Poll: A compromise for Skyrim's children

[Duskflamer]

I basically agree with that original comment, to quote myself in response to Yahtzee's article:

The problem with the argument that children shouldn't be able to die, is that they're no more innocent than any of the adult townspeople who CAN die. The children are no more unworth of death than the adults who can be killed, and to a gamer who decides to go on a rampage killing an entire town, hitting the block of "you cannot kill children" is rather frustrating. Why not just make all the noncombatant townspeople immortal if you're trying to establish some kind of morality?

And in line with this and the original comment, no. Giving children the plot-armor that significant NPCs have would not be enough (Hell, I don't like that plot-armor in the first place. When I do end up getting Skyrim, first two mods I'll grab will be to make children killable and to replace plot-armor with a "The plot cannot be finished now" message if you kill someone important).

I haven't read your spoiler yet, so I'll ask, 'why do you think people want to have this in game'? (see I avoided using 'you' in there).

Consistency. All NPC townsfolk need to have the same amount of mortality. Killing a child is no more evil or brutal than killing its defenseless mother. If the developers are trying to enforce some sort of morality, than both of them should be immortal. Otherwise, neither should be.

 

[lionrwal]

While normally I wouldn't care if we could kill children in a game, in Skyrim I do, all because of one little quest line.

Spoiler: Just in case this spoils anyone...

There is a quest where you have to investigate this person who is trying to summon the Dark Brotherhood. When you get to their house, you see its a child, and that he has somehow found human flesh and heart to perform the Black Sacrament. He want's you to kill someone, and as far as I know, you can't refuse the quest. I tried to kill the kid, only to have guards enter the house and try to kill me, forcing me to reload my last save. That's the only reason I want the child-killing mod in Skyrim.

 

[MaxwellEdison]

Why are people so against having the kids be mortal like the rest of us?

The dragon killing everyone but immortal kids situation is still a problem, and that's what bothers me.

 

[Peteron]

Honestly, its worse that they have to experience the torture of Wuuthrad and live as I repeatedly butcher them! Killing those bastards would put them out of their misery! Either way, I understand why they don't allow characters to do this in the game, that's why we have mods! But, honestly, did they have to make children the characters you want to kill the most? Seriously, they always have something stuck up to say that makes me want to destroy them!

 

[Talshere]

Two things I change is one.

Make them less annoying. Remember this one "Someone one else to lick my fathers boots."
Maybe after a beating the kid run in terror.

I think the main thing people are upset about is the attitude the children.

Fact is irl a kid with that mouth would have to have fast feet to avoid a beating. I one of my hypothetical future kids ever muttered that to a passer by you can be damned sure Id belt the foul mouthed brat on the spot, I sure as hell wouldnt doubt or even call out the person they said it to if they clipped em round the ear-hole. Kids need to be educated as to the proper manners and etiquette. Failure to do so leads to the many council estates that can be found around Britain.

 

[Risingblade]

Have we really gotten to the point where people want to kill kids?

Imagine all the shit we'd get from the media, "CHILD MURDER IN SKYRIM!"

Killing kids is plain wrong, even in a game. Wrong.
Screw immersion, anyone who wants to argue otherwhise needs to get their head checked.

Finally someone with some sense!

 

[Risingblade]

Have we really gotten to the point where people want to kill kids?

Imagine all the shit we'd get from the media, "CHILD MURDER IN SKYRIM!"

Killing kids is plain wrong, even in a game. Wrong.
Screw immersion, anyone who wants to argue otherwhise needs to get their head checked.

Finally someone with some sense!

Doesn't seem that way when I ripped that poor excuse of an argument to shreds a few posts up.

The truth is this child killing "controversy" is contrived, slow, and hypocritical. Child Killing has been in games for a while, and Skyrim isn't morally right 99% of the time. To complain of a child's death would make no logical sense.

