Monster Hunter Tri

[Kavachi]

I knew someone would respond XD Maybe I got attention problems 2

All right: first of all, why would there be a max time if people don't take that long to do it? And 1 hour tutorial is still bullshit, when a tutorial takes longer than 15 minutes, I stop playing (the main reason I had to try Oblivion multiple times before I finally made it through the boring tutorial, great game though). And who are you to say he didn't played long enough, did you spy on him or something?
Also you're using the same argument that every MH3 lover says: It gets better later. And as many people already said, that argument is obselete because a game that is good has to take you in from the start. That is why I still think of Oblivion as a game that needs improvements, for I almost discarded it because of the horrible start. And Yahtzee discribed a boss battle, which will spawn those bosses everywhere, and getting a gather quest for it. That is also a thing that is just plainly bad. It also reminds me of Oblivion when all those bloody Oblivion gates open. It may be fun for 1 or 2 times, but when you stand inf ront of gate 25, it gets old. I did some more research and all over the internet those main points come to light. Yahtzee only exaggurates it, that doesn't mean his review is bad, for the information he gives is still correct.

The max time is the same for every mission. 50 minutes. It's just there for the boss fights really. Most non-bigass-monster missions take 5-15 minutes. And the only times you ever bump up against the time limit is if you A) Are never hitting the damned monster because you can't keep up with it, or B) You have an incredibly shitty weapon and haven't upgraded in a half dozen monsters.

Furthermore, if you hate any game that is not immediately awesome in the first 15 minutes of playing it, you are extremely impatient and are missing out on many, many great games. In fact that precludes you from being able to enjoy whole genres. It's sad really. Don't act like we're "wrong" to like the game because we have human attention spans.

Oh dear, to get this out of the way: I am not saying that a person who likes this game is bad. As you will find in my original post is that I said he could very well like the game, but that he should not whine about somebody else's opinion, because that is basicly what you guys are doing. So who is actually saying somebody else is "wrong" here, for all you MH3 fans were the driving force to get Yahtzee to write this piece in the first place. It is not an offensive position I'm taking, it is defensive, and I'm sorry if anything I said offended you.
So, now you know how I feel about it I would find it odd if you would still take offence to me talking back in this discussion.
I'm not the only one who has a short patience, but that is because I got more stuff to do, like hanging with my buds, playing better games that don't suck in the beginning (there were pretty good examples in earlier posts). And the games that are worth playing through the tutorial I will play. (To use my example again: Oblivion). And boss-fights, like in more than one? What good tutorial is so huge that it has more than one boss-fight? I don't know you're definition of a boss-fight, but to me it is a small part at the beginning that learns you the basic controls and gameplay mechanics of the game, and I'm not sure how you need more than 15 minutes to do that.

 

[Anaklusmos]

I just loved the Prototype beggining I mean 10 seconds in your first instruction is "Throw this car at this helicopter" and one minute later "Eat this guy"

EDIT: One thing that I've just thought of, maybe Yahtzee doesn't consider the tutorial to be what you guys think the tutorial is. Like maybe you guys think it is the "Real tutorial" while Yahtzee thinks that the tutorial ends when you fight that monster that took 30 mins for him to kill? You know just throwing that out there.

 

[antigodoflife]

Bullshit, this is the same excuse people made about Final Fantasy XIII. "Oh it opens up 20 hours in." Jesus titty-fucking Christ, I do not have the time to play a shitty game for 20 fucking hours before it gets good.

I'd like to rephrase that... it takes 20 - 30 hours for it to become OPEN, not good... just not linear. It really is the worst Final Fantasy in 20 years.

 

[Uber Waddles]

Yahtzee has always been one of the more honest reviewers for games, in my experience. There are some genres and games where you should learn to take what he says with a grain of salt; but usually he's right no the dot.

Perhaps Yahtzee wasnt talking about the Tutorial, but the slow points after the tutorial. After a game says "X is attack, Y is block, Z is Punch, H is heal" most of them dont throw you against endgame enemies. The "Tutorial" Phase he was referring to was the phase where the action was low, and the game was still holding your hand; atleast thats my interpretation.

