Our generation's racism

[Darknacht]

they never will "get over it", its not something you can get over, any more than blacks can get over the fact that their ancestors were enslaved and ridiculed and persecuted for centuries. THey will never "get over" that.

I know plenty of Irish people that don't hold the atrocities committed against there ancestors against people of British descent. It is absurd to claim that their racism is in anyway acceptable or tolerable just because their ancestors where oppressed by some one of the same skin color as mine, would it be tolerable if eastern Europeans hated all Asians because of the Mongol conquest, no of course not. The racism held by some Natives is not really any different than Kanova's, they are both wrong.

 

[aba1]

has always been incredibly fond of Islam, which almost puts him ahead of our time).

Now what is that meant to mean?

Some people aren't.

Some people are anti-theist in general and Islam has gotten a bad rap in pop culture and media since about (oh at a rough guess) 12th September 2001 onward.

Only in the States nobody cares everywhere else. Well a few places have issues with Muslims but those are different issues based on a different matter.

 

[Indecipherable]

has always been incredibly fond of Islam, which almost puts him ahead of our time).

Now what is that meant to mean?

Some people aren't.

Some people are anti-theist in general and Islam has gotten a bad rap in pop culture and media since about (oh at a rough guess) 12th September 2001 onward.

Only in the States nobody cares everywhere else. Well a few places have issues with Muslims but those are different issues based on a different matter.

I can assure you Australia has a very heavy anti-muslim bias.

I am presuming that a great deal of Europe does too.

Food for thought:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosnian_Genocide

probably worth reading before you next contribute to this thread.

 

[Darknacht]

they never will "get over it", its not something you can get over, any more than blacks can get over the fact that their ancestors were enslaved and ridiculed and persecuted for centuries. THey will never "get over" that.

I know plenty of Irish people that don't hold the atrocities committed against there ancestors against people of British descent. It is absurd to claim that their racism is in anyway acceptable or tolerable just because their ancestors where oppressed by some one of the same skin color as mine, would it be tolerable if eastern Europeans hated all Asians because of the Mongol conquest, no of course not. The racism held by some Natives is not really any different than Kanova's, they are both wrong.

The two are very different, what happened to the natives was genocide, not war.

Wiping out most of the native population of an area through slaughter and starvation with the intent of settling your own people there is genocide even if its Europeans doing it to Europeans. They were both war and genocide, you can think of Ireland as England's trial run for colonial conquest.

 

[Jodah]

My grandpa went in to a chocolate shop one time. After browsing for a bit he said he wanted a pound of those "****** toes" (chocolate covered Brazil nuts) the lady had a look of horror on her face and said "Sir! You can't say that!" My grandfather looked her straight in the eye and said "Miss, I'm 82 years old. At this point in my life, I don't give a damn who I offend. I served with niggers in the war and have no problem with them. When I was growing up people called me a dago and we called blacks niggers. That's how it was and I'm too damn old to change now."

Personally I think the whole politically correct thing is a load of crap. If you take offense from something someone says that is your problem. If you want to call me a fat, hillbilly, dago, piece of shit go for it. But you better not take offense when I say the same to you.

 

[viranimus]

Three points.

A: "our" generation (if your refering to those who are on this forum) is comprised of two (and soon to be 3) separate and distinct generations. GenX (born 1960-1980) ME generation: AKA GenY (1980-2000) and soon there will be the "next gen" which has not clearly been identified yet and its placeholder is "GenZ"

B: If your referring to Me Gen, I think your "ism" is already clearly established. GenY as a whole is incredibly intolerant of all religion with unimaginable intolerance toward Christianity first, and Islam second. That is what your going to be bitching about when your old and senile.

C: Isms are not going to go away and to think that "Someday in the future all this is going to be a bad memory" is just plain ignorant. Part of these intolerances develop not from actual hatred of what is not being tolerated nearly as much as it is a rejection of what prior generations accepted so the younger generation can pretend its being tolerant as it doesnt realize its just a cog in a much larger cycle. Plus as world events occur, new hatreds will emerge. Just like I look at GenY and see them being especially hateful toward Islam and Arabs. A major part of this stems from the western Worlds view on the events of the gulf wars and 9/11. However those not as effected by it really dont have as much in born dislike of Arabs, buuut, being closer to vietnam and the ass end of WW2 in some cases, the are MUUUUUUCH more intolerant towards Asians. Times change, but intolerance simply just evolves.

 

[him over there]

they never will "get over it", its not something you can get over, any more than blacks can get over the fact that their ancestors were enslaved and ridiculed and persecuted for centuries. THey will never "get over" that.

