Poll: Time travel, is it possible?

[FrostyV3]

______________________________________________
Here is the paradox.
- If you destroy it; then it would not exist in the future to send you the message to destroy it.
- So you wouldn't destroy it; so it would exist in the future.
- So this is a never-ending cycle.

Number of ways to solve that.
1) There was another machine built. You can't really stop scientific progress. (And putting restraints on the human world never works)
2) The letter wasn't from you.
3) You're eliminated from the time-stream as a paradox.
4) You can't send the letter to yourself from non-intervention.
5) It might not have been the first time.
6) You might not be able to destroy the machine.

Applying set unbreakable rules to disprove something is Marketing, not Science.

Good answer, but here's my impression:

1) Fair enough, but in this scenario it is supposed that another will never be made.
2) It would not matter who sent the message; the focus matter is the machine, not the operator.
3) Interesting theory, I wont argue it.
4) Apologies, but I don't understand this point.
5) Apologies, but I don't understand this point.
6) We're assuming that you were able to break the machine. One would assume that something this complicated could be compromised easily enough.

~Frosty.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Good answer, but here's my impression:

1) Fair enough, but in this scenario it is supposed that another will never be made.

That's the problem with the scenario. You're applying arbitrary rules which, let's face it, ain't gonna happen

2) It would not matter who sent the message; the focus matter is the machine, not the operator. Combined with 1, this disavows you. It also allows for non-time travel to create a non-paradox
3) Interesting theory, I wont argue it.
4) Apologies, but I don't understand this point.Some force will prevent you sending the letter. Call it luck, fate or whatever.
5) Apologies, but I don't understand this point.Someone could have already created a time machine and they sent the letter back to keep their copyright
6) We're assuming that you were able to break the machine. One would assume that something this complicated could be compromised easily enough.Assumption is the problem with theoretical scenarios. Perhaps when it's been used it becomes immune to the timestream?

~Frosty.

The real problem is that we simply can't know what rules apply to the time stream until we test them, and although we can quote entropy as "No travel back, travel forward slowly", once we can beat/bypass entropy there are no other rules to what we can or can't do. Yet.

 

[MCHesh]

Anything is possible with the right amount of drugs.

 

[FrostyV3]

Good answer, but here's my impression:

1) Fair enough, but in this scenario it is supposed that another will never be made.

That's the problem with the scenario. You're applying arbitrary rules which, let's face it, ain't gonna happen

2) It would not matter who sent the message; the focus matter is the machine, not the operator. Combined with 1, this disavows you. It also allows for non-time travel to create a non-paradox
3) Interesting theory, I wont argue it.
4) Apologies, but I don't understand this point.Some force will prevent you sending the letter. Call it luck, fate or whatever.
5) Apologies, but I don't understand this point.Someone could have already created a time machine and they sent the letter back to keep their copyright
6) We're assuming that you were able to break the machine. One would assume that something this complicated could be compromised easily enough.Assumption is the problem with theoretical scenarios. Perhaps when it's been used it becomes immune to the timestream?

~Frosty.

The real problem is that we simply can't know what rules apply to the time stream until we test them, and although we can quote entropy as "No travel back, travel forward slowly", once we can beat/bypass entropy there are no other rules to what we can or can't do. Yet.

Interesting stuff; its good to have a good insightful conversation on here, not just seeing the same old abusive flame wars. Good Talk
~Frosty.

 

[Kurokami]

Yes it's possible and no changes yo make to the past would affect your future it would create an alternate universe and your reality would remain untouched.

Anyway physics says travel forward is theoretically possible but travel backwards is not.

of course travel forwards is possible, its not even a theory, look I'm doing it right now.

Time is just a concept anyway, i'd like to think it can't be manipulated

 

[ntafiend]

Fun topic. i think it will be possible someday. However i dont think any of the attempts being made now ( that ive heard of) will work. From what ive seen, certain people are thinking that just because the flow of time is "perceived" to change with distance from gravity etc... that the flow of time is actually changing. I think this is simply a flaw in the ways we measure time, and not any manipulation of time itself.

For example: ever look at the wheel of a car next to you on the highway? sometimes they seems to be turning backwards. We all know they arent. I think current scientists are making the same mistake in the pursuit of time travel.

How can people argue about this though? Obviously we cant do it with the technology we have today. Of course it could just be something as simple as making the mistake of thinking we completely understand all of the the laws of nature.

The most important point that I think needs to made: There are a lot of things we can do today that used to be "impossible", so why all the assertiveness one way or the other?

I see alot of references to that discovery show, and a few to the book Timeline by Michael Crichton. And i dont think i saw any BTTF jokes. that makes me sad.

Disclaimer: I am not a scientist. I have not studied the fields in question. I claim no actual knowledge of time travel.

 

[Tri Force95]

Not possible, because of both the Butterfly Effect and the major paradox's that would result no matter what you did, or didn't do, in the past.

There is a chance that a paradox would'nt affect our time, but create a new alternate dimension.

to the OT: Is it possible? Yes. Can we do it now?: No, not with our current technology.

True, it might, but what happens if time DOESN'T split? What if it is linear? And if that is the case, some who traveled back in time's smallest action could have profound consequences. Of course, this is all just speculation, since no one knows.

yeah, you bring up a good point.

 

[Cakes]

Everything about time travel is theoretical at the moment. Why is there no "maybe" option?

 

[darkless]

Yes it's possible and no changes yo make to the past would affect your future it would create an alternate universe and your reality would remain untouched.

Anyway physics says travel forward is theoretically possible but travel backwards is not.

of course travel forwards is possible, its not even a theory, look I'm doing it right now.