Either way, hes a game Critic, he criticizes games for a living. If you had fun with Monster Hunter Tri, then Yahtzees opinion shouldnt change that (I had fun with SSBB, and thought his review to be funny).

 

[Quorothorn]

Furthermore, if you hate any game that is not immediately awesome in the first 15 minutes of playing it, you are extremely impatient and are missing out on many, many great games. In fact that precludes you from being able to enjoy whole genres.

Exactly.
It saddens me that games in the quality of Baldurs Gate, Planescape: Torment, Fallout 1&2, The Elder Scrolls 3: Morrowind and similar ones, have died out.
Games like Fallout 3 don't deserve to be called RPG, if you compare them to their ancestors.

And all that because todays games are tailored to fit such people...

See, although I agree with this, I must make one point of my own: they do need to have that quality showing, from the beginning. If you have the capability of making a great game, I can't understand why you wouldn't ensure that the first 15 minutes are at least GOOD.

I'm a writer, and when I took writing classes in college, we were regularly told "get your audience in the first paragraph (or sentence), or you won't get them". This is a fact of human nature we're dealing with here: give the viewer a reason to stay from the word go, or they won't. Period.

 

[Fuloqwam]

Yahtzee has a point. A game should be fun right away, not just after ten hours, about within ten minutes.

"I have a simple rule when playing a game to review. I play until the game is finished, or until I can't stand any more".

This statement bothered me. Critics really need to start reviewing the replay value of games. So you've complete the eight-hour story mode. What now? Are there tons of unlockables and bonuses and/or map editors? Or are you expected to put it on a shelf and never look at it again as though it were a hardcover novel? We're about to blow sixty bucks, it's worth looking at.

 

[RJ Dalton]

No. Weapon degradation is never good. Ever. In any game that has ever existed or that will ever exist. It was the worst part of STALKER and the biggest reason I stopped playing it.

Really? With all the little bugs, you found a reasonably well implemented gameplay mechanic to be the most frustrating part of the game? Bit of a priorities mix-up, I think.

For the record, because I know people will mention it now that I have, yes, I thought the bugs in the game were rather annoying, but I found the rest of the game good enough that I was willing to put up with them. Although, there's a group of people who released a patch that fixes those. I downloaded it a while ago, but for some reason, my OS won't let me use it, so I can't say if it works or not.

 

[Kavachi]

I was disappointed by the bad review (not that he said the game was bad, but that he reviewed it poorly). I have a little more respect that he actually took the time to progress through to the Great Jaggi battle and get more feel for the game. I don't care if someone doesn't like Monster Hunter, as long as it is judged by more than the tutorial.

However, how the hell did you spend 10 hours on the tutorial? It's five quick gathering missions. It should take a new player 2 hours max, as in they took so long to figure out how to even draw their weapon that it would take two hours max. You can't even spend 10 hours doing them without failing due to the 50 minute time limit on missions!

A review isn't made it bad because you don't agree, and if you don't agree and you think it's just a fine game he shouldn't really get to you. So you can either just play that shitty game and enjoy yourself instead of wasting time whining about things "mean old Yahtzee" said. Why do you even bother, attention problems?

And about the tutorial. It is Yahtzee, he is known for over-exagguration. 10 hours is indeed ridiculous, however 50X5=250mins= more than 4 hours, so you're 2 hour max is pretty idiotic. However a real tutorial I think should be like the one from Brütal Legend. A 5 minute mission to roll you in, not 4 bloody hours of gathering horse shit, which probably will feel like 10 hours. So next time think before you actually post your bullshit.

so you take the maximum time to finish all the quests? it is 50 min limit, not you have to sit there for 50 min even after you finish the objective. So 2 hour max is not idiotic.

