On Gaymers and Cons

[Darken12]

So what you are saying.... is that we should totally also have straight cons as well, just for us straight people!

They're called regular cons.

Which Con exactly, labels itself as "straight"?

What do you mean by 'labels'? If you mean 'calls themselves', then obviously none. But that's what happens when the straight cis white male is seen as the human default: Every con is straight male con. There's no need to label them as such because it's implied. Everything caters to the white straight cis male.

 

[Peithelo]

Differentiating people of different sexualities in such a way that would even indirectly encourage them to remain seperated from one another merely increases the disconnect between every side of this societal issue.

True. If we keep this up, homosexuals might feel unwelcome and unwanted. Good thing that doesn't happen when gays try to fit in with the majority.

As I understand it homosexuals already do often feel unwelcome and unwanted, but I suppose your message was an attempt at sarcasm. Nevertheless, the comfort of understanding and sympathetic company can of course offer some relief, but it unfortunately doesn't do anything to alleviate any of the underlying issues. Those issues still continue to exist, and homosexuals seeking the company of understanding and sympathetic invididuals can possibly get a mere moment of respite from them, nothing more. To be forced into such a terrible situtation is a truly saddening thing to realize. I am merely implying that such public conventions as proposed here are only sidestepping the very problem and that it can not be a long-term solution to the fact that homosexuals do in fact often feel themselves unwelcome and unwanted.

Personally I am fortunate enough to have never witnessed any severe harassment of homosexuals.

 

[UniversalRonin]

'Ok this thread got out of hand fast, it is getting challenging to keep up...'

Exactly what I was thinking. Right as I was thinking about writing it I noticed that you already had, thank you for being sensible.

I did my spiel earlier in the thread, and I probably don't have anything else of value to add.
Sure, I come under 'white hetro male' but does Gaymer X bother me? Not a bit, why would it? Why would it bother anyone? Would I go? If I had mates who were going- why not. It would probably be a good laugh. After all, isn't a con a con what ever it's called, and whoever it's catered towards?

 

[Verkula]

So what you are saying.... is that we should totally also have straight cons as well, just for us straight people!

They're called regular cons.

Which Con exactly, labels itself as "straight"?

What do you mean by 'labels'? If you mean 'calls themselves', then obviously none. But that's what happens when the straight cis white male is seen as the human default: Every con is straight male con. There's no need to label them as such because it's implied. Everything caters to the white straight cis male.

How is it implied, and whats so diferent in Gaymercon, other then whats obvious? No, im curious.

Im not against it, if the advantage of making these are so big, but I feel like it makes it harder to get to equality if people keep separating themselves, though I know im probably just freakin naive.

 

[DudeistBelieve]

So what you are saying.... is that we should totally also have straight cons as well, just for us straight people!

They're called regular cons.

Which Con exactly, labels itself as "straight"?

We shall call them normie cons.

A place were we can all hang out and talk about issues regarding white, hetero, males. We can network.

Yeahh... Network!!!

Noo, "normie" wont do, we have to have an obvious word in there that represents our sexual orientation, even though we like to say thats not what defines our personality!

Hell lets skip the tongue and cheek.

KluKluxKlanKon.

Ah? Ah? See what I did there?

But it'll be okay, black people can come too.

I fine the whole lot of this absurd. I don't even care, I've never gone to a con.

 

[redmoretrout]

Really, comparing the Soviet Union's oppression of religious institutions to a straight guy simply not understanding why gay gamers need separate conventions? The blatant insensitivity the writer of this comic strip showed towards oppressed religious minorities makes him worse than Hitler.

 

[Superlative]

So what you are saying.... is that we should totally also have straight cons as well, just for us straight people!

They're called regular cons.

Which Con exactly, labels itself as "straight"?

Please allow me to try and explain

the reason why people are saying straight cons are called regular conventions is because we, as straight people enjoy the advantage of being the norm due to an overwhelming majority. Due to this majority, nearly everything at a regular convention is going to be marketed towards straight people and heterosexuality will be the presumed norm.

Try thinking of it this way.