I know plenty of Irish people that don't hold the atrocities committed against there ancestors against people of British descent. It is absurd to claim that their racism is in anyway acceptable or tolerable just because their ancestors where oppressed by some one of the same skin color as mine, would it be tolerable if eastern Europeans hated all Asians because of the Mongol conquest, no of course not. The racism held by some Natives is not really any different than Kanova's, they are both wrong.

The two are very different, what happened to the natives was genocide, not war.

Wiping out most of the native population of an area through slaughter and starvation with the intent of settling your own people there is genocide even if its Europeans doing it to Europeans. They were both war and genocide, you can think of Ireland as England's trial run for colonial conquest.

I'd just like to interject that whether or not First nations people will "get over it" that the act of people who's ancestors committed atrocities reimbursing the descendants of the people their ancestors committed atrocities against is flawed. You can't create equality through giving a group that once suffered at the hands of another special privileges, you have to give them equality. Honestly racism will diminish when we stop acknowledging that races exist. The scientific community doesn't and they built a high speed system that let's thousands of people congregate and communicate halfway across the world.

 

[RustlessPotato]

Reading this thread has confirmed what I always thought. In order to stay friends with somebody, never, under any circumstances, argue religion or politics.

 

[afroebob]

Muslims. Seriously. This generation is fucking FILLED with hatred towards Muslims. The first thing anyone thinks of when they hear Muslims is 'EVIL BASTARDS!'. I am one of the exceptions because the first thing that pops into my mind when I hear Muslim is that something is evil and despicable but its not Muslims, its the stereotype that surrounds them. I think (and hope) that the next generation will look back on us and think 'What the fuck was their problem with Muslims?'. Seriously. Muslims aren't all bad people. The majority of them are good people. Saying a small group of Muslims reflects their people as a whole (in this case the small groups would be terrorists) is like saying Westboro reflects Christianity as a hole (although I know a lot of you think they do. But I don't think a small group of internet users who hate Christianity reflect on internet users as a whole. Ha, see how I spun that around?).

 

[afroebob]

My grandpa went in to a chocolate shop one time. After browsing for a bit he said he wanted a pound of those "****** toes" (chocolate covered Brazil nuts) the lady had a look of horror on her face and said "Sir! You can't say that!" My grandfather looked her straight in the eye and said "Miss, I'm 82 years old. At this point in my life, I don't give a damn who I offend. I served with niggers in the war and have no problem with them. When I was growing up people called me a dago and we called blacks niggers. That's how it was and I'm too damn old to change now."

Personally I think the whole politically correct thing is a load of crap. If you take offense from something someone says that is your problem. If you want to call me a fat, hillbilly, dago, piece of shit go for it. But you better not take offense when I say the same to you.

You know, normally I have a problem with the word '******' but thats usually because of the context it is used in and the hypocrisy that surrounds it. I mean, seriously, if someone isn't using a word offensively than don't take it offensively. If he said the word ****** but didn't mean it as a putdown than yes, maybe its a little insensitive but I really don't think any rational black person is really going to be offended by it. Not everything has to be sugar coated sweatness, I don't use the word ****** but if I was black and I did hear someone say it but wasn't trying to be offensive I wouldn't think anything of it. A word is just as much about the definition as the context it is used in. Hmm... I think I just came up with a pretty awesome quote.

 

[BehattedWanderer]

Can't speak to bigotry, but I can guess that a "right to sexuality" in terms of fundamental human rights is in our relatively near future. Though, our tendency towards demanding tolerance is one that may have gone a bit too far the other way. As always, South Park creators Matt Stone and Trey Parker beat everyone to it by warning us of impending problems.

I've seen a lot of Matt and Trey's work, including most of the commentaries on their stuff so I kind of have a lot to go on, could you be more specific about which impending problem and where they warn us?

Death Camp of Tolerance. The one where Mr Garrison goes apeshit trying to get fired, by doing all kinds of screwed up sex acts, and the kids get sent to a tolerance camp when they try to point out there's a line for acceptance. Not sure what the Lemmiwinks part is a metaphor of, but I assume something singularly silly about never giving up when you're stuck in a gay man's rectum.

 

[lacktheknack]

Ugh, hating religions is vulgar.

I can understand the intellectual distaste for organised religion, it is reasonable. But hating a person for what they believe is simply boorish.

I support that.

OT: If we manage basic sentience in AI, then there'll be the whole "What is the measure of a non-human" problem going. For further details, play Geneforge 1-5. Warning: Depressing.

 

[lacktheknack]

Ugh, hating religions is vulgar.

I can understand the intellectual distaste for organised religion, it is reasonable. But hating a person for what they believe is simply boorish.