You're right, review isn't made bade because one doesn't agree, but this is really a bad one. He has played the tutorial and judged the whole game just on that little part. It took me about an hour to get there, seeing as he's a critic he was probably exploring and such so maybe that's why it took him so long, but took me an hour, shouldn't take him more than 3 even if he was fooling around a lot. But that is not the point, the point is that he is wrong on certain things that he points out in the review, and that is why the review is bad, because it gives false impressions and wrong information

I knew someone would respond XD Maybe I got attention problems 2

All right: first of all, why would there be a max time if people don't take that long to do it? And 1 hour tutorial is still bullshit, when a tutorial takes longer than 15 minutes, I stop playing (the main reason I had to try Oblivion multiple times before I finally made it through the boring tutorial, great game though). And who are you to say he didn't played long enough, did you spy on him or something?
Also you're using the same argument that every MH3 lover says: It gets better later. And as many people already said, that argument is obselete because a game that is good has to take you in from the start. That is why I still think of Oblivion as a game that needs improvements, for I almost discarded it because of the horrible start. And Yahtzee discribed a boss battle, which will spawn those bosses everywhere, and getting a gather quest for it. That is also a thing that is just plainly bad. It also reminds me of Oblivion when all those bloody Oblivion gates open. It may be fun for 1 or 2 times, but when you stand inf ront of gate 25, it gets old. I did some more research and all over the internet those main points come to light. Yahtzee only exaggurates it, that doesn't mean his review is bad, for the information he gives is still correct.

To be fair the 50 minute time limit is standard for quests. Whether the quest is to go there and pick 2 flowers and return (should take you like 2 minutes max) or slay Altereon the destroyer of all. The only time it's different is when they shorten it to make some quests harder. It doesn't change the fact that if you don't enjoy the game it won't matter though.

Sorry for double post everybody, didn't see this guy.
You just said what I thought. "It doesn't change the fact that if you don'te njoy the game it won't matter though." Why do you even care what Yahtzee thinks? It may be interesting to see, but if that is your reason and you know he will rip it apart than why bother replying? What you and all MH3 fans are doing here is trying to protect you're precious game form the outside world, but why? You just said it, so why do you care. If you had a blast with that game, be happy and play in peace, but don't start bothering us for having a diffrent opinion.

 

[Naled]

It still confuses me how people get worked up over a review. Its not like ranting back will change his mind.

Seriously, why get all cranky because someone doesnt like a game?

 

[Zoriath]

What this game is:
A pseudo-realistic fantasy based action rpg.
A game that rewards planning, preparation, and knowledge of both weapons and monsters.
A monster killing, item creating grind-fest.

What this game isn't:
A story-based epic rpg.
A "leveling" grind-fest.
A "run up and hit the button 'til it dies" kinda deal.

On combat:
This game has a skill/timing based combat system where everything you do has an animation that can result in you getting smacked if you tried to do it right next to the monster. You can move to a different area, chug a potion, eat a ration, sharpen your weapon, then run right back in there and attack. The monsters "have" tells that they do before they do a specific attack. You can learn when and where to dodge, or block if you have a shield.

On controls and weapons:
I've played with both the Wiimote/Nunchuk and the Classic Controller Pro. Yeah, the CCP is better, but the Wiimote isn't horrible. It just takes a little getting used to. If you look at the weapons, most of them are huge. A normal person couldn't swing one, much less carry 8 of them on their person. Part of the game is finding a weapon style you like, and learning it. Each weapon has different functions too, like hammers can knock out monsters well, while lances can tip them over.

On "leveling":
Your character doesn't gain levels. You can create better weapons and armor. You can learn the monsters' moves. You can get temporarily better stats by chugging specific potions and eating tasty meat that you've cooked.

On weapon sharpening:
If you swing your sword at the "armored" back of the monster, it's going to dull faster than if you swing at its soft underbelly. The less sharp your weapon is, the less damage it does, and if it gets really dull, it starts bouncing back. Keep it sharp and it stays effective.

I'm new to the Monster Hunter series, and have gotten through about 60% of the offline game. It's not for everyone. But it's sad to see a good game not get a fun and poignant review because the reviewer didn't know what he was getting into.

tl;dr Love the game, wished there were a funnier review from Yahtzee.

 

[golbleen]

EDIT: One thing that I've just thought of, maybe Yahtzee doesn't consider the tutorial to be what you guys think the tutorial is. Like maybe you guys think it is the "Real tutorial" while Yahtzee thinks that the tutorial ends when you fight that monster that took 30 mins for him to kill? You know just throwing that out there.

That would be a logical paradox given that the entire focus on the given 'tutorial length' is that you fight that big 30-minute-long monster he was talking about on the second page near the end of it, and this is the part of the game we were expecting his review to focus on.

