Poll: Adamantium vs Lightsaber
- Thread starter The Chemist
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To the original question: Lightsaber = unstoppable force. Adamantium = immovable object. If you read enough of the background fiction, you'll find there are things that stop lightsabers and things that dent adamantium. Generally the objects or forces they encounter are less sturdy than themselves and so break with only moderate effort. It's only when they encounter something else very strong or tough that it becomes a question. Even if a lightsaber could cut anything if sufficient force were applied, the arm holding the lightsaber will not have infinite strength. Likewise, whatever is hitting the adamantium is not doing so with infinite force (even the Hulk can only punch so hard). I abstain on the grounds that the question is subjective.
To "how do you make adamantium in the first place": I figure it's like making concrete. The things you put in the mixer aren't concrete until they've been stirred together in the right proportions and allowed to harden. After it hardens it's stronger than its components and can't be unmade just by reversing the process. Adamantium is Rule-Of-Coollurgy rather than metallurgy but the same principle should apply.
As to why Wolvie's claws cut through nearly everything, I figure they were made with ridiculously sharp edges, monomolecular or nearly so. Since adamantium is so hard, the claws would never need sharpening. Logan would still have to be strong to push the claws through steel, but have you seen how much muscle there is on that guy?
Bottom line: You're dealing with stuff that doesn't (and, arguably, cannot) exist so throwing science at it will take you only so far. It comes down to opinion.
To "how do you make adamantium in the first place": I figure it's like making concrete. The things you put in the mixer aren't concrete until they've been stirred together in the right proportions and allowed to harden. After it hardens it's stronger than its components and can't be unmade just by reversing the process. Adamantium is Rule-Of-Coollurgy rather than metallurgy but the same principle should apply.
As to why Wolvie's claws cut through nearly everything, I figure they were made with ridiculously sharp edges, monomolecular or nearly so. Since adamantium is so hard, the claws would never need sharpening. Logan would still have to be strong to push the claws through steel, but have you seen how much muscle there is on that guy?
Bottom line: You're dealing with stuff that doesn't (and, arguably, cannot) exist so throwing science at it will take you only so far. It comes down to opinion.
I don't think it's a good idea to cite a videogame in this case. Often, video games have to work out balancing extreme elements such as the cutting power of the lightsaber to make the game playable and challenging.DaJoW said:
Adamantium, its so super dense nothing can cut through it. Even a light saber can have a hard time cutting through certain metals. Let alone a uncutable metal.
As much as I hate the new Star Wars movies, I will have to cite the opening scene of the Phantom Menace, when they closed the big blast doors (the second set, not the first set). Those were just heavy metal doors, and yes, he did start getting through them slowly, but it was slow and he was having to twist it around and slowly melt it.
Thats just my opinion though, I think this is a unmovable object vs. an unstoppable force argument which is a paradox =P
As much as I hate the new Star Wars movies, I will have to cite the opening scene of the Phantom Menace, when they closed the big blast doors (the second set, not the first set). Those were just heavy metal doors, and yes, he did start getting through them slowly, but it was slow and he was having to twist it around and slowly melt it.
Thats just my opinion though, I think this is a unmovable object vs. an unstoppable force argument which is a paradox =P
With all of the debate and subsequent knowledge, I think the OP needs to make a new thread with the following question...
"If someone is wearing armor that consists of Mandalorian iron, cortosis, adamantium and vibranium and said person is also wielding a lightsaber...are they nigh unstoppable?"
OT: People are forgetting a crucial aspect of the lightsaber. The blade is, indeed, very destructive. However, it's hilt is quite vulnerable to attack. Destroy the hilt and you effectively destroy the blade. Then the question becomes, can the person using the adamantium figure this weakness out in time before the lightsaber can achieve victory? My answer - given the right person, yes. Therefore, my vote went to adamantium.
Now, if the lightsaber hilt was made of any of the previously mentioned materials....welllll, I think it's safe to assume that that would be one hell of a long battle. So long that I don't believe there's enough popcorn in the universe, and all of its parallels, to sustain me watching it. Let alone thousands upon thousands of people spanning that same universe.
"If someone is wearing armor that consists of Mandalorian iron, cortosis, adamantium and vibranium and said person is also wielding a lightsaber...are they nigh unstoppable?"