Islam is an organized religion. What do you think people think of when someone says Islam? Pop tarts?

Let me elucidate (I like using that word).

I'm fine with people being against organised religions in general. That's understandable to me.

I have a problem with someone hating faith, beliefs, or specific religions.

Why? That doesn't make sense to me.

Why would it be wrong for someone to hate a violent religion that says you should die if you try to leave and not dislike one that is non-violent? Not using any specifics btw.

Oh come off it. You're referring to Islam, aren't you?

You're aware that the Quran states that all Muslims, Christians, and Jews go directly to their own heaven, right? And that there's no lines about punishing those who leave?

And there's no replacement. Your theoretical organized religion doesn't even exist.

 

[Kanova]

Dont get broey with me brah, I think its disgusting how you generalize native americans like that. How can you say what they went trhough was less than what black went through? The Whites actively spread disease amongst the native's ranks. They actively slaughtered their children. We forced them to leave their lands, breaking promise after promise. I dont know where you live, but Natives have all but been wiped out. I think they make up something like a quarter of a percent of the population here in america. Just leave them alone, they have enough shit to deal with

Well where I am from they are everywhere, they are breeding like crazy dude. I think you are lucky for them to be rare there. They are legit worse then all the mexicans and blacks you have down there. Iono, we did that shit to the Indians because we just wanted their land. I always think that if we started to fuck with them they would put up a fight or something. You know, war. That thing humans do all the time but they didn't do shit until the very end. So shucks to them. Blacks were strung up and murdered for no reason besides being black. And yeah yeah yeah I know about the residential school system natives went through. Still, blacks had it pretty fucking bad. But yeah, they should have fought or rebelled or something. Blacks did, and wabam there they are today. Natives were either too stupid or nice to do that so they are where they are now. I mean they fought you guys and were fucked but they waited way to long. I don't know if I am getting that point across right, but there it is. Bro.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

Tell that to Martin LK and Malcolm X. If it werent for the very serious threat of a full scale insurrection of minorities, the gov't would have done jack squat and we would still be going to separate schools, drinking form separate fountains, and shitting in separate bowls

Malcom X? You mean the racist who said that all white people are the devil and that JFK's death was justified, and a devout member for the Nation of Islam( a group that the southern-poverty law center has deemed to be a racist group? [http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/groups/nation-of-islam]). The guy who only at the end of his life realized how incredibly racist his views were and how racist the people [en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation_of_Islam] he surrounded himself were?

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

Considering how often the response to this question here is the pretentious sounding "theres no such thing as race and racism because we're all the same race. what are we going tos tart hating aliens?) I dont know.

Id say more than anyhting its going to be the religious. I know atheists like to say they're the most downtroddened and hated because saying you dont believe in god is like saying you find joy in raping women for the shits and giggles of them screaming but in all reality theyre nto and its not. and I can only wait for the hypocrisy when the atheists start treating the religious the horrible ways they're supposedly treated.

They already do, go look at how the Tibetan people are treated by the PRC and how Tibetan Buddhism is treated.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

Tell that to Martin LK and Malcolm X. If it werent for the very serious threat of a full scale insurrection of minorities, the gov't would have done jack squat and we would still be going to separate schools, drinking form separate fountains, and shitting in separate bowls

Malcom X? You mean the racist who said that all white people are the devil and that JFK's death was justified, and a devout member for the Nation of Islam( a group that the southern-poverty law center has deemed to be a racist group? [http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/groups/nation-of-islam]). The guy who only at the end of his life realized how incredibly racist his views were and how racist the people [en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation_of_Islam] he surrounded himself were?

Yea that guy, the one who incited REAL change. If it werent for him, MLK wouldnt have had even close to the amount of leverage he did with white people. Malcolm X fucking scared white people, before malcolm x, mlk was doing alright, but the establishment never gave a shit. But then malcolm x lit a fire under all their asses and white folk went "Holy Shit! Ok okokok we'll take the nice guy see black people? We're doing it ok civil rights for everybody just ignore that malcolm x guy". And then they killed him.

Spoiler: ........

Please provide me with the academic level sources that support such claims, because otherwise what you are saying is complete nonsense.

 

[lacktheknack]

Tell that to Martin LK and Malcolm X. If it werent for the very serious threat of a full scale insurrection of minorities, the gov't would have done jack squat and we would still be going to separate schools, drinking form separate fountains, and shitting in separate bowls

Malcom X? You mean the racist who said that all white people are the devil and that JFK's death was justified, and a devout member for the Nation of Islam( a group that the southern-poverty law center has deemed to be a racist group? [http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/groups/nation-of-islam]). The guy who only at the end of his life realized how incredibly racist his views were and how racist the people [en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation_of_Islam] he surrounded himself were?