You are a Christian. When you get together with your Christian friends, you like to throw Christian Theology in among the general topics of conversation. Now imagine trying to have that theological discussion in the off-topic section of the forums here. Chances are good that you are going to have to deal with trolls posting insults aimed at you and your faith. all you wanted to do is have a nice theological discussion, not have to deal with sky daddy comments.

Now, if you were gay, instead of sky daddy jokes, you would at best attract odd looks and an worse have to deal with a group of knuckle-draggers trying to start trouble. this situation forces you to either hide your sexuality or endure said knuckle-draggers.

What the convention does is create a situation where homosexuality itself is the norm. not only do gay people not have to deal with people doucher, their homosexuality, which normally is something they have to compensate for, is celebrated, something which those in the group can greatly appreciate.

 

[UNHchabo]

Thats not the point, if someone did do a heterocon it would get blasted by every gay rights group out there for being a bigoted and homophobic venture. It's double standards and that defeats the whole point of such movements in the first place as they are supposed to eliminate double standards NOT propagate them.

What about special-interest panels? If there are lots of people who want to talk about LGBT issues in the gaming industry, why restrict that to an hour-long panel at PAX? Why can't there be panels of many different varieties that form the content base of a brand new convention?

 

[squid5580]

I'm going to post this (though it's already been posted before) because people don't seem to be reading it. It addresses a lot of the issues for sure, and is probably the only time I can tolerate the person who wrote it.

http://www.destructoid.com/the-importance-of-a-gay-gamer-convention-232467.phtml

This line alone makes it worth the read for me:

You can argue that LGBT people are "segregating themselves" by grouping together, but they were already pretty damn segregated -- not to mention alone. It can be lonely, and fucking terrifying to be gay. Just this week, through the social networks and grinning right-wing pundits, even I felt a level of fear by the hatred and venom being directed at the LGBT community over a fucking chicken sandwich.

He's also got a point with privilege, because a lot of people really don't know what it's like to be singled out like that. The arguments about self-segregation come from people who don't seem aware that the LGBT community gets treated like crap, period.

I'm sorry but what community doesn't take their lumps on a regular basis? Too old, to young, to rich, to poor, homed or homeless, hair too long, hair too short, casual or hardcore gamer. I don't know a single type of person who hasn't been singled out due to something and been picked on for it.

 

[Verkula]

So what you are saying.... is that we should totally also have straight cons as well, just for us straight people!

They're called regular cons.

Which Con exactly, labels itself as "straight"?

Please allow me to try and explain

the reason why people are saying straight cons are called regular conventions is because we, as straight people enjoy the advantage of being the norm due to an overwhelming majority. Due to this majority, nearly everything at a regular convention is going to be marketed towards straight people and heterosexuality will be the presumed norm.

Try thinking of it this way.

You are a Christian. When you get together with your Christian friends, you like to throw Christian Theology in among the general topics of conversation. Now imagine trying to have that theological discussion in the off-topic section of the forums here. Chances are good that you are going to have to deal with trolls posting insults aimed at you and your faith. all you wanted to do is have a nice theological discussion, not have to deal with sky daddy comments.

Now, if you were gay, instead of sky daddy jokes, you would at best attract odd looks and an worse have to deal with a group of knuckle-draggers trying to start trouble. this situation forces you to either hide your sexuality or endure said knuckle-draggers.

What the convention does is create a situation where homosexuality itself is the norm. not only do gay people not have to deal with people doucher, their homosexuality, which normally is something they have to compensate for, is celebrated, something which those in the group can greatly appreciate.

Um, no, actually, theres indeed a huge percent of people here who would gladly make fun of any religion, but the same poeple are usually also open to many things, including chatting with homosexuals, without making fun of them. The way I see it, more and more people getting open minded about these things, and because of that, I feel like separating them like this is a step backwards.

 

[Beryl77]

I still don't really get the reason why they do it but I also don't really care if they have such a specific convention.

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

See I'm more disturbed by the fact there are people that don't feel they are the norm.

Shouldn't we try to get everyone to feel like normies instead of letting people be all "NO! WE ARE DIFFERENT! GRRRR!"

