Mass Effect 2's Nudity Level Decided by Dictatorship

[Falseprophet]

Sometimes a good sex scene can almost make the story. Consider Sam Lowry's scene in Brazil, or for a more complete action Wild Things, Cruel Intention, Rear Window, The Hunger or even Brokeback Mountain.

Granted, 9 times out of 10 they're only titillation, and 8.5 of those are simply pink bits flapping like grunting turkeys; but I wouldn't be too quick to disregard the idea of a powerful sex scene.

While I normally agree with this guy [http://101reasonstostopwriting.com/2006/12/06/reason-10-addendum-now-with-even-more-sex/], you have a point (I'd add Enemy at the Gates to your list as well). When it's actually an important point of the story, it works.

Note that cartoon nudity is readily available on the internet and still manages to hit the right biological-instinctual triggers in the human psyche...I'm not sure I even have to mention the excessive nudity in fine art, especially throughout history. More often than not, these are usually paintings of Biblical topics. Yes, these tended to be a bit less realistic than modern game graphics, might I add. For human history stretching back thousands of years, an obsession with realism was hardly the topic of the day.

The problem being that current-gen computer graphics are square in the uncanny valley. They look just realistic enough that you realize how creepy and inhuman they actually are. I like some of the lead-ups to the relationships in DA:O--they're not the best romances ever written, but the characters are likeable enough that it holds my interest, and the top-notch voice talent sells it well--but consummating them is ridiculous...

What was ridiculous was Dragon Age, where we had relatively long and drawn out scenes that were both incredibly awkward and flat out ridiculous, considering the participants were all wearing clothes the entire time. There's really no call to show us characters awkwardly pretending to have sex while wearing underwear that, in the case of Morrigan at least, they clearly didn't have on underneath their outfit to begin with (begging the question of why you'd take off your clothing and then put on different clothing prior to physical activities typically performed sans clothing entirely).

...for Gildan's reasons and the uncanny valley effect.

Unless games are willing to stick with cartoony graphics, or wait until the graphics are perfectly photorealistic, I don't see the point of graphic sex scenes in games. Well-written mature relationships? Absolutely. Gratuitous sex that's not even titillating? Why bother?

 

[Fearzone]

The sex scene (from ME2) I saw on YouTube has all the expressivity of sex with a prostitute.

 

[silversun101]

Honestly, whether or not this one had explicit sex was completely overshadowed by the fact that YOU NEVER GET TO SEE WHAT TALI LOOKS LIKE. This should be the issue on everyone's minds, people! Heck, the prospect of knowing what she looked like was the singular reason I even chose her as my romance option. Christ, they could replace Miranda's lingerie'd boobs with her and Shepard playing with bunnies for all I care, just show me Tali's face.

 

[JeanLuc761]

I don't see why so many people care. tbh if I was bioware I would try to downplay the sex scene stuff so it wasn't my games "thing". Everytime I hear people talk about ME,ME2, or DA:O the awesomeness of them involving a sex scene is mentioned. Personally I feel it's not the best legacy for a game to leave behind.

Considering how epic the storyline is, how wonderful the characters are, and how entertaining the shooting mechanics can be...It disappoints me to think people only talk about the sex.

OT: Good for Stanley Woo for standing up for what he believes in. I see absolutely no reason to cheapen the characters in ME1 or ME2 simply for the sake of putting in titties. A well written dialogue (Thane, Tali, Garrus, Miranda) is 100x more meaningful than a quick ass-shot.

 

[Amnestic]

Developers should listen to gamers, cause the customer is always right.

Please tell me you don't actually believe that.

 

[JeanLuc761]

1) Woo is wrong. Developers should listen to gamers, cause the customer is always right.

2) Censorship is a *****, but when you are making an M rated game for mature people, they will expect more than that.

1) The customer is NOT always right. If every developer conformed to what their fans demanded we'd end up with a homogenized mess devoid of any risk-taking and creativity. Listening to the fans is always important (and Bioware have proven time and again that they do), but you should never sacrifice your integrity or your creative vision simply because a group want some more titties.

2) Ironically, I find it to be immature to desire a graphic sex scene when a mature dialogue and implication serves the purpose much more effectively. Forgive me if I'm misinterpreting you, but it sounds like "Well, it's an M-rated game therefore you're expected to have graphic sex." If so, I disagree and would argue that's entirely the wrong mentality to have.

 

[Nalesnik]

nice they say this, and if i were working there, i'd still not want tits in the games mostly because graphics aren't perfect, so it's like a cartoon, and that's kind of sick

What exactly is "sick" about it? They are crafted to look like geniune people (or aliens). Honestly they more resemble real people than "cartoons."

we have different eyes, sir, so my opinion pertains to my vision, i see the polygons and bitmaps where it seems that you see flesh.