Yea that guy, the one who incited REAL change. If it werent for him, MLK wouldnt have had even close to the amount of leverage he did with white people. Malcolm X fucking scared white people, before malcolm x, mlk was doing alright, but the establishment never gave a shit. But then malcolm x lit a fire under all their asses and white folk went "Holy Shit! Ok okokok we'll take the nice guy see black people? We're doing it ok civil rights for everybody just ignore that malcolm x guy". And then they killed him.

Spoiler: ........

Please provide me with the academic level sources that support such claims, because otherwise what you are saying is complete nonsense.

HH you wont find everything thats true in a history book, sometimes it takes a little independent thinking and seeing between the lines. Read some Chomsky or Zinn sometime

edit: especially since The whole topic of malcolm x has been basically taboo since the civil rights movement ended

double edit: one thing you cannot deny was that he was a powerful speaker, a man with genuine, dark anger in his soul, a very bright and intelligent man

You can't adjust history with a little independent thinking... Powerful and intelligent speaker or not.

 

[Darknacht]

they never will "get over it", its not something you can get over, any more than blacks can get over the fact that their ancestors were enslaved and ridiculed and persecuted for centuries. THey will never "get over" that.

I know plenty of Irish people that don't hold the atrocities committed against there ancestors against people of British descent. It is absurd to claim that their racism is in anyway acceptable or tolerable just because their ancestors where oppressed by some one of the same skin color as mine, would it be tolerable if eastern Europeans hated all Asians because of the Mongol conquest, no of course not. The racism held by some Natives is not really any different than Kanova's, they are both wrong.

The two are very different, what happened to the natives was genocide, not war.

Wiping out most of the native population of an area through slaughter and starvation with the intent of settling your own people there is genocide even if its Europeans doing it to Europeans. They were both war and genocide, you can think of Ireland as England's trial run for colonial conquest.

Yeah well at least they got to live, True Native americans are about as common as 4 headed kangaroos, I'm not sure we even left them with a even feasible gene pool. The women were all taken by white men that much i know, I'm not sure what the men did though. When I think about the shit I went through as a half ***** growing up, I cant imagine what the half indians kids had to go through back in the 17,1800's, it must've been hell. Thats how you disenfranchise a people man, kill all the men and take all the women, and watch as their sons hate you forever, which passes on to their kids, so on so forth, until the Natives forget who they are, why they're even angry, but they know their angry. Textbook disenfranchisement brought to you by good old US and A

At one point the English killed over 80% of the Irish population, and then basically used them as a slave force for 300 years that breads some fairly strong hatred. I'm not saying that its worse then what happened to the Natives but its still really bad and there is still allot of hate in some people. I know why Natives hate, I am part(a very small part) Native and I am related to full Natives by marriage, I am not saying that that I don't understand, I am saying that hating people that did nothing to you is wrong. I am of Irish ancestry and I would gut Cromwell on the spot if he hadn't died hundreds of years ago, but that does not give me a free excuse to hate all English people and it certainly doesn't give me an excuse hate all Germanic people.

if you think malcolm x played no major role in the success of the civil rights movement, you are ignant

Your definitely right there, no one person made the civil rights movement happen and Malcolm X should not be ignored just because he had some extreme views earlier in his life.

 

[TheVioletBandit]

yes Im sure the wholesale destruction of their race by whites plays no part in how disenfranchised the native american people are, shame on them for being depressed about something that happened 400 years ago

Almost certain you are being sarcastic, but all the same, who the fuck gives a shit. Not sure the majority of them needs to be a trashy piece of shit because of what happened generations and generations ago. There should be a lot of them that are trying to be better people, but I don't see it, I don't hear it so I don't think they are. So as far as I am concerned, they should not get special privileges because that is bullshit, they should not get free stuff (Oh look at me I am drunk every day and a druggy bastard and live in a shitty house because I have no clue how to take care of myself or possessions but still get free money and can afford new trucks that will soon be a shitty because I am scum) and they should just be treated like everyone else. I am sure they will soon die off and I am fine with that.

What kind of Indians are you talking about?

Native Americans. You know, the useless piles of flesh that is more alcohol than human. At least that is how they are in Canada.


Ugh, I get seriously rustled when it comes to racism.

Yeah, I'm an American Indian, and I don't drink, do drugs, or get any special privileges. I also have have a college education, and am now attending graduate school. Nevertheless, keep it up with that old school racism, I'm sure the hatred will eat you up inside like a cancer. Also, thanks for the motivation.