it's over" thing doesn't apply as much to MOBAs as it does to, say, shooters. MOBA game reward success (kills, objectives) with resources, which in turn makes further success more likely. So if the enemy team have 20 more kills than you, they're not only doing better, they are rendered more powerful in terms of hard stats.

(Don't mean to patronize you here if you already know this, but your answer suggested that you don't play MOBA games.)

Yes, reversals are possible. But there comes a point where the dwindling chance of such is outweighed by the fact that my leisure time is being wasted.

It's part of the reason I'm not good at LoL. I make a couple mistakes early on as I'm trying to get into the game and bam, I've set the enemy up to win. But I have had slow starts - I tried playing Dr. Mundo. I hated it at first, and didn't quite grasp the 'health as a resource' concept of the character, so while the enemy charged to the lv18 spot, I was stuck in the 10/11 mark. I started lurking in the jungles and sneaking around them, killing a load of minions and running away when the champions came to stop me. Repeated this till I could compete and eventually we won. Couldn't have been done without a competent team, obviously, but I guess it kind of counts? I could've just sat back and thought, fuck this champ it's crap, and gone. Could've.

Though I don't understand why you'd prevent a surrender if you were sitting the game out anyway - that's just nonsense.

 

[Imat]

I've been opposed to the surrender button since its inception. It promotes a wrong way of thinking. "Oh, I'm losing. Well, I don't want to waste any of my precious, precious time, so I'll cut this game early by giving up. Now this is only a 25 minutes game!" "Oh, now I'm winning, awesome! Even though this game has gone on for 3 hours now, I'm fine continuing because, and this is important, I'm WINNING this game." The surrender button encourages the 'No fun if you don't win' mentality, which is fundamentally wrong.

The only time I support surrender is when the winning team intentionally delays the victory when the losing team has no chance of coming back.

To be honest, though, I've basically given up on pvp in LoL. The community just can't act with any measure of maturity/sportsmanship. And the surrender button does not help matters.

 

[BartyMae]

I support surrendering in any game, both from the loser's and the winner's perspective...as long as the as it's clear the game is over. I don't really have fun unceremoniously crushing the enemy - I get self-conscious, I suppose, of how they're probably feeling, or, alternatively, how I'd feel in their shoes - and nor do I like being forced to play out a game that's clearly doomed from my point of view.

 

[Kyr Knightbane]

Honestly, i support it to a point. I don't want surrender to be the go-to reflex after the opposing team takes Baron, or any of the lanes start losing towers. A buddy of mine and myself actually won a game for our team by ignoring the stupid Baron Team Fight, and taking 2 towers, an inhib and just beasting the nexus turrets. By the time the other team disengaged the Baron Fight and had come back to base, they couldn't recover, their nexus had 100 Hp, and all it took was my Wukong Q to GG the game. (Granted, that was back during my 1-16 gameplay days where i didn't know how to lane properly and admittedly looking back at it, i was terrible during my laning phase. I lost my lane pretty bad. But pulling a wildcard move like that, despite our team calling us n00bs and berating us for it, afterwards they were all pretty agreeable. If i'm losing, i just do my best, try not to feed and Jungle if i can. Most times I lose is because my lane partner over-extends, despite me pinging and saying "Dude, their Jungler is right fucking there. DONT DO IT" Then our lane gets camped and I might be able to pull off a few kills or some insane saves but if my Lane Partner thinks Draven is invincible, then I can't help him.

So OT:

Sure, surrender buttons are useful, but they shouldn't be handicaps. They should be something that is used when the enemy team is dragging the game out, or if the synergy in the team is severely lacking.

 

[Vegosiux]

The surrender button encourages the 'No fun if you don't win' mentality, which is fundamentally wrong.

Exactly, what's the point in playing if you can't handle a legitimate, on-field defeat?

If a hockey team is down by 15 goals after two periods, they don't get to just concede and not play the final one.

 

[Sabitsuki]

Because brevity.

Sometimes the game is just.. over. You have two lanes down all the way to your nexus, and you've made exactly zero progress towards the enemy nexus. They are better equipped than you. They have champions that counter you. Your team is scattered and demoralized. The enemy hasn't quite collected themselves enough to finish you off for good, but it's definitely going there. Why not just save everyone a few minutes?

Continuing just for the sake of continuing is pointless. I don't need to prove anything to myself or anyone else by wasting people's time in some misguided need to delay a victory that the enemy has all but carved their name into.

That's not to say that the first reaction to being on the losing side is to immediately surrender. I have a lot of fond memories of getting unexpected aces that completely turned a bleak match around. However, you can generally tell when you reach a point of having no meaningful chance. Some people do abuse the surrender, however I'd much rather have the option to legitimately end a game quickly, rather than linger on a team with people who are no longer willing to make the effort to win.

 

[Ryan Minns]

I despise the damn thing. Sure I've hit yes once or twice in my time but I can honestly say with a straight face 7 out of 10 surrendered games were done prematurely with no real evidence to support them. I've literally just enjoyed a penta kill to receive a defeat notice immediately afterwards because mid had apparently fed Vlad... HE WAS ON 4 KILLS 0 Assists... This is FAR too often the moronic logic used by people and it annoys the living fuck out of me to no end.

One time though it was HILARIOUS. I was in a 4 man pre made so we had one random who lost his lane and continuously called for a surrender which we all ignored. He even went afk for 15 minutes after calling us all noobs and saying it was over. 5 minutes before the game ended he got back and started declaring how badly the other team sucked because his absence allowed us to turn it around and just as we were destroying their nexus I called a surrender vote and my mates all accepted as a giant fuck you to the idiot on our team

 

[Childe]

I'm not sure if this topic have already been discussed to oblivion (I did not search all the topic).
I played a lot of online games, FPS, RTS etc.. The one thing I learnt from those no matter how bad it is even you are going to lose make the living hell out of the enemy before dying (at least that's what I did). Learn from the mistakes examine the style of play and adapt new strategy to win next round. Then I started playing LoL with my friends.
At first the enemy surrendering seems fine at least I won. Then when the tables turn towards us I felt that surrendering seems a good choice and we surrender most of the time if the first few rumbles between heroes goes bad. One of my friends when commented things like "This is a stupid match lets just surrender", "There is not hope" etc etc. Sometimes my teammates even feed the enemy just to keep them from surrendering.
Then one day after a few match where even low level players surrender and one particular where my friend went on a pissing contest with me and then surrendered. I felt something wrong. Whats the point of playing if you can't handle the humiliation of getting your arse kicked, you are not suppose give up just because of that. Get pissed, find ways to attack back the enemy not coward away to the surrender button just because its bad. The button is like Cartman's way of saying "Screw you guys I'm going home."
The concept of the surrender button now feels wrong to me, its giving players an easy way out while not learning anything when a match goes bad.
Thats my though of the surrender button in LoL. What you guys think? Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong (will be, I played a lot of games but not all).

I think there is both a good an bad aspect to it. On one side there are some matches where there is really no hope of winning and in those cases the surrender button is nice because it allows everyone to go onto another game without dragging on an obviously lost match. On the other hand people tend to give up sooner if they think there is no hope of winning even though there might actually be a chance to win. People don't like to play when they feel they are going to lose and the surrender button gives them a chance to end the match early. So in the end my thought are ehh. I somethimes wish that i have it when i play dota2 and sometimes i wish it wasn't there when i play lol.