OT: People are forgetting a crucial aspect of the lightsaber. The blade is, indeed, very destructive. However, it's hilt is quite vulnerable to attack. Destroy the hilt and you effectively destroy the blade. Then the question becomes, can the person using the adamantium figure this weakness out in time before the lightsaber can achieve victory? My answer - given the right person, yes. Therefore, my vote went to adamantium.
Now, if the lightsaber hilt was made of any of the previously mentioned materials....welllll, I think it's safe to assume that that would be one hell of a long battle. So long that I don't believe there's enough popcorn in the universe, and all of its parallels, to sustain me watching it. Let alone thousands upon thousands of people spanning that same universe.
Lightsabers don't cut through everything like butter. Its been shown on multiple occasions that a swing of a lightsaber wont cut through alot of metals.
Qui Gon's door cutting has been used as an example as well as vader's saber bouncing off a railing and not cutting it (which I'm assuming was made from the stolen but not properly created mandalorian iron the empire strip mined.)
Cortosis has been referenced but as a comparason to adamantium it doesnt work. Cortosis is a very brittle weak metal. it stops lightsabers because of its reactive properties that actually short out the saber for a second or two.
adamantium would be more comparable to mandalorian iron. Mandolorian iron gloves (chrushgloves I think they were called) have been able to catch lightsaber blades with no problems. Adamantium would be similar.
And to further nerdify. Adamantium is an alloy not a metal you would mine from the ground. the combined elements (steel, vibranium and maybe one other thing I think) are each melted and combined. when it cools (as adamantium) it is considered indestructable and will not melt again even at its original melting temperature. So heat from a lightsaber would not be a factor.
Qui Gon's door cutting has been used as an example as well as vader's saber bouncing off a railing and not cutting it (which I'm assuming was made from the stolen but not properly created mandalorian iron the empire strip mined.)
Cortosis has been referenced but as a comparason to adamantium it doesnt work. Cortosis is a very brittle weak metal. it stops lightsabers because of its reactive properties that actually short out the saber for a second or two.
adamantium would be more comparable to mandalorian iron. Mandolorian iron gloves (chrushgloves I think they were called) have been able to catch lightsaber blades with no problems. Adamantium would be similar.
And to further nerdify. Adamantium is an alloy not a metal you would mine from the ground. the combined elements (steel, vibranium and maybe one other thing I think) are each melted and combined. when it cools (as adamantium) it is considered indestructable and will not melt again even at its original melting temperature. So heat from a lightsaber would not be a factor.
in the ultimates universe cap's shield is 100% adamantium. in the 616 universe it is officially a vibranium / unknown metal alloy. That's how its been listed in the official marvel databases for years, however there have been several marvel writers over the years that took it upon themselves to claim the unknown metal was adamantium (even though it wasn't created until years after the shield was). Poor editing work on marvel's partGruevy said:
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that and vibroswords aren't enchanted. they are a complicated blade that uses a combination of super high speed vibration and an electrical charge to create a thin electromagnetic field around the blade that repulses lightsabers.
I would research the cortosis and mandolorian iron that has been referenced many times in the thread before making that statement.THEAFRONINJA said:
that and vibroswords aren't enchanted. they are a complicated blade that uses a combination of super high speed vibration and an electrical charge to create a thin electromagnetic field around the blade that repulses lightsabers.
As I understand it, the lightsaber would eventually cut through, though it would take a very long time (and possibly several changes of battery).
Also, I have to wonder, is there some kind of heavy-duty, industrial strength lightsaber? That might be what's needed.
Also, I have to wonder, is there some kind of heavy-duty, industrial strength lightsaber? That might be what's needed.
binnsyboy said:
It's funny because he thinks Star Wars has magic. (force does not = magic) enchantments... *snort* but yeah, cortosis, and mandalorian metal (Beskar)SteveZim1017 said:
Beskar! thank you! I could not remember the mandolorian name for the metal. I felt so incomplete nerding out on star wars and marvel universe minutia and not being able to fully complete the process.binnsyboy said:
actually, beskar (Mandalorian steel/iron) is only ("only") highly resistant to lightsabers, not impervious.vallorn said:
unless they've changed something with all the rebooting and ret-conning, Cap's shield was actually an Adamantium/Vibranium blend. at least that's what they claimed in the '80s. i haven't kept up on Marvel continuity since the early '90s, so for all i know they changed it...Gruevy said:
*edit* aaaaaand, it looks like i was ninja'd on both points. i hate when i start typing a post at work and get side-tracked for an hour before i finish
