Valkyr71 said:
Ok Lets talk about real history since you havent read the second post
1. American Service merchant men (Merchant marine) killed by german submarines and Aircraft prior to the US entering the war in DEC 1941: 12200 These were the men and women shipping War materiel to the UK and the russians Prior to the us commencing combat operations. You ko wthings like Tanks, aircraft, bullets, beans etc etc. There was no sitting on our Entitled asses as you put it. American industry kept you supplied and in the war until we came and put boots on ground. Check your history this is fact.
2. The japanese never tried to surrender prior to either of the atomic weapons being dropped and the civilians were warned multiple days in advance that they would be destroyed if they stayed. I dont know what version of history you read but its wrong. The emporer spoke of surrender but he wasnt really in charge of japan Tojo was and he had decided to fight to the death.
3. Where do you get that Europe was mostly a russian victory? The russian while moving farther than the rest of the allieson the march to belin did less up to that point other than retreating into winter and burning everything to the ground so the germans couldnt use everything. Also how did try and take credit. No-where did i say that the US Deserves sole credit for winning the war in europe. All i said is that americans (many) spilled thier blood for another country to be free? Tell me where it says America won the war?
4. Our actions were just as bad? Really we restricted people behind walls and failed to let them move about freely? we didnt let them practice thier religion? We machine gunned them down when they wanted to leave? We didnt allow protests against our govt and we allowed people to vote? Again check your history. Im not proud of our history in the civil rights department for african americans. It was wrong. did we demonize the soviets? yeah did they deserve it? You fuckin bet.
Please review some proper history books and then get back to me
Real history...you mean the American version of it? No thanks, I like to be impartial here.
1) While I accept that Americans helped supply and arm the British (odd that you called me British, I'm actually Canadian), that doesn't change the fact that your military did jack shit to help until you, personally, were attacked. The fact that many people in your country had sympathy for the Germans didn't help your cause.
2) The Japanese tried for a peaceful end of the war. The Americans wouldn't accept anything other than a complete and unconditional surrender, and when that was denied, they obliterated two cities with virtually no military significance.
3) You Yanks always portray the war as mostly an American effort, maybe with some British help. The Russians pushed farther in the east on their own than all of the Allies combined pushed on the west. Also, the Russians lost between 8 and 10 million people in the war. I'm not quite sure exactly how many the Western Allies lost, but I think that it was a little over 2 million. They sacrificed four times as many troops as everyone else combined.
4) They did not deserve any demonization that you gave them. It's sickening to think that the worst thing you can say about your history in that time frame is the civil rights movement. You imprisoned people for supporting Communism. You invaded other nations, usually without cause. You tried to invade Cuba, and then spent fifty years trying to knock off Castro (seriously, what's the big deal with Castro? After the missile crisis, why the hate?). Your actions in Vietnam were absolutely horrendous. You discriminated against every single other nation on the face of the planet. You supported the mujahideen in their attempt to destroy the Afghan government (a democratic, progressive, pro-woman's rights government, and the best thing that could have happened to that poor counrty in its history) just because that government was supported by the Soviet Union. I'm not trying to apologize for the Soviets, because they did bad shit too, but you were at least as bad.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rogue_State:_A_Guide_to_the_World%27s_Only_Superpower
Read that, and then get back to me. And learn some proper grammar while you're at it.
DracoSuave said:
Valkyr71 said:
DracoSuave said:
Valkyr71 said:
WOW......Im amazed at the short memory of peoples in other countries. How much american blood has been spilled since the 1940's for the liberation of nations in Europe, Asia, Africa, and the middle east. We were asked because we were the only ones who could help or had the power to. When the world asks you to be the cops, or cries upon you to say you have the power therefore you have the responsibility to help dont ***** when we do take action because were not helping your favorite cause. Step up and take charge yourself or sit down and shut up.
Never start this sort of talk in front of Canadians. We know it for the bullshit it is.
1) Your multiple wars on terror are not for us, they are for you. You were the one attacked. Not us.
2) You are not asked to be cops. In multiple engagements, the UN asked you NOT to get involved. They asked you NOT to be cops.
3) By the fact you say 'Since the 1940s' implies you think world war II started in the 1940s. Hate to break it to you, you weren't the first North Americans in that party. Canada declared war on September 1, 1939. The US only entered the war AFTER Japan attacked them, and only on the pacific front until 1943 when they joined the European theater. By then Mexico had already declared war on Germany and was in there. US wasn't the first to fight Germany in North America. They were the
last
I appreciate you love your military, however, you need to learn military history better before you speak nonsense and propaganda like this.
Which takes me to my opinion on the States.
Your media bombards you with outright lies and mistruths for political gain. You believe propaganda spoonfed to you. Every time someone pipes up as a voice of reason and rationality, you allow the yahoos and morons and intellectually void shout them down. You actually have pockets that entertain creationism is a science. Your social consciousness derides learning and education as 'elitism' and do everything in your power to silence the voices of the rational.
Individually, I like some americans. But your political rhetoric is often hateful and malicious and irrational, and that makes people distrust you.
Now who needs to read a history Book. The United states declared war on japan DEC 8th 1941 Germany and Italy on DEC 11 1941 and Jun 5th 1942 on Bulgaria, Romania, and Hungary.
The declaration of war was still two years after Canada, and -involvement- in that theater wasn't until 1943. You had declared war, but you weren't physically -there- for another couple years.
Mexico declared war on Germany on 22 May 1942 after German submarines attacked Mexican oil tankers, Potrero del Llano and the Faja de Oro; tankers that were transporting crude oil to the United States. These attacks prompted President Manuel Ávila Camacho to declare war on the Axis powers.
1942 is still before 1943.
The US Fought in North africa starting direct military assistance in North Africa on 11 May 1942 along side good ole monty. This is where the rivalry between patton and monty was born.
Fair enough. This wasn't the european theater... but I concede this point.
So anything else you say tp me after this i have trouble reading as your "truths" are very skewed. These are all facts please check them and then get back to me
However, Canada was in there in 1939. The fact that americans think WW2 started in the 40s is itself a major falsehood. There were other countries fighting for a couple years before the US finally were
attacked and got involved.
Thanks mate. You said everything else I wanted to say, better.