I actually think you mean the majority, not norm.

Im a dude. And i feel like the norm. Yet i still enjoy a guys night out with my male friends watching rugby down at the pub for a night where we just chat. My girlfriend enjoys her girls night out too where her friends just chat and she does all the things i usually dont enjoy doing with her. We mix and feel normal and fine all the time with out friends. But isnt it nice to just have some nice sameness every so often just to feel like you can be around those you can relate to on a really fundamental level about something even as insignificant as sexuality or gender. Even if someone homosexual did feel normal it would still appeal to that same indulgence i take that you have too. Its the same as pulling a game night with your male friends without girlfriends ect, its just a time to behave differently than normal in a mixed group by relaxing. Even if we made everyone comfortable that feeling is still nice every once in a while.

 

[General Twinkletoes]

So what you are saying.... is that we should totally also have straight cons as well, just for us straight people!

you already do.

Wait, theres a StraightmerCon somewhere?

Regular cons are marketed towards straight men. They're not called "StraightmerCon" but they are designed for straight guys. Sexuality obviously does have a role in it cons, otherwise booth babes wouldn't exist.

 

[Darken12]

How is it implied, and whats so diferent in Gaymercon, other then whats obvious? No, im curious.

Im not against it, if the advantage of making these are so big, but I feel like it makes it harder to get to equality if people keep separating themselves, though I know im probably just freakin naive.

We're gamers, so let's look at games. For games that have the option of making a character of any race, sexuality or gender, we have a disproportionate amount of "straight white male" as the default. See the Dragon Age:Origins trailer [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SuJ5T9sfAA], the Dragon Age II trailer [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlACgYHtWCI], the Mass Effect posters (I [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d9/Mass_Effect_poster.jpg], II [http://johnnybgamer.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/mass-effect-2-poster.jpg] and III [http://www.nzgameshop.com/product_images/posters/video_game_posters/mass_effect_3_iii_maxi_poster_raw.jpg]), and this is BioWare, who is arguably the most egalitarian and inclusive studio. It gets worse from there.

Then we have a comparison between Uncharted and Tomb Raider, two similar games with protagonists of opposite gender. Uncharted has a male lead. He's covered head to toe in practical clothing [http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120715091917/fantendo/images/7/71/NathanDrake.png]. Tomb Raider's female lead, on the other hand, has exposed legs, midriff, arms and cleavage [http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_QWiwZvIq9hQ/TJuYM21bGsI/AAAAAAAAAe4/9MtjcqLtgwE/s1600/lara-croft-2.jpg]. Why? Because Lara Croft is meant to be a character for straight males to drool over, while Nathan Drake is a character for straight white males to project into. Lara Croft is a sexual fantasy, Nathan Drake is a power fantasy. Both are aimed at straight white males.

I could keep citing examples, but I think I've made my point. Most of the entertainment industry (of which games are only a sector) are catered to the straight white male demographic, not because they're a majority (if you put together all the women, non-white males and non-straight white males, you'd definitely outnumber the white straight males), but because they have the most amount of money and sociopolitical power. They're the safest and most lucrative demographic.

So as you can see, regular cons cater to that demographic as well, so I stand by my previous assertion: every con is straight male con. Probably straight white male con, but that's none of my business so I will leave it to someone better informed to speak about how racially inclusive cons usually are.

As for "is this a good thing or not", let me put it like this: it's none of your business. I know it sounds harsh and rude, but I can't think of a clearer way to get the message across. It's not something that's going to affect you, so while thinking about equality is very nice, you have no weight on this. Let LGBT people decide what's best for them. If we want our own con, let us have it. If we want more inclusion at regular cons, let us have it. If you really care about equality, listen to us and our problems instead of telling us what is and is not conducive to equality.

 

[Superlative]

So what you are saying.... is that we should totally also have straight cons as well, just for us straight people!

They're called regular cons.

Which Con exactly, labels itself as "straight"?

Please allow me to try and explain

the reason why people are saying straight cons are called regular conventions is because we, as straight people enjoy the advantage of being the norm due to an overwhelming majority. Due to this majority, nearly everything at a regular convention is going to be marketed towards straight people and heterosexuality will be the presumed norm.