Time is just a concept anyway, i'd like to think it can't be manipulated

there is a big difference between actually skiping through time and experiencing time as it goes.

 

[darkless]

Everything about time travel is theoretical at the moment. Why is there no "maybe" option?

Because at the same time gravity evolution and relativity are all theoretical at the moment a scientific theory is only one step from being a universal fact.

 

[Cakes]

Everything about time travel is theoretical at the moment. Why is there no "maybe" option?

Because at the same time gravity evolution and relativity are all theoretical at the moment a scientific theory is only one step from being a universal fact.

Except for the part that we know evolution actually happened. No one at the moment is even sure if time travel can be done. Your comparison is shit.

 

[darkless]

Everything about time travel is theoretical at the moment. Why is there no "maybe" option?

Because at the same time gravity evolution and relativity are all theoretical at the moment a scientific theory is only one step from being a universal fact.

Except for the part that we know evolution actually happened. No one at the moment is even sure if time travel can be done. Your comparison is shit.

No we cant prove evolution actually happened it is still a theory despite being "Proven" is still just a theory as is gravity my comparison is very valid you cant dismiss something simply for being a scientific theory as in science a theory is completely different to being a theory in general

 

[Cakes]

Everything about time travel is theoretical at the moment. Why is there no "maybe" option?

Because at the same time gravity evolution and relativity are all theoretical at the moment a scientific theory is only one step from being a universal fact.

Except for the part that we know evolution actually happened. No one at the moment is even sure if time travel can be done. Your comparison is shit.

No we cant prove evolution actually happened it is still a theory despite being "Proven" is still just a theory as is gravity my comparison is very valid you cant dismiss something simply for being a scientific theory as in science a theory is completely different to being a theory in general

Evolution is a scientific theory. It has been proven beyond all reasonable doubt. Time travel is just a vague concept. Everything written about it is completely theoretical. There's no complete "Theory of Time Travel". It is not a scientific theory. Your comparison is still shit.

 

[Code Monkey]

"Time is not made of lines. It is made of circles"
-Micheal J Caboose.

I voted no, but as I was typing some lame joke about 88 miles an hour, I realized that time travel DOES exist. When astronaunts exit the earths atmosphere, time apherently goes slower.Of course, I have no evidence of this.(I learned it from on episode of mystery hunters, back when I still had an imagination) I think its simpler to go with Dr. Manhattan, and say that time is simaltaneous.
Btw, thats the second time today I found an excuse to put that quote in a forum.

 

[Lukeje]

Time travel is impossible. There's no way to bend time forwards or backwards.

No known way.

It's kind of like teleportation: it sounds nice but it will never work and never happen. Hell, for teleportation to work you'd have to be able to create a machine that could break something down past its atoms, send them somewhere else and put them all back together. People are made up of trillions of atoms, and trying to remove & put back the most simple of items/organisms that there is next to impossible. No complex organism can be teleported in any such matter.

Exactly; that's why the way teleportation would actually work is by making a perfect copy on the other side, and then destroying the original.

You can't create matter.

Who said anything about creating matter? You'd just be utilising matter that was already in the place you wanted to teleport to.

 

[Sansha]

IF TIME TRAVEL WAS POSSIBLE, PEOPLE WOULD HAVE COME BACK IN TIME TO VISIT US

/discussion

 

[Hexenwolf]

Who says time exists?

I challenge any person or group to satisfactorily prove to me that "time" exists. When asked how you know time is passing, what is the universal answer? Things are changing. Well duh, change is the essence of time after all, isn't it? Time passing causes things to change. But what is change? Change is just energy. Energy changing state, moving from one particle to another, causing chemical reactions, etc. If you were able to completely and utterly remove all energy from an area would it not cease to change in every way shape and form? Would it not be "frozen in time"? Keep in mind that space has a temperature, 4 degrees Kelvin, and even nebulas, the coldest naturally occurring places have a temperature, 2 degrees Kelvin. The coldest scientists have been able to get particles is 50/1,000,000,000 of a degree Kelvin, using lasers to draw away energy. This results in a Bose-Einstein condensate. But I digress, my point is that time is a system of measurement humans (and any sentient being for that matter) have assigned to keep track of change, what has already happened, what is happening, and what we predict will happen. But it is not a flow. It is not a river; there is no past or future occurring simultaneously with the present. As such, time travel is not possible, because there is no where to travel to.

On a side note, I see a large amount of people referencing the change in the passage of time (that is, the perception of change) according to distance from major gravitational sources. Well of course, this makes perfect sense even using what we already know. We know that gravity can affect energy, after all, black holes can suck in light and radiation, they can cause such things to change direction. So why would it not be possible for sources of gravity such as planets or stars to influence the flow of electrons and such within such items as clocks? Or anything really.

 

[Lukeje]

Time travel is impossible. There's no way to bend time forwards or backwards.

No known way.

It's kind of like teleportation: it sounds nice but it will never work and never happen. Hell, for teleportation to work you'd have to be able to create a machine that could break something down past its atoms, send them somewhere else and put them all back together. People are made up of trillions of atoms, and trying to remove & put back the most simple of items/organisms that there is next to impossible. No complex organism can be teleported in any such matter.

Exactly; that's why the way teleportation would actually work is by making a perfect copy on the other side, and then destroying the original.

You can't create matter.

Who said anything about creating matter? You'd just be utilising matter that was already in the place you wanted to teleport to.

The copy wouldn't be perfect, and how would you 'destroy' the other copy. What purpose would that serve?

With current technology it wouldn't be possible to make a perfect copy, but who knows about in the future? And the other must be destroyed (simple incineration would suffice) or else it would just be a cloning machine, not a teleporter.