The "moral crusader" argument is only supported by pure emotion, not logic. Emotion is irrational, and not something you should follow. Emotions should be controlled, not control the person.

You just want to go around killing kids don't ya?

 

[Risingblade]

Have we really gotten to the point where people want to kill kids?

Imagine all the shit we'd get from the media, "CHILD MURDER IN SKYRIM!"

Killing kids is plain wrong, even in a game. Wrong.
Screw immersion, anyone who wants to argue otherwhise needs to get their head checked.

Finally someone with some sense!

Doesn't seem that way when I ripped that poor excuse of an argument to shreds a few posts up.

The truth is this child killing "controversy" is contrived, slow, and hypocritical. Child Killing has been in games for a while, and Skyrim isn't morally right 99% of the time. To complain of a child's death would make no logical sense.

The "moral crusader" argument is only supported by pure emotion, not logic. Emotion is irrational, and not something you should follow. Emotions should be controlled, not control the person.

You just want to go around killing kids don't ya?

See right there? Emotional argument. Not to mention a logical fallacy. I never said anything about wanting to kill kids, I said your argument is flawed. Out of every single person trying to claim the child killing mod is immoral, none of them provided an actual argument. They only provided insults and logical fallacies. Its like religion and how it goes on and on about how morally wrong something is yet turns around and does something 10x worse.

I have yet to see a logical argument for the child killing side so I'll stick to my emotional one. You can't always go pure logic, you're a human not a robot >.>

 

[KiloFox]

My problem with the game isn't that you can't kill the children, but rather that the children are invincible.

When a dragon lands on a village, burns it to a crisp and kills everyone there somehow the children will still survive because of their magical immortality, and THAT'S what's immersion breaking.

Wanting the children to be able to die does not necessarily mean that the players in fact want to kill the children in the game, it just means that we want the world's rules to apply to all the characters, be they children or otherwise. If an NPC is attacked by an enemy, be they adult or child we want the outcome to be the same, otherwise it's just silly.

this. definitely this. i made a good post earlier on another thread on this issue, but this gives a good explanation too.

 

[SquirePB]

I generally don't kill random NPC's in towns and stuff so it doesn't really affect me. But I do sometimes feel that the point of a game like Skyrim is complete freedom and so having exceptions about who you can/can't kill does take away from that.

 

[2012 Wont Happen]

So, err, what is this doing in the off-topic section?

We already have enough Skyrim threads in the Gaming section.

Too many, in fact. Did there end up so many Skyrim topics that they spilled into the other sections?

This is mayhem. I think that we just needed on Skyrim megathread in the beginning so that everything can go there and everyone not interested can ignore it. There's about 3,000 too many Skyrim topics as it stands.

If you aren't interested in Skyrim threads, don't read them.

 

[Akimoto]

Abusing children over and over but they never die? That...sounds too unsettlingly like Mai-chan's Daily Life for me.

Now I want to use the mod. Those children are probably super-powered aliens waiting to take over Skyrim!

Or, we could make a mod where all of the children are Mai-chan.

 

[Chase Yojimbo]

Whatever happened to not downloading the mod... People are fucking stupid. Fallout, Fallout NV, and Oblivion had the same mods, so why should Skyrim be any different?

 

[Akimoto]

@TheDarkEricDraven
.....yes

@Chase Yojimbo
Haters gonna hate. Players gonna play. After Skyrim no more online MMORPG for me.

 

[Elementary - Dear Watson]

Little Big Adventure 2 had some gobbly little shit children in, but also had the mechanic that if you hit one they would cry, and say they were going to get their big brother on you, then their big brother would aproach and hit you, knocking down your health... This was done in a cut scene, and you couldn't defend yourself!

In your home town thwere is a school, where if you hit all the kids in there, the teacher pleads with you, and all the kids cry, and then when you exit the school there is an entire line of brother waiting to give you beatings! Doesn't stop making it funny though! Especially as I was a kid when I used to do it!