See, what many people fail to understand is that the 'tutorial length' argument is not about the actual length of time in the tutorial, but one of the focus of his review - the first hour, possibly two, of the game, being spent acclimating yourself to the unusual control scheme and fighting some little monsters, which quickly fades by the wayside of "taking your big-arse sword and killing a big-arse monster, make a new sword out of his spine, find a new big-arse monster, rinse, repeat" gameplay that becomes prominent past that short, one- or two-hour tutorial.

For those of you who prefer fast, action-oriented games that thrust you into the main action within fifteen minutes, those are your tastes and you're entitled to them. You also, however, have to understand that this is only a recent byproduct of the slow analagous movement of "games are like books" to "games are like movies," and many of us preferred the depths that books presented over the fast instant gratification of movies. Many famous and well-known game classics benefited greatly from this format, and took similar amounts of time to 'rev up' before getting 'really good.'

 

[shadowmarth]

See, although I agree with this, I must make one point of my own: they do need to have that quality showing, from the beginning. If you have the capability of making a great game, I can't understand why you wouldn't ensure that the first 15 minutes are at least GOOD.

I'm a writer, and when I took writing classes in college, we were regularly told "get your audience in the first paragraph (or sentence), or you won't get them". This is a fact of human nature we're dealing with here: give the viewer a reason to stay from the word go, or they won't. Period.

That's not a fact of human nature. That's a fact of trying to appeal to a mass audience. Just because a significant portion of the population are brainless fucks doesn't mean you should write brainless drivel.

 

[Anaklusmos]

Yahtzee has always been one of the more honest reviewers for games, in my experience. There are some genres and games where you should learn to take what he says with a grain of salt; but usually he's right no the dot.

Perhaps Yahtzee wasnt talking about the Tutorial, but the slow points after the tutorial. After a game says "X is attack, Y is block, Z is Punch, H is heal" most of them dont throw you against endgame enemies. The "Tutorial" Phase he was referring to was the phase where the action was low, and the game was still holding your hand; atleast thats my interpretation.

Either way, hes a game Critic, he criticizes games for a living. If you had fun with Monster Hunter Tri, then Yahtzees opinion shouldnt change that (I had fun with SSBB, and thought his review to be funny).

I am quoting you for two reasons, one because your points are valid and I would like to give everyone the opportunity of reading them, and two because they are similar to what I said.

 

[duchaked]

Blah blah blah, MH3 does not have a 10 hour tutorial. It has a 90 minute tutorial, unless you linger on, doing things that are unnecessary forever. Do them for a bit, explore a bit, then move on. Do you need a manual to play this game, someone to hold your hand? You don't like some elements of it, sure, I accept that, but saying it has a 10 hour tutorial is like reviewing WoW and spending your first 10 hours picking herbs and then saying "In this game you do nothing but pick herbs for the first 10 hours". That's pretty silly.

Also, WELL UP YOURS TOO, PRICK!

A manual for a game is a good thing - it means that people without a psychic link to the developer's mind can work out the controls without the embarrassing trial and error inherent in accidentally shooting a villager in the face. (Yeah, red dead redemption never actually told me how to use the dead-eye system in game, so after I inadvertently shot a helpless randomer in the face, I looked at the manual{slight dramatisation, I accidentally used it on a bandit, and it helped. I still had no idea what the hell I'd done though}).

Also, I'd allow creative exaggeration when reading anything by Yahtzee. 10 hours basically means 'way too long'. 90 minutes for a tutorial is still a bloody long time.

yes, 90 minutes is pretty damn long haha

Con: Extra Punctuation this week somewhat less informative as usual
Pro: You get to read through all the emotional replies to an official "up yours" from Yahtzee to all the fanboys.

Noone cares about a videogame enough to be emotional about it, much less about Yahtzee. Just taking the piss, all in good fun!

We'll see how high the post count gets on this article and then we'll see how much of it is 'all in good fun' heh.

haha seemed quite emotional to me

 

[golbleen]

If you had a blast with that game, be happy and play in peace, but don't start bothering us for having a diffrent opinion.

The only opinion being argued is Yahtzee's.
Yahtzee's opinion is his opinion and no one else's.
Many posters in these threads did not form their own opinion, but simply took his and said it was theirs.