Try thinking of it this way.

You are a Christian. When you get together with your Christian friends, you like to throw Christian Theology in among the general topics of conversation. Now imagine trying to have that theological discussion in the off-topic section of the forums here. Chances are good that you are going to have to deal with trolls posting insults aimed at you and your faith. all you wanted to do is have a nice theological discussion, not have to deal with sky daddy comments.

Now, if you were gay, instead of sky daddy jokes, you would at best attract odd looks and an worse have to deal with a group of knuckle-draggers trying to start trouble. this situation forces you to either hide your sexuality or endure said knuckle-draggers.

What the convention does is create a situation where homosexuality itself is the norm. not only do gay people not have to deal with people doucher, their homosexuality, which normally is something they have to compensate for, is celebrated, something which those in the group can greatly appreciate.

Um, no, actually, theres indeed a huge percent of people here who would gladly make fun of any religion, but the same poeple are usually also open to many things, including chatting with homosexuals, without making fun of them. The way I see it, more and more people getting open minded about these things, and because of that, I feel like separating them like this is a step backwards.

You missed the point of my post.

these things are not 'seperating people out', its a temporary coming together to celebrate a commonality, something impossible just out on the street.

 

[The Funslinger]

It took me about a minute after reading this to realize he's not wearing pants in the third panel.

 

[stonemaskstoryteller]

and Frankly, thinking that gay people only go anywhere "gay" only to flirt just proves how downright ignorant you are on the matter.

Well excuse me.... when sexuality is mentioned in the very name, it seems pretty logical this is going to be relevant in that place.

I swear, if I am reading "heterosexual-centered" I'm assuming that place has to do with sex, otherwise why the need to mention it at all?
So yeah, tell me. Why the need to make a gay-centered convention if it's not a place to flirt or such?

Because you know.... videogames don't have much to do with talking about your sexual partners. So I still find it idiotic that there is apparently the need to make a VIDEOGAME convention gay-centered.

Again, the ignorance. Homosexuality, Just like Heterosexuality, is more than just a matter of "flirting and sex." Its about Love too, and lifestyle, and because of that it deserves just as much respect.

Also I think you'd be surprised about just how much homosexuality crops up, not just in video games, but in comics, artwork, movies, manga, anime and all aspects of geek culture and fiction. I think you'd be less quick to judge if you did your research...

Besides, If a minority of people want to meet up to discuss homosexuality within geek culture, and talk how it can be more openly talked about and accepted, not just swept under the carpet....Just how can that be so idiotic? It's not going to rob the "purity" from all other Gamer cons. You give us too much credit if you think Gaymer con is capable of such 'devistating' side effect. If people want it, and it's welcoming to everyone, then why not? There's no harm done to anyone and who are you to stop them?

 

[Verkula]

As for "is this a good thing or not", let me put it like this: it's none of your business. I know it sounds harsh and rude, but I can't think of a clearer way to get the message across. It's not something that's going to affect you, so while thinking about equality is very nice, you have no weight on this. Let LGBT people decide what's best for them. If we want our own con, let us have it. If we want more inclusion at regular cons, let us have it. If you really care about equality, listen to us and our problems instead of telling us what is and is not conducive to equality.

Actually, it is, at least a little bit. Maybe not now with the con, but in the end, in a global scale. Altough I doubt Ill live to see that.

 

[clippen05]

Ok, everyone, important question time:

Is this Con banning non-gay people from attending? (Answer: NO)


If the gay culture is not your thing, then give the convention a pass. All these complaints almost feel like people are afraid that having too many conventions will somehow deplete the non-renewable convention resource! (Hint: it won't, you can have a theoretical infinite number of conventions with infinite themes, given enough geek critical mass)

Discussing whether there is a need for this convention or not is exactly the same thing detractors of videogames or comics argue regarding those conventions. Just because you don't get it, it doesn't mean it's worthless.

Gay Culture lol? Isn't the whole idea that lesbians and gays want to be seen as no different than any straight person? I didn't know that sexual orientations had a whole culture reserved for themselves...