So if someone takes a picture of a good looking girl, you see the ink, and not the girl? :?
What about a movie? You can't recognize the actors, the plot, and the action cause your too preoccupied with the electrons that make up your TV screen?
xD

 

[JeanLuc761]

This part is more for jeanluc: I don't think that just because its a mature game there has to be sex in it, but you cant fully be immersed into a game if cuts are taken out and the screen fades to black. I know its not a japanese porn game, and im not implying we need a 10 minute long hard core sex scene, but if they want to make the game compelling, deep and immersive they cant just cut stuff out, its like taking out a level cause it might offend people, and putting a big notification on the screen saying "and they went there to do stuff" ! It breaks flow, its supposed to be gritty and realistic. When you've got a movie, you don't fade to black every time the characters show sexual emotion.

I understand where you're coming from but it really depends on how the director wants to handle it. I've seen plenty of sex scenes in movies where they cut to black and let the audience decide and I've seen plenty of semi-graphic sex scenes as well. It honestly depends entirely on the context of the relationship. In Mass Effect 2, I thought the relationships were written in a very intimate, mature manner and graphic sex would have cheapened it.

When it comes to immersion though, I believe videogames will never be 100% immersive and realistic until HD Virtual Reality is invented and you get full-force-feedback. And when that happens, rest assured I'll be praying for (or hopefully developing) a Mass Effect remake

 

[StriderShinryu]

Speaking of sex scenes in Bioware games.. outside of the less than perfect animations, I rather liked the pre-ritual scene in DA:O. A fade to black before anything happened and a fade that actually made sense seeing as it came with the blowing out of a candle. You could also say the underwear thing at that point wasn't too out of place (though Morrigan's underwear VS her regular outfit is a bit of a mystery).

All told, I think Woo is right but I can't help feel that they really were pushing things in the right direction. I haven't seen any ME2 scenes yet so I can't say, however, if what they are doing there really is a step back at all. Either way, good on him for actually coming out and telling the truth instead of kissing ass or remaining silent like many dev teams. It's not like most dev teams don't listen to their fans, but ultimately it's totally down to what the devs (and their publishers) want. They are making their games and at no point does it become "our" game. Not saying ME2 is or isn't art, but take the Mona Lisa. Da Vinci painted it and it's out in the world for all to see.. but it's still not "our" painting just because he's done with it and we're the ones experiencing it.

 

[SageRuffin]

An uncensored sex scene in ME2?

Some people clearly have no imagination whatsoever.

 

[Sir Prize]

Well, just to put my two cent in, I think that for now they have made the best choice here because...well when you think about some of the people that can be romanced you just know that anything like that would be awakard.

 

[mattttherman3]

To Woo, sex and nudity aren't "what make [BioWare] games great"- Clearly not, have you seen the sequences is Dragon Age? I'm just so sick of game developpers not showing peoples faces in these games, like Tali, seriously, why be like that? It's not cool man.

 

[mechanixis]

Hell yes! Remind 'em whose in charge, Bioware!

This is why I have so much respect for this developer, they have class. They'll listen to the fans but they know where to draw the line.

 

[_Cake_]

To Woo, sex and nudity aren't "what make [BioWare] games great,"

Wait have you played Dragon Age?

 

[viciouspen]

I wish people would grow up and get over this subject already.
You see worse things on friggin TV, no reason why it should be so scandalous in video games.
If anything it's more readily accessible by TV and any other media than games, in which you have to work to get to it (discounting Custer's revenge of course).
I get why people get hung up on this stuff, I just don't get why they chose to be like a pack of puritans when it comes to games.

The "outrage" over the scene in ME1 was hillarious with how tasteful and minimal it was, but just typical of the double standard, fine for TV and movies, in a video game though and you must be horrible.

Your post is embarrassingly off topic.

You internet sarcasm is embarrassingly off target.

 

[BloodyThoughts]

So, I gotta be a totally evil bad ass mother fucker to get Miranda to take all her clothes off and show the user her nips? God that's gonna be hard I might as well just see the ass.

 

[RatRace123]

Soooo, no quarian titties?
Not that it matters, though Mass Effect 1 had bare (potentially blue) ass. What happened in the last 2 years?
Or is it just not worth it to deal with Fox News again?

 

[Ironsouled]

Thing A) Putting in tons of nudity and such would have turned me the hell off the game, and I know I'm not the only fan of ME who feels this way. The relationship part is pretty cool... but if I want nudity, I've got a girl for chrissakes. Even if I didn't and I was really, really desperate I could just bar crawl or looka t porn. ME2 kiss and fade to black gives it the romancy feel (Geez, that sounds good coming from a guy sitting at his comp in jeans and a wife beater) without being boring and/or offputting.

I'm completely on Bioware for this... although could we have just seen Tali's FACE for chrissakes? I'm not asking for her boobs, just the fact that my curiosity is killing me!

Or even better, put it in ME3 or something lol, make it easy enough to get that I don't ahve to spend too many days but make it a challenge in that it doesn't feel anti-climactic.