Ergo, very few, if any, posters here are having their personal opinion attacked. They are having the opinion of Yahtzee attacked, and feel the need to defend him since he is not present.

 

[troqu]

Sorry for double post everybody, didn't see this guy.
You just said what I thought. "It doesn't change the fact that if you don'te njoy the game it won't matter though." Why do you even care what Yahtzee thinks? It may be interesting to see, but if that is your reason and you know he will rip it apart than why bother replying? What you and all MH3 fans are doing here is trying to protect you're precious game form the outside world, but why? You just said it, so why do you care. If you had a blast with that game, be happy and play in peace, but don't start bothering us for having a diffrent opinion.

I don't care what Yahtzee thinks and I wasn't trying to defend "my precious" game. I was informing you of the situation. I doubt Yahtzee even reads these comments. The point of my post was that you asked why they would give 50 minutes and I wanted to explain that it's just for continuity reasons.

 

[Quorothorn]

I just loved the Prototype beggining I mean 10 seconds in your first instruction is "Throw this car at this helicopter" and one minute later "Eat this guy"

EDIT: One thing that I've just thought of, maybe Yahtzee doesn't consider the tutorial to be what you guys think the tutorial is. Like maybe you guys think it is the "Real tutorial" while Yahtzee thinks that the tutorial ends when you fight that monster that took 30 mins for him to kill? You know just throwing that out there.

For me, the big "whoa" moment in Prototype was actually just running up the side of a building. I started giggling like a maniac, and knew right then which game was going to win the "Prototype vs Infamous" thing with me.

Interesting idea in your edit BTW.

 

[cynicalsaint1]

I'd like to take a moment to point out that a lot of us have no problem with negative review, but the rather poor quality of the review in general. Honestly I really wonder why he bothered with this review in the first place, I could have told you well in advance that he was going to end up hating it - if you've listened to any of his other reviews it isn't hard to get a feel for what he likes and doesn't like in games, and MH3 is chock full of things he tends to not like. Really its like asking a dude who's only into action movies to give his opinion on 2001: A Space Odyssey.

Really that I think is the main trouble of Yahtzee's reviews - he really tries to make himself out to be the voice of god when it comes to what's good or bad in video games, when really its a matter of personal taste. It results in good humor, but a poor sense of the game itself. So his reviews amount to what one dude happened to think of a game - rather than having any sort of consideration about what draws people to this sort of game to begin with.

For example the whole notion of a game should stand on its single-player mode. Totally BS if a game is built strongly around its multiplayer component you can't ignore it as part of the game. It's like watching a movie and refusing to take into account certain scenes for some equally arbitrary reason - all the scenes are part of the movie, multiplayer is still part of the game.

 

[mada7]

Bullshit, this is the same excuse people made about Final Fantasy XIII. "Oh it opens up 20 hours in." Jesus titty-fucking Christ, I do not have the time to play a shitty game for 20 fucking hours before it gets good.

I've heard, from a friend whose opinion I trust, that it apparently gets good to the point of you forgiving those 25 hours. I'm not saying start playing it but it is something to keep in mind.

No, it really doesn't. FFXIII is a train wreck. At 25 hours in, it gets about 10% as good as FFXII, barely enough to make you pause the game and reminisce on a time when Final Fantasy was still good and you could lose yourself in an open living world. Then it quickly becomes terrible again, kind of mocking you, like, "NAHHHH, we were just kidding, we just sneaked that part in to put some screenshots on the box that would fool people into thinking the game is good. Back to your corridor."

i never thought Id meet someone that could properly describe my experience with FF13 until now. I stopped playing that 35 hours in when I had to fight some boss I fought a different variation of already way earlier. Up until that point I saw ever variation of the hall one could possibly imagine there were halls, bridges, highways, trains, alleys, caves, mines, valleys, crevasses etc. even the towns somehow had no freedom in there.

As for the actual article my first thoughts went back to ff13 when I heard it gets better after the tutorial. To paraphrase from one of my friends "If a game is so bad that I never want to play it again after playing for 2 hours why play it even more to hope it gets better" there really shouldnt be any suffering through a bad part of a game when playing a game it's supposed to be a fun activity not a slog in the hopes of it later becoming fun